Changing oil in a CX-5 Turbo. Did the salesguy blow smoke up my tailpipe?

ColoradoDriver said:
Yeah...had I hit 100k and not touched the ATF, I'd have left it. But I intend to own this car for as long as it will go which I am hoping is 250k+ miles. Since Mazda refused to define what a "lifetime" was for their transmission fluid when I reached out to them, I will be performing periodic drain and fills.
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Here comes another Manual whine: They cite a spec for the transmission fluid, and there is no mention on the when or the how or the where. I'm glad you mentioned something about it. I may put a note in the maintenance log book to change mine around 50,000. I may do it sooner. There's no reason not to. And being retired, I'm not gonna rack up the miles, so I can do it infrequently time-wise (meaning not a lot of dollars) but still keep it rather fresh.

This is where I wish I trusted the dealer so as to have a reasonably factual conversation.
 
Avoidin Deer said:
Here comes another Manual whine: They cite a spec for the transmission fluid, and there is no mention on the when or the how or the where. I'm glad you mentioned something about it. I may put a note in the maintenance log book to change mine around 50,000. I may do it sooner. There's no reason not to. And being retired, I'm not gonna rack up the miles, so I can do it infrequently time-wise (meaning not a lot of dollars) but still keep it rather fresh.

This is where I wish I trusted the dealer so as to have a reasonably factual conversation.
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And I should be clear. Mazda refused to define what lifetime was in terms of mileage or years. They very easily (if you read between the lines) stated that the fluid was good until you needed to do major transmission work.

Hmm...major transmission work...from not changing the fluid perhaps????

Anyway, I'm of the opinion that throwing some new fluid in there periodically is fine. I think around 50k like you said is a good target. Since there is no ATF schedule, it's not an exact science. But from the Blackstone Lab reports I've seen, most fluids seemed good to that point. Mine at 71k miles for a first drain/fill showed it more out of spec from others.

In fact, just found the graph of posted UOA results posted for ATF made by ruthrj in the SkyActiv Transmission Fluid Analysis thread. Mine are the dots at the far right.
 
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ColoradoDriver said:
And I should be clear. Mazda refused to define what lifetime was in terms of mileage or years. They very easily (if you read between the lines) stated that the fluid was good until you needed to do major transmission work.

Hmm...major transmission work...from not changing the fluid perhaps????

Anyway, I'm of the opinion that throwing some new fluid in there periodically is fine. I think around 50k like you said is a good target. Since there is no ATF schedule, it's not an exact science. But from the Blackstone Lab reports I've seen, most fluids seemed good to that point. Mine at 71k miles for a first drain/fill showed it more out of spec from others.

In fact, just found the graph of posted UOA results posted for ATF made by ruthrj in the SkyActiv Transmission Fluid Analysis thread. Mine are the dots at the far right.
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I get that...but since when has a SA transmission died from "worn out fluid"? Name just one. I can make a better case for "don't buy a CX5 because the transmissions break because they are poorly made" by pointing out mechanical failures than you can for "Change your fluid because if you don't ,they die", if we are purely talking objective evidence presented by showing a deadlined vehicle.
 
ColoradoDriver said:
In fact, just found the graph of posted UOA results posted for ATF made by ruthrj in the SkyActiv Transmission Fluid Analysis thread. Mine are the dots at the far right.
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Interesting data.

I wonder if the transmission design changed during the model years that data was received from. Obviously, there are other factors, but it's interesting.

I wonder what accounts for your copper level?
 
Unobtanium said:
I get that...but since when has a SA transmission died from "worn out fluid"? Name just one. I can make a better case for "don't buy a CX5 because the transmissions break because they are poorly made" by pointing out mechanical failures than you can for "Change your fluid because if you don't ,they die", if we are purely talking objective evidence presented by showing a deadlined vehicle.
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You keep calling it "failure of worn out fluid", but worn out fluid just leads to the mechanical failures you are calling it.

Sorry, but my lifetime for a vehicle is 250k miles plus. Not 100k.

You can argue over how long the fluid can last, but what can't be argued is that fluid does break down over time.
 
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Avoidin Deer said:
Interesting data.

I wonder if the transmission design changed during the model years that data was received from. Obviously, there are other factors, but it's interesting.

I wonder what accounts for your copper level?
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I am a spirited driver. I'm sure that has contributed to higher wear over time.
 
ColoradoDriver said:
I am a spirited driver. I'm sure that has contributed to higher wear over time.
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I'm waiting to get my first 600 miles on it before resurrecting my inner redneck.
But he's in there, itching to test the turbo.

Hold my sake and watch <i>this</i>!
 
You can change your own transmission oil - its quite straight forward but keep in mind that it holds 8.2 quarts when dry and only 3.7-5.1 quarts to change so like many cars you wont get it all out. You could do it several times but youll need a lot of oil and I would definitely stick with the blue Mazda oil rather than mix it.
 

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Avoidin Deer said:
As I was test driving the CX-5 Reserve, the salesguy casually said "You can ruin the turbo if you change the oil and install an empty oil filter without manually filling it up first."

Is this true?
Has anyone heard of such a thing?
Did the guy invite me to go snipe hunting?
Was he trying to scare me off of doing my own maintenance?

You Tube videos of CX-9 oil changes have folks installing empty filters.
I feel stupid even asking this.

When I was working with the finance guy to finalize the sale, he tried to sell me a "discounted" service package. Dealer oil changes were done at the discounted prepaid package bargain price of $90 each, purchased in lots of 3!
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NO. He did not. Failing to prefill the filter will not destroy the turbo's center bearings if done once or 3 times, but starting a turbocharged engine means spinning the turbo for a short time without oil. Do it long enough for enough times and you will buy a new/rebuilt turbo prematurely.

Prefilling the filter has been standard practice in turbo cars since at least the late '70s/early '80 Mustangs and T-birds. You'd think a bunch of car guys would know this.

I'm sure you can figure out what's an overpriced oil change in your area.
 
ColtX-5 said:
NO. He did not. Failing to prefill the filter will not destroy the turbo's center bearings if done once or 3 times, but starting a turbocharged engine means spinning the turbo for a short time without oil. Do it long enough for enough times and you will buy a new/rebuilt turbo prematurely.

Prefilling the filter has been standard practice in turbo cars since at least the late '70s/early '80 Mustangs and T-birds. You'd think a bunch of car guys would know this.

I'm sure you can figure out what's an overpriced oil change in your area.
Click to expand...

It depends on the oil system of the vehicle.
 
ColtX-5 said:
NO. He did not. Failing to prefill the filter will not destroy the turbo's center bearings if done once or 3 times, but starting a turbocharged engine means spinning the turbo for a short time without oil. Do it long enough for enough times and you will buy a new/rebuilt turbo prematurely.

Prefilling the filter has been standard practice in turbo cars since at least the late '70s/early '80 Mustangs and T-birds. You'd think a bunch of car guys would know this.

I'm sure you can figure out what's an overpriced oil change in your area.
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Okay, you caused me to go do some reading. I won't put forth the pluses & minuses I've read so far, because I don't have the expertise to confirm or deny the validity of each.

I will say that the most consistent advice I see when pre-filling the oil filter (and lots of people do it on lots of machines, not just passenger vehicles) is to fill it through the outer holes (inlets) so that any contaminants get filtered out. The near-universal consensus is that filling the filter through the large center holes presents a strong risk of introducing contaminants into the engine, and that most oils do contain some levels of contaminants beyond the obvious one of the container's physical foil seal.
 
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Changing oil in a CX-5 Turbo. Did the salesguy blow smoke up my tailpipe?

Unobtanium said:
It depends on the oil system of the vehicle.
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Exactly. Many turbo engines with cartridge type oil filter you simply can't re-fill the oil into the canister if the oil filter cap is on top such as BMW N54/N55 3.0L I6 twin turbo; or you can only fill very little in the cap if the oil filter cap is down underneath the engine such as VW/Audi 2.0T FSI turbo.
 
I'm going to muddy the waters here a little bit.

I went over to the CX-9 forum to look at this topic, since the turbo has longevity over there.

One member said he emailed Mazda Customer Service regarding the type of oil to use in his 2.5L turbo (he was getting conflicting data from his dealer), and the response was either synthetic or conventional can be used as long as 5w30.

I thought people might be interested in hearing what Mazda Corporate says about the type of oil to use in the turbo (assuming the veracity of what was posted by some guy on the internet).

I could find no posts on the specific process of changing the oil/filter.
 
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ColtX-5 said:
Prefilling the filter has been standard practice in turbo cars since at least the late '70s/early '80 Mustangs and T-birds. You'd think a bunch of car guys would know this.
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As a car guy I still don't buy it.
Even if starting a car after a fresh oil change caused the turbo to have no oil at startup...how long would that be for? 1 second? 3 seconds? At IDLE?
This isn't going to harm your turbo even if that is what happened.
And it isn't what happens in the cars I am most familiar with (Swedish Cars).
 
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7eregrine said:
As a car guy I still don't buy it.
Even if starting a car after a fresh oil change caused the turbo to have no oil at startup...how long would that be for? 1 second? 3 seconds? At IDLE?
This isn't going to harm your turbo even if that is what happened.
And it isn't what happens in the card I am most familiar with (Swedish Cars).
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Exactly. Also...how are we chemically washing the oil off the turbo shaft etc. when the thing had oil on it an hour prior? It's got oil...
 
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