Breaking News: US plans to receive Ford Focus RS Canceled
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Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
Well your Skyline Example dont work in here, because a Skyline is already a special model. we are talking about FORD and FORD RS Division, there are s*** load of people that have even asked me back in USA where Spain is at and if they have TV over here so.... that says it all. not knowing is almost the same as not seen it.. Reading is one thing and saying who is going to pay 30k for a Focus is another buddy. because this is not a regular focus you get my point !!! no need to get mad here, thats what threads are for, to discuss no to insult and i aint insulting or disrespecting anybody here
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BlackCherry06
Member
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- '17 CX-3 GT
also remember that being so close to it you are caught up in the hype surrounding the car where someone who is removed from the situation can more objectively evaluate the car. it's the same here with the people who grew up around the muscle cars of the 60s/70s. they have a hard time believing that there is anything wrong with them and many still think that they are the pinnacle of performance.
i would also venture to say that the cosworth/rs cars of old (sierra and escort) were much more different than their normal counterparts than the latest generation.
i would also venture to say that the cosworth/rs cars of old (sierra and escort) were much more different than their normal counterparts than the latest generation.
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
Well you can compare this 2, they are very similar in years.
Ford Contour SVT and Ford Mondeo RS or ST220, no way the SVT version is near the RS or STS220 European version.. i still dont get it why we get s*** in United States when even OPEL that is GM in USA makes millions of time better and better engineered automobiles.. and the story continues..
happy and angry
Member
It is almost as if he provided a link for you to read that explains to you why he thinks that. It is almost as if his proof is available to any and all that have the know-how to click on a hyperlink!
You have to live there to really know, huh?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Appeal_to_authority
You've really got your panties in a twist over this "YOU HAVE TO KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO OWN AN RS VEHICLE, YOU ARE A MEMBER OF AN EXCLUSIVE CLUB WHEN YOU DO AND CHAMPAGNE WILL FALL FROM THE HEAVENS FOR ALL THAT HAVE REALLY EXPERIENCED THE TOTALLY AWESOMENESS THAT IS COSWORTH!!!!" thing, guy.
Let's back this up a second for you. This all started because someone said that people in North America won't want to buy a $30,000+ Ford Focus. How this very simple idea offends you, I'm not sure, but it's not a very contentious argument to make. In the U.S. especially and to some extent in Canada, when you take a car whose base model costs $15,000 and make an upscale or performance varient of it cost twice as much, a lot of people are not going to be interested. You can see this with the limited sales that STi's and EVO's get, for example. Marketshare will be limited. That's kind of what happens with a car like this.
For Ford to bring this car over to the U.S. they will have to deal with extra shipping costs, extra development costs to meet different emissions and safety regulations, and then hope to recoupe costs with sales. To do this they have to push (relatively) high volume or relatively high cost, and either prospect is questionable. One kills the exclusivity of Focus RS, the other prices it out of most buyers reach. Given the relatively small market for performance small cars in North America, especially given the dip car sales have taken as a result of a global financial meltdown, is not a very safe or prudent business venture to bring this over right now. You don't seem to understand the image a Ford Focus carries over here. Slap an RS badge on one and most people are just going to see "A 30,000+ economy car." STi's and EVO's have immediately recognizable rally pedigree. Cosworth and RS products have never really made it over to the U.S. and so do not have that same sort of recognition to drive sales. It sucks, I know, but that's the way it is.
This has nothing to do with your reverence for Cosworth or the RS/ST European monikers. This has nothing to do with anyone in these threads pissing on your precious Cosworth. I'm not entirely sure what the hell you are going on about here, to be honest, because it's hard enough to make sense of the garble you're throwing out. The reverence with which the average European car enthusiast holds Cosworth/RS/ST vehicles has absolutely no bearing whatsoever on the realities of North American markets. So stow your entirely fallacious and irrelevant "If you lived in Europe you'd know how awesome these companies are and you'd know how well they'd sell in the U.S." argument because most of us on here are aware how awesome Cosworth/RS are, we just rightly acknowledge that this has no bearing whatsoever on the average American enthusiast or on the economic realities that make bringing this car here a dicey proposition.
A lot of hype about this car. has been creating headlines in our local newspapers and there was a lot of pre orders in England, even befor the customers knew the color it would come in. All this rightly so, a lot of people complained about the first focus ST saying it was underpowered, and really welcomed the RS when the name re-appeared.
Comparing a normal SVT to the RS is like comparing a standard MZ3 2.0 to the MS3. Really not a great comparison, now is it.
Like most europpean ford this car is designed in Germany, to europpean standards. There are some differences that are not visible, and getting the approval for sale in America will cost a lot of money in paperwork that I think wouldn't be worth it compared to the expected sales
Comparing a normal SVT to the RS is like comparing a standard MZ3 2.0 to the MS3. Really not a great comparison, now is it.
Like most europpean ford this car is designed in Germany, to europpean standards. There are some differences that are not visible, and getting the approval for sale in America will cost a lot of money in paperwork that I think wouldn't be worth it compared to the expected sales
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- 2011 Mustang GT
Obviously you need to compute a little math before you make claims. A Focus RS is $25K in England, which, if you compute the currency exchange between GBP and USD brings the price to roughly $40K in the US. That's not factoring in the modifications necessary to make it legal to drive in the US, along with transportation costs across the pond.
Most recently, SVT and RS are one common entity. Ford Europe's designs and several of their engineers and vehicles are coming stateside.
The Focus RS is not a rocket, in fact it's times aren't anything to drool over, but the car is fundamentally sound, a solid handling machine and good power/torque curve to propel it around. It's not a rally car at all, but a well built, well balanced car.
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
First of all, i didnt got offended at all, first because i dont own any RS or Cosworth company, and i could careless what you and others think you know, i was just giving out my opinion like others have. I was just saying since i lived in USA and in Europe i kindly know the peoples mentalities and the market.. you cant really say a RS focus looks alike a regular Focus you know, if people see an RS like a regular focus the have a problem, but hey like i said i dont mind or care what people think about Ford, RS, Cosworth, i had fun living and using the best of the 2 continents thats all.... Economy got nothing to do in this. 10 years ago we didnt have any crisis worldwide, and we always got s*** in USA when other countries were getting good stuff and better engineered, thats my point, believe me here in Europe countries do care more about safety and environment more than USA millions of time. so if they dont bring those cars to USA is basically bases on my opinion because they will loose their 100 years old market were huge ass engines that eats lots of gas is business. bringing a car that perform millions of time better and consume less gas is not a business for the American oil companies.. in USA if is bigger and eats more gas is better, in Europe the smallest, economical and higher performance is better and a must... being that said. thats all i have to say about this ridiculous comparison we are making. Lets keep this thread clean..
SpooledupRacing
Banned
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- 86' RX-7 modded
All I can say is this is EXACTLY what I expected... Ford will NEVER bring over a cool car.
You have to remember that Europeans and Americans have different tastes and requirements when it comes to cars. Europeans love small sporty cars and Americans are in love with straight line power and large SUVs.
Opels are sold here in the states as Saturns. Just that they are the dumbed down versions.
no cars today that are sold in both countries have prices that closely relate to the exchange rate. i cringe whenever people do that because while technically true if i wanted to hop on a plane today and go pick up a car in england that is what it would cost me in US dollars there are a whole lot of other factors involved in pricing a car that do not make the price conversion that clean.
what is usually better is just to take the pound sign and replace it with a dollar sign and that's what the car will sell for over here. so if it's 25k pounds (don't know how to make that symbol on my keyboard) it will likely sell for $25k in the US. add in a few grand for extra safety development, shipping, etc... needed and the $30k mark sounds like a good estimate to me and is also actually not too far off from a MS3 GT which is a very similar vehicle.
i'm still hoping for my turbo falcon to make its way over
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
I totally agree with you, but you cant hide European Technology are ahead of the American one. even tho they are the Same... is ridiculous to hear Ford cannot bring such a better engineered car to the states, Cmon man we are talking about the most powerful and economical country in the world, thats not an excuse if you ask me. but if you ask me they dont bring those type of cars to USA because they will out Perform the current COWS V8s that eats tons of gas with this ones that are better, will last longer and consume less gas. there is no business in there. Less gas, performs better and is better engineered pretty simple is you ask me. and sorry for my grammar my english is not the best i sure try my best to make sense and sound right..
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- 2011 Mustang GT
It's a crude estimate but it serves its purpose to prove a point. You simply can't take a EDM car and drop it on US soil and sell it.
With the next Focus platform, the MAJORITY of the parts will be shared between EDM/USDM models, but there will be the obvious differences in safety,powertrain options, etc. Also, you've got the suppliers making more components, which should help keep costs down between them. Give it 2-3 years and we'll see a Focus RS(SVT?) over here.
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- 2011 Mustang GT
And while we're on the topic of V8's, the current 4.6/5.4/6.8 Triton motors are going away. Now, the 5.0 and 6.2 motors are more efficient and more powerful will replace those, with the ability to go DI/Ecoboost in the near future.
Trust me, Ford's got their s*** straight and their product mix is going to be stellar in the next few years.
Trust me, Ford's got their s*** straight and their product mix is going to be stellar in the next few years.
Mazdaspeed2oo35
600whp - 600wtq at 30 PSI
happy and angry
Member
You sound terribly offended with everything you write, from "Do you even live here man?" to "you just don't understand what it's like".
Oh, what we think we know. Yup, that doesn't sound aggressive/dismissive/offended at all.
This may come as a shock to you but having lived in a country does not actually convey any super secret knowledge about how the markets work, or even any general understanding of the mentalities of the population. Residency is not a magic potion that makes you know what the hell you are talking about.
I'm not saying it looks like a regular Focus. I have never made that claim. No one here has made that claim. What has been said, however, is that most of the car buying public will perceive the RS Focus as being... a really expensive Focus. For the last 8 or 9 years the Focus has just been a little econo-box, a domestic competitor to the Civic and the Corolla. Not a performance car, or even a performance platform. Most people over here have no idea what SVT is or even that we had an anemic little SVT Focus for sale for a while, let alone two performance brands that have never been sold on this side of the ocean.
If people aren't enthusiasts and don't know what the RS brand means, they have the problem? Not the arrogant dink sneering at their lack of car knowledge from the safety of a message board?
Economy has everything to do with why the Focus RS won't make it to North America any time soon.
Yes, this has been true for a very long time and isn't a very insightful point to make. It is also a combination of a lot of factors, but the main factor driving this has been what the American public is willing to buy. In large portions of the U.S. there is a certain xenophobia that drives vehicle sales, the road systems in the two countries are very different, driver attitudes are very different, and what people prioritize in a vehicle in the U.S. vs in Europe is very different. Rightly or wrongly, the markets are different between the two continents. They are slowly shifting to be more closely aligned, but cars like the Focus RS or the Renault Megane R26R or the Fiat 500 Abarth or even really any other performance oriented small car is going to be a very, very niche market proposition.
Oh, you think it's a conspiracy thing. Hah! One of those. Let's put it this way. Sales of cars like the Fit have gone through the roof over the last few years, and companies like Ford are trying to get a piece of that pie with things like the Fiesta and the Ka making it to these shores in the next two years. Truly, those American Oil companies and the secret shadow government megacorporations that really control these lands are doing a good job of suppressing the small car. The long-standing resistance to smaller vehicles has everything to do with ExxonMobile and nothing to do with the entirely different demographics driving vehicle sales between the North America and Europe, and also nothing to do with the vast differences in gas prices driving motorists to prioritize completely different sets or wants and needs when purchasing vehicles.
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- 2011 Mustang GT
Let me see here...old archaic motors with piss-poor mileage being scrapped for new motors built from the ground up, capable of being retrofitted with fuel efficient technologies as needed? Sounds like someone was thinking long-term when they designed that.
Here's a great example of some numbers for reference:
4.6 3V OHC motor: 315hp/325tq
5.0 4V DOHC 'Coyote' motor: 400hp/385+tq
Oh, and it weighs less than the 5.4 with the iron block used in the F-150, so weight reduction and increased payload to boot.
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