SeR_Cyclops
Member
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- Mazdaspeed Protege
Beautiful!!!
FS-DE Oil System
- Thread starter MP3racer
- Start date
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- Completely Stock P5
That's the route I'm going, so I thought I'd put it in there. 
I hope the attached drawing helps....below is the accompanying description.
An oil filter adapter plate is screwed onto the block in place of an oil filter. It will have an in and out port for the oil flow. Attach an AN-10 line from the "OUT" port and attach the other end of this line to the external pressure regulator valve (Ex-PRV) flow circuit fitting. Attach another AN-10 line to the other flow circuit fitting on the Ex-PRV with the other end of this line attached to the 'IN" port on a remote filter housing. A third AN-10 line will attach at one end to the "OUT" port on the remote filter housing with its opposite end attached back at the "IN" port on the oil filter adapter plate. A final AN-10 line will be attached at one end to the bypass port on the Ex-PRV and its other end attached to the engine block girdle (via a bung welded to the OE girdle).
Hope this helps???(dunno)
Attachments
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- MSP 1145
actually it does help, quite a bit!
Question: can filter be installed before the the Ex-PRV so when Ex-PRV by-passes oil then clean oil goes back to the pan instead of unfiltered oil or it will mess with pressure/time respond ?
Girdle can be drill-n-tap instead of welding a bung, right ?
BTW - good drawing specially with the logo on top , pro. look (yes).
Every bit of info helps man (thumb)
By placing the filter before the External PRV you run the chance of exploding your oil filter with unregulated oil pressure. Even the best racing filters are not rated for much above 150 psi (with 20w50 synthetic we typically see regulated oil pressure of ~100 psi on cold start-up). Standard street oil filters won't hold up to anywhere close to that. Also, if the can of the filter doesn't blow the gasket will. A huge mess will be the result!!
The oil is being drawn from the pan in the first place (by the pick-up which has a screen). Returning unfiltered oil to the place where it intially came from shouldn't be a big deal.
We like to place the oil filter right before the oil goes back to the block because as it enters the block the first place it goes is to the main bearings. As you know, they are very susceptible to scratching from particulate matter. Therefore, we like to make sure the oil is as filtered as possible.
If you still would like to put some sort of filtration prior to the External PRV a scavenge type of filter should hold up and be able to remove larger particulate matter.
Thanks for the good words on the drawing...was done late last night so coffee power was necessary(coffee)
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- Completely Stock P5
I just had a thought... With a sandwich plate, and NOT relocating the oil filter, doesn't a sand. plate just draw oil as it comes out of the block, as in before it's filtered?
I'm not sure on this one as I have not personally looked at a sandwich plate ((hah)other than at a diner) so I'm not sure of the flow pattern. I'm not a big fan of them since they seem like they would impead the flow too much. Also, there is not much room under the intake to get a decent size filter on the block let alone a sandwich plate. I it were me a remote oil filter housing with a good size oil filter would be the way to go.
Yeah I was going to say the same, I'm using a bit bigger size oil filter then stocker and it has only 2-3 mm space between intake mani and the filter so sandwich plate will not be a good option.
Well, just wondered on the filter position thing but its more then clear so I'd stick w/ the designed placement.
MAT , coffee is necessary sometimes, helped me through some exams with good results (headbang)
Yes...been there with the exam thing many a time....nowadays has helped us to get a racecar together in record time once or twice
I'll bump the thread again...
So this had been bugging me now that I have a spare block to work on for my built motor. I think I remember reading a good pressure to set was 10 psi for every 1000 RPM, is that correct or am I remembering things poorly? This just worries me as it sets the idle oil pressure around 7.5 psi and the cruise oil pressure at 30 psi (3000 RPM ~ 60 mph). This just seems a little low. I mean 65 psi at 6500 RPM seems fine - especially for the turbo (I believe Garrett says BB turbos should not see more than 60 psi).
For reference, my current idle oil pressure is 22-24 psi and around 60 psi at cruise.
So this had been bugging me now that I have a spare block to work on for my built motor. I think I remember reading a good pressure to set was 10 psi for every 1000 RPM, is that correct or am I remembering things poorly? This just worries me as it sets the idle oil pressure around 7.5 psi and the cruise oil pressure at 30 psi (3000 RPM ~ 60 mph). This just seems a little low. I mean 65 psi at 6500 RPM seems fine - especially for the turbo (I believe Garrett says BB turbos should not see more than 60 psi).
For reference, my current idle oil pressure is 22-24 psi and around 60 psi at cruise.
cougar10agREDUX
Member
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- 2003 Protege ES-T
hmm, i'm seeing 15-17psi at idle and 40-45psi at 60mph.
You are correct that a basic "rule of thumb" states 10 psi for every 1000 rpm. However, that is just a basic rule. I agree that 65-70 psi at redline (or 6500 rpm) is good but for a turbo motor 30 psi at 3000 rpm is a bit low. The intake pressure in a forced induction motor puts quite a bit of stress on the rod and main bearings and actually tries to squeeze the oil out. In the FS-DE motor the rod bearings do not have direct oiling supply. They rely on "scavaging" it from the main bearings. We have found with our race motors that increasing the oil pressure from idle and into the mid-range helps with the longevity of the bearings and ultimately the motor itself.
Your reference oil pressures are very similar to the oil pressures we run in our race motors.
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Sorry for continuing with the questions but I was under the impression the external PRV was a linear unit. IE, when you increase pressure at one point, it gets increased all over. I'm just worried that if I set my oil pressure to be ~60 psi or so at cruise that it will be too high at WOT at higher RPM.
Or am I getting this all wrong. By adjusting the external PRV are you adjusting oil pressure directly, or doing so by adjusting the pressure at which oil gets bypassed back to the engine? If this is the case, then there wouldn't be an issue with low pressure at idle and cruise provided I have the unit adjusted correctly.
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- Completely Stock P5
Good question... Is the PRV liek a "wastegate" that opens at a preset pressure and bypasses oil, and every pressure below that goes right into the engine, or does it gradually let pressure bleed off at a constant rate over the whole range of pressure. (Ex. 10% of all pressure gets dumped, so at idle 20psi in would mean 18psi out, and at 100psi in, 90psi out.) Make sense?
This is another good theory and more likely than my linear approximation.
The external PRV's are basically the same as the OE internal units except they have the ability to be adjusted and the ability to send the bypassed oil to a place where it doesn't interfere with the building oil pressure.
The unit is constantly bypassing pressure. The amount it is bypassing depends on how much pressure is put on the internal spring by turning the index bolt in or out.
60 psi at cruising speed is a bit high if your cruising rpm is around 3500. I would look for around 40-45, but before you adjust it further what is your oil pressure at redline or WOT throttle?
The unit is constantly bypassing pressure. The amount it is bypassing depends on how much pressure is put on the internal spring by turning the index bolt in or out.
60 psi at cruising speed is a bit high if your cruising rpm is around 3500. I would look for around 40-45, but before you adjust it further what is your oil pressure at redline or WOT throttle?
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I have had a fellow forum member interested in this system who is trying to put together a list of parts needed for the conversion to this system since he is in Europe. I put together a list from the install we did on the race car. I have not done this install on a street car myself. I wondered if the fellow forum members who have done this conversion can chime in to add or modify the parts on the list that are required.
Thanks in advance!!
Besides the normal Upgraded oil pump and external PRV the list is:
20 feet AN 10 hose
7 AN10 straight fittings
1 AN10 90 degree fitting (bypass return to block)
Bung for Block Girdle
Oil Filter Block Adapter
Remote Filter Housing
2 Fittings for remote filter housing
2 Fittings for Oil Filter Block Adapter
Filter for remote housing
Thanks in advance!!
Besides the normal Upgraded oil pump and external PRV the list is:
20 feet AN 10 hose
7 AN10 straight fittings
1 AN10 90 degree fitting (bypass return to block)
Bung for Block Girdle
Oil Filter Block Adapter
Remote Filter Housing
2 Fittings for remote filter housing
2 Fittings for Oil Filter Block Adapter
Filter for remote housing
mazdaspeed_kid8
Member
hi when i use my AC on my mazdaspeed the oil pressure drops to 0 PSI normally it is at 5-7 PSI with the AC off this is at Idle can anybody tell me if that is normal or if the oil pump needs changing. thanks
