The only drawback to buying a new vehicle

[premio53]

It is no longer possible for non-professionals to work on them. I work with a couple of men who can tear an engine apart and put it back together as well as do body work. One of them bought a brand new 2015 Ford Ranger and had nothing but problems but he told me that even after the warranty is up he will not be able to do any repairs himself other than very minor ones because it has 6 computers and everything is so integrated with these things that he has no idea what to do. He said the gas pedal has a wire going to something and that the truck actually "learns" as he drives it. I don't believe the first space ship was as complicated as some of the new cars on the road now.

I have a 2000 Dodge Dakota Sport with over 192,000 miles on it and usually have one of my mechanic friends fix something if it goes wrong. I had an estimate of over $900 for upper and lower ball joints but the guy I work with replaced them for $150 after I bought the parts. It is just old enough that I don't have to take it to a dealership every time something goes wrong. That is one reason I have no desire to ever buy another new truck. Has anyone else had the same feeling about new vehicles?

Correction: I meant to say Ford F-150.

 

[123373]

I remember I had a 1971 impala that I could almost stand in the engine compartment as there was so much room. It was easy to maintain and you didn't need a computer to figure out what was wrong with it, just a good shop book, or your eyes and ears! I actually am not afraid of all the computer technology in today's cars as I like that it can in some vehicles tell you exactly what the issue is without a code reader. I would attribute some fear of this to knowing some of my friends my age being afraid or not trusting a simple Windows home computer. I am old school and amazed that in today's generation if an appliance or a home computer breaks the skill set to diagnose and even just function is gone. God forbid if a calculator breaks and they have to do a math problem with pencil and paper! Wait until cars drive themselves and an accident occurs, who's fault will it be, the drivers or the car!

 

[RG_Flyer]

It is still possible for non-professionals to work on modern vehicles, but old-school methods will not always get it done. Someone reasonably technical can do it, but it frequently requires a genuine manufacturer's service manual and actually studying the issues and procedures. It is more crowded under the hood and having guidance on the order-of-operation and identifying hard-to-see fasteners and such make it a whole lot easier than digging in blindly. I have a modern vehicle with 206,000+ miles on it that has been maintained by me alone. Look at what what Chris is doing with all the CX-5 mods.

It can be done, it just takes a bit more research and mindset change from shade-tree mechanics of yore.

 

[TheGanzman]

At almost 60 years old, I've been wrenching on/restoring/restomodding vehicles for 47 years now. As I predicted ~8 years ago, vehicles have now attained the status of "major home appliances"; as such, they are approaching the same position as your washing machine or refrigerator. When I bought my 2016 AWD/GT CX-5, you'd better believe I opted for the 7 year/100K mile bumper-to-bumper warranty!

Got my '69 Ford Bronco in the 3rd car garage as my "backup" - I KNOW how to troubleshoot/work on/repair THAT!

 

[thedaddyb]

With my experience working with dealerships (we are a subcontractor), the majority of their mechanics are not particularly tech savvy. Usually a shop will have one techy "guru" that they use to hunt down electrical issues and gremlins. The other mechanics focus mostly on the standard maintenance that most of us hobbyists could tackle.

Most of the time if a computer or body control module fails, they are just swapping it out. There isn't anybody sitting at a bench working on circuit boards repairing them. So for the foreseeable future you could still do all the work yourself. In 20+ years from now though if you can't find these parts it could be a different story.

 

[Unobtanium]

I'm just sitting here laughing thinking of the 9 second Honda civic that my friend built in his garage, and all the other things my friends do. That's not my hobby, but if you "can't work on modern cars"...it's not the car, I it's the mechanic...

 

[premio53]

With my experience working with dealerships (we are a subcontractor), the majority of their mechanics are not particularly tech savvy. Usually a shop will have one techy "guru" that they use to hunt down electrical issues and gremlins. The other mechanics focus mostly on the standard maintenance that most of us hobbyists could tackle.

Most of the time if a computer or body control module fails, they are just swapping it out. There isn't anybody sitting at a bench working on circuit boards repairing them. So for the foreseeable future you could still do all the work yourself. In 20+ years from now though if you can't find these parts it could be a different story.

Could you replace a windshield with tech package? My friend's F-150 would never idle right and he has already had the engine replaced. He said they have to take the entire front body off the new trucks instead of just changing the engine out traditionally. There was something in the electrical system that eventually caught fire but instead of replacing the truck they insisted on rewiring it since the body itself wasn't damaged on the outside. He is still driving a rental after a month.

 

[GP 2004]

When I bought my 2016 AWD/GT CX-5, you'd better believe I opted for the 7 year/100K mile bumper-to-bumper warranty!

What warranty did you get? There are different ones out there. Do you mind telling what it cost?

 

[Srad600]

IMO modern vehicles aren't that bad, as others have said, you need to have the right equipment to diagnose and repair though. Back in the "old" days, none of that was needed. Engine bays are tighter due to the many additional systems on cars now, which make them more comfortable, but there's a lot more "spaghetti" in there. In my mind though, cars are pretty easy peasy...try working on a modern motorcycle. Talk about NO room to work! On one of my bikes, in order to check the valve clearances I need to remove the: seat, glove box, air cleaner, throttle bodies, fuel tanks, radiator, and upper fairing...all day job just to get to the point where I can take the valve covers off to stick a feeler gauge in there.

 

[Chris_Top_Her]

That's a convenient stance for business hat perform maintenance. Unless you are having an issue that is a software glitch, it's still all nuts and bolts. Might be harder to reach or require dissembling other pars to get to said parts, but you can still do it. Especially routine maintenance.

 

[CC58]

My 2006 Civic threw the serpentine belt. It was impossibly tight in the engine compartment.
A special tool was needed to install a new belt. Had it towed to the dealer.

At least the CX-5 has some working room under the hood. I think I could cook a turkey on the exhaust manifold there is so much room there. I think I could replace many bolt on components on engine, and the serpentine belt.

New cars all have a basic closed loop feedback; oxygen sensor in exhaust and mass air sensor in intake tells computer how much gas to inject. EGR systems are pretty similar. Variable valve timing problems could be hard to figure out. Its not easy to determine if fuel and spark are making it to the cylinder in new cars, but OBD readout could tell you a lot of what is happening. OBD readers are cheap. I think many problems could be figured out by a curious owner.

 

[thedaddyb]

Could you replace a windshield with tech package? My friend's F-150 would never idle right and he has already had the engine replaced. He said they have to take the entire front body off the new trucks instead of just changing the engine out traditionally. There was something in the electrical system that eventually caught fire but instead of replacing the truck they insisted on rewiring it since the body itself wasn't damaged on the outside. He is still driving a rental after a month.

Not sure why you are asking about the windshield? Actually safelite is coming next week to replace the windshield on our GT with tech package. Their technicians aren't tech savvy either but have no problem swapping the windshield.
As for your friend's F-150 nearly every manufacturer has some sort of weird things like that in at least one of their cars they produce. Not everything is engineered to easily be worked on while it is all assembled. For instance, on a lot of the VW/Audi V8 engines, you have to pull the motor to do a timing belt change. Not exactly a great design.

 

[premio53]

Well one thing that unnerved me when buying my 2015 CX-5 is the guy telling me just a computer going bad could cost in the thousands while pushing the extended warranty. I have never dealt with dealerships after the basic warranty was up but now I feel I won't really have much of a choice with all the new technology. It just sort of scares me when it comes to something going wrong with all the high tech stuff they are putting into the cars now. Like I said the guy I work with has changed engines out and rebuilt them etc but he no longer believes he can do most of his own repairs on the new vehicles coming out. I'm getting close to retirement so I won't be buying any more new vehicles. I really wanted my wife to get her a nice car before I quit working and the CX-5 was really a present for her. I like the CX-5 very much.

 

[Unobtanium]

Well one thing that unnerved me when buying my 2015 CX-5 is the guy telling me just a computer going bad could cost in the thousands while pushing the extended warranty. I have never dealt with dealerships after the basic warranty was up but now I feel I won't really have much of a choice with all the new technology. It just sort of scares me when it comes to something going wrong with all the high tech stuff they are putting into the cars now. Like I said the guy I work with has changed engines out and rebuilt them etc but he no longer believes he can do most of his own repairs on the new vehicles coming out. I'm getting close to retirement so I won't be buying any more new vehicles. I really wanted my wife to get her a nice car before I quit working and the CX-5 was really a present for her. I like the CX-5 very much.

Then don't worry about it. A dead ECU is rarer than a fatal car crash in a nerfmobile.

 

[rwortman]

It is no longer possible for non-professionals to work on them. I work with a couple of men who can tear an engine apart and put it back together as well as do body work. One of them bought a brand new 2015 Ford Ranger and had nothing but problems but he told me that even after the warranty is up he will not be able to do any repairs himself other than very minor ones because it has 6 computers and everything is so integrated with these things that he has no idea what to do. He said the gas pedal has a wire going to something and that the truck actually "learns" as he drives it. I don't believe the first space ship was as complicated as some of the new cars on the road now.

I have a 2000 Dodge Dakota Sport with over 192,000 miles on it and usually have one of my mechanic friends fix something if it goes wrong. I had an estimate of over $900 for upper and lower ball joints but the guy I work with replaced them for $150 after I bought the parts. It is just old enough that I don't have to take it to a dealership every time something goes wrong. That is one reason I have no desire to ever buy another new truck. Has anyone else had the same feeling about new vehicles?

Correction: I meant to say Ford F-150.

Last I checked they hadn't computerized ball joints.

 

[gimor]

If/when they do I hope the wear sensors are reuseable.
Changed the ball joints on my 97 Dodge Ram few months ago. .

>Last I checked they hadn't computerized ball joints. <

 

[KimGT]

I actually like all the ECU's in the car. Makes things a little more expensive but the benefits far out-weigh the cost. OBD-II systems pretty much do all the work for you in terms of diagnosing issues, we have ABS, EBFD, Smart-city brake support, adaptive cruise control, smart key systems, dual zone climate control, all these modern conveniences that makes things nicer and safer to boot.

I'm relatively young and have mostly worked on 2001+ cars so I might be biased, but its pretty simple. For cars that need "special" reset tools like BMW/Porsche cars, they sell the ECU reset tools online for any components that need it.

 

[MikeM.]

Last I checked they hadn't computerized ball joints.

Haha! Good catch!

Nowadays, even good used vehicles have computers. Computers are the most reliable part of the car and help the engine run better through all phases of warm-up, at all altitudes and all throttle openings. I never want to go back to the days before computers made everything better. Those were the days when even a brand new car smelled like gas/oil, in cold weather you were always glad when it started on the first try (it was not at all rare for cars to sputter and die and require another crank). Sometimes they didn't start at all. When they did, you had to decide when to stab the accelerator pedal to reduce the extra rich situation created by the cold start circuit. Wait too long and raw fuel would build-up in your crankcase causing main bearing failure well before 100,000 miles, too short of a wait and it might kill the engine requiring a re-start. These were not faults, they were considered normal operation. Almost all cars of the day had a big dip in power at a certain rpm's low in the range and were gutless even though 16 mpg was considered normal. No road trip was complete without at least a small, well thought out tool kit, an extra quart of motor oil, hand soap and rags in case you needed to adjust or replace points or the spark plugs because they burned an electrode while climbing that high mountain pass or became fouled descending a long grade. Now, only people who have not yet adjusted to the reliability of modern cars carry oil, rags and tools.

You just start the car and drive off without even considering it might not work.