MSP, Matrix, Celica..

T

TIGHTanium

Member
I've been dead set on a MSP since last fall. Every once in a while I get these "what if's" in my head about other cars. Mini, Mazda6, RSX, etc. Now lately...I've been thinking and looking real hard at the Matrix and Celica's. They'd both be cheaper then an MSP (GT, not a GTS) and I can deal on the price. Also, I want an orange...and since I cant get my car till June, its an issue if an MSP will still be available by then.

Anyone taken either of the Toyotas out at all? Theres some new turbo kits for the celi's very nice gains, install....but pricey. I've sat in a Celi once and without it turned on, the thing felt so fast damn.

Matrix are made in Cambridge...anyone heard if the built quality is good, medium, poor? I would get the XRS (180hp, 6sp ) but heard its still a dog since its based on the Corolla platform, etc.

I'm losing sleep over this!! Its 4:30am and I cant do anything except search the internet for stuff!!!

Anyone please....I still love the MSP's...but the hype isnt there anymore
 
What I didnt like about the Celica was the lack of interior space and the 2door aspect. I guess I like some functionality with my sports cars. Nice car though. The Matrix is too bubble looking for my taste.

- Still lovin my MSP!
:cool:
 
TRD has a supercharger kit that you can get on the Matrix and the Corolla. It doesn't void your warranty and you get more power.. what a plus! :D
 
+Celica has TRD parts for it for performance gains but get set to get raped for the price, but it does not void warrenty.
+Large aftermarket support
+okay looking IMO
-all aftermarket is $$$
-kind of slow if not GTS...16.1-15.6 in the 1/4
-interior space is very limited.

+MSP so to have MS parts or so I have heard.
+pre-turboed
+Great handling
+great trunk/interior space
-first production run (so problems are there that have not been corrected.)
-Limited choice in color if you want a specific one.
-no 6spd
-4 doors (not true sports car... but performs like one)
 
One of the Long term tests on the Martix (forgot what mag) said something along the lines of it having so many rattles & squeaks it seemed more like it was built by Kia on a friday rather than Toyota. So the build quality sounds below average.
 
Drove the Matrix and MSP back to back - had actually visited the dealer to check out the Matrix and P5... and purchased an MSP after the sales guy suggesting "Hey how about that one over there" and falling in love with the MSP after the first 200 yards... Compared to the MSP the Matrix stacks up pretty well and doesn't really look bad now that I'm used to that chunky look:

+ Matrix
a) more space (LOTS more) and useful cubbyholes everywhere
b) normally aspirated power curve (if you like that sort of thing) up to 6000 RPM
c) more options (cruise, roof, etc.)
d) Toyota reliability and reputation

- Matrix
a) "Sitting in a bathtub" feeling (high windowsills, especially in back - my son hated it back there)
b) Did NOT like the GTS engine in a Matrix - loits of power at 6000 RPM but it's not usable in day-to-day situations. It's not bad, but gfeels gutless under 6000RPM (which is, oh, about 99% of my driving)
c) Matrix seats = ptooey
d) Base Matrix is gutless, needs the supercharger
e) Every Matrix/Vibe I drove (there were 5 of them) had an AWFUL trans linkage, easily hung up on up and downshifts, and I've driven manual trans longer than some of our younger members have been alive :D!

Check the Car and Driver comparison test on small haulers - they rated the P5 best, and for good reason. The MSP is even
"more better" as a driver's car, but even has less room... and that sub really cuts down on trunk space.

Good luck whatever you choose - either way you've got a good car, really.
 
OH yeah - the driver's seating position in the Matrix = yarf.

Steering wheel is too far away and too high, and the armrests aren't where your arms would want to be. It's strange, and not a good kind of strange. (IMHO, YMMV, etc. but that's how it felt to me.)
 
I was the first Toyota Tech in North America to drive a Celica, please do not buy this car! It is very, very, slow, has no power (unless you spin the engine to eight grand, that sounds cool but gets boring very fast) it does not handle as well as the MSP and it has no, and I mean no space.

The Matrix is nothing more then a minivan. Call it what you want, but at the end of the day, that's what it is. Have not driven one, but by judging the Celica and its lack of power, I think the Matrix will be a dog.

I owned a Toyota MR2 for nine years, it had every TRD part that you could think of on it. I like my MSP more, it is faster, can hold A LOT of stuff and three of my best friends in comfort. Toyota's are very nice, but they are way over priced and under powered for your dollar. Simply put, there is no better deal out there for under twenty five grand then the MSP.

Go Mazda . . .
 
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Had to relate this - took the Vibe GT (Matrix 180hp twin) for a drive, other sales guys were taking a new Evo (wow!!!) for a drive, we got into it up a hill, Vibe at 6000-8000 rpm, Evo absolutely DUSTED us, what a GLORIOUS sight as it hunkered down and blasted off... The Vibe/Matrix definitely has some moves, it IS high and vannnish but that rally shifter is cool; the power is great, but only at 6k, anything below is not really all that lethargic but certainly not the punch of an MSP or the zinginess of a P5. My sig tells the tale of my buying experience...
 
EVO SIGHTING.

Hey, I just saw the new Evo during lunch today. GD what a sight! For a minute I that it was an 2003.5 speed, but the big front mount suggested otherwise. I couldnt help noticing the similarities between the two rear wings. I think Mazda my be trying to boost sales by making the Speed look Evolution like. Anyhow the Evo is a sweet looking ride.

HP
 
If you want a celica GTS get the 2000+2001 ones...the one without the 7500 rpm fuel cut.

The older ones had a 8500rpm fuel cut.

Stock they run high 14s, throw on intake + exhaust and they do low 14s.

Throw on a hotkins suspension kit, and they'll out handle anything on the road...all it needs is a LSD.

If you wanna mod...the Celica is the better way to go, it'll be cheaper to make it fast...just if you get one with the 7500rpm fuel cut you'll need to get a 2000 or 2001 ecu.

Just for the performance/luxury I'd take a GTS over a MSP..the GTS doesn't handle as well stock...but the aftermarket more than makes up for the small limitations.
 
I was going to make a trip to Toyota today...but it doesnt look like that will be happening anymore. Looks like I'll be getting an 03 MSP aslong as theres some lying around in a few weeks. I cant bring myself to getting an 03.5 (even though my name...) just because of how cheap they look to me...and ALOT more people will be driving them.

Thanks everyone....you've brainwashed me back into the Mazdaspeed cult!!!
 
Stock they run high 14s, throw on intake + exhaust and they do low 14s.
Click to expand...

where'd you get that from? they run mid-low 15's stock. friend had a cai, trd catback and lsd, blitz clutch, and only managed to run a 14.7 best.
 
I've taken out Toyotas. Matrix, not a good choice, Celica GT is underpowered but very fun to drive (kinda like the P5) and the GT-S I hear is sooo smooth. Never driven a GT-S, but I think it goes down to the question of if you rather have a 4 door or 2 door?

P.S. if you get a Celi get an aftermarket ECU and you'll be more than satisfied with your GT-S engine.
 
Can't see why your having troubles getting an orange one. If i wanted one, i could have it in 30 days or as long as it take to get here from BC

The one that got here back in Jan., the guy has it for sale already. He works at Mazda washing cars, got it for cost, and is selling it now pretty cheap from what I heard. Come over to NFLD and grab it...ha..ha..

As for the Celica...too small, looks ugly without a kit on it, and some wheels.

Matrix....yawn, too utility'ish looking. Never liked toyota's anyhow.

MSP - Well, almost perfect.
 
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