hypertech tuner

[TheStuartKid]

So today i just got my hypertech tune and plugged it in and changed everything from factory (0-60 restrictor, +/- rev limiter, +/- idle, and top speed limiter) when i did my first run after changing all that the car would go when i was WOT in 2nd gear.. but it would it first? My dashhawk fuel pressure was reading 1800s also when i was off the gas, feel like i havent seen it do that before? I feel like i got my best run when i had the rev limiter +500 and the 0-60 restrictor off factory and everything else was factory. Let me know what im doing wrong and what settings i should set to get the best performance but also the safest. Also, please answer some of the questions above. I really appreciate all the feedback

 

[boosted1]

Do you have an aftermarket SRI or CAI? The HT tune does not remove any ECU safeguards, so it is very safe. Your fuel pressure seems to be good.

 

[TheStuartKid]

I have a Mazdaspeed CAI and that's it, I thought the HT tune takes off some of the restrictions. For example, the 0-60 restriction? It is usually like 75% and now it should be 100% but I feel like the response right after I'm WOT is slower actually

 

[MSMS3]

When you enter the HT tuning mode you have to make specific choices at each stage.

You need to remove the 0-60 limit.

You need to raise idle speed +200 to help with your potential "smoking turbo" issues (separate threads here on this) and to help with vibes if you have an aftermarket rear motor mount, which is highly recommended.

You need to keep your rev limiter at stock. There is absolutely no reason to raise the limit, as our turbo cannot function safely WOT at higher than stock rpm limit.

You need to adjust the top speed limit to match the speed rating of your tires. If you don't know, just leave it alone and say "no." It will do nothing for you unless you plan on driving over 155 mph.

You need to make very sure you select the correct intake choice. If you, like I, have the MSCAI, then select "Mazdaspeed." This is your MAF sensor calibration and is very important.

After making all of those selections, then press "enter" and let it program.

As to whether the ECU needs to "relearn" for a certain period, there is honest debate on this. I don't know. It is my theory that relearning does matter and that your long term fuel trims continue to have some effect on fueling up until you pass about 200 grams/second air flow, which will not usually happen at WOT until about 4,000 rpm. Others disagree and claim that the ECU goes to full "closed loop" and ignores long term fuel trims at any WOT rpm.

You need to stop "tuning by feel." Get a stop watch or some other way to measure time. Do 4th gear pulls from 60-100 mph at WOT. Start WOT at about 50 mph and start the stopwatch as you swing to 60 and stop it as you hit 100. Always do this on straight, flat road. Compare results. Attempts to measure launch times are too fraught with driver fail, shift variations and the traction problems of fwd.

 

[60181]

I have a Mazdaspeed CAI and that's it, I thought the HT tune takes off some of the restrictions. For example, the 0-60 restriction? It is usually like 75% and now it should be 100% but I feel like the response right after I'm WOT is slower actually

What gear are you in when you got WOT and don't feel the quicker response? If it's 1st or 2nd, it could be you're feeling the TC / DSC system kicking in. Start the vehicle with DSC completely turned off. In and around town aka not on freeways, I turn DSC off as even with just TC disabled, I can invoke the nanny systems in second gear. Once I turn the systems off completely that goes away.

Try that and report back. You might want to also connect with someone that can datalog your car while you drive. Perhaps your seeing a small amount of KR.

 

[TheStuartKid]

Thanks i guess like you said you shouldn't just go from feel you should actually time it. But for raising the rev limiter, i feel like i get more pull out of it instead of having to shift right before 6.. Also, can you explain to me what KR is?

 

[60181]

Thanks i guess like you said you shouldn't just go from feel you should actually time it. But for raising the rev limiter, i feel like i get more pull out of it instead of having to shift right before 6..

I can't speak for your car, but just looking at the dyno and logs from my car with just an AEM CAI and a HT Flash, the car goes so super rich after 6,100rpm, I personally wouldn't rev any higher than that. I also wouldn't even consider raising the rev limiter. The turbo is maxed out at redline anyway (it's just a small KO4) and rev'ing it higher will just an increases in Exhaust Gas Temps and that's bad. Also, with things that rich I would believe there's a risk of cylinder wash and that's not good either. So while the car revs to 6,700, In practice and at the track, I'm shifting between 6,100-6,500 when I take her that high.

Also, can you explain to me what KR is?

Knock Retard and thus the cars PCM then reduces power electronically by retarding the overall ignition timing. I'm going to have mine dyno'd and logged again and am going to see if it's still present and if so, perhaps one step down in colder plugs will help. In my case I don't think changing plugs is necessary as I only saw a couple few degrees of knock but it was after 5 runs on the dyno. Once the car cooled and hit the open road I could feel the power / timing coming back.

 

[MSMS3]

OP: The rev limit raises your maximum rpm limit to some number higher than 6,700. It does NOT affect anything else. It will NOT give you more pull, not on this turbo. You do not need to be trying to increase rpm beyond 6,700 rpm unless you are trying to create a new form of block ventillation (piston and connecting rod through a self-inflicted hole in your block).

KR is knock retard. That is the response the ECU gives to the engine if your knock sensors detect knock (detonation). It pulls back engine timing by the number of degrees necessary (within limits) to stop the detonation. It tries to save the engine, but in doing so, lowers your power output.

I think it might be helpful for you to read some of the threads. There is an entire Hypertech section in this forum that might answer some or most of your questions.

 

[TheStuartKid]

So im confused on how you said " you saw a couple few degrees of knock".. explain that please. And up above^ you said if wasnt feeling a quicker response in 1st and 2nd, which i am not in second, to completely turn off DSC and disable TC? i thought they were both Traction control.

 

[MSMS3]

^

You need to read. A lot. Maybe start here with all the "stickies"?

http://www.mazdas247.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?410-Hypertech

And please use the search function regarding use of traction control DSC, and regarding KR and other issues. I'm not sure you are ready to make mods to your car.

 

[TheStuartKid]

i know what traction control and is it was he just worded it weird to me and i was confused. On the other hand, The KR still confuses me. Ive looked at plenty of threads and i still dont understand it, thats why im asking you guys, but whatever

 

[MSMS3]

I have a Mazdaspeed CAI and that's it, I thought the HT tune takes off some of the restrictions. For example, the 0-60 restriction? It is usually like 75% and now it should be 100% but I feel like the response right after I'm WOT is slower actually

The above was in response to mods question.

On another thread I see that you've had the car about a month, that it has a catless dp/rp and the turbo is smoking. I'd like you to explain. Folks here are trying to help you and we are getting conflicted information. If you have that dp/rp, then you need upgraded fuel pump internals too, and may, depending on other factors, need to be running step colder plugs with those mods and this tune. If you can find out from the prior owner if the pump was upgraded (and he is honest) that would be helpful.

I think you are either misleading us, or do not know how important it is to be accurate about your state of mods, or that you simply are not ready for this level of modding. You have a Dash Hawk but seem not to know anything about how to use it, if you do not even know what KR is and its significance. And you absolutely need to be monitoring fuel rail pressure.

This makes it very frustrating for me to try to offer assistance. Sorry if I am coming across harshly, but what is going on?

 

[TheStuartKid]

when i bought the car it came with the racepipe/downpipe but i sold it now and only have a hypertech. I understand most of the dashhawk now and understand how fuel rail pressure is important but im just confused on KR. There is a start to everything.

 

[MSMS3]

Removing the aftermarket catless dp and going back to stock is not exactly just "selling it." Where/how did you find the stock pieces to put back on? Did you do the swap out yourself? What is your level of mechanical experience? What about the smoking turbo?

I need to see a moment of clarity and truth. Sorry, again, if I am being a bit tough. It takes time to help people and to do it properly and not contribute to more problems we have to have some trust.

 

[TheStuartKid]

I removed it and sold it, the person i bought my car from gave me the stock parts. I tried the swap out at my friends shop but the downpipe is too much of a pain to take off because one stud is in the way, i ended up bringing it to my friends shop and it took them 3 hours to do it. that is why i sold it because i am going to buy another that is easier to take off just incase i need to bring my car into mazda for a new turbo or something. The smoking actually stopped when i went back to stock, i read up on it and it is just cause of the aft pressure of an aftermarket downpipe. So when i get more money i am going to be buying a turboxs downpipe/racepipe again, but doing a few things ive heard about to prevent the smoking... ptp pill, colder plugs, raise idle, etc.

But i understand where you are coming from, thank you for your time.

 

[MSMS3]

O.K. I understand now.

I do not believe that there is any downpipe/racepipe combo that is going to be easy to put on and take off. Exhaust work, expecially on cars with miles on them, is going to have to be done very carefully. As you already know the removal of the nuts from the studs on this car and wrestling the pieces in and out is going to be difficult, as is removing the O2 sensors. It can easily take a performance exhaust/muffler shop four hours with two guys working to do the remove and install. Some might can do it in less, if they've done it before.

TurboXS is what I run. I do recommend it highly because of the build quality and the flex joints, but it is still going to be a b**** to take your stock pieces off and to install it. Lots, lots, lots of PB Blaster and slow and easy on those studs, lots of different size rachet extensions, wiggler, etc. Slow and lots of solvent soak especially now that they've been stretched several times already.

The chances of smoking are going to be higher with a catless dp/rp simply because you don't have the two cats to help burn off the oil that gets into the downpipe from the turbo. The best fix short of the entire Mazda smoking turbo complete change out of the valve cover and PCV system is probably going to be raising idle, I repeat, IDLE rpm +200. Colder plugs have nothing to do with the smoking issue. You absolutely will not need colder plugs running the stock downpipe and racepipe, even on HT tune, and increase the risk of fouling the plugs.

If it smoked before, it will smoke again. Raising idle +200 really helps a lot with this and costs you nothing. If you wait until it begins smoking with the stock dp/rp it will probably be too late to do anything to stop is short of replacing the turbo.

Others may disagree, but I put my downpipe and racepipe on this car over 50,000 miles ago and the car has NEVER SMOKED. So, I do not buy into the theory that reduced backpressure from catless free flowing exhaust CAUSES smoking. It just makes it more noticable when it begins, because of the inability to further burn off the oil. The problem is the crankcase pressure due to the crappy, poorly designed stock PCV system on the gen 1 cars producing a pressure imbalance.

Make the proper choices on your HT menu and you should be very happy. It is not going to seem as strong with the catless dp/rp removed as it did before. Catless dp/rp on stock tune is a torque monster at boost onset because it is likely to be spiking to 21 psi, which is probably not such a good ideal. I'm not surprised that the car may seem a little "soft" now, even on HT, compared to how it might have been before you removed the catless dp/rp, because you are probably not getting higher than 18 psi and because the onset of boost will not be as dramatic. But, don't get too alarmed. Use the stopwatch and you'll see what a difference the tune makes in comparison to the stock ECU.

 

[TheStuartKid]

Thanks man i really appreciate the help there. Also, i did time a run stock compared to the HT tune and it was a difference. I went from 35-70 in 3rd gear so there wasnt any shifting and it was almost a second faster. Stock i did it in 5.5 and with the HT tune i did it in about 4.4. Even without a downpipe/racepipe do you believe i should raise the idle +200?

 

[MSMS3]

Nice gains.

On increased idle: Yes. Especially since you reported a smoking turbo on another thread. Even if removing the downpipe eliminated it (for the time), you have the early symptoms. Higher rpm idle helps.

 

[TheStuartKid]

Cool man, i appreciate the time and help.
Ill report back once i get the downpipe/racepipe and let you guys know how it goes.

 

[goob_os101]

I got to install the Test Pipe over the weekend. Nice improvment!!!

Before the TP my car would bog down after shifting gears, that is now gone. I have a nice constant pull which makes me happy. Drone is not very noticible, but the backfires are!

I Love my HT!!! I pulled(35mph-60mph) on another speed3 fully bolted(DP/CBE/HPFP/SRI/AP...) and kept a car length. Do I own a Unicorn?

My Mods: Hypertech, CPe Xcel CAI, CPe RMM, Turbosmart dual port, Street Unit boost tubes, Street Unit Test Pipe.