TMIC question.

[TheDirtyGoatee]

Sorry but I was posting in the "Funniest thing a ricer said" thread and I got flamed hard by a mod for being off-topic (in the off-topic section... go figure). So I've come here fellow Mazdaspeeders to ask...

Does anyone here know why Mazda put a top mount on the MS6? This, if I was in the market for an MS6 or competitor, would make me go to the competitors. I mean, it probably cost just as much as a FMIC (at least the SMIC in my car was cheaper to make). Unless you rally your MS6, there is no point. Same goes with the MS3 but that's a whole different section altogether. Yes, put it right above the engine, one of the hottest components in a vehicle. That's definitely the best place to put a piece that it's intended use is to keep cold air going to the already piping hot turbo.

??? (sadbanana)???

 

[8.5MS3]

the size of the turbo dictates the volume it can flow and therefore the size of the intercooler. less plumbing means quicker spool up. cheaper to make, manufacture etc

 

[TheDirtyGoatee]

Then why is everyone going FMIC? Tell me above the hot engine is smart?

 

[Super Shredder]

tmic intercoolers come on all subarus i dont see what the question is here. TMICs fit the size of the small turbo. 5 feet of pipes filled with moving air from the FMIC, the slower the spool and available HP at low rpms come (lag). When you increase the hp and fueling, you reach higher temps, THEN making the TMIC inefficient. The FMIC switch gets rid of high boost air temps that a hot TMIC heatsoaks and causes, now that there are bolt ons and tuning involved. also the flow cool air across the board works more efficiently in a straighter line. stockish bolt on cars like mine run fine with upgraded TMICs, its when you go DP and beyond stage "2" or 300+ whp that a TMIC even with meth injection just doesnt cut it anymore. people run it but i've been convinced that with a FMIC and tuning, its a much better way to be.

 

[8.5MS3]

not only that but with a fmic the car will run like crap until tuned. the ecu expects air in the engine a certain time after passing the MAF. since the air has to travel a much longer distance and pressurize a much larger volume before entering the engine, people tend to run pig rich on spool up.

also, having a TMIC makes the engine easier to put in different vehicles. if a fmic was in place originally you would need 3 different ones to fit the MS3/MS6/CX7

the main benefit of a fmic is its less prone to heatsoak. unless your going big turbo its not really worth it imo. yes its sitting on a hot engine, but after a few minutes of decent speed its cool again.

 

[Flightmedic]

Why ask why? I say just go to the competitor and have all your troubles solved : ) What car is it that comes with a FMIC that your considering?

 

[Blendercloud]

What 8.5 and SS have said are all legitimate reasons why Mazda could have and probably did use a top-mounted intercooler for the MZR 2.3 DISI turbo.

In summation, here is a list of factors:
1. Reduced lag
2. Modular design for future platforms (MS3, CX-7)
3. Lower cost
4. TMIC is efficient for the intended design (stock engine)
5. Crash rating - With a TMIC, the car remains functional even after a moderate front impact without redesigning the front crash bar system on each of the above-mentioned platforms.

 

[TheDirtyGoatee]

I wasn't saying I was looking for a turbo car with a FMIC... I was just curious. You've given me the answer.

 

[FORZDA 1]

Lots of rational reasons here why a TMIC is used rather than a FMIC, but I think we've missed the most important one. Note that those cars that DO have a FMIC from the OEM are usually very tiny, about the size of a cigar box. The FMIC interferes with airflow through the air conditioning condensor and the radiator itself, no matter how small. The OEM must provide a setup that will function well in ANY anticipated environment and WARRANTY the setup for at least several years. Note that the Mazdaspeed Protege and Miata have very small OEM FMICs to minimize airflow issues and provide a reasonable amount of charge cooling for the intake side. Many OEMs mount their ICs on the side, completely out of any appreciable airflow for these same reasons. The TMIC with appropriate airflow ducting, like in the Speed6, is the very BEST compromise for a fully OEM, long-term warrantied vehicle. The Suby version puts their TMIC scoop at the lowest pressure point on the hood rather than the highest (like the Speed3/6 at the leading edge) which makes it a worse compromise. YMMV and I don't care....

 

[Blendercloud]

Excellent point made about the ducting location comparison.

 

[Glocker23]

I have an Auto Exe TMIC and love it. not going crazy with mods anymore so I am happy right where I am

 

[SMOKEYS36SHOP]

kinda off topic but where the hell did you get your dyno done glocker23? 291 whp with a tmic, cai tip and dp is really frickin high without a tune? im really confused?

 

[8.5MS3]

kinda off topic but where the hell did you get your dyno done glocker23? 291 whp with a tmic, cai tip and dp is really frickin high without a tune? im really confused?

yea thats high even for an MS3 and we dont have AWD power loss

 

[Glocker23]

AWD dyno at "THE SHOP" in Norwalk CT. Got the print out at home. I will try to scan it and post it up

 

[SMOKEYS36SHOP]

hmmm how much did it cost for the dyno? i didnt know there was an awd dyno so close to me...that would take me a little over an hour to get there.

 

[Super Shredder]

220whp stock w/ tmic 240whp w/dp 270hp cai/inlet 280hp + correction factor?


ricer math ftw

 

[Glocker23]

hmmm how much did it cost for the dyno? i didnt know there was an awd dyno so close to me...that would take me a little over an hour to get there.

It was like 5 pulls for 125 i think. the guys there are great. but brace yourself cuz god damn its a suby and evo place. amongst other high enders