spark plugs necessary with cobb ap?

I've searched around and I have found some answers. However I still have some questions about whether or not it is a necessity to upgrade to 1 step colder plugs if I am going to purchase an AP in the future. I'm currently running a COBB DP, and a CPE CAI. I was going to purchase the AP when I receive my next pay check and was wondering is it absolutely essential that i need to upgrade my plugs? I currently live in San Francisco where it's about 55-66 degrees on average, if that has anything to do with it...And if I don't upgrade my plugs and I DO run an accessport, what problems am I looking at? Any help would be appreciated!
 
I'll take a stab at an answer.

First, I do not have a tune. I'm on stock ECU.

Second, I do have a catless dp/rp exhaust system that does raise boost about 2 pounds. So I can usually run 18 psi with no creep in the higher gears, and especially in cooler weather do run into load cut with transient spikes in the 20-21 psi range that immediately taper back to 17-18 and hold to my preferred shift point of 5,500-5,800 rpm.

With my intake and exhaust mods I consider my car border line for needing one step colder plugs. Most experienced people say that once you go up about 40 whp in power over your stock heat range plugs or increase boost by approximately 2 psi, you are a candidate for colder plugs. I'm at that point.

Third, Cobb's maps for AP are designed and tested to work best with the one step colder plugs. It would make sense to follow their recommendation. You will get more predictable results and will be better able to address any tuning issues without wondering if the plugs are creating issues of their own. One less variable to contend with.

The thinking is that you want to run the hottest plug you can without getting into knock retard with the engine pulling back timing to keep you from getting detonation. Detonation can kill your engine.

The thinking is also that you want to run the coldest plug you can without fouling the tip. If you are not getting a hot enough spark and not completely burning the mixture, you get random misfires and/or foul the tip of your plugs. The colder plug will help prevent harmful detonation and help to keep your the timing advance your tune wants to allow, provided you do not pull so much heat away that it fouls on you. When your ECU pulls timing to try to avoid knock, you loose power.

So, you want to find that happy medium in which your plugs don't foul, but you are getting extra protection against detonation/knock without pulling timing back. These are not mutually exclusive concepts.

For me, running in a Deep South high temperature environment which can exacerbate the problem, and since I'm right on the edge of needing the colder plugs, even without a tune, I decided to go one step colder. This works for me.

I'd rather run a risk of a misfire or fouled plugs than run the disasterous and expensive risk of detonation or losing even more power by having the ECU pull timing back.

When in doubt, I'd rather run the risk of fouling plugs and having to clean them, than run the risk of burning a hole in one or more pistons.

For you, since you already have the dp, aren't you seeing a couple pounds more boost than stock already in combo with the increased breathing on the intake side with your CAI? You should be. Taking that into consideration, I'd say that you should consider getting the colder plugs and put them at the same time that you activate the AP and start playing with its maps and tuning. Cobb wants you to do that. Cobb will probably tell you to narrow the gap down to .028 or even .026. This will tend to help keep the spark intensity up in the high boost, rich fuel DISI environment in which they will be asked to fire.

Others may disagree. Maybe a word from AP users? I would doubt you would find very many of them still running stock heat range plugs, but I defer to them.
 
Last edited:
Nice post MSMS3

yea i'd get 1 step colder plugs.

lots of people including myself run denso itv-22 plugs. shop around for the best price.
 
I'm running stock plugs with the AP for over 5000 hard driven miles with no problems. You have a DP so it's more of a must for you to upgrade.
 
Last edited:
i am about to order catless dp fmic one step colder plugs and ap tuner is there a map for this with the catless all i see is the catted
 
I don't think Cobb can legally recommend using its tuning products on a catless vehicle, with perhaps the exception of a known dedicated race car that never sees public roads.

I'm not an AP user, so you'll have to ask around here to see what maps and/or custom tune adjustments might work with catless dp/rp combo.

I am running the Hypertech tune catless and it is working great. For legal reasons they can't say anything on the subject publicly, and I understand that. But it works great. So I'm sure there is either a map or a custom tune for AP that will fit your needs.
 
I should have my one steps installed in a couple days and will report any apparent differences running the COBB tune in comparison with the stock plugs
 
Still waiting for my plugs :( Tracking shows that they will be in on Monday so hopefully I will have some time to install them that evening.
 
Denso ITV22 plugs are installed! Got them in yesterday and installed last night. Took about 1 hr of easy work, taking my time not to drop the new plugs during install. Dont forget to buy dielectric grease and copper anti seize like i did and had to go back to the auto store. Also, fyi...the plugs do not come with or need crush washers. the ends are tapered to fit into the ports.

I have driven the car for about 20 miles of street driving and can say that my first impressions are that the motor feels and runs smoother. Throttle is a bit more responsive, and feels more accurate than before. So far so good.
 
Last edited:
Do NOT use anti-seive on spark plugs with silver coating!

I tried to find a pic of new IVT22s, but no luck.

Do IVT22s have copper threads, or are they plated shiny silver like most are nowadays? If plated, anti-seize is NOT meant to be used.

Since reading this document, I never use anti-seize on silver-coated plugs.
 

Attachments

  • NGKSP-0907-1-Anti-SeizeonSparkPlugs.pdf
    85.6 KB · Views: 166
Also, see this link directly from Denso...

http://www.globaldenso.com/en/products/aftermarket/plug/basic_knowledge/installation/index.html

The info in the above two posts should really be stickied somewhere. Many of us are so used to using anti-seize (myself included, being an old-timer) that we don't realize it is not only no longer necessary, but can actually be harmful.

Thanks for that info....I was not aware of this. Last time I changes plugs was in a 68 Chevy truck lol. Well the good thing I guess is that I made sure not to over torque them, and applied the anti seize to about 3 of the threads. But for the future, Im sure I will follow the manufactures recommendations. Reading in the forums, most are still applying the lube as well.
 
yes its a good idea but not necessary until you start running more boost and timing. if you just install colder plugs on a fairly stock ms3 then u will actually loose alittle power. they dont make your car faster they help keep the cylinder temps in check whenever you start pushing your motor hard and increasing cylinder pressure. and btw use the denso's cause they work better than the ngk's
 
Back