question for those without ABS
- Thread starter winston3x
- Start date
thecrash91
Member
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- 2003.5 Mazdaspeed Protege
its not too bad as long as your rotors are good and when you break it doesnt veer to one side, only had breaks lock up once and i was prob going like 40 and braked hard on gravel, stayed perfectly straight
mp3-79bronco
Member
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- 2001 protege mp3
i wish i had abs...it would have saved my ass once already... i had my brakes lock up when i was goin really fast around a corner, and it threw me sideways into a ditch..
carter1551
Member
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- 03 Mp5
I dont have abs and the only time my wheels locked up was in the rain and i was following too close to the car in front of me anyway. Good thing i was able to stop, the car in front of me was a vet. Just be smart and keep a little extra distance between you and the car in front of you and youll never have to wonder "what if i had abs"
ABS doesn't make you stop faster, it actually can lengthen the stopping distance a bit. What it does is allow you to panic brake and SIMULTANEOUSLY steer around/away from danger, because every time it lets off the brakes, you regain some traction. A skilled driver withour ABS will out stop an average driver with ABS, all else being equal.
One note: IF you have ABS, and need to stop NOW, jam that brakE pedal with all your might. I mean put both feet on it and stand the hell up. Why? Finessing ABS brakes in a panic stop situation will not extract 100% of the brakes performance, you will fall far short. Again, the purpose of ABS is to allow traction while braking, so as to be able to steer and avoid hitting something, NOT shorten shopping distances. If you don't engage ABS, and steer away from disaster, you will probably come out the loser.
Non-ABS brakes are the opposite. You better not stand on them in a panic, as you'll lock up and slide in the direction of your travel, ie into whatever made you jam on the brakes in the first place. YOu need to finesse them, and if you can, you will be able to outstop a P5 with ABS. You just won't be able to steer around danger while outstopping it.
My Impreza had ABS...and it sucked. It triggered WAY too easily, it's a known Subie problem. My P5 doesn't have ABS, but they are WAYYY better stoppers than my Subaru ever was. I cant wait to get the AS tires off, and some sticky summers on. And some EBC Reds. And new rotors. Maybe stainless brake lines. Motul fluid. YOu know...
MOD BUG! GET AWAY FROM ME!
One note: IF you have ABS, and need to stop NOW, jam that brakE pedal with all your might. I mean put both feet on it and stand the hell up. Why? Finessing ABS brakes in a panic stop situation will not extract 100% of the brakes performance, you will fall far short. Again, the purpose of ABS is to allow traction while braking, so as to be able to steer and avoid hitting something, NOT shorten shopping distances. If you don't engage ABS, and steer away from disaster, you will probably come out the loser.
Non-ABS brakes are the opposite. You better not stand on them in a panic, as you'll lock up and slide in the direction of your travel, ie into whatever made you jam on the brakes in the first place. YOu need to finesse them, and if you can, you will be able to outstop a P5 with ABS. You just won't be able to steer around danger while outstopping it.
My Impreza had ABS...and it sucked. It triggered WAY too easily, it's a known Subie problem. My P5 doesn't have ABS, but they are WAYYY better stoppers than my Subaru ever was. I cant wait to get the AS tires off, and some sticky summers on. And some EBC Reds. And new rotors. Maybe stainless brake lines. Motul fluid. YOu know...
MOD BUG! GET AWAY FROM ME!
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klickfeuer
Member
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- 2003 Mazda Protege 5
ABS. I can't say that I'm against it, but if you really want to stop....Now!, then they are great! But the thing about that is most people, including myself, panic slightly when, oh , i dont know, the drunk guy in front of you come off the on ramp onto the thru-way, cuts you off and then for no reason slams the brakes at 70 mph at 2100 at night. did i hit him, no, but the panic caused me to lock up the brakes and come to a complete stop on the I-64. well, the guy flipped off the exit ramp in an suv that rolled multiple times in the grass. (**** that guy) I digress... if you are looking for a more fun ride then non-abs is the way to go. But anyone that they are dealing with it for the first time, you have to practice with them at different speeds. learn how to give just enough pressure to right before they lock up for maximum effectiveness. yeah.
thecrash91
Member
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- 2003.5 Mazdaspeed Protege
+1
you need to get used to it. but its not bad, just adds about 80 bucks every 6 months for insurance for me cuz im 18
you need to get used to it. but its not bad, just adds about 80 bucks every 6 months for insurance for me cuz im 18
the last owner of my car did a standard sears brake job last time, and i can tell you without a doubt that in the dry it goes straight as an arrow with threshhold braking. absolutely beautiful, drama free. unless you have upset the balance of the car immediately before braking, ie swerved or used some other steering wheel input, the car will should go in the direction you are traveling, wet or dry.
I also live in Nashville. I don't care to have ABS. My wife's cars always have it. It's fine for her, but I don't like it. You need to go somewhere safe, (track, airport, emty parking lot) and practice panic stops. This is the best way to learn control. Then if somebody pulls out in front of you, then you won't panic and lock it up. We like to go out is closed areas and slide around and goof off too much. I think it's more fun without it. Plus no repairs to worry about. Most higher mileage Hondas and even lower mileage VWs we had have problems with the ABS system.
Rockin03mp5
Member
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- '13 Mazda3 / '13 Edge / Your Mom
have had cars with, and without, and i much prefer NOT having abs.
i do not like when i am trying to stop and the car is pushing back.
when i was on a hill, in snowy conditions, and am only going 5 mph, and want to stop, the abs would not let me. in my p5, without abs, i have never had this problem.
if someone jumps out in front of you, with or without abs you are screwed. best bet is to not hit the brakes and try to go around, unless you do not have that option, then you aren't going to stop either way.
in normal driving, you should be paying attention enough to compensate, or leaving enough distance to never need abs. the only time i have ever locked up the brakes is in the winter. and then, you just let off again.
i do not like when i am trying to stop and the car is pushing back.
when i was on a hill, in snowy conditions, and am only going 5 mph, and want to stop, the abs would not let me. in my p5, without abs, i have never had this problem.
if someone jumps out in front of you, with or without abs you are screwed. best bet is to not hit the brakes and try to go around, unless you do not have that option, then you aren't going to stop either way.
in normal driving, you should be paying attention enough to compensate, or leaving enough distance to never need abs. the only time i have ever locked up the brakes is in the winter. and then, you just let off again.
I did an expensive 3 day driving school last year, security driving for bodyguards, not racetrack driving. We did a lot of abs work. They set up a cone lane, curved like a standard street corner and about the same radius. They put a cone 'gate' 20 feet in front of the lane, and told us to wait to brake until the gate, and try to navigate the curve. We tried, and either b came in cautiously at 30 or so, or came in hot and blew cones. Then the instructor said 'watch me'. He came in at an impossible radar verified 60, braked at the cones, and navigated the lane without touching a cone.
The problem we were having was not engaging the abs fully. You really have to put all your strength behind it to engage it, which then allows the abs to stutter the braking and you to turn while braking in a controlled manner. I am a very strong, fit 190lb male, but the 280lb guy had a distinct advantage on me: he could simply apply more pressure to the brake, and engage the abs more.
Braking with abs = brute force at the brake, steady hands on the wheel. Braking without abs = finesse the brake pedal, don't panic and stiffen up, and modulate the pedal if it starts to lock up.
The problem we were having was not engaging the abs fully. You really have to put all your strength behind it to engage it, which then allows the abs to stutter the braking and you to turn while braking in a controlled manner. I am a very strong, fit 190lb male, but the 280lb guy had a distinct advantage on me: he could simply apply more pressure to the brake, and engage the abs more.
Braking with abs = brute force at the brake, steady hands on the wheel. Braking without abs = finesse the brake pedal, don't panic and stiffen up, and modulate the pedal if it starts to lock up.
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- -- 03 P5 / 23 CX-5 --
c/s rotors, kevlar metallic pads, goodridge ss lines, good tread on tires & knowing what your car will do in any situation....priceless. ABS....not so much. Waste of engineering for people who don't care about doing things for themselves & needing someone or something to take up the slack for them. Too many things like that nowadays. More s*** to be scammed by at the dealer cause those folks can't work on their cars either. Too much of that s*** nowadays too. Self sufficiency rules!!!!
klickfeuer
Member
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- 2003 Mazda Protege 5
yeah that's the best thing that i can think of to do is just practice "freaking out" that way when an actual event comes along, you will know how much pressure to apply when in the situation without locking up your s***
thecrash91
Member
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- 2003.5 Mazdaspeed Protege
or you can pump the brakes manually
Rockin03mp5
Member
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- '13 Mazda3 / '13 Edge / Your Mom
or practice not "feaking out"
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- Protege5 2003
I am a not terribly fit 145lb male and once broke the master cylinder on a Honda Accord with a hard stop. In order to avoid smashing a squirrel on a city street (hey, I like the fuzzy little guys, and there was nobody behind me) I stomped the brakes enough to lock the tires and screeched down from 30MPH to 0. The brake light came on midway through the stop, and the next time I pumped the brakes they were gone. Limped home the last two blocks at 5MPH using the emergency brake, popped the hood, and the master cylinder was cracked and completely empty.
My point being, that "stomping the brake" pedal may be too much for the master cylinders in some cars. Not that that should ever be the case, but having experienced it, I can tell you it can be.
