MS3 at high speeds?

[maybemazda]

Hi again, I started another thread asking general thoughts about the mazdaspeed compared to the MKV. Good thread good answers, as I said before I drive a Legacy GT which is all good and fine but I will be getting a new car in about a year. Anyways while I was driving today and approaching fairly high speeds I didnt feel particular comfortable in this car. I am talking about 90-120 mph. I dont want to hear the morally corrupt people asking me why I need to to go that fast when they own a car with speed in the title, so lets just not go there. Now even in an STI I dont feel these speeds are comfortable and that is a VERY high performance machine. You may ask "what is stable at those speeds?". I drove a C43 AMG at around 145 and I felt like I was going 60 so maybe I have very high expectations, but even the current GTI was more stable than my Legacy at those speeds. So, is the MS3 sound at high speeds?
THX

 

[Mocoso]

An STI is NOT a VERY HIGH PERFORMANCE machine btw... but to get back on topic:

Stability at 90-120 MPH range is defined not only by the weight, weight distribution including center of gravity, tires, and the suspension but also by the aerodynamic characteristics of the car.... you can put a big ass wing in the back, tweak the front spoiler and rear diffuser but the basic shape of the car will have a huge impact on the aerodynamics of the car.... a lot of people fail to realize how much work and effort is placed on the UNDERSIDE of a high performance car to increase stability at high speeds.

The reason that C43 AMG feels more stable at 145 is due to the sum of parts - its part weight, weight distribution, shape, suspension, aerodynamic characteristics, and tires - it is also far more expensive than a MS3 - 20 something grand is only going to get you so much.....

For the price range the MS3 holds its own on the stability side at high speed but the suspension is too soft, the rear too light, and the underside has very little in the aero design area for it to compete wth cars in the trully high performance arena.... the STI btw suffers from the same types of problems and what it gains in weight distribution it loses in the aerodynamics of a brick area.....(my def. of high performance starts at the likes of a C6 Corvette and the types of cars that can match it or beat it - sheer speed need not apply)

Look at the underside of a C6 corvette, porche, or SL55 AMG and you will notice that there is a lot of thought placed as to how air will flow under the car....they are designed to create a huge amount of downward force as speeds increase - it isnt all done by a big ass wing in the back

I was actually pleased with how the MS3 handles at high speed as I expected much worse but the car doesnt get too nervous. The only complaint is the suspension is too soft and noticeable at high speeds

 

[maybemazda]

Yeah the suspension on the LGT is WAAAAY to soft for a car that big. I was not compfy at all. Maybe I am aiming to high but I want the handling as well as the speed. I shouldnt have used the words HIGH performance machine to characterize the STI maybe, but for what it is, I expected some amount of stability at high speeds, and there was NONE. It felt like it was on roller skates. Like I said though, the GTI performs admirably at high speeds. The engine falling out thing may just kill the MS3 for me. The GTI will take the hit on speed but at least it wont have the engine fall. I figure for a couple g's I can make the GTI at least as fast as the MS3. Only time will tell though, if the engine falling deal is fixed by the 08 model, I will pick one up for sure. I prolly just need to test one to get a feel. Ill know if it can handle at high speeds after driving it at the dealer for a bit. thx for the polite response.

 

[BuckDich]

I love how everyone is jumping to conclusions here. "I'd love to get a MS3, but I just don't have the time to deal with the engine falling out." That's like saying, "I wish I could fly to go visit my relatives but I don't want to crash into a building."

 

[maybemazda]

I love how everyone is jumping to conclusions here. "I'd love to get a MS3, but I just don't have the time to deal with the engine falling out." That's like saying, "I wish I could fly to go visit my relatives but I don't want to crash into a building."

LOL there are prolly less plane crashes. The part about not having time to deal with the engine falling out...thats a joke right? Why do you act like that is a normal occurence? Why do you act like every car suffers from this problem? Its lunacy. No conclusions are jumped to, only reality here. If the problem is fixed for 08 or the dealer that sells me my 07 can in some way prove to me that the problem has been handled then I will buy one. Plus your comparison sucked, it would work if ALL car companies had the engine falling out of the car...not only mazda. (eyeballs)

 

[dommo_g]

It felt fairly stable at 140. But like the other guy said, the suspension was a little soft. There was a small amount of float. I have a SRT-4 with coilovers, and other suspension mods, and god damn that thing is a pain in the ass as a daily driver, but at 155 it felt really attached to the road. So suspension mods for the MS3 will probably be at the top of the list as soon as there's more options.

 

[zoom-zoomhatch]

I'm sorry, my post and others about the failure may be misleading, the engine doesn't "fall out of the car" all hollywood style taking out cars behind you and causing mass histeria, the mount bolt breaks and the engine falls down on the side where it isn't held in place but in the cases I've heard of the other two mounts hold it in the engine bay itself still.

 

[maybemazda]

I'm sorry, my post and others about the failure may be misleading, the engine doesn't "fall out of the car" all hollywood style taking out cars behind you and causing mass histeria, the mount bolt breaks and the engine falls down on the side where it isn't held in place but in the cases I've heard of the other two mounts hold it in the engine bay itself still.

Yah I see, it does concern me though. After hearing about it though, I am surprised everyone isnt just going in with a wrench and some locktite. Or at least having a mazda dealer check it out.

 

[desperado-c]

Yah I see, it does concern me though. After hearing about it though, I am surprised everyone isnt just going in with a wrench and some locktite. Or at least having a mazda dealer check it out.

Dealers won't do anything without a TSB, so bringing it to the dealer when it isn't obviously loose is a waste of time. I know this from experience. And, personally, I didn't want to extract the bolt for loctiting myself since I don't want to give them any excuse to blame me if it does fall out on its own. I did, however put a torque wrench on it and make sure it was at least 80 ft/lbs tight. IIRC, this is about half way b/t the two different specs that The Man posted way back when (one was for engine removal and one for tranny removal as I recall). I'll probably check it once every 2 month or so. It's a little bit of a pain to take out the battery box for access to the bolt, but not too bad.

 

[Antonio DiMarco]

It depends on the dealer...and perspective

Dealers won't do anything without a TSB, so bringing it to the dealer when it isn't obviously loose is a waste of time. I know this from experience. And, personally, I didn't want to extract the bolt for loctiting myself since I don't want to give them any excuse to blame me if it does fall out on its own. I did, however put a torque wrench on it and make sure it was at least 80 ft/lbs tight. IIRC, this is about half way b/t the two different specs that The Man posted way back when (one was for engine removal and one for tranny removal as I recall). I'll probably check it once every 2 month or so. It's a little bit of a pain to take out the battery box for access to the bolt, but not too bad.

Whether a dealer does or does not look into an issue without a TSB is up to the dealer. My dealer has always looked into any issue (TSB or not) that I have reported. It all goes back to how much the dealer values customer service.

The engine falling out thing is a perfect example of an issue can get blown out of proportion quickly. The funny thing is that if you look back on history VW has probably had more catastrophic defects than Mazda. It's just that the Speed 3 is current. Whose to say the VW GTI won't have a similar issue two months from now.

One thing people fail to realize is that manufacturers are at the mercy of their parts suppliers. While a manufacturer does apply some level of quality control they can't test EVERY part- it's not cost effective, especially when you're dealing with tight profit margins. Issues with specific lots of parts happen all the time. If any of you looked at Consumer Reports in the 90's you'd notice that EVERY Japanese manufacturer- including the mighty Toyota- had horrible electrical and hardware issues. Why becasue they were all using a specific lot of Nippon-Denso parts.

And engine mount failing is bad, but let's keep some perspective.

 

[Rainman]

Check out the thread of the MS3 at 155 mph on the Autobahn. The video can be seen at Sport Compact Car. The car looked rock solid at that speed.

R

 

[mcb]

I didnt had the gut to take it over 210 and at that speed the car was very stable. The braking from 200 to 80 was strong and precise. you can modulate the breaking the abs is just going in when necessary.

Now where can i find an airport strip to go to 250 (laugh) would be to crazy to go at that speed on public roads (drive2)

 

[Mocoso]

Its a 10K repair bill paid by Mazda if it happens... at that run rate I doubt Mazda would allow any more MS3's to be sold until the issue was resolved if it was a recurring and highly probable issue. Not to mention a recall notice would have gone out by now... there isnt even a TSB on it which is the first step car makers take to fix issues like this

Like I said in the other thread.. this is a forum.. you will hear about every single horror story and I assure you I doubt any 08 (or even current production) MS3 will have this issue.

If the engine drop scares you that much I suggest you visit the VW forums and get a feel for the issues they are running into with their "pimp ride" - I suspect you will find a few horror stories like the engine falling out (theirs are more tranny related) -

 

[dommo_g]

I didnt had the gut to take it over 210 and at that speed the car was very stable. The braking from 200 to 80 was strong and precise. you can modulate the breaking the abs is just going in when necessary.

Now where can i find an airport strip to go to 250 (laugh) would be to crazy to go at that speed on public roads (drive2)

I slowed from 140 to about 65 really fast, and I got a headache. Good brakes on this car.

 

[adamsredms3]

It felt fairly stable at 140. But like the other guy said, the suspension was a little soft. There was a small amount of float. I have a SRT-4 with coilovers, and other suspension mods, and god damn that thing is a pain in the ass as a daily driver, but at 155 it felt really attached to the road. So suspension mods for the MS3 will probably be at the top of the list as soon as there's more options.

I agree. Feels like the car could use a little bit more rebound control. I had an SRT-4 before and with some suspension work it was stable at 140+. I'd love to get some of the weight up front - out back, but for now I have the wheel telescoped all the way out while still giving myself a comfortable and controlled distance between me and the steering wheel. Getting some of your body weight shifted towards the rear is a nice, inexpensive handling upgrade.

Being only a week old, I've limited my MS3 to 120 a few times but everything felt fine to me. At those speeds, no matter what car your driving, all your actions must be smooth and focused so you can avoid any costly mistakes. And if you feel like it is too fast, that brake pedal has to be one of the best I have felt in a long time.

 

[ReFlex]

For what i thought and don't quote me on this, their is a TSB coming out soon and the problem with this ordeal about the engine falling is a single washer on bolt #4 and not the tighten of the bolt...Believe me, i don't think it so happens that the same bolt on a few MS3 was loose...

 

[camrycev6]

I have had my MS3 up to about 90-110 (This morning too...until I saw a cop.) on several occasions for short periods of time. It always felt smooth to me at those speeds. Like others have said, sudden movements, braking, etc., all will effect how the car feels to you. Feelings aside, multiple reviews on the car by professionals have said the car is and feels stable (to them of course) at high speeds.

 

[Rainman]

Does anyone know what the spring rates are for the MS3? I haven't had a chance to look this up yet, but I wonder how they compare to the spring rates of the MSP. In comparison, I found my MSP to be more intimately connected to the ground. Weight probably has something to do with it, but so too does spring rate I would imagine.

R

 

[Ms3InMd]

I think that this car feels very stable at high speeds. I was doing 130 down 95 this afternoon until a car cut me off. Even then while braking it felt great. Though I wouldn't reccommend making any sudden movements at that speed.

 

[Speedy3]

I think that this car feels very stable at high speeds. I was doing 130 down 95 this afternoon until a car cut me off. Even then while braking it felt great. Though I wouldn't be making sudden movements at that speed.

Hmmm....Wonder how DSC will perform at those speeds.....Anyone up for a test?