Mazda 3 Sport Gear box, First Gear

[GoooN]

Hi, I bought a 3 sport last month and absolutely LOVE it, my only problem is with the 6 speed manual gear box, I have some real difficulty with putting it into 1st and sometimes into 2nd. I know most of the guys on this site are yanks and therefore probably have automatics but if anyone has manual transmission do you know if there's any 'knack' to putting it into first? Is there actually a limiter that stops you going into first when you're not at stand still and also stops you going into second when you're travelling too fast? Just a thought

 

[tsunami]

6 speed? is it a speed version? yes there are limiters that you can't put it into first unless you are less then a few miles an hour or really force it. as far as second goes i haven't had an issue with it but mine is a 5 speed. whats up with sayin us yanks can't drive a stick eh???

 

[GoooN]

Ha my impression was that most yanks had automatic cars? I was trying to reason why Europeans (English people especially) haven't gone the same way, one person I know raised the point that in America you have lots stop signs which would be fairly irritating having to change gear all the time. Also, in Britain the roads are particularly undulating and full of turns which might make manual transmission more appealing. with the gear box, I'm gradually getting used to it.

 

[Betelgeuse]

Yes us yanks do tend to love the automatics. Fortunately some of us have seen the light . I have a 6-speed (ms3) and yes it does 'lock' you out of first when moving above 5 mph or so although with a little force it can be put into gear but that's not recommended. Second is similar at higher speeds as well. You have to get used to it.

 

[tsunami]

moved to ms3 section.... good luck with the new car!

 

[Kooldino]

My yank ass has 4 vehicles - all of them manual.

That said - does it make any noise going into gear?

You could always try upgraded gear oil.

 

[6262MS3]

1st doesn't have a synchro (I think), so it's difficult to get into when moving unless you rev-match. 1st is so short on our cars I don't like to use it for anything other than a dead stop, anyway. I've never had a problem getting into second, but I always try to rev-match when downshifting. I recently put synthetic in the tranny (which makes things much easier in the cold) and it made the shifter action noticeably smoother.

I love how in Europe you can get pretty much anything in a manual, I was in the uk last fall and rented a mercedes sprinter diesel van, it came with a 6-speed. Awesome! Having to shift with the wrong hand on the opposite side of the H-pattern took some getting used to though...

 

[mordant80]

Guys, the car doesn't lock you out of 1st and you don't have to force it. Try this next time you get the chance. Driving along at a speed that 1st is atleast capable of simply push the shifter up towards first and hold it there, it doesn't take much, don't force it. You'll hear the synchro (i think) wind up and when it gets up to speed the shifter will almost fall on in to gear. It's been like this on all other standards I've driven as well. This works with other gears too.. I don't ever force anything in to gear, just hold the shifter towards that gear and when it's ready it will go on in.

If you practice this technique for daily driving it makes for some really smooth shifts. Shifter goes in to gear when ready, release the clutch almost immediately after and you've got a super smooth shift. May take some practice for some of ya.

 

[jeffmsp]

rev...match... how could you not know this if you have been driving manual trans all your life?

 

[TheDoc]

Keep in mind it's not recommended to shift in to first at over 20mph as per the owner's manual.

 

[LukeP]

Double clutching makes engaging 1st while rolling a lot easier. Or, try blipping the throttle. Second gear never game me any problems, but I think on your roads you probably are best with third when you think you should be using second. Generally if I'm rolling at all, I'll use second. Idle speed in second is like 4 km/h anyway, so just go off the clutch, roll on the throttle after and it will pull away no problem. Has anyone tried launching from second? I wonder if that would actually improve the 0-60 times.

Do you have the Mazda 3 MPS? That's what we call the Mazda'speed' 3. I actually prefer the term MPS, because people keep incorrectly calling it the (southern american accent) Mahzda Three Speed! and that aggravates me to no end. If you do, then you have the same transmission as us.

Since second is also so short, I noticed that going around corners it was already doing 2000 revs or so, but only 1500 in third. This means that you'll also have to double-clutch downshifts to second when making turns, or use third, or blip the throttle before going down for a corner. If you're doing 30k or more, just use third anyhow.

My old car revved lower around turns and only had a 5 gears, so second was in it's sweet spot for engagement. This transmission revs a little higher so I've had to get used to double clutching before a turn. I personally find the drive-by-wire throttle system completely unfathomable for rev matching. It takes like a full second before the engine does what my foot tells it to (throttle tip in lag?). Yeah I'm being picky.

 

[amascio]

Seems like I read somewhere (Car&Driver perhaps) that the MS3's had triple cone synchros in the lower 3 gears and double cone synchos on the rest.

And mordant80 you are correct with the idea of gently putting the car into 1st while at speed...the only thing is - why?
These cars have a very low 1st and a veritable crawl is all it takes to take off in 2nd with little bogging.

While you can put the car into 1st gear while traveling up to maybe 10mph, keep in mind that this all happens at the synchronizers cost (wear) - he has to grab hold of, and speed up the internals before the meshing occurs that allows the gear shift lever to finally go into 1st.
In a well designed transmission, properly maintained and correctly driven, the synchros will last the life of the trannie; usually when they are ready to give it up there are other parts in the guts about to go too (counter shaft bearings and various bushings come to mind).

Personally, I don't feel much like wearing out my synchros prematurely and as a result, I don't speedshift and all down shifts are rev matched. My clutch popping days are over too; that s*** just tortures the input shaft.

I street raced a '67 Mustang as a lad and learned by practical demonstration (read blew up a lot of driveline stuff that I had to replace) that every time you stress parts there IS going to be wear and nowadays I try to keep that stuff to a minimum.

Anything over about 3 mph and I just let 2nd do the job.

Cheers all! That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

[GoooN]

fair play, you guys know your stuff. The whole double clutching thing is too complicated for me, I'm not really a "boy racer" as we call it in the UK like you guys. I think it's just a case of getting used to the car, using 3rd around corners that I used to take in 2nd in my old car for starters. I have definately noticed it's harder to use the lower gears from a cold start too, I reckon I'll try some better oil. Cheers guys

 

[amascio]

Hey Gooon, here's a link to the oil I'm using in my Speed trannie - it helped the low temp shifting immeasurably: http://www.fcsdchemicalsandlubrican...ransmission Fluid&category=Transmission Fluid it's a bit pricey tho-

Don't know if you can get it across the pond ....

 

[squidmotion]

i'm a yank, and i hate automatics!

my tundra would have a 'row your own' if it was available!

 

[LukeP]

The whole double clutching thing is too complicated for me, I'm not really a "boy racer" as we call it in the UK

Just put the clutch in, take it out of gear, and release. Then, press it in again as you normally would for a gear change. This syncs the transmission in neutral and should make it easier to downshift.

Boy racers wouldn't do this; it's totally a technique that died when cars started coming with syncros in the transmission (the fifties? sixties?).

I normally don't use it either, but given the choice between rev matching with this drive-by-wire laggy throttle nonsense and double clutching or using third, I'll take either of the latter two.

 

[mordant80]

And mordant80 you are correct with the idea of gently putting the car into 1st while at speed...the only thing is - why?
These cars have a very low 1st and a veritable crawl is all it takes to take off in 2nd with little bogging.

There's just one place I do it.. turning on to my road, it's gravel and has big holes I have to go very very slow over. I downshift from 2nd when turning on to this road going a couple mph. The whole idea about wearing out the synchros though... I mean that's what they're there for and I am by no means hard on them.. forcing it into gear like others are saying is much harder on them then lightly holding the shifter towards first until it slides in like butter.

 

[MSMS3]

fair play, you guys know your stuff. The whole double clutching thing is too complicated for me, I'm not really a "boy racer" as we call it in the UK like you guys. I think it's just a case of getting used to the car, using 3rd around corners that I used to take in 2nd in my old car for starters. I have definately noticed it's harder to use the lower gears from a cold start too, I reckon I'll try some better oil. Cheers guys

Happy New Year, GooN. Do you drive an European MS3 or a normally aspirated 3 Sport?

I guess you saw that your thread got moved here. Maybe most Yanks drive automatic transmission vehicles, but here on this forum we all have 6 speed manuals, because that's the only way Mazdaspeed 3's are made.

I did want to chime in on the observation that if you have the turbo engine, there really is no need to either double clutch or rev match to get into first gear. These cars are geared much lower than they need to be. Second will easily handle any low speed need you have except from a dead stop. Hell, MS3's will boil smoke from the tires in second gear with a 2500-3000 rpm clutch dump from a dead stop on most road surfaces. Even on a drag strip with very sticky surface, the quickest times come by getting out of first gear and short shifting into second ASAP.

 

[GoooN]

hehe, well I've got used to the car a lot now, I've got a normally aspirated mazda 3 (dunno why my thread got moved). I pretty much do all the stuff you guys have been talking about anyway every now and then but I didn;t know it was actually called double clutching or rev matching, it's just something you do anyway. now i'm used to the car I've realised it'll handle pretty much any corner in 3rd and first gear isn't really necessary unless you're going from stop up a hill. I will definately look into that oil you recommended though. Thanks for the help!