broken coil boot

[pasadena_commut]

I've been trying to fix up my 2003 P5 to repair some previous owner's none too skillful repairs. Last weekend it was the broken bumper cover clips. This weekend it was the misrouted air mixer cable, which provided the wonderful feature that air was either cold or hot, but nothing in between. Since that didn't take too long to do, including disabling the auto A/C and defrost

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55382

(thanks zapwizard!) I figured, I'd better change the plugs too.

Everything went fine for three plugs, working left to right, but it went south while pulling the second coil upward (the one attached to the longer wire). As it came out of the hole I could see for about 1/10th of a second that there was a big gap in the top of the little rubber boot which lives down at the bottom of the vertical plastic connector - at which point the little boot fell off and straight back down the hole! Choice words were uttered. I can see that little bugger down there, with about a 1/3 of an inch chunk missing from the outer edge and some of the inner part gone as well. Apparently at the best of times the only thing that holds the boot on is a ridge on the plastic connector, and if the rubber breaks, as here, the boot just falls off. Note there was nothing I could do to prevent this - the first point I saw that the boot was broken was also the instant it fell off.

So I called up a Mazda dealer and it turns out that stupid little piece of rubber costs $40 (KJR118T08), whereas an entirely new coil is $89.67 (ST8518100C). I didn't have any forceps long enough to get down into the hole to remove that rubber, so I carefully pushed the coil back into place, tightened up the bolts, and luckily it made a decent connection - the motor runs and it isn't even rough. So I can wait a little bit before dealing with this mess.

When I do fix this the first problem is going to be getting the broken boot, and any little pieces of it, out of the hole. I'm thinking a nice pair of straight and sharp 10" forceps should do the trick, not that I own anything like that. Is there a simpler tool available for retrieving this boot?

Secondly, I really hate to pay Mazda $40 for a piece of poorly engineered rubber. Is it possible to relocate the existing coils and run a set of 4 normal plug wires? I figure for $40 one can probably obtain a set of wires with the right electrical characteristics that will fit, and have enough cash left over for a few bits of mounting hardware from Home Depot to hold the coils.

Thanks.

 

[terbow]

nology makes a relocation kit (hotwires), so to speak. its kinda pricey but it does what ur asking.

http://www.nology.com/images/mazdaprodege.gif

thers the instructs for ur viewing pleasure.

they run like 185 ish. but you can prolly get an idea of what you need to do?

 

[pasadena_commut]

nology makes a relocation kit (hotwires), so to speak. its kinda pricey but it does what ur asking.

http://www.nology.com/images/mazdaprodege.gif

thers the instructs for ur viewing pleasure.

they run like 185 ish. but you can prolly get an idea of what you need to do?

That's a bit steep. I see that they have a custom wiring harness to hook up the coil packs, as the stock connectors won't reach across the engine to the spot where they relocated the packs. I was thinking of moving the coil packs forward and a bit to the left in the engine bay on brackets that use the existing mounting holes. Then the stock wires should still reach. The packs are about as high as they are deep (not counting own the down tube) so they could be rotated 90 degrees to make both sparkplug wire connectors accessible.

I've been searching a bit in these forums and have found two other threads where the boot has fallen off the coil pack. In 3/3 cases it was the coil pack furthest to the right (the one attached to the long wire). The other two were:

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=33400
http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61272

I wonder if maybe there isn't a little sharp bit somewhere on that plug hole that tends to score the rubber boot so that it gets nicked going in, and then after a couple of thousand heat cycles the rubber splits open so that the boot falls off when one next tries to remove it?

As I said before it's a really stupid design, the only thing holding that boot on once it has been pushed over the little ridge on the down tube is tension from the rubber. Damage the rubber in that region and bad things are going to happen - that same tension will cause the rubber to split. Think of putting a rubber band tightly around a bottle, then nick it with a razor blade - it's going to fall off sooner rather than later.

 

[pasadena_commut]

Here's a little tidbit to file away for future reference.

Mazda wants around $40 for the boot part, and about $90 for a replacement coil part. However it turns out that there is an aftermarket replacement made by Standard Motor Products, their part number is UF-407. It looks the same as the whole coil unit but only costs around $17. Here's a picture:

http://www.smpcorp.com/web_app/catalog/images/UF407.jpg

It's available from a couple of sites, including rockauto. Looks like this is probably the cheapest way to fix the present problem. I'm going to order one and see if it does the trick.

 

[pasadena_commut]

Here's a little tidbit to file away for future reference.

Unfortunately when I ordered the part listed above from RockAuto they didn't have it in stock and neither did the manufacturer. However last week I checked RockAuto again and they had yet another coil listed, this one from Airtex, part 5C1208. With shipping it came to $21.97, and it was in stock.

Well I installed this replacement today and it is identical in all ways but one to the units that were in my car, and which were presumably original equipment. Both are marked "HANSH/N" and "DSC1500" on the side where the one sparkplug wire attaches, and every other marking on the plastic exterior seemed to be the same. The one way it differed is that rather than having a friction grip rubber boot the new one had the boot glued on. (It looked like epoxy but I couldn't be sure.) Oh yes, and it also differed in costing less than 25% of what Mazda wanted for the part.

As for removing the broken boot from the spark plug well, that was really not fun. The small part retriever tool (the flexible thing with claws that come out) didn't have enough room to work. A vacuum couldn't suck out the boot even with several different size tubes taped onto the nozzle. A screwdriver couldn't get under it. Finally I bent a coathanger into a sort of hook/harpoon, with about 1/3" of hook on the end of the straight shaft, bent back at about 80 degrees. The point was inserted between the inner and outer walls of the boot and twisted so that the 'barb" stuck into the outer wall, then when the harpoon was pulled up the boot lifted a bit so that a long screwdriver could then be inserted past the plug and through the hole to keep it from falling down again. Once the boot reached the top of the spark plug hole I was able to grab it with some needlenose pliers and yank it out. Thanks for nothing to the previous owner/mechanic who damaged the boot and then stuffed it back down the sparkplug hole like that.

 

[Groza187]

I need a raplacement for this stupid boot.

 

[pasadena_commut]

I need a raplacement for this stupid boot.

Sure, the boot should cost $5 but it doesn't. So just buy the full replacement Airtex part from rockauto and keep the old coil pack for a spare. If you ever blow the new coil you can try then to move the boot part from the Airtex to the spare.

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

Good stuff, thanks 4 the research. Printed 4 future reference.

 

[Groza187]

AIRTEX Part # 5C1208
(2 Coils Required) More Info
$94.79 $0.00 $94.79

Check out the new price evrybody. I called them yesterday to see if it's a mistake. The guy told me he'll give me a call back today. We'll see what the deal is.

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

AIRTEX Part # 5C1208
(2 Coils Required) More Info
$94.79 $0.00 $94.79

Check out the new price evrybody. I called them yesterday to see if it's a mistake. The guy told me he'll give me a call back today. We'll see what the deal is.

They musta called around & found out what Mazda was selling them for. LOL

 

[pasadena_commut]

AIRTEX Part # 5C1208
(2 Coils Required) More Info
$94.79 $0.00 $94.79

Check out the new price evrybody. I called them yesterday to see if it's a mistake. The guy told me he'll give me a call back today. We'll see what the deal is.

Check out their site again and you'll find they list a second part by a different manufacturer:

http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/catalog.php?carcode=1387447&parttype=7060

which looks like exactly the same part but costs only 10.81:

http://www.rockauto.com/ref/SMP/SMPDetail2.html?UF407.jpg

buy a couple before they change the price on this one too!!!

 

[pasadena_commut]

Also found here:

http://bbb-carb.com/ignitioncoil.htm

(click on UF407)

 

[Groza187]

None of these are available, i called a whole bunch of places and they are all on backorder, But if anybody else ever has this problem Email me @ mop4e@comcast.net. I ended up coming into posession of a whole buch of these things (just the little rubber boots that go over the sparkplug, not the whole coil). Im not gona charge an arm and a leg either.

 

[pasadena_commut]

I ended up coming into posession of a whole buch of these things (just the little rubber boots that go over the sparkplug, not the whole coil).

Interesting choice of words. Did they, um, fall off a truck?
If not, where did you get them and how much were they?

 

[Groza187]

Interesting choice of words. Did they, um, fall off a truck?
If not, where did you get them and how much were they?

I cannot disclose that information.

 

[Quesogrande]

Legitimacy of UF407

So what's the deal with these $13-$22 deals? Are they just the plastic? Is it a refurb? Why does the part cost $22 at some places and $100 at others?

Before I drop $100 on one instead of spending $60 on two plus shipping, has anyone purchased UF407 before?

 

[pasadena_commut]

So what's the deal with these $13-$22 deals? Are they just the plastic? Is it a refurb? Why does the part cost $22 at some places and $100 at others?

Before I drop $100 on one instead of spending $60 on two plus shipping, has anyone purchased UF407 before?

I installed the Airtex part 5C120 from Rock Auto, because the UF407 was out of stock. The 5C120 was, as far as I could tell, identical to the broken one I pulled out of my car, right down to the most obscure surface markings. It wasn't just the plastic, it was the entire part including the boot. There's a remote possibility that original broken coil pack had been replaced before by a previous owner, but I think it's much more likely that there are only one or two sources for this part, Mazda uses all of them, and they just mark up the price - a lot.

The car has had no ignition problems since that coil pack was replaced. I doubt it's a refurb, a part like that would be pretty expensive to take apart, fix, and reassemble - cheaper to just make a new one.

 

[Quesogrande]

I installed the Airtex part 5C120 from Rock Auto, because the UF407 was out of stock. The 5C120 was, as far as I could tell, identical to the broken one I pulled out of my car, right down to the most obscure surface markings. It wasn't just the plastic, it was the entire part including the boot. There's a remote possibility that original broken coil pack had been replaced before by a previous owner, but I think it's much more likely that there are only one or two sources for this part, Mazda uses all of them, and they just mark up the price - a lot.

The car has had no ignition problems since that coil pack was replaced. I doubt it's a refurb, a part like that would be pretty expensive to take apart, fix, and reassemble - cheaper to just make a new one.

Well I bought the $100 version from Roger Beasely Mazda. I only got one, because I needed it pronto. When I replace the other one, I'll get the UF407.

 

[i12drivemyMP5]

Well I bought the $100 version from Roger Beasely Mazda. I only got one, because I needed it pronto. When I replace the other one, I'll get the UF407.

For about 80.00 you coulda done the 1.8 coil swap & have 4 wires & no coils on top of the valve cover.

 

[P-Funk!]

None of these are available, i called a whole bunch of places and they are all on backorder, But if anybody else ever has this problem Email me @ mop4e@comcast.net. I ended up coming into posession of a whole buch of these things (just the little rubber boots that go over the sparkplug, not the whole coil). Im not gona charge an arm and a leg either.

Dang! I went through the exapct same pain - and bough the stock coil just to get the rubber gasket! Oh Well.(inout)