The difference between MSP and Racing Beat springs. Pics.

[JoshP5]

I know this has been discussed for years, but it never seems to get straightened out. Maybe some photographic evidence will put the ambiguity to bed.

MSP springs != Racing Beat springs != MP3 springs.

Front springs (left:MSP, right:RB)

Rear springs (left:RB, right:MSP)

Thickness of front springs (above:MSP, below:RB)

Only the RB springs are labeled, MSP springs don't say anything on them:

Front: MSP/RB
Thickness: 14mm/13.5mm
Height: 30.5cm/30.2cm

Rear: MSP/RB
Thickness: 11.5mm/12mm
Height: 32.7cm/35.1cm

You can see from the photos that the springs are coiled differently. Note the difference in the heights of the rear springs. The MSP spring is shorter corresponding to the higher spring perch on MSP rear struts.

The story behind MP3 springs can be found here. Hopefully now we can call MSP springs "MSP springs," Racing Beat springs "Racing Beat springs," and MP3 springs "MP3 springs" without mixing them up. Just because it's red doesn't mean it's Racing Beat!

 

[Kansei]

yeah.. Mazda kinda just took the racing beat specs and made their own stuff from what I've read.

 

[njaremka]

very good work, thanks.

 

[FlyinHawaiian]

Your pictures are kind of confusing. Which is which in the pictures? The bright/shiny ones look like the RB springs, while the dull mottled ones look like MSP ones, but the labels don't match up. Also, according the Racing Beat website, and what I've gathered from the forms, the MP3 springs are built to the same spec that RB made. Any insight to the truth of this?

 

[benjpi]

okay, so here's my question: I have MSP springs on Tokico's. The front looks a little high. I'm considering cutting the front springs down by 1/2 to 3/4 of one coil to lower the front of the car AND to account for the 10mm gain from the camber plates. So, are the tops of the MSP springs at the same pitch as the remaining coils, or are they 'squished' for a better seat? I'd like to know if anyone here has the answers.

 

[TheMAN]

thank you! I've been saying this for the longest time that they weren't the same! the MP3 springs are NOT the same as the MSP ones either... obviously, neither of them are the same as the real racing beat ones either... so now we need pics comparing all 3 of them... I don't know what the real difference between the MP3 and MSP springs are, but I'm going to guess that the MP3 springs are a bit shorter because the MP3 is a bit lighter than the MSP based on people complaining about how the front of their non-turbo proteges stayed pretty high after installing the MSP springs

 

[Kansei]

Which is weird, because it's not like the manifold + turbo + downpipe is much heavier than the stock cast manifold and downpipe.. or is it? I haven't seen my stock manifold in many years.

Then you have the lightweight side mount intercooler, smaller radiator, some plastic piping.

Is the LSD really heavy or something?

 

[JoshP5]

Your pictures are kind of confusing.

Photo captions edited for clarity.

Also, according the Racing Beat website, and what I've gathered from the forms, the MP3 springs are built to the same spec that RB made. Any insight to the truth of this?

Read the RB website again. It clearly states that Mazda revised the springs for the MP3: the production MP3 springs are softer and ride higher than the prototype springs that RB developed and currently sells.

So, are the tops of the MSP springs at the same pitch as the remaining coils, or are they 'squished' for a better seat?

Check the photo--one side is squished.

...so now we need pics comparing all 3 of them...

If someone sends me a set of MP3 springs, I'd be happy to post the comparison.

Is the LSD really heavy or something?

Don't forget the beefier sway bars and half-shafts!

If you consider the curb weights and weight distributions of the P5 and MSP you come up with the following: The P5 is like 150lbs lighter up front and 50lbs heavier in the rear. But there's some error in those estimates because there are only two significant digits in the weight distribution numbers I have (P5 60/40, MSP 63/37), so maybe +/- 25lbs.

 

[pass the peas]

Looking forward to seeing them installed on the P5. I've seen pics of the MSP springs on the P5, and the drop seems lower in the rear relative to the front. I've been thinking about this suspension set up for a long time. I hope it looks good, because I've been thinking about other springs that I really don't want, based on what the drop might look like.

 

[JoshP5]

Here's a picture of Racing Beat springs installed on a P5, if you can't wait for my installation shots.

 

[Action Jackson]

Here's my old setup.

Just MP3 springs which AFAIK came from an MP3 and said Racing Beat on it.

 

[JoshP5]

^A beautiful example of what happens when you use MP3 springs without MP3 struts.

I started this thread to clear up the ambiguity about the differences between MP3/MSP/RB springs: do you have photos or anything more concrete than "AFAIK"? I'd be interested (and surprised) to know for sure if the MP3 springs say "Racing Beat" on them.

 

[Action Jackson]

I can only tell you what I was told and from what I saw on the springs. I sold them awhile ago.

 

[pass the peas]

Both drops are lower than I imagined. The P5 with apparent MP3 springs does appear a little lower in the rear. The other one is shot at a dramatic angle and the (RX8?)wheels make it difficult to tell about the actual drop, though the photo does make the car look great. JoshP5, are you on factory rims?

 

[JoshP5]

booom was running Mazda3 rims, not RX8. I attached another shot of his car at that time. I'm on aftermarket 16x7s, 40mm offset.

 

[Kansei]

The MP3 springs on that P5 lower it like the goldline springs did my car.. quite a bit lower in the rear than the front. Definitely good to get springs made for the hatchback instead of hoping sedan ones will work.

 

[JoshP5]

The reason MP3/MSP springs drop the rear so much is because the short rear springs were designed to be used in conjuction with MP3/MSP struts, whose rear spring perches are mounted higher than the usual position.

Use of MP3/MSP springs with stock struts, regular HPs, or Illuminas results in too much rear drop--and I wonder if they even fit tight between the spring caps when the suspension is fully extended.

When used together MP3 springs should drop a P5 ~1/2" even. Maybe nominally more in the rear due to some additional wagon weight.

 

[bluenoser]

Just bringing this back up while I wait for delivery of mine(RB/Illuminas). Josh, you have yours on yet? If so, what do you think. Did it reduce the understeer as we hope it will.

Terry.

 

[JoshP5]

I didn't get a chance to install my new setup before my trip to Korea. I'm leaving tomorrow and won't be back in the states for three weeks, so it'll have to wait until then. Probably you'll beat me to it...

 

[FlyinHawaiian]

I didn't get a chance to install my new setup before my trip to Korea. I'm leaving tomorrow and won't be back in the states for three weeks, so it'll have to wait until then. Probably you'll beat me to it...

Let me know when you're back... I'm back home (Frederick, MD) from Penn State and would like to meet up or have you come meet with the big mazda crew in Columbia sometime!

Have fun in Korea: Don't drink the water and don't eat the dog...