Pretty bad case of vibration and humming noise (2022 CX-9)

[Ivan Drago]

Bought '22 CX-9 Touring Plus 3 months ago. Love the car. Or should I say "loved"... Until recently....
When I bought it, the vehicle had 3 OEM Bridgestones and 1 brand new Goodyear installed. Bridgestones had about 6/32 on them, Goodyear - 10/32. Me, being the perfectionist, and knowing that substantial variance in tread wear can cause problems with AWD, decided to buy another 10/32 Goodyear to match the one already installed on it. That's when the problems started.....
I purchased an "used, driven once" Goodyear off of ebay and had it installed (by Mazda dealer). Also had the alignment and 4-wheel balancing done. Started to exprience pretty bad vibration at speeds 40+ mph, getting progressively worse after 70mph. Had the tires balanced five (5) times - twice by dealership, then Discount tire, Pep boys, some random shop... Nothing helped. Decided that the ebay Goodyear tire was probably defective. Had the two Goodeyars replaced with two Michelin Defenders (also used). No change. Vibration changed to where it only happens at 60mph+. But now I also started to experience a weird humming/growling noise coming from front axle. So, I thought it might be a wheel bearing. Or the stupid used Michelins... Or maybe the two remaining OEM Bridgestones (but they were fine when I bought the car). So, I decided f...k this.. and went to Discount tire and bought two new Michelines to replace the OEM Bridgetones. And also had them inspect the two other MIchelins (and they said everything was fine with them, they have about 10/32 tread left and no irregularities or abnormal wear).
After I installed the two new Michelins things got worse.... Vibration at 60mph is now so bad that I hate the car. The humming/growling noise from front axle is still there. Dealer had the wheel bearings checked - said everything is fine...
I'm at a loss... The dealer (Freeman Mazda in Dallas) is great... over the years I've owned two Miatas, two Mazda 3s, another CX-9, and now this '22 Touring Plus, and never had any problems with the dealer, they are always willing to help... but this time I don't really know what to do next. They already had the tires balanced twice at no cost, checked suspension, bearings, etc. and said everything looked fine. Vehicle has 17k miles on it... The humming/growling noise doesn't really change with speed (or when turning), but gets worse when the road gets worse, and is most noticeable when just cruising at around 50mph. Can also feel it on the gas pedal... Feels like something is rubbing... And then at 60mph the vibration kicks in....
Any suggestions will be much appreciated.

 

[N7turbo]

Why was there one new tire? Did the previous owner hit something and cause any damage to a hub, axle, etc? I wonder.

 

[Tchman2016]

You have so many cooks cooking the same soup that its impossible to tell who or what place made an error, including yourself. On an awd car, all 4 tires must be matched and replaced as a set at the same time. That is the problem if you get a damaged tire, it requires a brand new set on all four wheels unless the remaining tires have less than 2/32nds of an inch or less in difference from the new identical tire being replaced. If you don't do this, you WILL damage the transfer case and/or Diff and transmission driving on uneven tread depth tires. You should have just bought 4 brand new tires from the beginning and sold the others on marketplace or something OR demanded the dealer replace all 4 with new. Now, you need to go to another dealer and hope they will find the problem and warranty some work. You should have never accepted the car with 1 completely different brand, tread design and tread depth tire. If you have a hum or grinding noise going on, then that should be where a tech starts and uses mechanics ears to pinpoint the noise. It could all just be a coincidence as well but I would try to see if you can reset the TCM by leaving the negative battery cable off for several hours and also check for any codes stored in the PCM or TCM using a good reader and clear them out first if any exists and see what comes back if anything. These TCM codes will not trip a check engine light on the dash. Good luck

 

[Ivan Drago]

Why was there one new tire? Did the previous owner hit something and cause any damage to a hub, axle, etc? I wonder.

That I don't know. My guess is the previous owner had a puncture. I bought the car used from a Lexus dealer (it was a trade-in). However, please note that when I bought it everything was just fine - i.e. no vibration, humming noise... anything. It drove perfectly fine. For about a month... until I decided to replace the tire. Btw, it was the rear passenger-side tire that was brand new.

 

[Ivan Drago]

You have so many cooks cooking the same soup that its impossible to tell who or what place made an error, including yourself. On an awd car, all 4 tires must be matched and replaced as a set at the same time. That is the problem if you get a damaged tire, it requires a brand new set on all four wheels unless the remaining tires have less than 2/32nds of an inch or less in difference from the new identical tire veing replaced. If you don't do this, you WILL damage the transfer case and/or Diff and transmission driving on uneven tread depth tires. You should have just bought 4 brand new tires from the beginning and sold the others on marketplace or something OR demanded the dealer replace all 4 with nee Now, you need to go to another dealer and hope they will find the problem and warranty some work. You should have never accepted the car with 1 completely different brand, tread design and tread depth tire. Good luck

This is a valid point. However, the symptoms I'm experiencing do not necessarily reflect a transfer case/transmission/AWD problem. Simply because the symptoms can get much better (or much worse) by simply changing tires. The symptoms were moderate when I was running two Bridgestones and two Goodyears (6/32 on Bridgestone, 10/32 on Goodyears). They were still about the same when running two 8/32 Michelines and two 6/32 Bridgestones. They then were minimal when I was running 4 used Michelins, all with about the same treadwear (8/32 - 9/32) - the vibration was almost gone, but the humming noise was present. And, finally, they got progressively worse when running two new 11/32 Michelins on the front axle, and two used Michelins on the rear. I'm going to give it one last try - will have it balanced on the Hunter Roadforce Elite tomorrow; and if that doesn't help will swap them for 4 brand new Pirellis on Fri (thank god Discount Tire has 30-day return policy)... And then if that doesn't help.... then you might be right and my problem is caused a bad transfer case/transmission....

 

[Tchman2016]

This is a valid point. However, the symptoms I'm experiencing do not necessarily reflect a transfer case/transmission/AWD problem. Simply because the symptoms can get much better (or much worse) by simply changing tires. The symptoms were moderate when I was running two Michelins and two Goodyears (8/32 on Michelins, 10/32 on Goodyears). They then were minimal when I was running 4 used Michelins, all with about the same treadwear (8/32 - 9/32) - the vibration was almost gone, but the humming noise was present. And, finally, they got progressively worse when running two new 11/32 Michelins on the front axle, and two used Michelins on the rear.

Go and buy 2 more identical brand new Michelins and have all the wheels road force balanced. You must start fresh. Then reset your TCM after checking for codes stored. Only certain readers can check TCM codes. An auto store reader will not. You can get one on amazon cheap.

 

[Tchman2016]

This is a valid point. However, the symptoms I'm experiencing do not necessarily reflect a transfer case/transmission/AWD problem. Simply because the symptoms can get much better (or much worse) by simply changing tires. The symptoms were moderate when I was running two Bridgestones and two Goodyears (6/32 on Bridgestone, 10/32 on Goodyears). They were still about the same when running two 8/32 Michelines and two 6/32 Bridgestones. They then were minimal when I was running 4 used Michelins, all with about the same treadwear (8/32 - 9/32) - the vibration was almost gone, but the humming noise was present. And, finally, they got progressively worse when running two new 11/32 Michelins on the front axle, and two used Michelins on the rear. I'm going to give it one last try - will have it balanced on the Hunter Roadforce Elite tomorrow; and if that doesn't help will swap them for 4 brand new Pirellis on Fri (thank god Discount Tire has 30-day return policy)... And then if that doesn't help.... then you might be right and my problem is caused a bad transfer case/transmission....

Swap for 4 brand new pirellis absolutely if you can and road force. Don't bother with the road force first. Do it all together on 4 new tires of the same tread depth and style. You may luck out with no damage done. With all this swapping, the TCM can get very confused. I would check for codes and reset anyway.

 

[190018]

Bought '22 CX-9 Touring Plus 3 months ago. Love the car. Or should I say "loved"... Until recently....
When I bought it, the vehicle had 3 OEM Bridgestones and 1 brand new Goodyear installed. Bridgestones had about 6/32 on them, Goodyear - 10/32. Me, being the perfectionist, and knowing that substantial variance in tread wear can cause problems with AWD, decided to buy another 10/32 Goodyear for the front axle. That's when the problems started.....
I purchased an "used, driven once" Goodyear off of ebay and had it installed (by Mazda dealer). Also had the alignment and 4-wheel balancing done. Started to exprience pretty bad vibration at speeds 40+ mph, getting progressively worse after 70mph. Had the tires balanced five (5) times - twice by dealership, then Discount tire, Pep boys, some random shop... Nothing helped. Decided that the ebay Goodyear tire was probably defective. Had the two Goodeyars replaced with two Michelin Defenders (also used). No change. Vibration changed to where it only happens at 60mph+. But now I also started to experience a weird humming/growling noise coming from front axle. So, I thought it might be a wheel bearing. Or the stupid used Michelins... Or maybe the two remaining OEM Bridgestones (but they were fine when I bought the car). So, I decided f...k this.. and went to Discount tire and bought two new Michelines to replace the OEM Bridgetones. And also had them inspect the two other MIchelins (and they said everything was fine with them, they have about 10/32 tread left and no irregularities or abnormal wear).
After I installed the two new Michelins things got worse.... Vibration at 60mph is now so bad that I hate the car. The humming/growling noise from front axle is still there. Dealer had the wheel bearings checked - said everything is fine...
I'm at a loss... The dealer (Freeman Mazda in Dallas) is great... over the years I've owned two Miatas, two Mazda 3s, another CX-9, and now this '22 Touring Plus, and never had any problems with the dealer, they are always willing to help... but this time I don't really know what to do next. They already had the tires balanced twice at no cost, checked suspension, bearings, etc. and said everything looked fine. Vehicle has 17k miles on it... The humming/growling noise doesn't really change with speed (or when turning), but gets worse when the road gets worse, and is most noticeable when just cruising at around 50mph. Can also feel it on the gas pedal... Feels like something is rubbing... And then at 60mph the vibration kicks in....
Any suggestions will be much appreciated.

Since the tires are of different depth, the humming/growling is understandable. But the vibrations is something to be concerned about. I drove my previous honda crv awd for 10k miles with 2 different brand tires with different depths. I felt the road noise to be substantial with huge growl, but I never had vibrations. I would start off with this:

1. Check for damaged rims or loose lug nuts.
2. Check the source of vibration feel, it can be at the steering or the brakes. Based on the source, you can blame the bearings or the rotors. Since you already checked the bearings, have a look at the rotors. (I believe the mechanic to be correct with the bearings as 17k miles is too less for bearings to go bad.)
3. You mentioned vibration at gas pedals. As far as I know, the only time this would happen is when there is a broken CV joint or engine mount. So please check these.

By the way, has the car been in a fender bender or some kind of a curb hit?. Because these kind of things may not have an immediate effect and may take time to develop symptoms, which you might feel now.

Good luck.

 

[Ivan Drago]

Since the tires are of different depth, the humming/growling is understandable. But the vibrations is something to be concerned about. I drove my previous honda crv awd for 10k miles with 2 different brand tires with different depths. I felt the road noise to be substantial with huge growl, but I never had vibrations. I would start off with this:

1. Check for damaged rims or loose lug nuts.
2. Check the source of vibration feel, it can be at the steering or the brakes. Based on the source, you can blame the bearings or the rotors. Since you already checked the bearings, have a look at the rotors. (I believe the mechanic to be correct with the bearings as 17k miles is too less for bearings to go bad.)
3. You mentioned vibration at gas pedals. As far as I know, the only time this would happen is when there is a broken CV joint or engine mount. So please check these.

By the way, has the car been in a fender bender or some kind of a curb hit?. Because these kind of things may not have an immediate effect and may take time to develop symptoms, which you might feel now.

Good luck.

Thanks for your reply. No accidents, at least none on Carfax. I know what a bad rotor feels like because I had one on my previous CX-9 - it doesn't feel anything like that. I don't feel the vibration when braking, only when cruising. The engine mount is actually a good suggestion - and I was thinking about it myself.... because I also have some weird vibrations at idle. It's also idling kinda low - at about 550-600 rpms, but maybe it's normal for a '22 CX-9, can someone confirm?
Anyways.... I guess the plan for now is: 1) roadforce balancing; 2) four new Pirellis; 3) have dealer check the engine mounts, transfer case, differential and transmission (if nothing helps). I had an engine mount fail on my Nissan Murano at 20k miles, so I won't be surprised... And yes, I do feel it on the gas pedal. And it's an extremely weird feeling... Nothing I experienced before on any of my cars (but none of them were AWD) - in addition to "normal" vibration feeling it also feels like something is rubbing against the pedal.... and that rubbing is consisent with that humming/growling noise, meaning when the noise gets worse, the feeling on the pedal gets worse... don't really know how to desribe it better...

 

[Ivan Drago]

Go and buy 2 more identical brand new Michelins and have all the wheels road force balanced. You must start fresh. Then reset your TCM after checking for codes stored. Only certain readers can check TCM codes. An auto store reader will not. You can get one on amazon cheap.

Is there a procedure to reset it manually? Something like turning on ignition and pressing gas pedal for 30 seconds? I know some cars have it.... some don't...

 

[Ivan Drago]

I drove my previous honda crv awd for 10k miles with 2 different brand tires with different depths. I felt the road noise to be substantial with huge grow

This is actually a very interesting take... Because honestly I'm more worried about the humming/growling sounds that the vibrations. The vibrations the dealer was able to eliminate almost entirely after they installed the Michelins - but the tech said it took a lot of weights to get the tires balanced... because that's just how those Michelins are - they are heavy and very hard to properly balance, even on roadforce... At least that's what he said... It's Michelin Defender LTX (in case someone is wondering)...

 

[Tchman2016]

Thanks for your reply. No accidents, at least none on Carfax. I know what a bad rotor feels like because I had one on my previous CX-9 - it doesn't feel anything like that. I don't feel the vibration when braking, only when cruising. The engine mount is actually a good suggestion - and I was thinking about it myself.... because I also have some weird vibrations at idle. It's also idling kinda low - at about 550-600 rpms, but maybe it's normal for a '22 CX-9, can someone confirm?
Anyways.... I guess the plan for now is: 1) roadforce balancing; 2) four new Pirellis; 3) have dealer check the engine mounts, transfer case, differential and transmission (if nothing helps). I had an engine mount fail on my Nissan Murano at 20k miles, so I won't be surprised... And yes, I do feel it on the gas pedal. And it's an extremely weird feeling... Nothing I experienced before on any of my cars (but none of them were AWD) - in addition to "normal" vibration feeling it also feels like something is rubbing against the pedal.... and that rubbing is consisent with that humming/growling noise, meaning when the noise gets worse, the feeling on the pedal gets worse... don't really know how to desribe it better...

I have a 2020 CX-9 GT and one of my major complaints is that it idles too low, same as yours and what this does is cause a lot of excess vibration in the body and in the cabin you can feel and see with these 4 cyl turbo engines that are very pronounced when sitting in gear just standing still. Feeling like an unrefined vehicle with this vibration that just takes away the overall pleasure of owning and replacing it with annoying experience every time you get in. My wifes 2021 CX-5 Sig does this too. Idle set too low. Its just not a smooth idling balanced engine and it really annoys me.

 

[Ivan Drago]

I have a 2020 CX-9 GT and one of my major complaints is that it idles too low, same as yours and what this does is cause a lot of excess vibration in the body and in the cabin you can feel and see with these 4 cyl turbo engines that are very pronounced when sitting in gear just standing still. Feeling like an unrefined vehicle with this vibration that just takes away the overall pleasure of owning and replacing it with annoying experience every time you get in. My wifes 2021 CX-5 Sig does this too. Idle set too low. Its just not a smooth idling balanced engine and it really annoys me.

Interesting. My previous CX-9 was a 2020 Touring. And it idled perfectly fine: at around 700rpms, with no vibrations whatsoever, in gear or not. That's why when I bought this '22 Touring Plus I was kinda surprised....

 

[N7turbo]

Quiet and smooth here, a bit less when cold but that's to be expected of internal combustion.

 

[Ivan Drago]

Update: took it back to Discount Tire where I had the two new Michelins installed. They had all four tires balanced again on the RoadForce Elite. Turned out the two new ones were way out of balance (store manager couldn't explain how... they just installed them a week ago). That's where things got even more weird... After they rebalanced it the vibration was almost gone; the humming noise was still there but less noticeable. I could live with that, at least it was drivable again.... for exactly two days! After two days the vibration was back.

I took it back to DT, they threw it on RF Elite again... and the tires were out of balance again! (and no, I didn't hit any potholes). But this time it was the different tires that were off! One of the new ones (on front axle) was slightly off again, but one of the older Michelins on rear axle was substantially off, even though it was perfectly fine two days ago. So... I'm at a loss here.... Why would the tires not stay in balance?

 

[Tchman2016]

Update: took it back to Discount Tire where I had the two new Michelins installed. They had all four tires balanced again on the RoadForce Elite. Turned out the two new ones were way out of balance (store manager couldn't explain how... they just installed them a week ago). That's where things got even more weird... After they rebalanced it the vibration was almost gone; the humming noise was still there but less noticeable. I could live with that, at least it was drivable again.... for exactly two days! After two days the vibration was back.

I took it back to DT, they threw it on RF Elite again... and the tires were out of balance again! (and no, I didn't hit any potholes). But this time it was the different tires that were off! One of the new ones (on front axle) was slightly off again, but one of the older Michelins on rear axle was substantially off, even though it was perfectly fine two days ago. So... I'm at a loss here.... Why would the tires not stay in balance?

Get rid of all those tires immediately. They suck and/or the shop is not balancing them correctly or not first checking balance correctly or using different people on the machines at any point in time or combination of everything. 1 person should be balancing all 4 tires in a visit, not 2 or 3 people each taking a tire and throwing it on a machine to get the job done quicker.

You need to ditch those horrible tires first and start over

 

[Ivan Drago]

Get rid of all those tires immediately. They suck and/or the shop is not balancing them correctly or not first checking balance correctly or using different people on the machines at any point in time or combination of everything. 1 person should be balancing all 4 tires in a visit, not 2 or 3 people each taking a tire and throwing it on a machine to get the job done quicker.

You need to ditch those horrible tires first and start over

This time it was the store manager himself who rebalanced all four tires and also invited me to stand next to the balancer to watch all the readings.... But yeah, I'm leaning towards putting a set of 4 new tires. Choosing between Pirelli Scorprion AS Plus 3 and Goodyear Assurance Comfortdrive. What's intriguing about Comfortdrive is how light they are - only 29lbs vs. 35lbs for Pirellis (and not only Pirellis but pretty much everything else in this category is 34-35lbs, including Michelins).

 

[N7turbo]

It's too bad Continental doesn't make the DWS06 Plus in our size. I'm actually getting new wheels so I can run them. They are 25-28 lbs.

 

[Tchman2016]

This time it was the store manager himself who rebalanced all four tires and also invited me to stand next to the balancer to watch all the readings.... But yeah, I'm leaning towards putting a set of 4 new tires. Choosing between Pirelli Scorprion AS Plus 3 and Goodyear Assurance Comfortdrive. What's intriguing about Comfortdrive is how light they are - only 29lbs vs. 35lbs for Pirellis (and not only Pirellis but pretty much everything else in this category is 34-35lbs, including Michelins).

Ahhh. That is good. Same balancer for all 4 as well? Those 2 tire choices are top notch. You cant go wrong with either one and they both have rim guards built in. I have those goodyear on my 9 and those pirellis on my wife's 5 after doing extensive research. The comfortdrive do have a stiffer sidewall and load capacity which in turn, provides much better handling and cornering like the car is on rails. Ride is smooth, quiet and tread is wearing well. Only had on for 12k miles but they feel secure with great traction. You will feel the road bumps, expansion joints and imperfections just a bit more but the feel is connected and a trade off for sharper handling/less body roll. The lower unsprung weight of the tire also means quicker acceleration as the rotational mass of the wheel and tire can be propelled as if you had a couple extra horsepower from the engine to the wheels.

The pirellis have only been on for a couple thousand miles on the 5 and they are awesome as well but not as stiff as the Goodyear, although they are on a lighter car but ride is smooth and quiet as well with surefooted traction. If anyone here has a 9 with the 20" wheels wearing the pirellis they may want to chime in. Hope that helps!

 

[acidbug]

Should never have picked up a SUV with all-wheel-drive with three the same tires and one completely different. This will throw off the all-wheel-drive. Far you might want to talk to someone with a CX five swap, rooms and tires and see if the issue resolves itself.