Mazdaspeed Sport Spring install notes and driving impressions

[nhluhr]

Part Number: GRMS-8M-L25
Includes:
-Front and Rear Springs with a claimed lowering of 15mm front and rear and a springrate of a claimed 30% higher than stock, making it 244f/222r.
-Mazdaspeed Camber Kit (about 3mm shorter bolt-center than the stock camber arms)
-Install instructions. Download: here.
-MAZDASPEED white vinyl transfer stickers

The Camber arms are a genuine pain in the butt to install. Although it would probably be possible to do it solo, I highly recommend doing it 2-man and definitely use some wire or something to secure the hub and prevent it from falling sideways when you undo the camber arm. We didn't do it on the first one and it was an epic battle but on the second one we did and it was almost a breeze in comparison. I highly recommend putting the top (chassis side) bolt in first and then putting in the lower (hub side) bolt in last, then tightening them both. Otherwise, threading them in becomes a battle.

Also, on the front struts, there is a little alignment fin on the bottom that assures the strut is aligned when it slips into the knuckle. Well that alignment tab has a tab that wraps around below the bolt which makes it very difficult to remove the strut but pushing open the knuckle with a bolt through the hole (the tab retains the strut if something is in the hole...) So when I had mine out, I cut off that tab since there's no need for it.

Also, I torqued everything to the high end of the ranges given.

I DID leave the bumpstop in, contrary to the instructions, and it feels just fine. I don't think it's a good idea to remove a bumpstop completely. The change to the handling is dramatic with a very minimal change to the ride. Mainly, the only thing you notice from a ride standpoint is an increased jostling when you go over bumps but the overall smoothness feels better. I can only assume the valving of the stock dampers is just better suited to these springrates.

The handling though... wow what a difference. The car just TURNS IN on command. I'm not saying the car was bad before but now it has RESPONSE! I love it. You can also feel the tire feedback much better now, imho.

Now for some measurements:
I measured from the lip of the hub centercap to the lip of the fender at all four corners and found the following data with ~30lbs of crap in the trunk and 5/8 tank of gas:
(measurements in cm)
FL: from 34.7 to 33.3 FR: from 34.8 to 33.5 (so basically -13mm so far)
RL: from 33.3 to 33.0 RR: from 33.1 to 33.0 (roughly -2mm so far)

So basically there is not yet any drop apparent in the rear. Maybe after some settling it will show some but the less drop (front and rear) the better, imho. FWIW, I think most 'settling' is in the rubber pads since the metal spring should never display any settling so I am expecting the fronts to not settle at all (since there is no rubber spring seat) and expecting the rears to settle some (since there is a rubber spring seat). That would be great. Will definitely update with more info, including pics and 'final' measurements.

 

[MS3077]

Great review! Thanks

 

[CHIEFSMS3]

Thanks for the write up.
Now I can't wait to get mine installed.

 

[nhluhr]

FYI: this is my ONLY modification so far aside from brighter highbeams bulbs.

I chose to go this way instead of swaybars because I felt the pitching was too dramatic to be left alone and springs would solve both the pitching problem and also reduce roll. The stock swaybars are also already extremely stiff.

I mentioned in my above post that "the less drop the better imho". I have a lot of reasons to say that but I'll hit the highlights:

1) struts and their camber curve - it is known that mcphearson strut suspensions (like the front) have a tendancy to not gain as much negative camber in compression as other suspensions and the lower the static height, the less they gain for a given amount of bump, all else held equal. So what you end up with when you lower a mcstrut suspension too far is a tradeoff. All I really want was less roll and higher springrates accomplish that.

2) roll centers and moments. mcstrut suspensions tend to lose roll center height at a high proportion to amount of lowering. This means that if you lower a car (and its CG) a given amount, the roll center drops a good bit more. So what you end up with is a GREATER roll moment (the imaginary torque arm between the CG and the roll axis). This means that a lot of your extra spring rate is eaten up by the greater roll moment so you're losing ride comfort without the corresponding improvement in handling you deserve for such a compromise.

3) Roll Axis Inclination - Basically, the inclination of the roll axis is directly related to the yaw damping factor. This is basically a natural stability but not necessarily linked to steady state understeer or oversteer. It is closely tied to the basic handling dynamics of the car and changing it dramatically via a big drop (on dissimilar suspension types front and rear) will cause a dramatic change in the slope of this axis and thus destroy the factory engineered character of your car's handling.

4) ground clearance - I have no desire to scrape my nose or highcenter on speedbumps.

5) tire clearance - I DO want to put wider tires on and greatly reduced fender clearance is counter to that goal.

6) suspension travel - Dropping too low will result in a car that exhibits untuneable and unexpected handling traits and will increase wear rates on things like the suspension parts, chassis attachment points, etc. It also causes a razor harshness if you are hard-bottoming instead of just soft-bottoming onto the rising rate bumpstops.

In short, most aftermarket springs lower the ride height way too much for the spring rate increase they offer. Look at coilovers. They don't always drop the ride height that much but they increase the spring rate a HUGE amount and coilovers are generally considered the most track-oriented (best handling?) option. How can a spring that lowers the same amount but with half the spring rate be considered a performance upgrade? Plain and simple: It's not. Most aftermarket springs, despite what the manufacturers tell you are primarily an aesthetic upgrade and only secondarily a performance ugprade.

 

[Yoo Shin]

VERY very good review and excellent follow up. I are the camber plates absolutely necessary? I thought they only really help if the car is lowered more then 1"? I'd like to actually try the springs first instead of sways too, since the MS3s sways are pretty beefy and I'm afraid going larger would give the car to much of a "solid" axle feel as it has done with prior cars I've owned when I've gone huge with the sways.

I learned a lot of lessons with my WRXs and it took me a while to find the right spring and strut combo for the handling I wanted, though still ended up sacrificing much of the ride quality and compliance.

Anybody wanting to slam there MS3 really needs to read the OPs posts. Trust me, the "slammed" look gets old quick once you realize that the car handles poorly and your lower back and neck hurts.

I'm really interested in these springs, as they seem much like the "STI JDM Pinks" that are made by STI specifically for the STIs struts, with optimal ride and suspension performance in mind, and actually don't lower more then 1/2".

So maybe these can be called the Mazdaspeed "Reds" or something?

Post pics when you get a chance!

EDIT: LOL I just saw your status(?) under your User Name! How funny.

 

[nhluhr]

Yeah I am still holding out judgement on if the camber links were necessary but even if the back doesn't 'settle' anymore, I can think of some reasoning why you might want them.

With 30% stiffer springs you would presumably not be rolling as much in corners so the optimal camber would be decreased... thus the desire to reduce that value...

Or to make the car more rotate-y via reduced camber.

Either way, I'm okay with it (especially since they are installed already!)

 

[Darkhorse]

picsss ;D

 

[ispypsi]

nice writeup.

i'm in agreement for the most part. a subtle drop of no more than an inch is all that's needed on these cars. (wheel choice is much more of a deciding factor in completing a 'look', IMO, esp on these cars)

i agree the stock sway bars are pretty stout. i was surprised to actually 3 wheel a few entry ramps to businesses or whatnot if i hit them right - in stock form.

i think my next mod will definitely be springs, cobb or MS should do the trick.

 

[nhluhr]

Yep, I have procured some used RX-8 wheels which I'll be refinishing and mounting up with some wider rubber and I think I'll be all done.

 

[GoFast]

very nice write up!! im happy to see a review/spring mod based off of better handling instead of looks/drag

 

[opt_ms3]

Was your review on the stock Bridgestones? What tires are you going to go with for your new set of wheels?

 

[ericrapp]

Helpful, and understandable.There is a lot to be gained in the handling department. which is really saying something for a car that is fairly stable at 120mph. a little bit more tire, with a bit wider contact patch and softer compound will do wonders as the appropriate spring stiffening also dials in the suspension. But the bars really are the cat's pajamas. all together well that is something else!

 

[Rotus]

Yep, I have procured some used RX-8 wheels which I'll be refinishing and mounting up with some wider rubber and I think I'll be all done.

Are you planning on going 235/40 with those. I should be getting my RX8s back from the powdercoater this week *crosses fingers*.

Very nice write-up BTW. Knowledgeable. Thanks for the info.

 

[wisniaPl]

do you think that camber kit is necessary??I know that they came with them but people with cobb spring thing that drop is not big enough to use cambers...

 

[ericrapp]

I think the camber is for the Mazdaspeed coilovers

 

[Yoo Shin]

Can the MS3 springs even be purchased new w/o the camber kit?

 

[Yoo Shin]

Have you had a chance to remeasure how much lower the car got? Hopefully it didn't get much lower. I really like how these springs are designed.

 

[nhluhr]

Was your review on the stock Bridgestones? What tires are you going to go with for your new set of wheels?

Yes. However, I have used a LOT of different tires over the years and I feel that these are among the best summer tires (without going to the "extreme performance" category). I will most likely be going to RE01R or RE050A-PP on the new wheels though.

Are you planning on going 235/40 with those. I should be getting my RX8s back from the powdercoater this week *crosses fingers*.

Very nice write-up BTW. Knowledgeable. Thanks for the info.

I'm kind of thinking about 245/40R18 but might settle for 235/40R18 since it is a more sure fit. Having trouble deciding!

do you think that camber kit is necessary??I know that they came with them but people with cobb spring thing that drop is not big enough to use cambers...

The thing is, when you increase roll stiffness, you decrease how much camber is required. So even if it doesn't drop the car very much, you now need less camber because the car won't roll as much as before so to fit what Mazda feels is the ideal handling balance for customers buying stiff springs like these, yes the camber kit is a good idea.

Can the MS3 springs even be purchased new w/o the camber kit?

Don't think so.

Have you had a chance to remeasure how much lower the car got? Hopefully it didn't get much lower. I really like how these springs are designed.

I have been climbing mount rainier all week and the car has been sitting. I get back on Sunday night and might have a chance to get some final measurements and pics on Monday.

 

[Boosted333]

Did you get any measurements?