Cash for Clunkers

mikeyb

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01 BMW 325xi Touring


The U.S. House approved the "cash for clunkers" legislation earlier today, paving the way for consumers to snag up to $4,500 for trading in their older vehicles for new, more fuel efficient transport.

The bill, which passed 298-119, drew overwhelming support from automakers, local business groups and dealers who claimed the passage could boost sales further aiding GM and Chrysler's "reinvention" during the economic downturn.

Although politicians and pundits are sure to weigh-in on the merits of the bill, the specifics appear clear: if your car gets 18 mpg or less and you trade in for a new vehicle the achieves at least 22 mpg, you receive a $3,500 voucher, or $4,500 if the mileage of the new vehicle is 10 mpg higher than your previous heap. SUV, pickup truck and minivan buyers are eligible for a $3,500 voucher if their vehicle gets at least two mpg higher than their trade-in and $4,500 if the vehicle gets five mpg more than their older model. The vehicle has to have been insured for the last year and there is no trade-in value beyond the voucher. The program is also available for leases. Dealers are required to provide proof that the vehicle (1984 MY or later) has been crushed or shredded, and the government estimates that around 25 million vehicles are eligible.
 
i hope that bill sticks around....i'ld love to trade my dakota in for a new truck in about a year.....BAD ASS
 
Hell yea! Something that finally benefits the consumer directly! 5K on a trade in AND an extra $3,500 bones at minimum from the gov't might be enough to get my dad's old 99 Volvo outta here and him into some new car!
(this may be the only time in my life I say this...) THANKS OBAMA RUN GOVERNMENT!
 
Hell yea! Something that finally benefits the consumer directly! 5K on a trade in AND an extra $3,500 bones at minimum from the gov't might be enough to get my dad's old 99 Volvo outta here and him into some new car!
(this may be the only time in my life I say this...) THANKS OBAMA RUN GOVERNMENT!

You get nothing for your trade, only the voucher amount of 3500 or 4500.
 
I think it's a horrible idea. It's essentially trying to throw the supply v demand economic model out the window and 'manufacture' demand, so to speak, which will never work. It may stimulate car sales to some extent, but what is the cost to the taxpayers going to be? All this 'stimulus' is starting to get obsurd.
 
You will see alot of older cars dying tragic deaths!

The bad thing to me is that the vehicles will be scrapped, crushed, and destroyed, and none of the individual parts will be recycled.(nuts)
 
I think it's a horrible idea. It's essentially trying to throw the supply v demand economic model out the window and 'manufacture' demand, so to speak, which will never work. It may stimulate car sales to some extent, but what is the cost to the taxpayers going to be? All this 'stimulus' is starting to get obsurd.
agreed. where is the government going to get the funds to pay those vouchers? Taxes...
 
You get nothing for your trade, only the voucher amount of 3500 or 4500.
WHAT?!?!?!??!?!?!?!?? THAT'S SOME BULLSH*T!!!!! I withdraw my original statement of thanks obama run government.
 
agreed. where is the government going to get the funds to pay those vouchers? Taxes...

not only that, but when this 'artificial demand' wears off, whats gonna happen? we'll be back in the same place we are now. and we'll continue to dump money into bad companies and before you know it gm will stand for government motors. and heck, while we're at it, we might as well sell the health insurance industry to the govt as well. the USA is teetering awfully close to socialism
 
not only that, but when this 'artificial demand' wears off, whats gonna happen? we'll be back in the same place we are now. and we'll continue to dump money into bad companies and before you know it gm will stand for government motors. and heck, while we're at it, we might as well sell the health insurance industry to the govt as well. the USA is teetering awfully close to socialism

Ding ding ding! We have a winner.
 
not only that, but when this 'artificial demand' wears off, whats gonna happen? we'll be back in the same place we are now.

Not sure, GM and Chrysler are still going bankrupt, they will stop producing many types of low MPG cars they produce today and they've been mandated very strict objectives to transform themselves and build more efficient cars thanks to the new emission rules which need to be achieved by 2016, so to me this is temporary to offload all the excess of inventory, start improving MPG in general and get ride of crappy MPG cars, so there is no going back to the same place where they were IMO.

If the government would have put this incentive yet let GM and Chrysler keep on producing the same gas guzzlers at the same level of production without firing anyone, then that would very very bad.
 
Not sure, GM and Chrysler are still going bankrupt, they will stop producing many types of low MPG cars they produce today and they've been mandated very strict objectives to transform themselves and build more efficient cars thanks to the new emission rules which need to be achieved by 2016, so to me this is temporary to offload all the excess of inventory, start improving MPG in general and get ride of crappy MPG cars, so there is no going back to the same place where they were IMO.

If the government would have put this incentive yet let GM and Chrysler keep on producing the same gas guzzlers at the same level of production without firing anyone, then that would very very bad.

The product line-up may have drastically changed by that time, but that's not what I'm saying. When this falsified demand they're tying to create finally wanes, less people are going to buy because there won't be an incentive to buy. And to add to that, the majority of the population is most likely going to be feeling the sting of this recession for years to come(wait til interest rates skyrocket-already starting), which will keep demand low as there will be less people wanting to (or able to) finance new vehicles.

so when demand drops off the cliff again, where is gm and chrysler going to turn to? And since the govt has already invested so heavily in shoddy companies making shoddy products, they're not going to want to see that money go down the drain, so they'll send them another check. And as proof of this, look back into chryslers history and you'll see that this is not the first bailout they've received. This is a recurring problem. And infact, the closer you look into that company's past, you'll see that the 2008/2009 bailout of chrysler was due to nearly identical circumstances to the 1979 bailout. Gas prices were extraordinarily high, they were selling gas guzzlers nobody wanted, couldn't change their lineup quick enough, and ran the company into the ground. And rest assured, this won't be the last time, either, as long as the company is run by morons and the govt is willing to send them checks, they'll be in line for a handout any time its available.
 
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And on that note, what I think needs to happen is the general population needs to wake up, get some common sense, and demand that this nonsense be put to an end. There is no fiscally responsible way, nor is there any reason, for the government to own an auto company, insurance company, or any company for that matter. Dumping it's (our?) money into a nonperforming company is one of the worst ideas these beaurocrats have ever come up with.
 
Valid points, but if IIRC Chrysler repaid all the government loans made to them in 1979 and actually the government made money out of those loans.

Yet I agree, I don't see this happening this time around, the situations seem far worse than in that year (and there is no Iacocca this time, LOL)

Yet, on the other side, while I understand that the government should not become the daddy of big loser corporations, in the case of the American automakers, there seems to be a moral obligation to "pay back" by giving them a shot of cash and a less painful death or another chance to make it through, especially as GM (and to some degree Chrysler) were vital pillars of the industrial power and a symbol of the global manufacturing prestige that put the US economy to where it is today (before they started f&^%ng things up of course)

Oh well, too much (blah), LOL
 
OMFG

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aWKYBKED5EKI

Apparently the entire $1 billion allocated for this program was burned through in only six days.

I highly doubt we blew a billion on that in 6 days. Seems to me like they have to catch up, or beef up the system to more readily accomodate the huge movement that this has become.

On the other hand, I don't think destroying the motors of these cars is the right solution for the situation. I think there are plenty of people who are out there and trying to make an honest living and own a car that may need a motor or trans from a 'clunker'. By trashing the motors, you force them to buy a part that in the end will cost them more money, simply because you're trying to get inefficient cars off the roads.

I think moving these cars to scrap yards, giving them the option to pull the pertinent parts off, then keeping said car for an allotted time (6 months works), then scrapping the car for good is a good idea.

People need to remember we're in a recession/depression. Not everyone has the expendable income to go buy a new car, regardless of incentives. I'm sure there are people who could swing a $500 motor payment, but not a $250/month car payment, plus the inflated insurance that comes with it.
 
How long before 'Cash-for-Clunkers' becomes a permanent federal entitlement?

About five seconds after I first heard about the Cash-for-Clunkers program, I wondered how long it would take before the politicians in Washington decided that if this is such a great temporary idea, how much better it will be when it becomes permanent.

Well, that hasn't happened yet, but it has been announced that the response on the part of buyers has been so over-whelming - more than $850 million of the $1 billion made available was spoken for in a mere four days! - that the program is being suspended.

Don't be surprised if Congress and President Obama use this temporary reprise and the public response to the program as the occasion to make it a permanent federal entitlement as part of government's anti-global warming effort.

Here are three reasons why you can bet this will happen:
First, anytime Congress and the White House see an opportunity to take tax dollars and give them to somebody who can vote, they will do it. In a $3.4 trillion annual federal budget, the $1 billion for Cash-for-Clunkers might seem like a drop in the bucket. The politicians have a billion reasons for why that is the wrong way to look at it.

Second, Washington cash always comes wth strings. Just look at the 15 pages of regulations telling dealers how they must dispose of the trade-ins. And don't forget NHTSA has to approve each and every deal. Right there, the government is telling the buyer and the seller what to do. That's an irresistible opportunity for the Washington politicians and bureaucrats to expand their power and perogatives over the rest of us.

Third, the timing is perfect. The economy is in a recession. The auto industry is in a depression. People are hungry for positive economic news. In just four days, Cash-for-Clunkers has given new life to the whole idea that government spending is the way to stimulate the economy. People are more receptive now than they will ever be to the idea of making a temporary measure permanent.

Fourth, Washington money is like crack cocaine. Smoke it once and odds are you are hooked. Desperate dealers are already lobbying their congressmen to keep the Cash-for-Clunkers going a little while longer. That's just putting off the inevitable agony of withdrawal. Congressman Pusherman will say, "Here, let's make you feel better for good."

Finally, the media won't tell the whole story of Cash-for-Clunkers. Reporting on it will emphasize two things - Happy dealers and buyers getting new cars and trucks, and worried dealers wondering what will happen when the program ends.

What won't be reported will be the actual cost of the program to the taxpayers, the transitory economic stimulus it provides, and how the most severe consequences will be felt among low-inomes people who must depend on used cars and trucks for their transportation.
 
more than $850 million of the $1 billion made available was spoken for in a mere four days!
One thing worth noting regarding the above:
Dealers started pushing the program before the federal government officially rolled it out, so we're talking about weeks, not days.
 
The Hyundai dealer I purchased my Genesis from said this last Saturday was the best sales day the dealership has ever had because of that program.
 
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