Ford/Mazda Partnership... Want To Know More

G

GJ-Molestor

Banned
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2011 BMW 528i, 2015 Mazda 6, 1995 Nissan Maxima Manual
The partnership was a simple, yet very smart one. Ford has a very strong business/marketing reputation, while Mazda's marketing is lacking, but they are known to have some of the finest chassis and engine designs coming out of Japan.

So how the partnership worked was that Mazda designed engines and a chassis which Ford can also use. they own the NAME and manufacturing rights of engines like the Cyclone and Duratec.

so...

Mazda L engine = Ford duratec 4 cylinders
Mazda K engine (also note Yamaha engine in 1991 Taurus SHO) = Ford Duratec V6
Mazda MZI engine = Ford Cyclone (the Ecoboost 3.5 engine is based off the MZI)
Mazda MZR = Ford Ecoboost 2.3

the 2.3L engine in the mustang Ecoboost and Focus ST is tuned by ford (just like the rest of "Fords" engines) and has its own cylinder head, but the block is Mazda. The engine bay of a standard issue Focus looks identical to a Mazda 3's.

so... obviously ford has been hiding quite a lot in order to protect their reputation, but it all makes perfect sense.

lets not forget the chassis, shall we?

the "Ford" CD3 chassis is what you see in the Mazda 6. the CD4 chassis is essentially an evolution of this chassis. These underpin MANY ford/lincoln vehicles...


Who knows who designed the Mustang and F150 chassis + the Coyote v8 engine, but I am willing to bet it was not Ford.
 
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I think you're giving too much credit to Mazda on this Ford/Mazda partnership. We all know Ford saved Mazda from bankruptcy by investing 33.3% shares of Mazda in 1996. But their partnership actually started as early as 1979 where Ford acquired 7% of the Mazda due to Mazda's financial difficulties during late 1960's. In return Ford was getting some small 4-cylinder engines and compact vehicle chassis from Mazda where Ford was not good at so that Ford can compete in Asian market. On the other hand Mazda was getting Ford products such as Duratec V6 and AWD system used in 1st-gen CX-9.

But Ford didn't totally rely on Mazda for small engine and compact vehicle development as they have Ford Europe which has been doing very well in compact automobiles. In other words, at the time Ford didn't really need Mazda to survive, but Mazda did. Yeah Mazda may be a spearhead for some unique engine development such as rotary engine、Miller-cycle engine、and now SkyActive engine, but they're hardly known to have finest engine designs coming out of Japan. Or Mazda shouldn't need any help at the time by Ford. Mazda's unique engines couldn't compete with modern 4-cylinder engines on power、fuel efficiency、emission control、and reliability; and their conventional 4-cylinder engines were not powerful and fuel efficient until newer SkyActive engines came out.
 
I am not giving Mazda more credit then they deserve at all here. not even a little bit. whatever i applaud them for is proportional to what they have actually done on the big scale.

do you realize that 90% of what Ford sells is riding on a Mazda chassis and has a Mazda engine in it? That's huge! What would ford possibly have done if it wasnt for Mazda? the ecoboost engine was designed by ford, but the engine fundamentals is mazda design. the ford duratec 4 cylinder is literally a mazda L engine with a ford ECU slapped on!

the duratec v6 was NOT built or designed by ford. ford doesnt design anything at all, the duratec is a Yamaha v6 (note 1992 Taurus SHO.) note the pattern here? essentially all of their vehicles, except for the f150 and mustang are Mazda's in ford sheetmetal. Ford needed someone like Mazda just as much as Mazda needed ford.

I have no problems with the partnership itself because it worked out great for the both of them. my problem is that Mazda does not get the credit they deserve in this partnership purely to protect ford's reputation. they remain to be a small scale company that no one bothers to look at, because they do not have the repuation of Ford (which would not be what it is today without mazda's help)
 
GJ-Molestor said:
I am not giving Mazda more credit then they deserve at all here. not even a little bit. whatever i applaud them for is proportional to what they have actually done on the big scale.

do you realize that 90% of what Ford sells is riding on a Mazda chassis and has a Mazda engine in it? That's huge! What would ford possibly have done if it wasnt for Mazda? the ecoboost engine was designed by ford, but the engine fundamentals is mazda design. the ford duratec 4 cylinder is literally a mazda L engine with a ford ECU slapped on!

the duratec v6 was NOT built or designed by ford. ford doesnt design anything at all, the duratec is a Yamaha v6 (note 1992 Taurus SHO.) note the pattern here? essentially all of their vehicles, except for the f150 and mustang are Mazda's in ford sheetmetal. Ford needed someone like Mazda just as much as Mazda needed ford.

I have no problems with the partnership itself because it worked out great for the both of them. my problem is that Mazda does not get the credit they deserve in this partnership purely to protect ford's reputation. they remain to be a small scale company that no one bothers to look at, because they do not have the repuation of Ford (which would not be what it is today without mazda's help)
Click to expand...

google Mazda K engine if you are interested. Identical intake manifold and engine bay layout to whatever the "ford" duratec is. it is not ford design.
 
craigo said:
I know right? This is hardly unknown... my 2006 3 had a "FoMoCo" stamp on the dipstick!
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It's a Mazda I4 engine, why there's "FoMoCo" mark on the dipstick? I saw people say they saw "FoMoCo" mark on 1st-gen CX-9's V6、transfer case and real differential.

Or is the dipstick the only part developed by Ford on the I4 engine during Ford/Mazda partnership in your 2006 Mazda3? (whistle)
 
Mazda has been making very reliable 4 cylinder engines long before the SkyActive engine. I stater owning them since 1985, and all have been exceptional in the reliability department. In fact I don't think the 2.2 cast iron engine can be beat ( you really have to be trying if you want to kill that engine ). At the time other friends and family bought honda's and toyota's. None lasted as long as my mazdas.
 
timberstx said:
Mazda has been making very reliable 4 cylinder engines long before the SkyActive engine. I stater owning them since 1985, and all have been exceptional in the reliability department. In fact I don't think the 2.2 cast iron engine can be beat ( you really have to be trying if you want to kill that engine ). At the time other friends and family bought honda's and toyota's. None lasted as long as my mazdas.
Click to expand...

The skyactiv engines are very well designed. They are essentially the Mazda L 2L and 2.5L with revised cylinder heads, new pistons, new exhaust manifold, direct injection etc. Mazda future proofs their engines and has had very good tech from the start, reducing the need to invest in a clean sheet design. Their engines are simply evolutions of what they used to make, and it's really not a bad thing.

The skyactiv 2.5L I have is an excellent motor. It's very resonsive, free-revving, very solid torque at 3000Rpm yet pulls strong and linear all the way to redline. Very little lag as you reach the torque curve. My only real concern is the carbon buildup due To the direct injection design. My dad is a conversative driver, and it's causing the intake ports to build up with gunk rather quickly in comparison to an engine that is revved out on a regular basis. Otherwise we are very happy with the car.
 
yrwei52 said:
It's a Mazda I4 engine, why there's "FoMoCo" mark on the dipstick? I saw people say they saw "FoMoCo" mark on 1st-gen CX-9's V6、transfer case and real differential.

Or is the dipstick the only part developed by Ford on the I4 engine during Ford/Mazda partnership in your 2006 Mazda3? (whistle)
Click to expand...

Presumably Mazda didn't spend time designing mundane parts their partner had already designed. Probably also got a nice deal on delivery from existing Ford supply - hence the FoMoCo stamp. IIRC the 3 of that era was based on a Volvo-designed platform (another Ford partner at the time) and the suspension design came from the Euro-spec Focus. There was a lot of sharing going on.
 
craigo said:
Presumably Mazda didn't spend time designing mundane parts their partner had already designed. Probably also got a nice deal on delivery from existing Ford supply - hence the FoMoCo stamp. IIRC the 3 of that era was based on a Volvo-designed platform (another Ford partner at the time) and the suspension design came from the Euro-spec Focus. There was a lot of sharing going on.
Click to expand...

That guys Mazda could have had a duratec engine swapped in since it's the same thing but with a Ford tune. But most likely you are correct, Mazda was only designing the important stuff...

Apparently Ford, Volvo and Mazda all worked together on one chassis, but the Volvo from that era, along with the Ford Focus had the first generation Mazda chassis. The suspension was also designed by Mazda.

It's interesting to note that the "Ford" duratec v6, which was apparently designed by Porsche is actually a Mazda K engine from like 1992.
 
GJ-Molestor said:
That guys Mazda could have had a duratec engine swapped in since it's the same thing but with a Ford tune. But most likely you are correct, Mazda was only designing the important stuff...

Apparently Ford, Volvo and Mazda all worked together on one chassis, but the Volvo from that era, along with the Ford Focus had the first generation Mazda chassis. The suspension was also designed by Mazda.

It's interesting to note that the "Ford" duratec v6, which was apparently designed by Porsche is actually a Mazda K engine from like 1992.
Click to expand...

The modern global car industry is pretty incestuous - they're all "competitors" technically but not really. They all deal with each other because it often makes more sense economically to license a design (or buy a stake in the company) than reinvent it. Factory sharing is also really common, especially in Asia and South America. Mazda still builds the B-series pickup at Asian Ford plants.
 
TheMAN said:
something smells in this thread, and I know it's not my upper lip....
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Fords hesitance to reveal mazdas role in the partnership? I know...

All you gotta do is compare the engine bays of Ford to Mazda to know what I'm talking about..
 
Skyactiv is very much Mazda's. That said there's a FoMoCo stamp on my 2016 Mazda6 intake plumbing :)
 
Pretty sure the Mazda, Ford partnership really started in the early 70's. In 1972 Ford came out with the Courier. Which was really a Mazda truck.
 
timberstx said:
Pretty sure the Mazda, Ford partnership really started in the early 70's. In 1972 Ford came out with the Courier. Which was really a Mazda truck.
Click to expand...

That is correct!

Ford Courier = Mazda B1800
Ford Festiva = Mazda 121
Ford Probe GT = Mazda MX-6
Ford Escort GT = Mazda Protg
Ford Ranger = Mazda B2300, B3000, and B4000
Ford Fusion = Mazda6
Ford Contour = Mazda 626

There are many others...(inout)
 
1u7ym1.jpg
 
CX-5um said:
Skyactiv is very much Mazda's. That said there's a FoMoCo stamp on my 2016 Mazda6 intake plumbing :)
Click to expand...

the skyactiv engine is the mazda L 2.5 engine with the skyactiv bits attached to it. they took the 6 speed auto used in the older v6 mazda 6 models and retuned it big-time.

the 6 still rides on the same G-chassis from the original Mazda 6, but with revised skyactiv suspension. whatever mazda has done with the skyactiv stuff has improved their cars drastically- given them a new dose of personality and easily class-competitve.

now that they have improved the interiors in the newer cars (addressing my only complaint) they have really shaped up to become quite the the brand now. If they could improve two more things, it would be stiffer suspension (less body roll) and most importantly do something with the stock open differential, which is crap. that thing needs to go.
 
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