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Thread: really unsure..

  1. #1
    long time mazda owner d0sitmatr's Avatar

    2003 Protege5

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    really unsure..

    I dont post often because there isnt really much to post about with my mp5. any problems I can usually figure out and are resolved quickly.
    this one, however, has me at a loss and I no longer have an ASE cert mechanic I trust at the moment as my previous one moved away, so Im hoping to find some help here as I have in the past.

    ok, here is the issue as best I can describe:
    about 1 1/2 mos ago, I had to pull pretty hard to enter traffic, and also had to enter a turning lane in less than a mile after, so I pull like I usually do, and once in the turning lane, take it out of gear to coast to the turn, the car shuts off, completely, nothing using electrical power was active. I put it into gear and it bumps starts easy enough and everything is powered again. however, unless Im actively giving it gas, it tries to shut off. I did notice that after a timing belt replacement that the mechanic at that time (emergency mech that Ive not ever used before in a different city as the timing belt spun while traveling...) had broken the tab for one of the coilpacks, my mechanic and I agreed that was the most likely culprit since if its damp out from a rain or early morning dew, Ill see sparking coming from it. so I bought new packs and put them on, no problems. however, I did also have to replace my headlamp bulbs (both... at the same time ?) which I did, they lasted less than 3 wks... in which both are blown again. now, this morning, again I had to pull real hard to get into traffic, and when I did, the car again tried to shut down. this time though, it stayed running even if in neutral coasting. and idled fine when I got home. no inclement scents coming from under the hood, but I did smell something like a mix of electrical and exhaust immediately after.

    anyways, I havent a clue how to search the forums for this type of issue, so I hope it isnt something covered somewhere else, but I really do need some help.

    here are a couple of things I considered might be the issue:
    wiring
    ECU
    sensor

    I am not getting any error codes and no cel.

  2. #2
    long time mazda owner d0sitmatr's Avatar

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    oh yes, pertinent info:
    batt is about 6 mos old, new alt, new alt belt, new batt terminals... cant really think of what else might be related.
    there is one thing of consideration, the coolant line male intake for the fuel modulator (not sure if that is correct, sits at the top of the engine right behind intake mani) has 3 micro holes in it, not sure how or why, but until I caught it, coolant was shooting directly at the firewall pretty much covering the middle area, I had read somewhere the computer is located right behind the FW at that spot, but I dont know that for certain.
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  3. #3
    The Diagram Dude pcb's Avatar

    2002 mazda protege 5

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    You may have a sticky EGR valve ??? It doesn't always throw a code and is a common problem with our car.

    Don't know about the other stuff but our cars like to eat headlights... Make sure you never touch the bulbs.

    The ECU is located on the floor under the front passengers feet toward the front.

  4. #4
    long time mazda owner d0sitmatr's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcb View Post
    You may have a sticky EGR valve ??? It doesn't always throw a code and is a common problem with our car.

    Don't know about the other stuff but our cars like to eat headlights... Make sure you never touch the bulbs.

    The ECU is located on the floor under the front passengers feet toward the front.
    I hadnt considered egr, mostly because I thought the car would run kind of funky even in every day driving ? but I cant rule it out.

    I always use vinyl gloves when installing bulbs
    I did read this can become more of a problem over time, and its following along with other posts Ive read about headlamp bulbs, first set lasted from 2011 to 2014, (1 bulb went bad, I replaced both anyways and kept one for spare/emergency) the second set from 2014 2015.5, 3rd set lasted just under a year, then as mentioned, both bulbs at same time 1.5 mos ago, those 2 new bulbs lasted less than 3 wks.
    Ive read that getting LED with ballast makes a huge difference, so Ill most likely be going that route. I do have HiD setup that I removed due to how they bypass the range block and blind oncoming traffic, every time Id drive people would be flashing me to put low beams on, got too annoying, guess Ill throw it back on the car, see how long the bulbs last.

    thanks for a direction to look in regards to the main issue.
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  5. #5
    ......................... i12drivemyMP5's Avatar
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    I agree with cleaning EGR. My car ran fine but would randomly die sitting at red light but start right back up. Auto so no coasting. EGR was dirty. Cleaned it and no issue since. Replace the hoses going to and from throttle body if leaking. As far as headlights, try replacing the adapters between the plug and the bulb and see if that helps. They are known to get bad. Time fucks everything eventually.




    http://www.ebay.com/itm/Muzzys-645-5...dW6yCk&vxp=mtr

  6. #6
    long time mazda owner d0sitmatr's Avatar

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    thanks, Ill look at those, I remember reading about that as well, but had forgotten about it.

    thanks for the direction to start, sounds like Ill be checking the EGR and clean it up, possibly replace if needed. hopefully just clean though
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  7. #7
    The Diagram Dude pcb's Avatar

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    There is a "Canadian" version of the EGR with coolant lines attached.
    The guys that have installed them never had problems with their EGR again.
    They are kinda difficult to install though.


  8. #8
    ......................... i12drivemyMP5's Avatar
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    I've cleaned the American once in 100,000 miles, still on car workin just fine...............

  9. #9
    The Diagram Dude pcb's Avatar

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    I've got my original EGR on my car and have never had a problem with it... I'm at 234,000 km (145,000 miles)

  10. #10
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    protege5

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    i've got the original EGR on my car at 240k miles and never been a problem with it.

    I would check for electrical connections. make sure all of your grounds are secure. make sure your battery terminals are secure, the P5 stock battery terminals are junk and tend to be problematic for many people. wiggle harnesses and connectors with it running and see if wiggling anything can cause it to stumble or cause any fluctuations in the idle. check for any signs of rodents in the vehicle, if you can find any poopies in the the windshield cowl area (under the wipers), in the blower box, air filter, etc then you should really go over every harness in the car with a fine tooth comb. field mice and rats love to eat wiring.

    it's also worth picking up a cheap voltage gauge or hooking a meter up to the battery while you drive and watching the voltage either for spikes or dips, watch what your voltage does when you're doing your hard acceleration. this can give you clues as to where you need to look. The headlights may be a coincidence or it may be related. but if all power was dead unless you had your foot on the gas i would lean towards some type of electrical gremlin. in most cases you'll find that it's a ground.

    don't rule anything out because you've got a new battery and new alternator. i'm assuming you probably got an alternator from o'reilly or autozone or somewhere, not an OEM Mazda one because i wouldn't pay that kind of a premium for an OEM one either lol. but i've seen aftermarket alternators take a dump within a week of being brand new, same with batteries. And a bad battery can kill a car. I had a customer bring in her car that wouldn't jump start or run, dead to the world. she just had a brand new battery put in at walmart and it died on her driving down the street so she towed it in. She assumed it had big problems... battery showed 12v at rest but it woudn't jump start. i looked at it for a few minutes, and something didn't seem right. so i disconnect the battery, jump it off and runs great. $99 later and a new battery she never had another problem with it.

    don't mean to ramble, but just an example. it's best to not 'overthink' it. start with the basics and figure out WHAT happens when it dies. Then you can move to WHY it happens, and pinpoint the root cause. it's just a machine, nuts and bolts. keep it simple

  11. #11
    long time mazda owner d0sitmatr's Avatar

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    I will look into the advice you posted, pb4ugotobed.
    I did replace the batt terminals when I replaced the batt itself so they arent originals, although cables could probably be replaced. the alt is a Bosch, came from partsgeek, new, not remand, so it should be solid. but as you say, anything is possible
    connections at the battery and alt are solid, that much I know, but elsewhere... not sure, and I wouldnt really know where to start, can you give me a reference ?

    its really got me worried because this is my primary driver and the one I prefer, as my truck is a friggin gasoholic and the civic... well, its a civic....
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  12. #12
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    protege5

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    Without seeing the car in person, it's hard to say. I would start with watching the source voltage at the + and - battery terminals and drive the car and try to force it to die/stumble/stuttter out. being able to duplicate the concern when you want it to is half the battle, and will make diagnosis much, much easier.

    If it falls on its face and everything goes dead but source voltage at the battery itself stays at 12+ volts then you can reasonably assume the battery/alt are good. I would suspect a loose/weak ground somewhere. You said all electronics in the car shut off when it happened, so i would focus on main grounding points. i'm sure pcb has a diagram showing ground locations in the vehicle, he seems to have a diagram for everything lol but i would start my making sure the main ground from the battery (-) terminal to the chassis is good and shows less than 1 ohm resistance.

    But start with trying to duplicate the concern. Then watch the battery voltage in 2 ways. first with the meter leads connected directly to the batt (+) and (-) terminals. And then again with the meter leads connected to batter (+) terminal and a grounding point in the chassis or dashboard. let us know what you find and we'll take it from there.



    keep in mind there is a possibility that it's not an electrical issue at all, and something else. but if what you describe is accurate with all the electrical in the car dying when the car did it's a pretty safe bet you've got something going on in the electrical system. And unfortunately, MOST mechanics really struggle when it comes to electrical diagnosis, mostly because they just don't understand it. But you've got a good group here willing to help and plenty of brain power to go around, it's just that you'll have to do the actual leg work and report back until we can get it resolved

  13. #13
    ZOOOOOOOOOM ZOOOOOOOOOOOM mazdadude's Avatar

    '16.5 Mazda CX-5 Touring AWD

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    Quote Originally Posted by d0sitmatr View Post
    I dont post often because there isnt really much to post about with my mp5. any problems I can usually figure out and are resolved quickly.
    this one, however, has me at a loss and I no longer have an ASE cert mechanic I trust at the moment as my previous one moved away, so Im hoping to find some help here as I have in the past.

    ok, here is the issue as best I can describe:
    about 1 1/2 mos ago, I had to pull pretty hard to enter traffic, and also had to enter a turning lane in less than a mile after, so I pull like I usually do, and once in the turning lane, take it out of gear to coast to the turn, the car shuts off, completely, nothing using electrical power was active. I put it into gear and it bumps starts easy enough and everything is powered again. however, unless Im actively giving it gas, it tries to shut off. I did notice that after a timing belt replacement that the mechanic at that time (emergency mech that Ive not ever used before in a different city as the timing belt spun while traveling...) had broken the tab for one of the coilpacks, my mechanic and I agreed that was the most likely culprit since if its damp out from a rain or early morning dew, Ill see sparking coming from it. so I bought new packs and put them on, no problems. however, I did also have to replace my headlamp bulbs (both... at the same time ?) which I did, they lasted less than 3 wks... in which both are blown again. now, this morning, again I had to pull real hard to get into traffic, and when I did, the car again tried to shut down. this time though, it stayed running even if in neutral coasting. and idled fine when I got home. no inclement scents coming from under the hood, but I did smell something like a mix of electrical and exhaust immediately after.

    anyways, I havent a clue how to search the forums for this type of issue, so I hope it isnt something covered somewhere else, but I really do need some help.

    here are a couple of things I considered might be the issue:
    wiring
    ECU
    sensor

    I am not getting any error codes and no cel.
    This comment if I am reading correctly, is what makes me think it could be a:
    failed rear motor mount pulling on wiring harness
    ignition switch defective,
    alternator connection,
    battery cable connections including engine ground,
    defective battery, Your bump starting it during driving could have produced enough motion on the motor in the engine bay to move the engine ground, alternator wiring, or a chaffed or shorting wire.
    Last edited by mazdadude; 05-10-2017 at 08:45 AM.
    Mazda's I have owned over the years.
    80' Mazda GLC SPORT MT - sold
    81' Mazda 626 DX MT - sold
    81' Mazda 626 LX AT - sold
    82' Mazda 626 DX MT - sold
    82' Mazda 626 LX AT - sold
    85' Mazda 626 LX MT - sold
    87' Mazda 626 GT Turbo MT - sold
    85' Mazda RX-7 GSL-SE MT- sold
    87' Mazda RX-7 Turbo 2 MT - sold
    91' Mazda Protege LX MT - sold
    92' Mazda MX-5 Miata MT - sold
    93' Mazda MX-3 GS-V6 Special Edition MT - sold
    00' Mazda 626 LX-V6 MT - sold
    02.5' Mazda Protege5 MT - sold
    92' Mazda MX-5 Miata MT - sold
    06' Mazda 5 Touring AT - sold
    13' Mazda CX-5 Touring AT - sold
    14' Mazda 3i Grand Touring MT - sold
    15' Mazda CX-5 Touring AWD AT - sold
    03' Mazda Protege5 AT - sold
    16.5' Mazda CX-5 Touring AWD AT - current
    09' Mazda Mazdaspeed3 GT - current

  14. #14
    The Diagram Dude pcb's Avatar

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    I still think he should start with the EGR.
    There has been a lot of guys here on the forum with EGR problems.
    Some guys have to clean it every year.

    PS... I remember one guy said he put his car in gear and pushed it a bit then hit the P-brake.
    That rolled the engine a little bit on it's mounts and gave him a little bit more room to get in there with his 1/4" stubby drive.

  15. #15
    ZOOOOOOOOOM ZOOOOOOOOOOOM mazdadude's Avatar

    '16.5 Mazda CX-5 Touring AWD

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    Quote Originally Posted by pcb View Post
    I still think he should start with the EGR.
    There has been a lot of guys here on the forum with EGR problems.
    Some guys have to clean it every year.

    PS... I remember one guy said he put his car in gear and pushed it a bit then hit the P-brake.
    That rolled the engine a little bit on it's mounts and gave him a little bit more room to get in there with his 1/4" stubby drive.
    The EGR's are def a prob on these, but why would the EGR kill everything electrical?
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