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Thread: Mushy brake pedal

  1. #16
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    Any resolution to this issue? My mazda5 2009 gt just crossed the 100k miles mark. Lately I have noticed the brake pedal to be mushy. Just had brake fluid replaced and brakes inspected but tech did not find anything wrong but mentioned that maybe master cylinder needs to be replaced.

  2. #17
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    So I went ahead with a master cylinder replacement today. There was a little improvment but brakes still dont feel solid. A post on another mazda site said that stuck cylinder pins were the culprit to this issue and using pematex caliper grease to clean them would resolve it. Anyone have other ideas to reolve this?


    Quote Originally Posted by andresamia View Post
    Any resolution to this issue? My mazda5 2009 gt just crossed the 100k miles mark. Lately I have noticed the brake pedal to be mushy. Just had brake fluid replaced and brakes inspected but tech did not find anything wrong but mentioned that maybe master cylinder needs to be replaced.

  3. #18
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    2006 Mazda 6 - auto

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    Quote Originally Posted by andresamia View Post
    So I went ahead with a master cylinder replacement today. There was a little improvment but brakes still dont feel solid. A post on another mazda site said that stuck cylinder pins were the culprit to this issue and using pematex caliper grease to clean them would resolve it. Anyone have other ideas to reolve this?
    I assume you mean lube up the caliber brake pins. I would suggest using https://www.amazon.com/AGS-American-...ords=sil+glyde instead of permatex. Some people have experience issues with permatex grease causing the rubber parts to swell. There are several types of permatex grease, the silicon based one may be better.

    Are your hoses ok? Do they flex a lot if you press on the brakes?

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by kw_da View Post
    I assume you mean lube up the caliber brake pins. I would suggest using https://www.amazon.com/AGS-American-...ords=sil+glyde instead of permatex. Some people have experience issues with permatex grease causing the rubber parts to swell. There are several types of permatex grease, the silicon based one may be better.

    Are your hoses ok? Do they flex a lot if you press on the brakes?
    Yes i meant lube the brake pins. Ive been bringing my 5 to a local shop aand I assume that they checked on the hoses. I will remind them to do this when I return tom. I will also ask them to look into lubing the caliber pins. I am hoping it is not the ABS. I dont have any CEL on but from what Ive read here CEL dont always turn on when damaged. Thanks

  5. #20
    Registered Member Silentnoise713's Avatar

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    It can't be slider pins. Greasy pins are necessary for floating calipers to release and not constantly rub (causes uneven pad wear/warp rotors, builds up heat which creates air and leads to frozen calipers).
    It's also unlike power brake booster or vacuum leak as that should lead to harder pedal feel (you loose power 'assisted' vacuum). You can test this by turning car off, step on brake pedal a few times so it sinks and stay down. Start car and norm vacuum should raise it back up.


    Assuming you are not loosing brake fluid, mushy brakes is usually fluid related (mostly likely air in system -or worm fluid but this is more soft pedal). Sounds like you've bleed the system and replace the MC, which are the first things to check. I suspect there's air in the ABS module or the module is failing (but you 'should' get a code if failing). The ABS module is harder (or easier!) to bleed. Have the shop bleed the ABS module (computer controlled cycle) or you can buy a handheld device for ~$150 and DIY (!not sure if the cheap ones work for Ford!). You plug it in and click through options to have it perform automated bleeding procedure for all ABS solenoids. Look up youtube videos to get an idea.

    Google 'Ford ABS Bleeding Tool'

    http://www.aa1car.com/library/abs_bleeding.htm
    Last edited by Silentnoise713; 05-14-2018 at 01:15 PM.
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  6. #21
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    I agree with silentnoise, it's probably something to do with your ABS. A faster/cheaper way to clear your ABS may be to activate it by slamming on your brakes on a slick service. This should activate the ABS and cycle new fluid thru it. At least this is what I read :-). It still doesn't hurt to lube your caliber pins as they do get stuck.

    edit: by the way, how did your mechanic bleed the brakes? See this: http://www.************.com/62-suspe...ake-bleed.html
    Last edited by kw_da; 05-14-2018 at 02:05 PM.

  7. #22
    Registered Member Silentnoise713's Avatar

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    Explained in detail. You are not going to like what you hear...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0r46_unyYk8
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  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silentnoise713 View Post
    Explained in detail. You are not going to like what you hear...

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0r46_unyYk8
    Yes Ive been hoping it would not be the ABS but all the symptoms point to it being the problem. Unless bleeding the ABS can fix the problem. BTW which ABS control unit does my mazda 5 2009 GT have: with stability control C3Y7-43-7AZA for $950 or one without C2Y6-43-7AZB $390 (from realmazdsa parts.com? According to website they both fit my car. Are they interchangeable? Is the AZA an upgrade? I havent checked availability at the scrap yard but then again I havent gone back to the shop for additional diagnosis to check if this is really the problem. Thanks
    Last edited by andresamia; 05-18-2018 at 08:43 PM.

  9. #24
    Registered Member Silentnoise713's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by andresamia View Post
    Yes Ive been hoping it would not be the ABS but all the symptoms point to it being the problem. Unless bleeding the ABS can fix the problem. BTW which ABS control unit does my mazda 5 2009 GT have: with stability control C3Y7-43-7AZA for $950 or one without C2Y6-43-7AZB $390 (from realmazdsa parts.com? According to website they both fit my car. Are they interchangeable? Is the AZA an upgrade? I havent checked availability at the scrap yard but then again I havent gone back to the shop for additional diagnosis to check if this is really the problem. Thanks
    Do your model come with DSC? You should have a button on the dash panel, above your left knee, to turn it on/off. If your 'ca' is Cali, then you likely don't. DSC became standard equipment starting 2010 models. If 'ca' = Canada or other, don't know.

    BTW, for folks who have this problem, have you ever serviced your brake fluid? I tend to think this is happening b/c of neglected brake fluid maintenance -you are suppose to change (not just bleed) it every 2-3 years. I remember before ABS, no body changes brake fluid. Top off as needed and go. Sure you had to brake a little harder but it works. I bought a garage queen Miata and the brake fluid reservoir has contaminants in it and strained the inner reservoir walls - but it works! Not the case anymore with more electronic doohickies in the system.
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  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bsedgal View Post
    I had the exact problem on the 5 that I just traded for. Spent countless time bleeding brakes, checking for leaks, and even replaced the master cylinder. All to no avail. Then yesterday I picked up a used ABS pump from the local salvage yard for $75. Fixed! I guess if you were looking to properly diagnose you could get plugs for the master cylinder and then move down the line and get plugs for the ABS in order to isolate the problem. I had a hard time finding the plugs at any hardware store because the thread size is rare (M12x1.0).
    Did you have to bleed the new ABS pump using a device when you installed it?

  11. #26
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    Finally able to put closure to this issue. And yes it was the ABS that was the culprit. My 5 never had any leaks and CEL/ABS light. Even dealer couldnt isolate the problem and wanted me to replace MC, all calipers, all brake hoses, and the ABS unit. While trying to solve the sinking brake issue I ended up replacing the MC and booster before finally the ABS. Got the part online and had a shop install it. Thanks for all the help.
    Last edited by andresamia; 07-18-2018 at 06:25 PM.

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by andresamia View Post
    Did you have to bleed the new ABS pump using a device when you installed it?
    Sorry I didn't see this. I had my neighborhood shade tree mechanic install the used ABS pump (1.5 years later its still working great and only 75 bucks plus 2 hours labor!). I'm pretty sure he doesn't have any fancy ABS bleed equipment. More than likely just bled at the furthest wheel first and eventually all the wheels (as he instructed me early on while I was initially troubleshooting).

    The brake fluid was absolutely filthy when I first bought the car and so I can't help but think the reason many of us deal with ABS failures is the lack of checking/flushing the brake fluid periodically.
    2006 Mazda5 Sport, 130K miles

  13. #28
    Registered Member 1987cp's Avatar

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    This is interesting. I've noticed a slightly mushy brake pedal on our '12 "5", and I assumed that new brake hoses might be in order even though brake feel is generally just like new after my brake job last week. My dealership had recently recommended a brake fluid flush, which I thought sounded just as pointless as a throttle body cleaning.

    Then again, this is my very first ABS-equipped vehicle, and my last fuel injected vehicle (1987 Ford 5.0 EEC-IV) was swapped to a carburetor in 2004.



    Anywhoo ... I'm confused by references in this thread to bleeding something called an ABS "pump". Is brake bleeding not done the same on this car as on a car with normal brakes?
    Last edited by 1987cp; 07-24-2018 at 09:17 PM.

  14. #29
    Registered Member Silentnoise713's Avatar

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    Brake fluid is hygroscopic (except DOT 5). Once the bottle's air tight seal breaks, it has a limited shelf life regardless of if/how you drive the car. The consistent heating/cooling from everyday braking accelerates wear. The brake fluid reservoir cap is not air tight.


    Normal brake bleeding wont activate the ABS pump. Watch video in post #22 to get a sense of the ABS solenoid.
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  15. #30
    2012 CR Mazda5 Touring 90210's Avatar

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1987cp View Post
    This is interesting. I've noticed a slightly mushy brake pedal on our '12 "5", and I assumed that new brake hoses might be in order even though brake feel is generally just like new after my brake job last week. My dealership had recently recommended a brake fluid flush, which I thought sounded just as pointless as a throttle body cleaning.

    Then again, this is my very first ABS-equipped vehicle, and my last fuel injected vehicle (1987 Ford 5.0 EEC-IV) was swapped to a carburetor in 2004.



    Anywhoo ... I'm confused by references in this thread to bleeding something called an ABS "pump". Is brake bleeding not done the same on this car as on a car with normal brakes?
    My 12 pedal is as firm as they day I bought it new in 2011. I did new brake fluid once at 65K miles. Car has 101K miles now.

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