BMW X3 and CX-5

bmninada

Contributor
:
2016 CX-5 AWD GT+iActive Soul Red
Okay, so all talk about exquisite drivability, handling, steering responsiveness and road connection suspension of CX-5. I do NOT deny this, it's arguably the best in this price range. But guess what, BMW is often touted as a good example of car should be on ALL of the factors I mentioned.

Now, if I am to take CX-5 AWD 2.5L and BMW X3 xDrive and NOT factor in the cost difference, inside amenities and instead concentrate on ONLY the factors mentioned above (and few more on pure driving experience) I wonder what's the verdict? Equally good? Bad? Better?
Also - let's not look at purchase or maintenance costs here - that's known.
Finally - when driving in city? Highway? Off-road? Horribly icy conditions? .... these are what decides.
 
I've never driven an X3, or a 2.5L AWD CX-5 or any BMW for that matter.

I frequently drive my 2013 CX-5 on very narrow, windy, bumpy roads with poor pavement and I cannot imagine having more fun in any other car. The suspension, for my style of driving is simply perfect and I wouldn't change a thing.

First of, the BMW is HEAVY. Over 1100lbs heavier than my CX-5 and 650lbs heavier than the 2.5L AWD.
4300lbs for the 2015 x3 xdrive-28d vs 3550 for the 2016 CX-5 vs 3120 for the 2013 6MT.

A lot of the enjoyment of driving comes from feeling connected to the road.
One way to feel that connection is by feeling and hearing the changes in pavement, hearing each pothole, puddle or patch of ice and hearing the rubber grip the road.
In the CX-5 I get plenty of that NVH (too much according to my wife and most on this forum), but in all of the more "refined" cars that I've driven I do not get that connection and I bet the BMW is the same.

The X3 its certainly going to be much more comfortable and quiet on road trips, but simply because it is heavy and quiet I cannot imagine it being as fun to drive as my CX-5.

car and driver reviews of both cars in question:
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2015-bmw-x3-xdrive28d-diesel-test-review
http://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/2016-mazda-cx-5-25l-awd-test-review
 
The BMW is much fuglier than the CX5. Plus I think the X3 comes with run-flats and no spare tire. From what I've read a lot of folks hate the run-flats for a variety of reasons, and dislike not having the spare tire on hand (you'll need to buy an aftermarket spare kit).
 
Never driven the x3, but my experience with BMW is thay their suspensions are infinitely competent and the cars are like rolling bank vaults regarding feel and isolation,, without compromising the data you want from the road. Very well filtered sensations. I'd go BMW x3 in a heartbeat over cx5 if all costs, front and back, we're equal. But they arent.
 
Wouldn't a X1 be a closer comparison to The CX-5? I traded in a 2014 BMW 228 MSport on my AWD CX-5. Didn't even consider any of the BMW SUVs. Just think the Mazda is a better car.
 
I can't get beyond BMWs being great lease vehicles then run away..... I hear the stories of older BMWs piling on the years with reliable & flawless use... the newer stuff... not...
 
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My driving experience is purely in summer, urban area with a mix of 70% h/w and 30% city driving. Duration: 1 month. 1st. off: X1 is much smaller, X3 is correct comparison. For CX-7 it'll be X5. Anyways, right off the bat road feel is equal to both CX-5 and BMW in terms of feeling the road, bumps, etc., etc. Sharp turns at reasonably high speeds and winding roads I BMW handles a little bit better, as most probably its heavier in terms of pitch and roll. Does it justifies the cost, just for that: Absolutely not. However, I never had dynamic stability control kick in for CX-5 and I remember at least quite a few instances when the beemer's DSC assisted. Braking distance and overall braking: can't really comment but being a German car, the brakes kick in early. I have ALWAYS found Jap cars are a bit mushy initially with brakes.
Acceleration: This is where BMW outshines CX-5 in terms of the quick changes in transmission. In a way, only in sports mode CX-5 transmission shifting is similar. Its however very smooth in BMW.

What I do not know is areas where CX5 will be better due to its engine(?), transmission setup(?), axle/torque/AWD distribution(?). ... no idea.
 
My driving experience is purely in summer, urban area with a mix of 70% h/w and 30% city driving. Duration: 1 month. 1st. off: X1 is much smaller, X3 is correct comparison. For CX-7 it'll be X5. Anyways, right off the bat road feel is equal to both CX-5 and BMW in terms of feeling the road, bumps, etc., etc. Sharp turns at reasonably high speeds and winding roads I BMW handles a little bit better, as most probably its heavier in terms of pitch and roll. Does it justifies the cost, just for that: Absolutely not. However, I never had dynamic stability control kick in for CX-5 and I remember at least quite a few instances when the beemer's DSC assisted. Braking distance and overall braking: can't really comment but being a German car, the brakes kick in early. I have ALWAYS found Jap cars are a bit mushy initially with brakes.
Acceleration: This is where BMW outshines CX-5 in terms of the quick changes in transmission. In a way, only in sports mode CX-5 transmission shifting is similar. Its however very smooth in BMW.

What I do not know is areas where CX5 will be better due to its engine(?), transmission setup(?), axle/torque/AWD distribution(?). ... no idea.

A lot of times you may not feel DSC kicking in, it depends on how it's tuned. My 370Z, it would many times flicker the VDC light ever so slightly and I could not tell what in the world it was doing, but suffice it to say maybe it modulated something JUST A TINY BIT. In the Corvette, it's even less obtrusive using PTM. Who knows how the CX-5 is tuned?
 
However, I never had dynamic stability control kick in for CX-5 and I remember at least quite a few instances when the beemer's DSC assisted.

Did you check the BMW's tire air pressure? I'm not sure why it's DSC would kick in more (especially considering you drove the BMW in the warmer summer months).

Braking distance and overall braking: can't really comment but being a German car, the brakes kick in early. I have ALWAYS found Jap cars are a bit mushy initially with brakes.

I've driven a lot of German cars. I've driven a lot of Japanese cars. I can't say their brakes tend to fall into one category or the other. Some of the German cars had mushy brakes and some were firm. And likewise with the Japanese cars. In any case, in every actual test I've seen, the CX-5 stopped considerably quicker than the X3. This is with actual instrumented testing. One reviewer even commented that the brakes were sub-par for the class.

Acceleration: This is where BMW outshines CX-5 in terms of the quick changes in transmission.


With 8 gears the BMW should have quick, nearly seamless shifts. The ratio jump between each gear is quite small. I think Mazda has done incredible things with the Skyactiv 6AT. Time will tell which is more reliable but I have a good vibe from the CX-5 in terms of longevity.
 
Did you check the BMW's tire air pressure? I'm not sure why it's DSC would kick in more (especially considering you drove the BMW in the warmer summer months).



I've driven a lot of German cars. I've driven a lot of Japanese cars. I can't say their brakes tend to fall into one category or the other. Some of the German cars had mushy brakes and some were firm. And likewise with the Japanese cars. In any case, in every actual test I've seen, the CX-5 stopped considerably quicker than the X3. This is with actual instrumented testing. One reviewer even commented that the brakes were sub-par for the class.




With 8 gears the BMW should have quick, nearly seamless shifts. The ratio jump between each gear is quite small. I think Mazda has done incredible things with the Skyactiv 6AT. Time will tell which is more reliable but I have a good vibe from the CX-5 in terms of longevity.

All "modern typical vehicles" (not track centric like Porsche CCB, ZR1 ceramic, etc.) brake systems are "mush", IMO. This is the response of a ceramic based pad, which is used to cut dust. Penalty is a bit of squeaking and "wooden" braking feel at times.
 
I've driven a BMW X5 with the 8 speed auto trans and twin turbo V6. No doubt the X5 is super fast and the 8 speed auto trans shifts fast and crisp, like a sports car. The BMW is a luxury vehicle and doing 80mph it is dead silent. It's a rocket ship when you drop the throttle.

The negatives is the BMW engine compartment has a fine oil mist everywhere. Something is leaking leaving a mist of oil. Maintaining the X5 is very expensive and I would NEVER own a BMW after the warranty expires. Too costly and risky in long term ownership. They are great to have but once they hit 50k miles, time to turn them in or it can turn into an expensive repair.

The BMW X3 is the little brother to the X5 but they are essentially the same platform with a little less HP and size.

Long term the CX5 is the better choice. It is a fun to drive car and reliability is better than the BMW. Cost of repair and ownership is also much lower with the CX5.
 
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I've driven a BMW X5 with the 8 speed auto trans and twin turbo V6. No doubt the X5 is super fast and the 8 speed auto trans shifts fast and crisp, like a sports car. The BMW is a luxury vehicle and doing 80mph it is dead silent. It's a rocket ship when you drop the throttle.

The negatives is the BMW engine compartment has a fine oil mist everywhere. Something is leaking leaving a mist of oil. Maintaining the X5 is very expensive and I would NEVER own a BMW after the warranty expires. Too costly and risky in long term ownership. They are great to have but once they hit 50k miles, time to turn them in or it can turn into an expensive repair.

The BMW X3 is the little brother to the X5 but they are essentially the same platform with a little less HP and size.

Long term the CX5 is the better choice. It is a fun to drive car and reliability is better than the BMW. Cost of repair and ownership is also much lower with the CX5.

I think the Grand Jeep Cherokee SRT8 is a GREAT alternative to the X5M, if you're on a budget. It's very nice inside, and every bit as fast from what I recall. Further, it comes with a 5/100 warranty. When it breaks...have it fixed. No skin off your snout. If you still love it in 5 years, well hell, you probably are so emotionally attached to it that when you DO have to pay for repairs out of warranty you'll find some way to rationalize it, lol!
 
Did you check the BMW's tire air pressure? I'm not sure why it's DSC would kick in more (especially considering you drove the BMW in the warmer summer months).
Yes, pressure was fine.


In any case, in every actual test I've seen, the CX-5 stopped considerably quicker than the X3. This is with actual instrumented testing. One reviewer even commented that the brakes were sub-par for the class.
Sorry, I did not mean braking distance. Yes, CX-5 dist is shorter (maybe 'cause its lighter?).
I am talking of brake feel. It's softer than BMW, more mushy, initially. It's like this: say you're in cruise control or SCB kicked in (whatever). You attempt pressing the brake and you find a little tiny press and it's already hard. BMW was not that instant but it had considerably less pedal depress length than CX5. Whether you like it? No? YMMV. I liked BMW more.
 
You attempt pressing the brake and you find a little tiny press and it's already hard. BMW was not that instant but it had considerably less pedal depress length than CX5. Whether you like it? No? YMMV. I liked BMW more.

I guess I rate actual safety and capability well above what the actual brake pedal "feels" like.

Every car has different brake pedal feel. My Volvo S80 had very sudden and initial bite (especially at parking lot speeds) It took me 2-3 weeks to adjust to it. But they worked well and after a month, I never even thought about it. The ability to consistently and quickly bring the tires to threshold braking matters to me a lot more than whether the feel is harder or softer. Of course with anti-lock brakes standard nowadays, feel is even less important. But a shorter stopping distance could be the difference between life and death.
 
I guess I rate actual safety and capability well above what the actual brake pedal "feels" like.

Every car has different brake pedal feel. My Volvo S80 had very sudden and initial bite (especially at parking lot speeds) It took me 2-3 weeks to adjust to it. But they worked well and after a month, I never even thought about it. The ability to consistently and quickly bring the tires to threshold braking matters to me a lot more than whether the feel is harder or softer. Of course with anti-lock brakes standard nowadays, feel is even less important. But a shorter stopping distance could be the difference between life and death.

BTW: Do you know how CX-5 internally makes the brake pedal HARD? I thought it's hydraulics all the way. Is there a way to tune the brakes to make them more hard, for example by default?
 
Disconnect or plug the brake vacuum assist and it will be all manual brakes and nice and hard. You could probably create a vacuum control valve in the line to the brake assist chamber to limit/adjust the level of vacuum in the chamber that was available for it to "assist" with and tune it that way.
 
The BMW has more horsepower. For me that is the only thing in it's favor. It is too expensive to buy, too expensive to fix, too heavy, and not that reliable. 8 speeds in the transmission of a vehicle that can maybe do 145'ish if the governor wasn't there is about 2 too many. Driving it in manual mode would have you shifting all the time. It's all about maxing out the EPA mileage cycle and overkill for actual driving.
 
The BMW has more horsepower. For me that is the only thing in it's favor. It is too expensive to buy, too expensive to fix, too heavy, and not that reliable. 8 speeds in the transmission of a vehicle that can maybe do 145'ish if the governor wasn't there is about 2 too many. Driving it in manual mode would have you shifting all the time. It's all about maxing out the EPA mileage cycle and overkill for actual driving.

That and 1 thing I forgot: X3 at 85 feels like 55, rock solid. I had a feeling - the faster I go, more CROUCHED the X3 gets, as if super glue is being sprayed on to the tires.....
unno about CX-5. Just crossed 2000 miles so might attempt a +80. But in NJ: LOL!!
 
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