2008 Mazda5, banging/rattling noise in front suspension

Thanks for the info Davicho.

The saga continues…sorry for hijacking your thread damaludin. I’ll create a new thread if the mods ask me to.
I picked up the 5 yesterday and my mechanic told me 2 new sounds are coming from the front.
-Creaking, crunching when slowly driving over speed bumps, potholes or uneven surfaces
-Humming (especially noticeable when driving on the highway)

He thinks the creaking\crunching is a result of bad control arms or the struts or springs not being installed properly (installed by a different mechanic)

As for the humming, he thinks the front right wheel bearing is bad (potentially a result from him torching the seized wheel hub in the axle/steering knuckle when working on installing the new control arm)

So I’ll have the car for a week and then back to the shop…argh!

In regards to the rear, he kept the Moog end links and installed new “redesigned” Mazda stabilizer bar bushings and brackets as per recommendation from a friend of his who works at Mazda. I’ll probably order the poly bushings and the 2012 Mazda brackets Davicho used later but the Mazda ones will do for now.

Update:
My mechanic uninstalled/re-installed the new Beck/Arnley front control arms + uninstalled/re-installed Monroe front strut mounts last week.

After 6 days of driving, including a long road trip to Buffalo and back, the suspension does feel better but I still hear a bit of a clunk from the rear and crunch from the front. I've heard the noises mainly when driving over uneven surfaces, medium-large size potholes or bumps and entering/exiting sloped driveways, especially in the mornings when the car is cold.

Thankfully, I haven’t seen the rear shoot up higher than the front when going over some uneven surfaces yet…which used to freak me out but excite my 3 year old when seated in the 3rd row.

Now it’s possible the clunk and crunch that I’m steel feeling/hearing are a result of the mechanics not doing a good job or because the new parts (Beck/Arnley, KYB and Mazda) are crap.

Or maybe the suspension actually sounds/feels as designed (guess I’ll know that when I test drive another 5)… but really, I've driven and sat in many other cars through the same streets I drive my Mazda through and the suspension in the Mazda just doesn't feel or sound as good as the other cars (03 Sienna, 09 CX9, 99 Altima, 01 Protege, 97 Integra, 06 Vibe... to name some). A friend even borrowed my 5 this past weekend and he thought I needed new shocks… yeh he was pretty surprised when I told him most of the suspension was brand new.

Anyhow, my 5 has spent way too much time at the shop over the last few months so I'm going to hold off on any further suspension work for the next year or so. I really want to see how it holds up through the winter. If things are not better, I might sell or look into getting:

• Arch-welding bead in the crossmember spring pockets grinded (if needed)
• Coilover kit front and back (Koni or BC Racing) or Koni FSD kit or Bilstein shocks n struts
• Beefier end links for the front
• Either:

FYI: My mechanic (a family relative who runs a small shop) did not have a lot of 5's coming in for suspension work until this past year. He told me the 5's and the 3's all seem to have similar suspension issues. Excluding myself, none of his customers went beyond replacing bushings (Mazda) and end-links (Mazda or aftermarket) so he does not know what the “fix” is.

As for the front right wheel bearing, it’s a work in progress. My mechanic is having a really hard time getting the wheel hub out of the steering knuckle. He torched it for over an hour last week and ran out of the torch fuel. He knows he could use a hammer and chisel to get it out be he feels torching it will cause the least amount of damage to other components. I'll be dropping the 5 off later this week so he can continue working on it... I think he will be detaching the steering knuckle with wheel hub in it then try to get the hub out.

Update:
Mechanic replaced the front right bearing last week. (He replaced it by taking the steering knuckle off with wheel hub in it, torched the hub to get it loose and out.) Humming noise is gone...yay!

I'm not hearing the clunk/thud from the rear much either. He replaced a rear right upper control arm bolt with a stock size one (the one he used when first installing the new arm was too skinny).

Update:Beck/Arnley rear left upper control arm broke.



Happened while I was driving this past Saturday night. I was driving around 30km/h with all rows occupied...wife and 3 year old in third row and I stopped right away as soon as it happened.

I haven't got the 5 back yet but it seems the arm is the only thing that needs to be replaced. It could have been a lot worse in more ways than one had i been driving on the highway...thank God!




I drove quite a bit that day on some really crappy roads and did my best at avoiding what I could...though I didn't encounter and crazy pot holes.

My mechanic will be installing a Doorman arm. It looks, feels and weighs exactly the same as the Beck/Arnley one but costs around $25 more... so i'm a bit worried this might happen again.

Anyone have any ideas on why it broke so quickly?

Do you think it's because of the parts combination I'm using for the rear?

Or maybe cuss Beck/Arnley makes crappy suspension parts? I'm beginning to think that since the end-links were replaced not too long ago because they were "crappy" according to my mechanic. (I wish I had taken pictures of all of the old parts).

Wow, that looks bad. I will say OE replica arms do look very weak but perhaps you should consider stronger/adjustable arms next time. Also, are your tires rubbing on the shock body!?

I like JBR arms but you can also find many alternatives on eBay. Personally, I don't like B&A replacement parts.
http://www.jamesbaroneracing.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=43_57

Silentnoise713 said:

Wow, that looks bad. I will say OE replica arms do look very weak but perhaps you should consider stronger/adjustable arms next time. Also, are your tires rubbing on the shock body!?

Click to expand...

When the arm broke, the tire caved in and rubbed against the shock body until I stopped the car. Thats what caused the scrape marks on the shock.

Silentnoise713 said:

I like JBR arms but you can also find many alternatives on eBay. Personally, I don't like B&A replacement parts.
http://www.jamesbaroneracing.com/store/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=43_57

Click to expand...

I bought all of the non-Mazda parts from a cousin who is a parts dealer. He assured me that B&A parts were good...maybe I just got a bad batch.

I'll probably get the Top Speed arms phunky buddha got. Just not sure if I should replace them now or wait. If I do replace them now, I might as well get the Progress bar (with included poly bushings) and beefier end-links. Oh and then there's Koni FSD's + high load springs(from phunky buddha). I don't know, i'll probably wait till the winter and see what happens.

what size bushings are they for front and rear? I have a 2009 Mazda 5 with same issues, having a hard time finding size needed I heard 23mm front 20mm rear.

I have 23mm ES bushings for the front and Mazda bushings for the rear but I don't know what size they are. I'm guessing they are 19mm per Davicho's post in this thread.

If you are going to get ES bushings, you might want to get the black ones as "Energy has impregnated selected black polyurethane components with graphite to add a lubrication property".

I know this is an old thread but what width brackets did you guys use for the Energy Suspension bushings in the front?

The 9.5127 has brackets that fit 2 1/16th to 2 7/8ths.

The 9.5115 has brackets that fit 2 9/16ths to 3 5/8ths.

Both are for a 23mm sway bar.

My mechanic used the stock brackets with the 9.5127 bushings. I don't know what the dimensions are of the stocks.

Update:
I haven't had any mechanics confirm this but I think the Doorman left rear upper arm broke.




When it happened, I was driving around 30 km/h and all the seats were occupied. Third row had 9 year old rear left, adult middle and 4 year old rear right. I haven't even run into any potholes or big bumps since the last time this happened.

I have JBR arms, FSD kit, ES bushings and https://www.ebay.com (commissions earned) (ones Davichio has). I'll be getting all the parts minus front struts installed. I'll also be getting rear alignment done to following specs:
Rear Camber: -1.3 degrees
Rear Toe: 0.12 degrees

Front is holding up well accept for a little squeak on first bump after car has been sitting for several hours on cold days (-10 celsius or more usually).

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.

Not a lot of responses but over 7500 views… guess that merits an update

For you fellow TD Gold Visa holders, if this ever happens to you, be very careful in describing the problem when requesting for tow truck service. I accidentally said I hit a pothole and as a result, the rep gave me a very hard time when I tried to back track on my statement after finding out damage from hitting a pothole was not covered. Also, the first tow truck (Success Towing) refused to tow for free claiming I hit a pothole, even though I proved to him there were none in sight. I’m pretty sure he declined because of the bad weather and long distance to the shop. The second tow truck (Williams Towing) refused to tow without me coming along with him to the shop because he did not want to be responsible for further damage to the car due to the bad weather… so I ended up having it towed to a friend’s house a few blocks away. The Williams guy recommended I request a flat bed in the future for the type of damage… which I later found out could only be requested by the tow truck company once on site and not the customer when calling TD. Also important to note that TD will not cover towing to anywhere for free… it must be towed to a certified auto repair shop.

The ES bushings with brackets, Ebay end-links, FSD shocks and JBR arms have been installed. I also got new Monroe Shock Mounts… the old mounts were fine but got them changed anyways. Also ended up getting brand new Mazda nuts and bolts installed for all of the changed parts… considering they had been taken out (sometimes loosened with a torch) and put back in so many times already and knowing they would have to be taken out and put back in for the camber arms several times for adjusting. So didn’t want to take the chance of having weak nuts and bolts.

In regards to the JBR Arms, one shop refused to install them because they were a pain to adjust … they had to be fully taken off each time to adjust. The shop that put them on charged $200 for 2.5 hours. I don’t have the exact alignment specs yet but the mechanic told me the camber was around -0.9 and the toe around 0.115.

Only driven a couple of days and haven’t had a chance to load the 3rd row up with adults so I can’t comment on the feel of the suspension or if this is the “fix” for my 5’s “camber arms breaking” issue yet.

One problem I do have now is the ABS light keeps turning on/off… which I’m guessing is the rear left ABS Wheel Speed Sensor.


Old parts:

Hey tech how did those KYBs hold up? I just bought them and installed them about a month ago and they feel nice and sturdy but still rides nice. Of course I came off those POS China made Sensens which are crap even worse then OEM Mazdas so the comparison is null really.

I had the stock shocks prior to the KYB's. Only had the KYB's for about 7 months but they were noticeably better than the stocks (which is the consensus on this forum). They are still in good shape (the dampening capability is still close to or the same as it was new) and I could have left them on but decided to go with the FSD's in an attempt to factor out any potential "weak" components that may be contributing to my 5's issue with the camber arm breaking.


Considering your location, I think the KYB's will last you a lot longer than they would have ever lasted me... unless you drive through crappier roads significantly more than I do.

In regards to dampening capability or providing a softer ride or softest ride possible, which is my preference, so far the FSD's seem to be the best option or at least better than stock or KYB. I personally cannot absolutely attribute the softer ride to the FSD's alone considering I do not know what role the other "better" components are playing however, from reading the other posts, it is very possible.

Thanks tech for your input. By the way my rear eBay end links are still in perfect condition. My Prothane rear bushings also work great and still no noise. However, after 20k miles and two sets of rear cheap ass Sensen shocks. My rear crunching noise was actually coming from those crappy shocks. There was no noise for the first 10k but as soon as 10k or so came around...BAM! The damn noise would come back. I know this because the first set of Sensen shocks started making noise and I got them replaced under warranty with another set and those started making noise shortly after 10k miles. So I chucked them and bought KYBs. They definitely feel nice and sturdy and of course not a peep out of the rear suspension.
Also, I am on the search for used 2012+ rear springs because they are supposed to be firmer with a higher spring rate which can help the rear feel a bit firmer without lowering the height and in turn help prolong the rear shock life. I just can't seem to find anyone selling them nor have I had luck with my contact at a huge salvage yard. I'll keep you all posted.

To damp means to attenuate. To dampen means to make wet. Shocks damp. Garden hoses dampen.

"Centrifugal" gas compressors have dampers, which are just volume bottles on the discharge, to damp the pulsation due to piston stroke. Even compressor manufacturers will sometimes call them dampeners, which is wrong, wrong, wrong and drives me insane. FYI, centrifugal force does not exist and people who use the term are very wrong. It is negative centripetal force.

I'm not a mechanic nor do I know much about physics... so I plead ignorance lol

I used the term based on what I read here: http://auto.howstuffworks.com/car-suspension2.htm

So, like many of the posters here, I too have the clunk coming from the read end. So it's either the bushings, shocks or sway bar links, in that order? By order, I mean most likely to be the problem to least. It's a clunk with a rattle, most noticeable at slow speeds over uneven surfaces (which thanks to PA winter, there's a lot of!). 08 5 GT with 29k on the clock.

CrapI spoke to soon. I have squeaking noises in the rearwhich Ive actually never had before...argh! On the first couple days of having the car, after the new parts were installed, I could only hear the squeak on the first bump/dip after the car had been resting for several hours. The temperature was around -10 then and it was similar to the front squeak so I didnt think much of it. The temperature has been warmer the last few days and Im now hearing it a lot more frequently.

Im guessing the noise is coming from the stabilizer bar bushings or JBR control arm bushings. As per suggestion from my family mechanic, I confirmed the stabilizer bar bushings are the right size (roughly 19 mm):


I spoke with the mechanic who installed the parts (a different one this time with 18 years of experience who lives a few blocks away from me only took it to him because of towing issues and due to family coercion I mean recommendation lol) and he asked me to bring it in. He also told me that he didnt grease either the stabilizer bar or control arm bushings because he claims its not required for the parts.

So, I could take it to a mechanic or DIY troubleshoot, which would be a first for me. So I could DIY either putting the Mazda stabilizer bar bushings back on, to confirm the noise is not coming from there or I try greasing the existing ES ones.

If greasing the stabilizer bar bushings is the way to go, any suggestions on which product?
Ive done a bit of research and found there is no real consensus on whats best for polyurethane bushings. There does seem to be a consensus that petroleum based or aerosol based are not recommended. If I do go the greasing route, Im leaning towards silicone or graphite based grease in a tube or tub in addition to wrapping Teflon tape around the sway bar. So far I checked Princess Auto and Canadian Tire and neither of them carry graphite or silicone based tubed or tubbed grease (didnt bother locking for aerosol).

BTW, here are some recordings from my cell phone. I extended my right arm to the rear with cell phone in hand while driving to capture them. I was also driving on similar roads with nothing in the rear aside from childrens car seats and with no passengers. Yeah its not very scientific but its something lol
First recording: Friday, driving around 60 km/h, -1 degrees Celsius
Second and third recordings: Yesterday, including exiting and entering driveway, max of around 60 km/h, 5 degrees Celsius.

View attachment 01.mp3View attachment 02.mp3View attachment 03.mp3

June 2012 (different cell phone) with KYB, Mazda & B&A suspension parts in rear, max of 60 km/h, 20 degrees Celsius
View attachment 04.mp3View attachment 05.mp3

Whats interesting about the recordings is they all have an additional rattling sound which can only be heard in the recordings. Also, the normal thumping or thud noises from the suspension are a lot more pronounced. The point of posting these recordings is really to better express the squeaking noise Im now hearing from the rear cuss I think any written explanations of noises are problematic. Maybe this should be the standard for all postings that try to identify problems through sounds lol

BTW, I know cell phones differ in recording quality so FYI, first set of recordings were done using Samsung Galaxy Note 2. Second set with HTC Touch.