Ok. So I'm pretty much commited to running 15X10" rims this season. i'm just tossing a few ideas around about widening the fenders a little. I know Corksport has the widebody kit in fiberglass and carbon fiber. I'm pretty certain that I would probably destroy it though the first time I hit a cone sideways at 60mph. I tried to talk them into making the kit in urethane, but they wouldn't consider it. Corksport also sells flares for the GTR. I've asked for pictures of those. What other options are out there. I've heard there is a MX-6 floating around with old school Toyota or Nissan rivet on flares around somewhere.
Fender Flares???
- Thread starter xelderx
- Start date
Custom sheet metal welded to the car? Fiberglass is easy to repair, why not just buy them and rattlecan the paint. That way you don't get upset if/when they crack...
Unless you trim the stock fenders, flares aren't going to make a clearance difference... do you really want to cut them up?
Unless you trim the stock fenders, flares aren't going to make a clearance difference... do you really want to cut them up?
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gavin_leslie
Member
xelderx said:
Hmm.
http://www.teamunemployment.com/gavin/fender flares/
http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/7BSA02/50-1562
Theres an addage in the theatre biz that warns nervous actors to not sneak a peek out of the curtains to see the audience...."If you can see them, then they can see you".
Ive been watching your buildup (and Britt's to an extent) for a bit now in secret, or so I thought. Im curious to know where you heard about the "floating MX-6"
Gavin (finally out of the shadows)
low_psi said:
I don't need the extra clearence for larger diameter tires. I just need to widen the fenders a little to match the rims/tires sticking out a few inches outside the fender. I'm going to run the 275/35-15 Hoosiers on 15X10 rims. The overall diameter is exactly the same as my current 225/45-15 which doesn't rub even though it sticks out a little (due to crappy offset on the Kosei rims).
I'll be upping my springrates to compensate for the extra grip so the tire fender clearence would technically be no different than it is now. I'm just looking for a little aesthetic.
gavin_leslie said:Hmm.
http://www.teamunemployment.com/gavin/fender%20flares/
http://www.thezstore.com/page/TZS/PROD/7BSA02/50-1562
Theres an addage in the theatre biz that warns nervous actors to not sneak a peek out of the curtains to see the audience...."If you can see them, then they can see you".
Ive been watching your buildup (and Britt's to an extent) for a bit now in secret, or so I thought. Im curious to know where you heard about the "floating MX-6"
Gavin (finally out of the shadows)
Yea...that's the MX-6. I have no idea where I first heard about your car. I've actually seen the pictures too. What size tires are you running? It looks like the ZG flares on the rear have a little less arch than the stock fender.The rears pose another problem for me having rear doors that follow the fender line.
gavin_leslie
Member
Hmm, Ill have to have a talk with my ninja assassins, er....I mean "Information Security Officers". Security is vital you see.
Tires are currently 245/45/16 S05s on 16x9 CCWs.
Yes, the flares are less curved than the cars natural fender arch. Both front and rear have a less pronounced curve. The flares are somewhat flexable and it was rather easy to profile them to a shape that would match closely with the cars natural arches.
The flares can accommodate a fairly wide tire(and wider in the rear as the original application is for a RWD car). Since the metal that was trimmed on my car only goes down to the side mouldings, I didnt have to get too agressive with tweaking the flares to cover what needs to be covered.
As for your car, the rear doors will pose a minor issue, but no more than say...Joel Fermann with his BSP STi (4 doors and 315s all around). Unless of course you decide on narrower wheels for the rear, which might not be such a bad idea. (and yes, I know you had issues before, but things change. It might be time to revisit the idea again).
Gavin
Tires are currently 245/45/16 S05s on 16x9 CCWs.
Yes, the flares are less curved than the cars natural fender arch. Both front and rear have a less pronounced curve. The flares are somewhat flexable and it was rather easy to profile them to a shape that would match closely with the cars natural arches.
The flares can accommodate a fairly wide tire(and wider in the rear as the original application is for a RWD car). Since the metal that was trimmed on my car only goes down to the side mouldings, I didnt have to get too agressive with tweaking the flares to cover what needs to be covered.
As for your car, the rear doors will pose a minor issue, but no more than say...Joel Fermann with his BSP STi (4 doors and 315s all around). Unless of course you decide on narrower wheels for the rear, which might not be such a bad idea. (and yes, I know you had issues before, but things change. It might be time to revisit the idea again).
Gavin
gavin_leslie
Member
I think that youll find that you may need to up your spring rates again, But I might be wrong. If I recall, Will Kalman was using 450/450 when he was still in STS. However, sometimes people who have skill can run seemingly unpossible setups, so take that as you may.
By the way, (unless there was a cry for this tire previously that I havent heard of) The asking for and getting of the 275/35/15 took just a bit over a month! It went so quickly it made my head spin. The subaru guys have been asking for a 265/40/16 forever (at least 2 yrs with me hanging on their coattails). Now that all of the old RS guys have moved on to WRXs and STi's, Hoosier springs out with this tire???
Hey... Im sure itll do a lot of good to the honda/miata (and to a lesser extent the P5) set and Im happy for them, but wheres my happiness Hoosier? Yeah, thats what I thought, thanks for nothing :mad:
Gavin (bitter? No, why do you ask?)
By the way, (unless there was a cry for this tire previously that I havent heard of) The asking for and getting of the 275/35/15 took just a bit over a month! It went so quickly it made my head spin. The subaru guys have been asking for a 265/40/16 forever (at least 2 yrs with me hanging on their coattails). Now that all of the old RS guys have moved on to WRXs and STi's, Hoosier springs out with this tire???
Hey... Im sure itll do a lot of good to the honda/miata (and to a lesser extent the P5) set and Im happy for them, but wheres my happiness Hoosier? Yeah, thats what I thought, thanks for nothing :mad:
Gavin (bitter? No, why do you ask?)
i believe justin is planning to up his rates to compensate. i also agree that maybe 275 is too much for the rear; a 225 might work better back there. but you can always use 2 custom wheels...rains!
i suspect that 16" size never came about b/c that 16" size is too tall for lower-powered, but slightly heavy cars like newer FWD imports. a 265/40/16 is 24.3", which is much taller than this size (22.5"); thus, not really as widely usable as this one is.
in fact it would be barely shorter than the existing 285/30/18 (24.7"), so there likely wouldn't be much market for it. why not use the 285?
if the review of SP really results in UD/BD covering more cars, an impreza L w/ an EJ25 swap might end up legal in SP. that would be a good candidate for these shoes. as would a RWD corolla w/ the high-compression 4ag.
i suspect that 16" size never came about b/c that 16" size is too tall for lower-powered, but slightly heavy cars like newer FWD imports. a 265/40/16 is 24.3", which is much taller than this size (22.5"); thus, not really as widely usable as this one is.
in fact it would be barely shorter than the existing 285/30/18 (24.7"), so there likely wouldn't be much market for it. why not use the 285?
if the review of SP really results in UD/BD covering more cars, an impreza L w/ an EJ25 swap might end up legal in SP. that would be a good candidate for these shoes. as would a RWD corolla w/ the high-compression 4ag.
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gavin_leslie
Member
Understood about the sizing of the tires, but your assumption is that all FWD cars can benefit from shorter tires than stock.
This is why I sided with the Subaru folks. Their cars are somewhat heavy (which makes them an ideal candidate for wider tires), Fairly torquey(can spin big tires). Problem is that they have gearing that usually requires a 2-3 shift. Thats a recipe for a tire thats same size or even taller than stock.
I am in that boat.
The GS car runs on 225/50/15s, thats an inch shorter than stock. 275/35/15 is based on the 225/45/15 which would almost be 2 inches shorter than stock for me (205/60/15). I have no use for a tire that is 2" shorter and the torque multiplication that comes with them given that the engine untouched makes 192ft/lbs torque @ 3000rpm(yes...at the wheels). My gearing is also such that 2nd gear tops out at 58mph with stock tires. Short tires...simply not ideal. Alas, Most of the suby drivers have graduated to cars that no longer need a wide 16.
The magic 285/30/18s? Irrelevant and unproven. Worse they have been made even more pointless for FWD cars with the move to heartland. Perhaps one could comfort themselves with the thought that the immense grip and abrasiveness of a Forbes would allow them to run such wide pontoons, but thats not the case any longer(and maybe never was in the first place).
One could argue that the wide275/35/15 is much more useless than the proposed 265/40/16. Really, whats the last car that needed such a wide 15? The 84 lamborghini Countach? At least you could make a convincing(or not so convincing as the case may be) argument that the carcass of the 265 could be used for the road racing compound for late model F-bodies or mustangs, but this is all academic anyway....you have your tires and a win is a win in the end.
Id like to see the new proposal for SP as well, I dont think its going to be as sweeping as everyone thinks though.
Meh, these are just idle ramblings and tangential anyway.
Gavin
This is why I sided with the Subaru folks. Their cars are somewhat heavy (which makes them an ideal candidate for wider tires), Fairly torquey(can spin big tires). Problem is that they have gearing that usually requires a 2-3 shift. Thats a recipe for a tire thats same size or even taller than stock.
I am in that boat.
The GS car runs on 225/50/15s, thats an inch shorter than stock. 275/35/15 is based on the 225/45/15 which would almost be 2 inches shorter than stock for me (205/60/15). I have no use for a tire that is 2" shorter and the torque multiplication that comes with them given that the engine untouched makes 192ft/lbs torque @ 3000rpm(yes...at the wheels). My gearing is also such that 2nd gear tops out at 58mph with stock tires. Short tires...simply not ideal. Alas, Most of the suby drivers have graduated to cars that no longer need a wide 16.
The magic 285/30/18s? Irrelevant and unproven. Worse they have been made even more pointless for FWD cars with the move to heartland. Perhaps one could comfort themselves with the thought that the immense grip and abrasiveness of a Forbes would allow them to run such wide pontoons, but thats not the case any longer(and maybe never was in the first place).
One could argue that the wide275/35/15 is much more useless than the proposed 265/40/16. Really, whats the last car that needed such a wide 15? The 84 lamborghini Countach? At least you could make a convincing(or not so convincing as the case may be) argument that the carcass of the 265 could be used for the road racing compound for late model F-bodies or mustangs, but this is all academic anyway....you have your tires and a win is a win in the end.
Id like to see the new proposal for SP as well, I dont think its going to be as sweeping as everyone thinks though.
Meh, these are just idle ramblings and tangential anyway.
Gavin
gavin_leslie
Member
well its gone in this direction anyway....
apologies to Justin.
Another thought that I have been mulling over as well. 3rd gear isnt as poochy as in some other cars, and with an (over)abundance of torque down low, its a real possibility. At some point though, Ill have to make my decision as to the direction the car will go.
This is not to mean that I am not without curiosity. I am still expirimenting with the GS (an 88 MX6)car to see if this(3rd gear) is feasable. I should pull out the gear chart/rollout calculator again.
The irony is that when the engine build happens(sometime late this year I hope) Ill be looking for ways to reduce the torque output. Please, no more.
Gavin
Another thought that I have been mulling over as well. 3rd gear isnt as poochy as in some other cars, and with an (over)abundance of torque down low, its a real possibility. At some point though, Ill have to make my decision as to the direction the car will go.
This is not to mean that I am not without curiosity. I am still expirimenting with the GS (an 88 MX6)car to see if this(3rd gear) is feasable. I should pull out the gear chart/rollout calculator again.
The irony is that when the engine build happens(sometime late this year I hope) Ill be looking for ways to reduce the torque output. Please, no more.
Gavin
justin, there was a link to some flares on club4ag. if they ever get back up and running, i'll search for the link.
gavin, i was simply positing a reason for the quick acceptance of the shorter wide tires vs. the size you mentioned, which seemed to have a more limited applicability, as well as an existing size that was pretty close. there must be a business reason; i don't think it lies in some antipathy toward subarus. my post certainly had nothing to do with your car in particular.
gavin, i was simply positing a reason for the quick acceptance of the shorter wide tires vs. the size you mentioned, which seemed to have a more limited applicability, as well as an existing size that was pretty close. there must be a business reason; i don't think it lies in some antipathy toward subarus. my post certainly had nothing to do with your car in particular.
gavin_leslie
Member
dmitrik4... No worries. Im an absurdist at heart so I didnt take anything you said as a jab at my car. I fully understand its irrelevancy in the grand scheme of things.
As for Hoosier, I have a thought on why things happened. Timing, competition and market share. After a couple fumbles with the S04 and S05, It wasnt so clear cut anymore where people would spend their dollars with the V710 kicking ass. The A6 is a winner, but the "damage" was already done.
Kumho is kinda encroaching on Hoosiers turf so they need to get ahead again. How? Go after the empty spots that arent filled(IE, no competition there). Hmmm, where are the empty spots? Eh? whats this?...an email about a wide 15"...wont cost us much since we can recycle the 225/45/15 mould...Done. Back in the day when people were asking for the 265/40/16 there just wasnt the same impetus there to drive hoosier I think.
All a matter of timing. But its just a theory
Back on topic:
I think the flares on club4AG are the jubiride(sp) flares. I did a long search a while back looking for flares and I sent through the same cast of characters. club4ag, freshalloy.com, NICO, clubrx7, miataforums, all the places where the drift team would show up. Theres surprisingly not that many flare kits to be had in the bolt-on arena. When you find them, like the jubiride flares they cost $600 and upwards. For a set of fiberglass bolt-on flares??? F-that.
By the way, I was originally looking for bolt-on urethane flares. I figured that injection moulding would make them cheaper, and they would be more flexable and resistant to cones/easier to trim to fit. Just about impossible to find, and when I did, they were JDM pricing. unacceptable
Then I stumbled across the flares that I eventually wound up with. I could live with a $200 loss if it didnt fit. I gambled a bit and it turned out better than I figured. Not perfect, but perfect enough.
Z-car store also lists another flare kit thats smaller than the ones I got, but their pictures are awful and I couldnt tell if they were bolt-on or mould-on. if they are bolt-on that might help in the rear of the protege. I saw another set of small flares in my searches, but I dont recall who made it. Ill look around and see if i can find it again(im almost sure itll be from the land of JDM though)
Gavin
As for Hoosier, I have a thought on why things happened. Timing, competition and market share. After a couple fumbles with the S04 and S05, It wasnt so clear cut anymore where people would spend their dollars with the V710 kicking ass. The A6 is a winner, but the "damage" was already done.
Kumho is kinda encroaching on Hoosiers turf so they need to get ahead again. How? Go after the empty spots that arent filled(IE, no competition there). Hmmm, where are the empty spots? Eh? whats this?...an email about a wide 15"...wont cost us much since we can recycle the 225/45/15 mould...Done. Back in the day when people were asking for the 265/40/16 there just wasnt the same impetus there to drive hoosier I think.
All a matter of timing. But its just a theory
Back on topic:
I think the flares on club4AG are the jubiride(sp) flares. I did a long search a while back looking for flares and I sent through the same cast of characters. club4ag, freshalloy.com, NICO, clubrx7, miataforums, all the places where the drift team would show up. Theres surprisingly not that many flare kits to be had in the bolt-on arena. When you find them, like the jubiride flares they cost $600 and upwards. For a set of fiberglass bolt-on flares??? F-that.
By the way, I was originally looking for bolt-on urethane flares. I figured that injection moulding would make them cheaper, and they would be more flexable and resistant to cones/easier to trim to fit. Just about impossible to find, and when I did, they were JDM pricing. unacceptable
Then I stumbled across the flares that I eventually wound up with. I could live with a $200 loss if it didnt fit. I gambled a bit and it turned out better than I figured. Not perfect, but perfect enough.
Z-car store also lists another flare kit thats smaller than the ones I got, but their pictures are awful and I couldnt tell if they were bolt-on or mould-on. if they are bolt-on that might help in the rear of the protege. I saw another set of small flares in my searches, but I dont recall who made it. Ill look around and see if i can find it again(im almost sure itll be from the land of JDM though)
Gavin
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i think you're right re: hoosier trying to gain advantage in the market. if they want to make funky sizes i'm all for that. i think they're going to sell a ton of those 275/35/15s. and i'm certainly going to write my letter re: subarus and corollas getting good UD/BD allowances in SP.
i think the ones i saw on club4ag were a sort of generic urethane flare...i don't believe they were the jubiride(?) flares, and they certainly weren't very expensive. hopefully taka and moto can upgrade to a modern BB system and hardware.
i think the ones i saw on club4ag were a sort of generic urethane flare...i don't believe they were the jubiride(?) flares, and they certainly weren't very expensive. hopefully taka and moto can upgrade to a modern BB system and hardware.
