Newbie: Engine Electrical Noise Problem

OK - I'm new here so take it easy on me. I have searched the threads but didn't see anything in this category so I'm posting a new one. I've done some nice subtle speaker installs that I will have to post when I get the time.

I'm going insane with my radio upgrade to my 2002 Protege5. I am having an electrical noise problem tied to the engine revs (loud whinning/whirring). Now almost always the problem with this is a bad ground.

I have now installed a ground kit so that the block, throttle, alternator, etc. are all grounded (which improved throttle response greatly - but did not fix the problem). I have run a ground wire directly to the head unit and amps off the grounding block. Additional ground point is underneath the center ebrake module drilled into sanded steel body.

I believe the problem is coming from the head unit. Two different head units have done the same thing. The head unit (Alpine) came w/a noise supressor inline. Unhooking the amps and running only the internal power from the head unit to the speakers still results in whirring w/ engine...esp when lights or AC are on. Yes, my power wires are well separated from my RCAs.

I've poked and tested. The stock unit did not have this problem. In a couple of instances it seemed as if the antenna may have been part of the problem and carrying the noise. I also have XM hookup to the head unit but I don't think thats it. I've ordered new NGK plug wires and plugs but they are not here yet. I've been working on this for 4 months on and off. Has anyone had similar problems? Help!

what about your door speaker wires, did you rerun those?

No - I ran the amp wires for the door speakers up to the stock harness - not the best but couldn't find an easy way to run the wires directly. Eventually I should fix that as I'm using component speakers (JBLs). A small bazooka is wired directly in the trunk. The noise happens when the volume is at zero so I don't think that's the problem.

moved to Protege 5 section.

did you run your rca cables on the same side of the cabin as your power wire?

Sorry - I was out of town for awhile. Got the new plugs and wires but have not installed them yet.

No, the RCAs are on the other side from the power. Maybe bad alternator? But why no noise with stock radio? The problem has got to be on my end since I'm not hearing that this is a common problem. This is driving me crazy. This car is awesome if it wasn't for that noise!

Do an internet search. There are tons of pages about how to get rid of ground loop noise. But yeah, the problem is with running the wires and your install...not the car itself. This IS a common problem when you install a system.

try running a new ground from the chasis of the car to the radio directly. DO NOT USE THE GROUND ON THE FACTORY HARNESS FOR ANY PART OF YOUR NEW SYSTEM!!!

Same ol whinny song

blthlt said:

try running a new ground from the chasis of the car to the radio directly. DO NOT USE THE GROUND ON THE FACTORY HARNESS FOR ANY PART OF YOUR NEW SYSTEM!!!

Click to expand...

Roger that. That's what the peeps at crutchfield said when I originally installed. Still no luck. I think the ground w/in the antenna may be part of it....this time of the year I'm always traveling so its hard to work on car. Those of you that want a quick answer from me might want to email since I check this less frequent when I'm out & about. I should take the other guys advice and do a wider internet search on engine noise / ground loops.

What's up w/all these people adding 200lbs of insulation to their cars? Buy a caddie.

2 decks same problem
Speaker routing, RCA check
Car still runs, battery charging, altenator check

It's your amp.

the noise is your altenator but that isn't the reason you are hearing it. go to the rca connection on your amp and wiggle the connection (you are trying to move the circuit board inside ever so much) I bet you hear the wiggle in the whine.

borrow a buddy's amp or connect speakers directly to the regular outputs on your deck and I bet you won't hear the noise.

neoturner said:

2 decks same problem
Speaker routing, RCA check
Car still runs, battery charging, altenator check

It's your amp.

the noise is your altenator but that isn't the reason you are hearing it. go to the rca connection on your amp and wiggle the connection (you are trying to move the circuit board inside ever so much) I bet you hear the wiggle in the whine.

borrow a buddy's amp or connect speakers directly to the regular outputs on your deck and I bet you won't hear the noise.

Click to expand...

nevermind saw that you tested without. still thinking but perplexed.

Ok. I have definatley done this kind of troubleshoot and feel your pain but I have another idea. You gotta isolate the problem more.

Stock unit no, aftermarket yes - Did you have the XM with the Stock unit installed?

If no I would definately take the XM and move it's power wire away from anything behind the deck that it might be close to and test without it in there.

Is it all your speakers that produce the whine? I'm guessing yes since you are concentrating your efforts up front. or that you have tried just connection a speaker to the amp away from everything to see if it makes the noise.

I'd still wiggle the connections on the amp just to rule those out.

My system sounded perfect, until I installed my XM (plugs right into my Alpine deck) and then I got the whine. There's your problem.

Here's my install:
Amps under seats, driver for fronts, passenger for rear. The RCA's run down the middle console, then split to the amps.

I originally run the power wires for the amps down the left size of the middle console and the speaker wires from the amps to the sides, then to the doors. This gave me RPM wine. You'll notice that your power windows will affect the speakers too Very good sign that you are running the wires in a bad spot! Since you are using the stock wires, you will probably have this problem.

Instead, I re-ran the power wire on the left side of the car, then accross to both amps (dist block by my driver side amp under seat). I re-ran the speaker wires up the middle console, then out to the doors from the front. This way the speaker wires aren't running with the rest of the wires along the sides of the car. This fixed everything. In your case, you will have to run wire, which includes pulling some carpet up a little, taking the center console out, etc. Also, there's no good place to run wires to the doors. I have mine run up behind the pastic panels, then under the door gasket on the front, then through a small hole in the rubber thing that houses the stock wires. Doesn't look too bad and is very easy compared to trying to drill holes in the stock harness to run additional speaker wires.

Btw, I don't have any fancy grounding or that s***. My amps ground to my seat bolts... simple. Make sure you clean up the bolts and stuff to give a good connection.

So basically, run your speaker wires and RCA's along the middle console. Run your power wires along the sides. Ground your amps as close as you can to the amps, the seat bolts worked for me because of my amp locations. Everything else should work...

Just so I don't kill modem people I'm just posting links...

Some pics of my install:

Amp under driver's seat, powers fronts. Include dist block for amp power. Power wire comes from left side of car to dist block under carpet. Dist block runs to amps. Speaker wires run to center console, then to front, then back out to doors along front (not by any other wires).
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/amp1.jpg

Amp under passenger's seat, powers rears. Wires actually run to side pillars. The rear only have "subs" so not really a chance for wine anyway, but I keep them away from other wires except when running up the side pillar.
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/amp2.jpg

How I run wires for rear doors...
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/rear1.jpg
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/rear2.jpg
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/rear3.jpg
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/rear4.jpg

The front wires are similar to rear. Here's kind of a bad pic. The wires run along the front floor boards.
http://www.hex2bit.com/pics/front1.jpg

That should give people a little idea. I have more pics if you want to see something else.