Winter is here and my CX-5 turbo is now a 2.0L!

[finch204]

I'm not buying a car that gimps out under any condition. I'm not that brand loyal to anyone.

I think I've asked this question before, not to you specifically, but in general. Would a CX-5 spinning its tires be faster than a CX-5 accelerating slower than usual but whose tires are not spinning?

I think Mazda decided to prioritize traction to stop people from losing control of their vehicles. It kind of falls in line with their jinba ittai philosophy too. No one mashes the gas pedal and expects to get wheelspin, they expect to move forward. Of course the issue here is slower acceleration, but you still move forward and maybe that's what they designed the car to do.

By the way all of this is assumption as I don't think anyone has determined what the real issue is.

 

[7eregrine]

Does that mean you're staying away from all cars with traction control systems? All cars that have torque vectoring control? Seems like a broad statement..

My turbo Saab's with traction control never had an issue and in fact drove better in the cold. And how many other cars have "Torque Vectoring Control". AFAIKnew this was a Mazda thing. But yea... if this is an issue with T-Vectoring and other cars do this same thing in cold weather then: yes. 100%. Will not buy.

 

[7eregrine]

I think I've asked this question before, not to you specifically, but in general. Would a CX-5 spinning its tires be faster than a CX-5 accelerating slower than usual but whose tires are not spinning?

I would think the spinner would be slower. and agree we still can't say 100% what the issue is. I could change my tune. But for now... which is cool because I am not in the market now...

 

[sm1ke]

I'm not buying a car that gimps out under any condition.

Remember this statement whenever traction control on your CX-5 kicks in.

BTW I wasn't relating the thread topic with traction control or torque vectoring, just making a point that these systems "gimp out" with a purpose in mind, and improve the driving experience for the majority of drivers.

 

[Odrapnew]

I think I've asked this question before, not to you specifically, but in general. Would a CX-5 spinning its tires be faster than a CX-5 accelerating slower than usual but whose tires are not spinning?

Depends on how close to the limit of adhesion the non-spinning is.
If you are right at the limit, the non-spinning would be faster.
From feedback that people have noticed the issue of low power, I don't think it's anywhere near that limit.

 

[Odrapnew]

How often do you guys drive your CX-5's like you're on a drag strip? I got mine last Feb, so this is my 2nd Boston winter and daily driving, I have no lack of power feeling. Lots of hyperbole in this thread.........

I don't think its a matter of being able to use it or not. Moreso an issue of "I paid for it, so it should be there".

I agree with sm1ke. If I paid extra for more power, I should get it 99% of the time. Low traction (snow, rain) may invoke traction control, but that's not often.

If my Explorer choked when temps were cold, you bet I would be back at the dealer. It's roughly the same 0-60 as the Turbo CX5 based on magazine tests and I don't notice any difference in acceleration except wet/snow when traction control kicks in.

Luckily, the Explorer engine loves the cold weather. I might get a split second of front wheel spin when jumping on it from a dead stop before power is transmitted to the rear. That's regardless of traction control on or off. With traction control on (normal mode), it might kick on, again, for a split second, but once power is transmitted to the rear tires, it'll accelerate like normal. This is in any temp (as low as -20F), dry conditions.

I don't see how/why the CX5 should accelerate much slower in cold temps. I don't think it has enough torque/hp to get full-on 4 wheel spin on cold, dry pavement (assuming full torque available and no traction control).

In all honesty, this is really deterring me from picking up a CX5 (and they have some killer deals on 2019 Sigs and GTRs). I know, internet forums are usually about complaints and most people who don't have issues never report, so we really don't know how widespread this issue is. But, living in 'FREEZING' MN winters does have me concerned/curious if this affects all CX5's.

 

[2001birdowner]

How often do you guys drive your CX-5's like you're on a drag strip? I got mine last Feb, so this is my 2nd Boston winter and daily driving, I have no lack of power feeling. Lots of hyperbole in this thread.........

It’s not about driving like you’re on a drag strip. It’s about the car consistently performing the way it should.

You don’t need to drive like you’re on a drag strip to notice the issue if you are in tune with your car.

 

[2001birdowner]

In all honesty, this is really deterring me from picking up a CX5 (and they have some killer deals on 2019 Sigs and GTRs). I know, internet forums are usually about complaints and most people who don't have issues never report, so we really don't know how widespread this issue is. But, living in 'FREEZING' MN winters does have me concerned/curious if this affects all CX5's.

I’m in VT and I’m really regretting this purchase.

Go test drive one when it’s in the teens, that’s when it’s most consistent.

 

[sm1ke]

It’s not about driving like you’re on a drag strip. It’s about the car consistently performing the way it should.

Well, I don't think it makes sense to expect the car to perform the way it does at 40F in 20F temps. At 40F, there should be no risk of ice on the road, tires will be warmer so they'll have better traction, etc. Winter tires are recommended at temps below 45F because that's generally when all-season tires start to become less effective.

This is just my opinion, and I fully acknowledge the fact that I know less about these cars/tires/systems than the people who design and engineer them.

 

[finch204]

Are the people having these issues running winter tires?

 

[joeca]

I'm seeing the complaints beginning to pile up, sorry. Not trolling just observing:

- less than comfortable seats
- excessive paint chipping
- crappy service at dealerships
- losing power when its cold (never seen this ever, with any car)

 

[sm1ke]

My observations of your observations.

I'm seeing the complaints beginning to pile up, sorry. Not trolling just observing:

- less than comfortable seats for some people
- excessive paint chipping commonly seen across most Japanese paint
- crappy service at dealerships which is common across all brands
- losing power when its cold (never seen this ever, with any car) not ideal, but personally I get it

All this to say that Mazda can do better, and hopefully they will.

 

[niavlys]

Are the people having these issues running winter tires?

I have 4 new Blizzak tires, some have all season tires, it makes no difference. We all experience the same loss of power at about the same outside air temp.

 

[Odrapnew]

Well, I don't think it makes sense to expect the car to perform the way it does at 40F in 20F temps. At 40F, there should be no risk of ice on the road, tires will be warmer so they'll have better traction, etc. Winter tires are recommended at temps below 45F because that's generally when all-season tires start to become less effective.

This is just my opinion, and I fully acknowledge the fact that I know less about these cars/tires/systems than the people who design and engineer them.

I agree.....I expect an engine to produce more power when it's cold outside.

If it's truly a traction issue, let the traction control take care of that (with notification by traction control light).

 

[2001birdowner]

I agree.....I expect an engine to produce more power when it's cold outside.

If it's truly a traction issue, let the traction control take care of that (with notification by traction control light).

Agreed.

38*F on the drive home, totally different vehicle.

 

[Odrapnew]

Unfortunately (or fortunately) our weather is going to be too warm to test this low power theory. Maybe it's just a sign that I should get a tune and rear sway bar for my Explorer and keep that for a few more years.

 

[Avoidin Deer]

Deleted.

 

[sm1ke]

I agree.....I expect an engine to produce more power when it's cold outside.

Do you expect traction to improve as well? Because it doesn't. Extra power + less traction = wheel spin. Maybe engineers tuned it this way to avoid traction control kicking in as much as possible, because if it did, then everyone would be blaming the traction control (which is a safety feature) and calling for them to disable it. I don't know.. like everyone else, I'm just guessing.

If I were so concerned about this, I'd be test driving an RDX or a Q5 to see if they exhibited the same "quirk". If they didn't, I'd be trying to use this info to leverage an explanation from Mazda.

 

[Odrapnew]

Do you expect traction to improve as well? Because it doesn't. Extra power + less traction = wheel spin. Maybe engineers tuned it this way to avoid traction control kicking in as much as possible, because if it did, then everyone would be blaming the traction control (which is a safety feature) and calling for them to disable it. I don't know.. like everyone else, I'm just guessing.

If I were so concerned about this, I'd be test driving an RDX or a Q5 to see if they exhibited the same "quirk". If they didn't, I'd be trying to use this info to leverage an explanation from Mazda.

I agree, colder temps = less traction, but, if it's actually exceeding the traction limits, let traction control do its job, don't reduce power because is could be more slippery.

If they are reducing power to 'make it safer,' then put that in the owner's manual.

Think about a RWD car with lots of power. I don't know of any that reduce power to maintain traction. Traction control may kick in, but they don't reduce power to a point that it won't spin the tires. I know, completely different vehicle and just speculating that power is not reduced.

We both have our opinions and neither of us know why it happens, but to me, it doesn't make sense.

I might be able to convince my sister in-law to let me drive her SQ5 and see how that runs in cold weather.

EDIT: do they reduced braking performance when it's cold out?

 

[sm1ke]

EDIT: do they reduce braking performance when it's cold out?

Anti-lock braking system - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

ABS is an automated system that uses the principles of threshold braking and cadence braking, techniques which were once practiced by skillful drivers before ABSes were widespread. ABS operates at a much faster rate and more effectively than most drivers could manage.

So yes, you could say that ABS reduces braking performance if you're one of those skillful drivers who can brake better than the ABS system can.