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What Auto Braking?

Ronzuki

South Central PA
:
2018 CX5 Touring
:
w/ Pref Pkg
I KNEW IT!
i thought i test drove the cx-9 and it had a tachometer...phew good to know i wasn't losing it!
And THIS right here is the real problem w/ software controlling everything.
It happens constantly w/o one's knowledge or consent. The manufacturers and dealers act as though the vehicle, your vehicle, bought, paid for, and insured by you, is theirs. Features, functionality, here today gone tomorrow. Fixing things that weren't broken. I took my '14 Jeep JK in for its first annual state inspection after purchasing it new. Next morning I notice it wasn't shifting properly, as it had been for nearly the entire year, going up a certain hill under light acceleration as it had been. My imagination. Day after day, same thing. Not my imagination...WTF!? Go back and look at my service invoice and find buried in all of the BS they flashed the TCM. Why? I hadn't reported any problems, didn't ask for it, wasn't asked if they could, they just did it and then didn't tell me. I went in for state inspection and emissions testing, period. I took it back, complained asked them WTF are they flashing things that aren't broken for. A manufacturer update he says. I explained FCA didn't own the thing, I did and to back-flash. Said they couldn't. I called bullshyit, and asked, can't or won't? Blank stare. Pissed me off. Now I tell dealer service monkeys behind the counters no updates w/o my ok every time I drop any vehicles off at a dealer for anything.

Now that most of the newest vehicles have connections to wonderful web world 24/7, these updates happen at will and there's nothing you, the owner, can do to stop it. To make matters worse, hackers know this, are far better at their craft than manufacturers, and let's just say that security measures for these intrusions, 'friendly' or otherwise, are not very high up on the manufacturers profitability radar. Kinda like the Nest invasion of privacy devices and your kids' IoT Teddy Bear.

This is my gripe and why I rail against automotive automation. Far too easy to manipulate. From safety perspective that everyone is concerned about, THIS type of willy-nilly practice is extremely dangerous.
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
:
2018 CX5 Touring
:
w/ Pref Pkg
Because statistically there are many accidents avoided by them. I visit the USA every year and the misuse of mobile phones seems to be getting worse to me. I regularly see drivers not only using their phone but browsing and texting on them so I’m quite happy for cars to include autonomous braking even if it isn’t perfect.
Seems to be getting worse? Uhh no, its a damn national crisis is what it is. Whose statistics btw? Numbers, studies, information, all subjective and interpreted by many with differing opinions and objectives...usually financial. I feel like I've seen this discussion somewhere before.
Statistically then, it's quite clear the distraction caused by a viral misuse of a certain technology, should be eliminated along w/ its distraction. Fixing a problem, caused by technology, w/ more technology...I love it. Brilliant. Why didn't I think of that?
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
:
2018 CX5 Touring
:
w/ Pref Pkg
Yes, it is.

Lots of us have stories of coming up a little too quickly on a vehicle turning off the road, and our systems Notify to Brake, but not Brake.

Mine had Notified probably close to 10 times the past year, and actually Braked once. But if you look back in these comments you'll see where I posted owner's manual excerpts stating when the system will not Brake (like you're steering to avoid collision.)
So we clearly have a feature, a supposed safety feature, that is admittedly is not reliable. This is what is known as half-azzed automation and, in industry, is quickly eliminated from the process. Change orders for credits (for non-functioning 'features') are demanded and granted. Throw the term 'safety' ahead of any feature and the gravity of its uselessness opens an entirely different can of liability worms. Putting some lame caveat in a manual no one reads nor remembers stating "WARNING: yeah, it might not always work" isn't going to cut it.

As I've said elsewhere, gonna be a great future for lawyers. That money-mill is going to be printing cash.
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
So we clearly have a feature, a supposed safety feature, that is admittedly is not reliable. This is what is known as half-azzed automation and, in industry, is quickly eliminated from the process. Change orders for credits (for non-functioning 'features') are demanded and granted. Throw the term 'safety' ahead of any feature and the gravity of its uselessness opens an entirely different can of liability worms. Putting some lame caveat in a manual no one reads nor remembers stating "WARNING: yeah, it might not always work" isn't going to cut it.

As I've said elsewhere, gonna be a great future for lawyers. That money-mill is going to be printing cash.
The worst part is gonna be when some union guy misinterprets BRAKE! and he immediately gets out the car and disappears for 10 minutes ;)
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
:
2018 CX5 Touring
:
w/ Pref Pkg
Speaking of having a 'brake', here's an epic one for ya..which illustrates, very clearly, the gravity of what happens when people (the mechanics you'll see standing around) who are tasked with messing w/ automated 'things' (cars for example?) that clearly have no knowledge or comprehensive understanding of the dangers associated with what they are playing around with. (They sure have a clue now). There are numerous hardware and integrated software features embedded in these machines, and its controls, to prevent this exact catastrophe. We design, build and program controls for an OEM of these types of machines. This one is quite small. Watch very closely...

 

Pipemajor

Hoot Mon!
:
Minnesota
:
2017 CX-5 GT AWD
Mine scared the crap out of me driving up to a parking gate arm. Braked automatically.
My '15 GT would do this regularly - about launched the spouse through the windshield (she was belted).

My current '17 GT will flash the warning on the MID saying BRAKE! but I can't recall SCBS ever engaging.
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Good commercial, but I can't place the accent.

Is it Idaho?
South Dakota?

I know it's somewhere out there.

btw: Here's another "brake."



I've bought my share of fabricated enclosures.

I bet Mazda uses these to make SCBS parts. <<on topic
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Speaking of having a 'brake', here's an epic one for ya..which illustrates, very clearly, the gravity of what happens when people (the mechanics you'll see standing around) who are tasked with messing w/ automated 'things' (cars for example?) that clearly have no knowledge or comprehensive understanding of the dangers associated with what they are playing around with. (They sure have a clue now). There are numerous hardware and integrated software features embedded in these machines, and its controls, to prevent this exact catastrophe. We design, build and program controls for an OEM of these types of machines. This one is quite small. Watch very closely...

I've worked in a number of environments during my purchasing career. I always stayed away from the lab (where we kept the LN₂ tanks) when E.J. came back from a 3 beer lunch.

If you're a male who has been fortunate enough to survive his teen years, you're supposed to stop doing this stuff. "Hold my brain and watch this!"
 
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Chocolate

Harpy Eagle
:
2019 CX-5 AWD
There are two levels of AEB on the 17+, camera based only (windshield camera), standard on all 17+ and camera based + radar based.

Chrome trim plastic emblem


Radar emblem
 
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Ronzuki

South Central PA
:
2018 CX5 Touring
:
w/ Pref Pkg
So tell me, what happens when some incapable operator accustomed to all the gobbledy-goop they have no clue about, or care about, (with certain this, that, or the other thing...ActiveSense braking or other BS) hops in to a car that, well, doesn't wipe their butt for them (or isn't functioning 100% because it was too expensive to fix)? Then what? I only ask because skills are perishable and if you don't actually learn how to do something in the first place (like drive a car yourself), well then, the results, when the need arises, are fairly dismal. Like sticking a pencil between your fingers and writing something. The lost art of writing, which most kids can't, and, I've been dealing professionally lately w/ young adults who can't. I have a business card here on my desk that a twenty-something engineer scribbled his email address on, as a shake-my-head reminder of just how deplorable things are in that regard. I printed better than that when I was 5 years old. Only thing is, however, we're discussing something much more serious like operating a 3,000 lb. rolling instrument of destruction here, ya know, every time the technology fails << on topic...Just a thought...

The video I posted above is simply one of a million real-world examples of failed technology, with dire consequences... an attempt to open eyes and bring 'things' in to real-world perspective. If you think there is any difference between the machine in that video and the machines whizzing down the road all around you, well, then all I can say is continue living in your marketing driven fantasy world bubble and don't be surprised, appalled, or whatever else when seemingly inexplicable bad schitt starts happening on the roads in the not too distant future. Already are in fact. Oh, and please, don't bitch about how expensive everything has become either...you have been warned. Also, highly recommend seeking out and becoming good-buddy-friends with a competent attorney. Keep him or her on retainer, just like your annual insurance policy, it'll be worth it.
 
Last edited:
:
N. Arizona @ 7000'
:
'19 CX-5 Reserve
So tell me, what happens when some incapable operator accustomed to all the gobbledy-goop they have no clue about, or care about, (with certain this, that, or the other thing...ActiveSense braking or other BS) hops in to a car that, well, doesn't wipe their butt for them (or isn't functioning 100% because it was too expensive to fix)? Then what? I only ask because skills are perishable and if you don't actually learn how to do something in the first place (like drive a car yourself), well then, the results, when the need arises, are fairly dismal. Like sticking a pencil between your fingers and writing something. The lost art of writing, which most kids can't, and, I've been dealing professionally lately w/ young adults who can't. I have a business card here on my desk that a twenty-something engineer scribbled his email address on, as a shake-my-head reminder of just how deplorable things are in that regard. I printed better than that when I was 5 years old. Only thing is, however, we're discussing something much more serious like operating a 3,000 lb. rolling instrument of destruction here, ya know, every time the technology fails << on topic...Just a thought...

The video I posted above is simply one of a million real-world examples of failed technology, with dire consequences... an attempt to open eyes and bring 'things' in to real-world perspective. If you think there is any difference between the machine in that video and the machines whizzing down the road all around you, well, then all I can say is continue living in your marketing driven fantasy world bubble and don't be surprised, appalled, or whatever else when seemingly inexplicable bad schitt starts happening on the roads in the not too distant future. Already are in fact. Oh, and please, don't bitch about how expensive everything has become either...you have been warned. Also, highly recommend seeking out and becoming good-buddy-friends with a competent attorney. Keep him or her on retainer, just like your annual insurance policy, it'll be worth it.
I'm sorry, I usually try to ignore stuff like this, but your rants on tech are getting really tiresome. We all know your opinions as you have stated them dozens of times. Everyone you're ranting at on this forum knows the upsides and the downsides of the growth of automobile safety technology. You need to take a deep breath every time you want give your keyboard a workout on this same topic and fight the urge. Please!
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
So tell me, what happens when some incapable operator accustomed to all the gobbledy-goop they have no clue about, or care about, (with certain this, that, or the other thing...ActiveSense braking or other BS) hops in to a car that, well, doesn't wipe their butt for them (or isn't functioning 100% because it was too expensive to fix)? Then what?
A real-world example can be had by putting 90% of the population behind the wheel of a standard shift vehicle.
 
:
2019 cx-5 signature. 2019 cx-3 awd touring
One day I was trolling the NHTSA site for legacy recall and TSB stuff, and came upon a software patch that incidentally (not it's primary goal) removed the tach from the HUD on CX-9s because it was deemed to be "too distracting." So at one point there was at least that information before the "You'll shoot your eye out" crowd got hold of it.
Found the video of the cx-9 HUD tachometer.
Would love to have this for the cx-5
why oh why did they take it away..
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Found the video of the cx-9 HUD tachometer.
Would love to have this for the cx-5
why oh why did they take it away..
Man, they need to put it back!!!
Although it <i>is</i> of minimal value with an automatic, unless you're gettin' into it in manual mode.
 
:
2019 cx-5 signature. 2019 cx-3 awd touring
Man, they need to put it back!!!
Although it <i>is</i> of minimal value with an automatic, unless you're gettin' into it in manual mode.
seeing that Driving gear selection is displayed on this video, i'm guessing in manual mode the numbered Gear selection will be displayed, which is pretty cool.
 
:
2018 AWD GT Premium Red/Black
I agree that the tach isn't too distracting. What is too distracting? Filming a video while driving below the limit in the left lane. Not good.
 
:
2019 CX5 Reserve AWD
What I think would be cool is to always show the gear you're in where the "D" is. Like it does when you go into manual mode. Something like D1, D2, ... D6.
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
I agree that the tach isn't too distracting. What is too distracting? Filming a video while driving below the limit in the left lane. Not good.
Yeh, I noticed that, too.

The guy's kinda weaving and showing us that the HUD displays the speed limit as he drives under it while cars are passing him on both sides throughout the entire video. He was doing OK early on until he went up that hill and his right leg got tired...it was a steep hill.
 

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