Transmission fluid change without filter replacement

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Soon to be 2.5T CX-5
I bet by 60k, oil analysis would indicate all lubricating additives would be spent. By 100k if not changed....the metal shavings themselves would be the lubricating agents.

I just do drain and fills because I may want to keep the car through 150k miles in severe (desert heat) conditions AND be able to give or sell car to friends/family with added peace of mind.
Ill take that bet, but it wont be with my fluid, because Im not changing it. Theres no use to at 60k, or even 100k, and its not because Mazda told me so.

Metal shavings as the lubricant at 100k, ha, I needed that laugh this morning.
 
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2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
*.so you guys change out your wheel bearings every 60,000 miles? Does anyone know what the extent of transmission life testing Mazda performed to justify their stance on this issue? I have worked with Japanese engineers before and found them to be extremely thorough when it comes to reliability testing.
I once thought that too with Honda but give the Google a look for piston rings/fouled spark plugs on the Odyssey. Give it another look regarding transmission fluid deterioration and how the interval was shortened after release when issues started cropping up.

Mazda fluid gets dirty. Its nothing special. A TSB was even issued to reprogram how the car handles a signal from a transmission sensor. The fluid was getting enough particulate in it that the car would get a CEL. Mazda had to bump the acceptable threshold higher for that sensor. They didnt catch that in testing prior to release.

Drain of fluid through a designated hole in the drain pan and fill through the dipstick is a whole world of difference vs wheel bearings lol. All of that said, its probably just fine for the lifetime of the car for the majority of owners. But draining and filling the ATF a few times while you own it is not much more difficult than an oil change and really isnt that expensive.
 
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I read through this thread and just want to double check the temp change. Should I Check if temp dip stick is right on the 50 C line and then run the car until blue light on dash turns off. then check if dip stick fluid is on the thick middle marker between 50 C and 150 C to check if it was factory undefiled before I change the fluid? my 2015 is shifting rough when cold so wondering if its undefiled and want to do this properly. thanks
 
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2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
Youll want the fluid to be at 50 C mark when the blue light goes off or you determine the fluid temp is 50C or higher using a OBD reader. As the temp of the fluid goes above 50C, the fluid level should creep up the stick accordingly.
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
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2018 CX5 Touring
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w/ Pref Pkg
Can anyone confirm, or deny, that there is NOT a small fiber cartridge filter behind the trans cooling lines return cover (part hoses are attached to) in this photo?

 
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2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
If there is a cartridge filter on the lines that would be news to me. Had one on my Odyssey but not aware of one with Mazda Skyactiv. There is a filter inside of the transmission (more of a screen really). Drain pan needs to be removed to access it though and theres no gasket. Youd have to use silicone to reseal it to the transmission.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
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Plano, Texas, USA
Can anyone confirm, or deny, that there is NOT a small fiber cartridge filter behind the trans cooling lines return cover (part hoses are attached to) in this photo?

No. That is an ATF cooler or heat exchanger with engine coolant and ATF circulating inside.


here is the cooler, water-oil



bottom right

Yeah I know your modified ATF heat exchanger would have no coolant flowing as you're going to leave the original cooler hanging with the coolant hoses.

Actually it'd be the best to find some enhanced aftermarket Mazda SkyActiv-Drive ATF/coolant heat exchanger such as this modified 4-port cooler for Nissan's CVT from China. This enhanced heat exchanger has 2 additional CVT fluid ports for an external fluid cooler. For our SkyActiv-Drive a transmission flush is now possible with these 2 additional ATF ports! :)





 
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2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
Lol, yrwei thanks for filling in on that. I read return lines and complete forgot there arent any on the Skyactiv transmission.
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
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2018 CX5 Touring
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w/ Pref Pkg
OK, thanks for the pics and clearing it up that it is an actual heat exchanger. Reason for the question is Jatco JF011E CVT transmissions used in many brands, including my Suzukis, there is a filter element behind a cover similar to the one pictured above for the trans fluid and those hoses sent fluid out to an external cooler. The existence of the filter I speak of within the trans is not acknowledged by any of the auto makers utilizing the trans in their vehicles. No mention in their FSMs, TSBs, or parts diagrams, except, Mitsubishi. There is a very small filter in all of those CVTs, regardless of auto brand. It's a fibrous cartridge type. An oil filter w/o the metal can wrapped around it.

Jatco CVT service parts for our Suzukis (order the O-ring and cartridge filter from Mitsubishi):




Just wanted to confirm, since this thread had discussed filters and I wanted to know about this once I saw that photo in another thread that was referenced.
 

ColoradoDriver

Gen-1 Kodo Design
Contributor
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Denver, CO
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2014 CX-5 Touring
I*ll take that bet, but it won*t be with my fluid, because I*m not changing it. There*s no use to at 60k, or even 100k, and it*s not because Mazda told me so.

Metal shavings as the lubricant at 100k, ha, I needed that laugh this morning.
Based on my UOA of my ATF changed at 71k miles, I'm absolutely glad I put new fluid in there.
 
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13' CX-5 and 16' Mazda6 both Touring w/Tech/Bose
I*ll take that bet, but it won*t be with my fluid, because I*m not changing it. There*s no use to at 60k, or even 100k, and it*s not because Mazda told me so.

Metal shavings as the lubricant at 100k, ha, I needed that laugh this morning.
Not sure if your being sarcastic?

Mazda's factory oil has high amounts of moly as its friction additive. Moly= metal.

Once the transmission oil reaches a certain thershold where the original intended additives are spent....the metal shavings become the friction additive replacement. At this stage the tranny is highly dependent of the tranny fluid with high metal shaving content and should not be changed. Doing so = instant failure.

This is pretty much common knowledge to BMW owners and Transmission specialists alike.



This CX-5 had 8k miles. Look at the metal shavings on 2:20 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MuE2v6Jycp8

Video helping to explain Transmissions and when to/when not to change fluid. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o690DovjDAc

That said...if you plan and keeping your CX-5 for say 200k+ miles or want the next owner/s to have good transmission service or are just anal for this stuff...change the fluid.

If you don't care.....just don't change it and you'll be fine. Not so much the next owners down the road. Technically I want to not care myself :)
 
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Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
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Central Virginia
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2019 CX-5 Reserve
I haven't seen anyone mention whether you check the ATF level with the engine running (like every car I've had with the standard accessible dipstick), or with the engine off.
 
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2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
Engine running. Easiest way seems to be removing the air box but keeping it plugged in. Run until the blue dash light goes off and check ATF stick while engine is on.
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Engine running. Easiest way seems to be removing the air box but keeping it plugged in. Run until the blue dash light goes off and check ATF stick while engine is on.
Thanks.

That's what I figured, although it seems "awkward" to be laying under a running vehicle..

I've seen a couple of recommendations here for getting an ODB2 reader to get the tranny temp, but I have bought and downloaded two different software packages (TorquePro and ScanTool) and neither reads transmission temp that I can see. ScanTool has Mazda-specific PIDs for sale by model year, but they have yet to configure the package for 2019 (apparently delays on Mazda's end).
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
I haven't seen anyone mention whether you check the ATF level with the engine running (like every car I've had with the standard accessible dipstick), or with the engine off.
Its been mentioned many times before. Here's the official procedure to check ATF level for CX-5:

Nice!

ATF level should be at the central marker area on the dipstick at 122F while the engine is running. Make sure to shift into all possible gears during the warm-up.

Judging by the color of your drained ATF, I may consider another drain-and-fill if I were you.


View attachment 219691
 
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13' CX-5 and 16' Mazda6 both Touring w/Tech/Bose
Been awhile but If I recall correctly:

The Blue light turns off at 131F.
Pro Torque app picks up coolant temp...to be used as reference temp for atf fluid.
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
:
Central Virginia
:
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Been awhile but If I recall correctly:

The Blue light turns off at 131F.
Pro Torque app picks up coolant temp...to be used as reference temp for atf fluid.
I have a temp gauge...no lights. I'd imagine one of the apps I have measures coolant temp.

I'm still waiting for ScanTool to release the Mazda-specific PIDs for the 2019 model year ($9.99 to buy that software). They say that there's a delay on Mazda's side this year in getting them the data. I can't imagine what the problem might be...the major changes due to cylinder deactivation should have flushed through the 2018 software.

It's weird that the instructions cite a specific temp for tranny fluid with no suggestions on how to determine it.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
⋯ It's weird that the instructions cite a specific temp for tranny fluid with no suggestions on how to determine it.
In step 4.(1) of Adjust the ATF level, Connect the M-MDS to the DLC-2 and display the PID TFT, this Mazda system used by Mazda dealer displays the PIDs with many informations including engine coolant temperature and ATF temperature.
 

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