Off Topic Toyota recalling almost 700,000 cars. Bad fuel pump.

V
2010 Mazda 5 Sport
Meh. Lot of worse things out there that don't get recalls. Ford, I'm looking at your Duratec.
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
L
2018 CX5 Touring
V
w/ Pref Pkg
Meh. Lot of worse things out there that don't get recalls. Ford, I'm looking at your Duratec.
This a recall because it's safety related. Whatever your beef is w/ Duratec, there's likely a TSB for what ails you. If under warranty and your vehicle demonstrates the issue, then they'll likely repair it free of charge. If not you pay. Whatever your problem, it likely hasn't been deemed a safety hazard by anyone yet.
Driving in congested rush-hour freeway traffic at speed, for instance, and having the engine cut off w/o any warning whatsoever because of low/no fuel pressure is a pretty serious issue...no power steering (hyd), no power brakes (vac assist), no acceleration, no nuthin'.
For most drivers who have less than zero knowledge, or even care, about what makes the vehicle they are operating go down the road, it's a freak-out moment. Freak-out moments lead to crashes.
 
V
2010 Mazda 5 Sport
This a recall because it's safety related. Whatever your beef is w/ Duratec, there's likely a TSB for what ails you. If under warranty and your vehicle demonstrates the issue, then they'll likely repair it free of charge. If not you pay. Whatever your problem, it likely hasn't been deemed a safety hazard by anyone yet.
Driving in congested rush-hour freeway traffic at speed, for instance, and having the engine cut off w/o any warning whatsoever because of low/no fuel pressure is a pretty serious issue...no power steering (hyd), no power brakes (vac assist), no acceleration, no nuthin'.
For most drivers who have less than zero knowledge, or even care, about what makes the vehicle they are operating go down the road, it's a freak-out moment. Freak-out moments lead to crashes.
Meh. Duratec failures have the same danger. Unfortunately, it's WAY more expensive to fix.

Ford is fighting it and not taking the safety issue seriously.

Toyota is. Kudos to Toyota.

Shame on Ford.

FYI, the Duratec Suit:


"This hazardous defect has resulted in numerous complaints to NHTSA. For example, numerous Ford customers have reported sudden engine failure while driving as a result of the Water Pump Defect, leading to dangerous on-road situations that could have resulted in accidents. "

-Mike
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
L
2018 CX5 Touring
V
w/ Pref Pkg
This water pump defect is a very different issue. There's very likely indicators, or warnings so to speak, that one would expect an owner to take notice of prior to an escalation "leading to dangerous on-road situations that could have resulted in accidents". That's the lawyers playing the safety card in their lawsuit in an attempt to take advantage of the stupidity of the gullible. A "hazardous defect" and "safety recall" aren't necessarily the same thing, and Ford knows it, hence they're fighting it. I certainly wouldn't vote for that has any sort of hazard sitting on a jury, so stop wasting my time playing it up as such. Loss of points for the plaintiffs in my world. I'd certainly agree...utterly stupid design that never should have been, however, shame on the owners letting this issue escalate to the "dangerous on-road situations that could have resulted in accidents".

A fuel pump cutting out while driving gives zero indication anything's wrong until you can't steer and have no throttle response. Instantaneous and without warning is truly a safety hazard.

That suit is simply another instance reinforcing why I steer towards Japanese brands over Ford/GM/CDJ. I've owned them all over the years. Not to say the Japanese brands are not w/o fault, but they're generally better engineered vehicles that I've had far fewer issues with over the long haul. The issues I've had are minuscule by comparison to the issues, such as this Duratec debacle, w/ domestic brands I've owned. CDJ worst, GM and Ford are about equal.
 
V
2010 Mazda 5 Sport
I don't agree. Ford's water pump failure has nearly the same failure pattern that the fuel pumps do. Most of the time you do get an indication but in both it is rare but possible for an immediate failure.

Fuel pump will cause rough running of the car or a non-start condition.

Water pump will cause a "milk shake" or the car will run hot.

-Mike
 

Ronzuki

South Central PA
L
2018 CX5 Touring
V
w/ Pref Pkg
Fuel pump will cause rough running of the car or a non-start condition.
I've had 3 modern in-tank fuel pumps running injected engines fail on me, all in Dodges. We won't even count how many of the highly failure-prone mechanical pumps I'd replaced during the by-gone era of 2 and 4 barrel carbs (those would certainly cause rough running issues because there were no low fuel pressure sensors to cut of the ignition).

So, two failures in the same 96 Stratus (manual trans). First time was a no start after running just fine and shutting the engine off at the day care to pick up the kids. Come back out, no start (no pressure, no fire). Second time in that same car, the factory warranty replacement pump simply died while I was driving down the highway 60mph and everything went dead as I've described. No warning, no anything. The third one was in another Dodge, a 4wd 2000 Ram Quad-Cab pickup, also w/ a MT. Again, died w/o any warning driving down a 2 lane road. Both times the pumps failed while driving, no warning, no sputtering...just no power. The truck was pretty freaking hard to steer w/o power.

Water pump will cause a "milk shake" or the car will run hot.
There's your sign, you've got a problem...stop operating the machine. 😏 Meh...I'll just be an idiot and keep going until it really starts carrying on, spewing steam or blowing something apart and really cause a problem...maaayybe that "dangerous on-road situation" being alleged?
 

Avoidin Deer

Zoom Zoom, baby
Contributor
L
Central Virginia
V
2019 CX-5 Reserve
You got that right...doesn't matter, new or used.
The difference is that the first few used cars I bought cost less than $500, had low insurance/low tax fees, were driven for a few years, and were sold for near what I paid for them. The next car cost closer to $1,000. Then I bought a new truck in '89, only because there's no such thing as a reasonably priced used one.
 

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