Towing with your CX-9

[Ryan in Melb]

I ended up buying myself a new trailer, got one with electric brakes. Mazda Australia fitted an electric brake controller when I bought the car. Think it’s a red arc one. Overall, the set up works very well.

I still need to get the reverse light sorted out, as they are not wired up to the socket on the rear bumper.

 

[hw4ng3r]

The controller was a tekonsha prodigy RF brake controller. Similar to a Bluetooth controller in that it does not need a brake controller installed in the towing vehicle. But instead of using an app on the phone it uses a dongle connected in the cigarette lighter plug to adjust the brake setting and to brake manually in case of emergency.

I don’t know if Bluetooth is better or not, this one was provided with the trailer which is why i used it. I don’t have a brake controller installed in my CX-9.

How was that camper? I was looking to do something very similar next camping season.

And did your rental come with everything required (ball, mount, weight dist bar, etc)? How much was the rental per night (if you don't mind me asking)?

 

[youri]

That trailer was great. It was my first time camping in a trailer. I do think with all the luggage and everything it might have been slightly above the recommended towing capacity. If I redo it i might try to go lighter but i didn’t really run into any issues. Again, very flat roads on my trip though.

Very limited experience on my behalf, but i feel like these “convertible” trailer with tent extension have a bit of the disadvantage of both world. They have more space and amenities inside which is great, but you still sleep in a tent bed, with its associated drawback (moisture on the fabric ceiling, low noise insulation, low temperature insulation, etc), and it still has a large exterior footprint. Overall the trailer worked really well but next time i might try a fully closed trailer if I don’t need the extra interior space, or just a pop-up camper if i need the space but a low weight solution for long distance towing.

I rented the trailer from an individual on RVezy. It came with everything to tow: ball, weight distribution hitch, RF brake controller). It was great, but that is more to the credit of the individual renter. Not everyone on that app offers this. Here is his listing on RVezy.
https://www.rvezy.com/rv-rental/ontario_goulbourn_traveltrailer_hybrid_kodiak_dutchman

I paid for additional insurance and roadside assistance. For 7 nights it came to about 1200$ CAD taxes included for the rental.

 

[GTA-CX9]

I would be worried about a WDH on a cx9, check the manual but even if allowed, still wonder about the wear and tear on a unibody.

I was never able to find a hitch rating specifically but given the 10-15% rule, one can apply that to the 3500 lb limit and make an assumption. I run a small camper prob only 270ish lb on the tongue and still get some squat in the rear.

Obviously these are less a concern if were talking short term rental.

As a general FYI for anyone, when mazda did my hitch they only did a 4 pin. My trailer dealer had to upgrade to the 7 for my brake controller hard wired. I know bluetooth is supposed to be reliable and certainly for general braking I'm sure it's fine. But in a sway situation, I wonder about delay in braking thru bluetooth. We're talking seconds to act. Again, for rental its less a concern but for anyone doing towing regularly, I think hard wired is the way (I have a prodigy as well).

My fuel consumption literally doubled, and camper is only about 2000 lb! Another thing to keep in mind, know where the gas stations are!

 

[youri]

Now that you brought that up, i actually had never considered if a WDH could be used. The manual doesn’t mention it. A google search brought the point that your hitch must be rated for it to be safe to use. I checked and thankfully my hitch is. (Class 3 Trailer Hitch, 2" Receiver, Select Mazda CX-9). I know the car limit weights are the ones to follow, not the hitch rating, but at least it is WDH rated. As far as strain on the car, i am not sure a WDH is worst than not having any. The weight gets distributed and puts less strain on rear suspension components, and i think it does so by pulling on the tongue and hitch so that is where i think the most strain would be. I might be wrong, i couldn’t really find the answer online. The worst damage i have seen reported is broken trailer tongue from going up a steep angle with it connected.

The WDH also usually provide some sway control, so there is that.

I agree for regular usage i would prefer a hardwired controller, if only because i would have a dedicated control instead of relying on keeping the app open on my phone. The RF prodigy is a bit different and better in that it does not need your phone and it’s own dedicated wireless controller that plugs in the 12v outlet. I liked it, but the exterior module is a bit bulky and require more setup to attach it to the trailer as opposed to the Bluetooth one which are compact and easy to put on and off .

 

[hw4ng3r]

I would be worried about a WDH on a cx9, check the manual but even if allowed, still wonder about the wear and tear on a unibody.

I was never able to find a hitch rating specifically but given the 10-15% rule, one can apply that to the 3500 lb limit and make an assumption. I run a small camper prob only 270ish lb on the tongue and still get some squat in the rear.

Obviously these are less a concern if were talking short term rental.

As a general FYI for anyone, when mazda did my hitch they only did a 4 pin. My trailer dealer had to upgrade to the 7 for my brake controller hard wired. I know bluetooth is supposed to be reliable and certainly for general braking I'm sure it's fine. But in a sway situation, I wonder about delay in braking thru bluetooth. We're talking seconds to act. Again, for rental its less a concern but for anyone doing towing regularly, I think hard wired is the way (I have a prodigy as well).

My fuel consumption literally doubled, and camper is only about 2000 lb! Another thing to keep in mind, know where the gas stations are!

Slightly related,

I've been reading up a bit more on things towing related and I found it quite interesting that the 10-15% is North American. Europeans apparently go by 4-7% tongue weight.

My understanding is just two different philosophies. Europe's thinking is you reduce tongue weight, you pull more without risking max GAWR or nosing up the vehicle, resulting in trailers with mass more centralized over the axle. While this certainly doesn't help with potential destabilizing oscillations (trailer sway) they have more strict towing speed limits (some EU countries are max 50mph or 80 km/h) and trailer brake requirements (EU requires brakes at ~1600 lbs loaded vs US ~3000 lbs unloaded) to greatly reduce the chances of sway. Also, If your car and trailer weight together is over 3.5t (~7700 lbs), then you need a special license.

North American system is heavily influenced by the SAE J2807 tow test (almost all major manufacturers use this standard here) and its definitely more safety-centric. Speed limits to my knowledge isn't drastically different from non-towing vehicles (except for California, but they're different on almost all accounts), and I've certainly seen enough idiots driving like it's a tractor pull.

Actually, the one thing I do notice a lot more now since I'm remotely interested in towing a camper, is the fact that so many people are not "level towing".

And you may have come across this in these forums, but the 3500lbs tow rating is for North American CX9. The same CX9's in Australia for example is rated for ~4400 lbs. I'm just curious since the trailer I'm looking to tow has a GVWR of 3,650 with a UVW of 3180. Of course I could easily stay under the 3,500 rated on the CX9 by not loading a lot in the trailer, but just a thought if that 150 lbs will make a huge difference.

 

[GTA-CX9]

Slightly related,

I've been reading up a bit more on things towing related and I found it quite interesting that the 10-15% is North American. Europeans apparently go by 4-7% tongue weight.

My understanding is just two different philosophies. Europe's thinking is you reduce tongue weight, you pull more without risking max GAWR or nosing up the vehicle, resulting in trailers with mass more centralized over the axle. While this certainly doesn't help with potential destabilizing oscillations (trailer sway) they have more strict towing speed limits (some EU countries are max 50mph or 80 km/h) and trailer brake requirements (EU requires brakes at ~1600 lbs loaded vs US ~3000 lbs unloaded) to greatly reduce the chances of sway. Also, If your car and trailer weight together is over 3.5t (~7700 lbs), then you need a special license.

North American system is heavily influenced by the SAE J2807 tow test (almost all major manufacturers use this standard here) and its definitely more safety-centric. Speed limits to my knowledge isn't drastically different from non-towing vehicles (except for California, but they're different on almost all accounts), and I've certainly seen enough idiots driving like it's a tractor pull.

Actually, the one thing I do notice a lot more now since I'm remotely interested in towing a camper, is the fact that so many people are not "level towing".

And you may have come across this in these forums, but the 3500lbs tow rating is for North American CX9. The same CX9's in Australia for example is rated for ~4400 lbs. I'm just curious since the trailer I'm looking to tow has a GVWR of 3,650 with a UVW of 3180. Of course I could easily stay under the 3,500 rated on the CX9 by not loading a lot in the trailer, but just a thought if that 150 lbs will make a huge difference.

Yes it's a commonly mentioned difference on forums, FB etc. I have always suspected that it means a trailer sold in Europe is weighted differently than NA (I've not confirmed that), so while in theory a CX9 can haul the bigger lb, finding a trailer balanced with under 10% on the tongue locally would be hard (short of importing one). Speed would indeed be higher here given we don't have seperate towing limits and thus while an individual might choose to keep it under 50 mph, the regulation needs to apply to the population as a whole.

End of day, there's also a worry that in a bad accident, one could be in a lot of trouble if over weight (or lose out on ins coverage payment). I'm not sure how that might play out, but certainly I know if I was ever hit by someone I'd ask what's the weight of that trailer.

Plus of course, were talking safety. No one should be taking chances with such things, it's just easier to trade in for a 5000 lb rated SUV and have the peace of mind. Too often I see people playing the Euro limit card, which is foolish IMO.

 

[PTguy]

The weight gets distributed and puts less strain on rear suspension components, and i think it does so by pulling on the tongue and hitch so that is where i think the most strain would be.

Not exactly. Think of putting a pair of wheelbarrow handles into the car's rear bumper somehow and lifting up on them until the tow vehicle is now level. Chain the handles to the trailer tongue, and you've got weight distribution. Change the wheelbarrow handles for spring steel bars, and you've got the system. The WD system puts an upward strain on the subframe part the receiver bolts to.

The WDH also usually provide some sway control, so there is that.

It depends on the make & model & design of the WDH. Some include a separate section for sway damping, and some don't. WD hitches with sway damping include the dual-cam models from Draw-tite, Reese, and their other Horizon Global Corp. brand cousins and the Equal-i-zer brand as well as others.

 

[Mbcx9]

I towed my Tent trailer from Winnipeg to the west coast of Canada this summer. Overall the trip went really smoothly. One thing that many may overlook when towing is transmission temperature. I brought a Bluetooth OBD2 reader and connected it to my phone to monitor the temperatures. Temperatures were mostly under control, but there was a time when I saw it spike as high as 232 degrees f. Not a damaging temperature, but also not great. This was towing a smaller trailer on a cooler day, and not on the steepest hills that I climbed. I was watching speed and temperatures that day, and the temperature suddenly climbed when I was in traffic around Kamloops, BC. My caution is to consider transmission temperature when towing, as Mazda did not include a gauge.

My trailer also has the prodigy wireless brake controller. It works great with no noticeable lag, and I would have no hesitation recommending it to those who don’t want to wire in a brake controller.

 

[GTA-CX9]

Slightly related,

I've been reading up a bit more on things towing related and I found it quite interesting that the 10-15% is North American. Europeans apparently go by 4-7% tongue weight.

My understanding is just two different philosophies. Europe's thinking is you reduce tongue weight, you pull more without risking max GAWR or nosing up the vehicle, resulting in trailers with mass more centralized over the axle. While this certainly doesn't help with potential destabilizing oscillations (trailer sway) they have more strict towing speed limits (some EU countries are max 50mph or 80 km/h) and trailer brake requirements (EU requires brakes at ~1600 lbs loaded vs US ~3000 lbs unloaded) to greatly reduce the chances of sway. Also, If your car and trailer weight together is over 3.5t (~7700 lbs), then you need a special license.

North American system is heavily influenced by the SAE J2807 tow test (almost all major manufacturers use this standard here) and its definitely more safety-centric. Speed limits to my knowledge isn't drastically different from non-towing vehicles (except for California, but they're different on almost all accounts), and I've certainly seen enough idiots driving like it's a tractor pull.

Actually, the one thing I do notice a lot more now since I'm remotely interested in towing a camper, is the fact that so many people are not "level towing".

And you may have come across this in these forums, but the 3500lbs tow rating is for North American CX9. The same CX9's in Australia for example is rated for ~4400 lbs. I'm just curious since the trailer I'm looking to tow has a GVWR of 3,650 with a UVW of 3180. Of course I could easily stay under the 3,500 rated on the CX9 by not loading a lot in the trailer, but just a thought if that 150 lbs will make a huge difference.

Sorry, circling back to this, I realize I did forget to mention to check the tongue weight of the trailer. I find they vary massively, for ex Geo Pros can have UVW in the low 3000s but owners reporting tongue weights near 600 lb are not uncommon. And that tongue weight goes toward your payload limit, if you load your gear in the vehicle to keep your trailer weight down, you might blow over your max payload. Passengers, gear, plus the tongue weight can add up quick.

As well, UWV usually doesn't include your battery and propane tanks. A wet cell plus dual tanks would add well over 100 lb to the 3180. You'll be way over 3300 lb and the rule of thumb is to try to stay under 80% of the vehicle max tow capacity.

 

[sm1ke]

One thing that many may overlook when towing is transmission temperature. I brought a Bluetooth OBD2 reader and connected it to my phone to monitor the temperatures.

Just wanted to ask - which OBD2 reader and app are you using to see transmission fluid temps?

 

[Mbcx9]

Sorry, for the very late reply, I never saw this last post. I use a Veepeak OBDCheck BLE+. The app that I use is Car Scanner ELM OBD2 on iOS.

I set up a custom dashboard with the additional gauges that were important to me. I mostly use this for long distance towing.

 

[N7turbo]

Just wanted to ask - which OBD2 reader and app are you using to see transmission fluid temps?

I've been eyeing the Lufi XS, but it doesn't seem like you can use it with a JB4. Might push me to a custom tune instead of the JB4. Anyway, it should have a good shot at reading most anything that can be read from the computer, if it's available.

 

[PTguy]

Lubricants are damaged by high temperatures, more accurately time at temperature. A brief spike at a high temperature is less damaging to the lubricant than longer time at a high temp. ATF is a lubricant as well as a hydraulic fluid. If run hot for long an early change of the lubricant is necessary. If the lubricant is damaged then it can no longer adequately protect the machinery it's used in.