Rear brake locked up, smoking, tire sensor = panic

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Car: CX-5 2016 Touring

What fun: Was just about to turn the new used car over to my son, took one more spin.

- Backed out if the driveway - absolutely disengaged the parking e-break
- Drove about 3 miles - at some point (maybe right away, but I'm not certain) heard a rotational thumping noise - with car speed, so it was a rotation noise.
- Almost at destination, tire sensor lights up and a smell starts
- 30 seconds later we parked (I didnt engage the parking brake, it was flat) and the rear-left wheel smells horrible - burned brake dust smell
- so I'm all pissed - the dealership did rear brakes for me like a week ago when we bought it
- So we are busy and get a ride home, and I come back total 90 min later - did a small test drive, no ADDITIONAL smell, no sounds, light still on
- I drive to Autozone like 2000 yards away - they can't code the tire sensor through ODB
- I drive home (maybe 1.5 miles) and no more drama - I don't engage the parking break, again on flat

So what happened? I know that I disengaged the parking break.
Can the tire sensors come on for *ANY* other reason than pressure? If yes what? If no, did the sensor maybe get eaten by a break pad?
I am going to get it back to the dealer tomm and see what is what.

Any tips? Suggestions? Trouble shooting things to do? Most important question I asked above I guess is what sets off that sensors OTHER than pressure.

Thank you! This car is stressing me out a bit, appreciate the help.

Carl
 
V
2017 Mazda CX-5 GT, 2016 Mazda6 iGT, 2014 Mazda3 sGT hatchback
Guessing here.
Sounds like the e-Brake failed and tried to lock the rear-left wheel. (smell, sound, etc.)
Because of that, the tire rotation sensor lit up due to diff numbers of rotations per minutes.
Definitely get it back to the dealer.
Maybe they messed up something when replacing the pads.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg. Plano, TX
Contributor
Car: CX-5 2016 Touring

What fun: Was just about to turn the new used car over to my son, took one more spin.

- Backed out if the driveway - absolutely disengaged the parking e-break
- Drove about 3 miles - at some point (maybe right away, but I'm not certain) heard a rotational thumping noise - with car speed, so it was a rotation noise.
- Almost at destination, tire sensor lights up and a smell starts
- 30 seconds later we parked (I didnt engage the parking brake, it was flat) and the rear-left wheel smells horrible - burned brake dust smell
- so I'm all pissed - the dealership did rear brakes for me like a week ago when we bought it
- So we are busy and get a ride home, and I come back total 90 min later - did a small test drive, no ADDITIONAL smell, no sounds, light still on
- I drive to Autozone like 2000 yards away - they can't code the tire sensor through ODB
- I drive home (maybe 1.5 miles) and no more drama - I don't engage the parking break, again on flat

So what happened? I know that I disengaged the parking break.
Can the tire sensors come on for *ANY* other reason than pressure? If yes what? If no, did the sensor maybe get eaten by a break pad?
I am going to get it back to the dealer tomm and see what is what.

Any tips? Suggestions? Trouble shooting things to do? Most important question I asked above I guess is what sets off that sensors OTHER than pressure.

Thank you! This car is stressing me out a bit, appreciate the help.

Carl
Its a known problem for 2016 CX-5. There're several TSBs for this EPB dragging issue because Mazda didn't figure out what was the root cause in the beginning. Mazda started to replace EPB control module with software fix, then eventually have to revise the rear disk brake calipers. Your dealer did the rear brake job, but failed to replace the factory defective rear disk calipers based on the TSB R052/16C which actually caused rear brake dragging and lock-up, and your early rear disk pads replacement.

TSB 04-005/16: Noise from Rear Brakes Due To Brake Drag

TSB R052/16C: Noise from REAR BRAKE/Trace of Rear Brake Dragging

2016 rear brake TSB resolution
 

madar

Contributor
V
2016.5 CX 5 Touring AWD, 2015 SCION XB
Yep, same thing happened to me, get those rear calipers replaced.
 
Update => It got over to a Mazda dealer and although they are pretty cool about it, and said there is "no cost to me", they can't reproduce the problem and thusly it's inconclusive if they will do anything.

I CLEARY detailed at great length to the service guy and the tech exactly what happened - so in my head I'm thinking "Really? I give you a clearly defined symptom that exactly matches the TSBs you've already mentioned to me, you see a warper rotor & thinner pads on that side, and you think I'm making this extremely detailed matching issue up? To what end? The dealer already did a brake job, so it's not that I'm trying to scam you".

When I brought it into AutoNation (who brought it to Mazda) it again CLEARLY wouldn't unlatch the e-brake (switch wouldn't un-light and red emergency-brake light on dash was lite-up) - only after turning the car off and on would it again work properly, clear those lights, and drive OK. Lord only knows why cycling the car cleared the problem, but that also seems to bolster clearly this issue. So I can respect "not reproducible" - but this is pretty cut and dry IMHO.

So they tell me they will get back to me tonight with status, into maybe tomm - we'll see what they say and go from there.

QUESTION => Any suggestions about arguments to give them to convince them they need to handle this?
- regulations and such?
- sensitive Mazda issues that they are trying to not have everyone hear about that can be referenced?
- talking about this being a safety issue?
- the fact that it could have been little else?
- anyone I should escalate to? I don't know car service places that well - a higher supervisor? The GM of the entire place? The owner? Mazda Corporate?

Thanks guys, the thoughts and ideas you are sharing are *REALLY* helping, and even though he's a 16 yo car newbie, my son would appreciate the assist.

Carl
 
V
92 MX-3; 18 CX-5
I wish you the best in getting this resolved. Obviously you want working brakes. Truth is I'm kinda surprised that the dealer didn't immediately jump to the TSB, follow the procedure and call it a fix. Maybe I'm odd to think this, but consider it good that someone wants to diagnose the problem first. Is the car still under warranty?
Advice: Negotiate for a good outcome - an actual fix even if it turns out that it is not the solution defined by the TSB. Just remember that a TSB is only a good clue to the tech who is looking to resolve the issue. Since you have had the recent brake work done at the dealership then their repair probably includes a kind of limited time warranty - so hopefully you can get some redress even if the car is out of warranty. If out of warranty then you may have to kick in some money for the repair. But, you should not have to pay to replace the ruined rotor and pads.
 

sm1ke

Work In Progress..
Moderator
Contributor
L
Canada
V
'18 CX-9 Signature
QUESTION => Any suggestions about arguments to give them to convince them they need to handle this?
- regulations and such?
- sensitive Mazda issues that they are trying to not have everyone hear about that can be referenced?
- talking about this being a safety issue?
- the fact that it could have been little else?
- anyone I should escalate to? I don't know car service places that well - a higher supervisor? The GM of the entire place? The owner? Mazda Corporate?

Thanks guys, the thoughts and ideas you are sharing are *REALLY* helping, and even though he's a 16 yo car newbie, my son would appreciate the assist.

Carl
The TSBs should be enough, but if they continue to fight you on it, stress that the car is being handed down to your son who is a relatively inexperienced driver, so it is a very serious safety issue for him. If they still won't budge, escalate to the GM via email or in person (copy the Service Manager on the email), stating the same concern about your son's safety. Give the GM a reasonable timeline for when you expect to have a resolution. If the timeline passes, escalate to MNAO with all of your documented communications between the dealer/service desk.

Note that the dealer has every right to refuse to assist if they feel that your business is not profitable to them or if they feel that they cannot satisfy your expectations. At that point you'll be left to find another dealer, and if you don't have many around, it becomes even more important to keep a level head in situations like these.
 
V
92 MX-3; 18 CX-5
Note that the dealer has every right to refuse to assist if they feel that your business is not profitable to them or if they feel that they cannot satisfy your expectations. At that point you'll be left to find another dealer, and if you don't have many around, it becomes even more important to keep a level head in situations like these.
Agree - keeping the discussion reasonable (tone, volume and position) seems to get best result. Not only is the person you speak with more likely to want to satisfy you - but you are able to think more clearly and present your position.
 

Avoidin Deer

Central Virginia
Contributor
V
2019 CX-5 Reserve
Never having been down this path with a dealer before...if there's a safety-related TSB issued by the manufacturer, are you saying that the dealer has no obligation to remediate the problem?

Not only does that sound like generally horrible business practice, it seems like it would expose the company to all sorts of liability.

I'm probably missing something here.
 

madar

Contributor
V
2016.5 CX 5 Touring AWD, 2015 SCION XB
Also consider this: the TSB shows what to look for with pictures, white residue on the brake pads or rotor which is caused by heat, uneven wear of the brake pads, rotors turned blue by heat...if one or any of these symptoms shows then there's a valid reason to change parts. That is specifically in the TSB.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg. Plano, TX
Contributor
Also consider this: the TSB shows what to look for with pictures, white residue on the brake pads or rotor which is caused by heat, uneven wear of the brake pads, rotors turned blue by heat...if one or any of these symptoms shows then there's a valid reason to change parts. That is specifically in the TSB.
Agreed. The problem is the TSB is not safety recall. Mazda dealer and Mazda North American Operations dont have any obligation to fix the problem for free unless you have warranty to cover the fix. I hope OPs CX-5 has CPO warranty, or hell be under the mercy of MNAO for any help to fix the problem.

OP should be able to talk to the Mazda dealer with the TSB who did the rear brake job. Then talk to MNAO and file the complaint to NHTSA (which may trigger a safety recall) and local BBB whatever can help you to the problem. If every effort failed, go get revised rear disk calipers and other damaged brake parts and fix it with your own expense. It should cost less than $800 total but you have to fix this safety related problem at all cost. And dont buy another Mazda if you feel like it.
 
when you contact the Dealer/Region/Mazda USA - put a line at the bottom; it should say:

cc: - your state Attorney General's Office of Consumer Protection
US DOT, NHTSB
- a local large tort law firm

you can also say "This may be suitable for a Class Action"
 
V
Cx-5 Sport
I was thinking about EPBs and I recalled 2 instances (in my old 626) when I used the handbrake to straighten out my trajectory after I started sliding on an icy bridge. I pressed the clutch and used the handbrake while keeping the thumb button in so it wouldnt lock.

I couldnt do this with the EPB. It would lock the rears and it wouldnt release until the car was stopped.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg. Plano, TX
Contributor
I was thinking about EPBs and I recalled 2 instances (in my old 626) when I used the handbrake to straighten out my trajectory after I started sliding on an icy bridge. I pressed the clutch and used the handbrake while keeping the thumb button in so it wouldnt lock.

I couldnt do this with the EPB. It would lock the rears and it wouldnt release until the car was stopped.
Never tried, but I believe you can simulate the operation on old hand brake like you described with pulling the EPB switch up and hold there while the car is moving, then release the EPB switch when you dont need the parking brake. Of course you cant control how hard youd like to apply the parking brake like the old mechanical one. EPB is digital, either on or off.
 
V
Cx-5 Sport
I see. You mean rather than just "trip" the button? It does work a bit like that with the window switch. I find it's kind of tricky for me to regulate the window exactly the way I like--but it does work that way.
Im not sure when or where I could test that except my driveway.
The two times I used the handbrake it was kind of a desparate situation I hadnt practiced so I feel lucky it worked. One time I would have gone down the side of a snow covered mountain. Im gl
 
V
CX5
So I am having a very similar problem with my 2016 CX5. About 3 months ago, we were about 200 miles from home, and the tire light and warning came on while driving. Checked air and tires, and seemed fine, but left rear smelled of burning. We were on a newly paved road when this happened, so initially thought that was the smell. Didn't go away, so took to a tire store to see what was up, and said tires looked fine, but calipers looked messed up. Seemed fine the next day, so drove home with no further issues. Took to Mazda dealer, and they said there was some gunk in calipers, and cleaned up and adjusted. Figured something must have gotten picked up from driving on the newly paved road. No further problems, then about 3 weeks later, felt like car was pulling/dragging. Almost like emergency brake was on. Only drove short distance, but again smelled of smoke (opposite side rear wheel this time). Left rear brake even looked kind of red. Next day all seemed fine, but took into dealer again. They looked at again, and said there was some kind of goop in the other wheel, and cleaned again, no charge. Weird, but maybe something left over from the initial incident? Been fine for another 4 weeks, then today, drove about a mile to get a coffee, felt a clunking/thumping while stopped at a light, and again, bit of a burning (seemed from the front this time). Stopped, drove home, and out for a couple errands, with no further problems.

Before I take it in again trying to do some research on what I can point them too if this is a known problem. Been wondering if it could be related to the parking brake not fully releasing or the emergency braking system partially engaging, so trying to understand some of the threads on here, and what this TSB report people are referring to is.
 
V
Cx-5 Sport
Until you get this fixed it might be good to stop if you hear anything. Also maybe make it a habit to feel the wheel for overheating when you park. I had a brake burst into flames once and it ruined more than the tire.
 

madar

Contributor
V
2016.5 CX 5 Touring AWD, 2015 SCION XB
So I am having a very similar problem with my 2016 CX5. About 3 months ago, we were about 200 miles from home, and the tire light and warning came on while driving. Checked air and tires, and seemed fine, but left rear smelled of burning. We were on a newly paved road when this happened, so initially thought that was the smell. Didn't go away, so took to a tire store to see what was up, and said tires looked fine, but calipers looked messed up. Seemed fine the next day, so drove home with no further issues. Took to Mazda dealer, and they said there was some gunk in calipers, and cleaned up and adjusted. Figured something must have gotten picked up from driving on the newly paved road. No further problems, then about 3 weeks later, felt like car was pulling/dragging. Almost like emergency brake was on. Only drove short distance, but again smelled of smoke (opposite side rear wheel this time). Left rear brake even looked kind of red. Next day all seemed fine, but took into dealer again. They looked at again, and said there was some kind of goop in the other wheel, and cleaned again, no charge. Weird, but maybe something left over from the initial incident? Been fine for another 4 weeks, then today, drove about a mile to get a coffee, felt a clunking/thumping while stopped at a light, and again, bit of a burning (seemed from the front this time). Stopped, drove home, and out for a couple errands, with no further problems.

Before I take it in again trying to do some research on what I can point them too if this is a known problem. Been wondering if it could be related to the parking brake not fully releasing or the emergency braking system partially engaging, so trying to understand some of the threads on here, and what this TSB report people are referring to is.
How about the rear rotors? Do they have a blueish tint? Can you see if the brake pads have a white residue on the edges? These all are signs of extreme heat. The TSB clearly shows this with pictures. Next time you see something red, take a picture. If it was glowing red, then you have something very seriously wrong and whoever is checking your brakes needs to get their head out of their butt.
 

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