Next-gen CX-5: Rumors from Japan

[ceric]

Source: https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/192955
Time: 2023 Jan.
Engine: Inline-6 SPCCI (Skyactiv-X) with 3.0L. Supercharger + 48V mild hybrid. 300hp, 253ft-lb.
Same engine will show up first on next-gen Mazda6 (2022 March), which will become RWD (optionally AWD).
Use google translate if you want to read other info.

 

[ceric]

Mazda President confirmed in 2019 that Mazda is developing a 3L inline-6 engine. That part is confirmed. Others are rumors.

(from Google Translate)
"At the financial results briefing in May 2019, Mazda President Akira Marumoto announced the management policy for the next six years. Among them, he announced the announcement of a model equipped with a longitudinal in-line 6-cylinder engine. The company has clarified plans for the development and market launch of high-end models."

 

[chickdr]

A supercharged 3.0 I6 that only puts out 300hp isn't very special IMHO...

 

[ceric]

True. Still a rumors at the point.
The supercharger, if true, might not be for high performance.

 

[santa]

A supercharged 3.0 I6 that only puts out 300hp isn't very special IMHO...

It's only supercharged because the SPCCI tech needs a supercharger to deliver enough air to work, as the 3.0 I6 is a Skyactiv-X engine.
So you need to compare it to a NA 3.0 engine for power and torque.

 

[tibimakai]

I'm not familiar with hybrid technology, but the electric motor won't give more HP?

 

[yrwei52]

Source: https://bestcarweb.jp/news/scoop/192955
Time: 2023 Jan.
Engine: Inline-6 SPCCI (Skyactiv-X) with 3.0L. Supercharger + 48V mild hybrid. 300hp, 253ft-lb.
Same engine will show up first on next-gen Mazda6 (2022 March), which will become RWD (optionally AWD).
Use google translate if you want to read other info.

So where is the promised SkyActiv-X HCCI / SPCCI 2.0L??? Isn’t it supposed to be the future of the Mazda with break-throuigh technology on BOTH horse power AND fuel efficiency???

Any modern 3.0 ~ 3.5L naturally aspirated V6 can get ~300 hp and torque. Now SkyActiv-X 3.0L I6 needs some help of supercharger + 48V motor to achieve that? Unless the setup is super fuel efficient, with the complexity of the SPCCI, I don’t see any future of it, just like the SkyActiv-X 2.0L.

 

[yrwei52]

It's only supercharged because the SPCCI tech needs a supercharger to deliver enough air to work, as the 3.0 I6 is a Skyactiv-X engine.
So you need to compare it to a NA 3.0 engine for power and torque.

The 3.5L naturally aspirated V6 on 2021 Toyota Highlanders makes 295 hp and 263 ft-lb of torque.

 

[Chocolate]

These rumors on the internet (and threads on this forum) have been circulating for a while.

I have to post this in every such thread.

I am skeptical of those numbers for the reasons above. Just rumors.

 

[Chocolate]

There was an accurate render of the 16.5 refresh in posted in August 2014.

Spyshots: 2016 Mazda CX-5 Facelift

Even though it's a brand new model, still in its infancy, the CX-5 is one of the best selling Mazda models right now. To keep this momentum going in the face of ever-increasing competition, the Japanese company is working on a mild facelift for its compact SUV.

www.autoevolution.com

2016 Mazda CX-5 Facelift Rendered

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www.autoevolution.com

 

[Bird-Dog]

Sorry, couldn't help myself. I think maybe the last post was meant for the
guy asking in another thread if the used CX-5 he just bought is a 2016 or 2016.5. No offense intended @Chocolate.

 

[ceric]

yrwei52,
Skyactiv-X 2.0L is available in several countries. Not in US, though.
Japanese market, for one, has it, and is quite popular.
Why? Mazda feel that US customers won't pay for the $2k-3k premium due to low fuel price.
So, they only sell it in markets where fuel price is high.

On the rumors, I won't believe in the drawings. I have seen many versions already.
None is more creditable than the others.

The I6 engine and RWD platform were confirmed by Mazda President himself in 2019.

 

[ceric]

>

I'm not familiar with hybrid technology, but the electric motor won't give more HP?

No. The 48V mild hybrid costs much less than traditional hybrid system, and is meant to help offline performance. Overall, it does not help with peak horsepower and torque. Some MB models already have it.

 

[ceric]

Any modern 3.0 ~ 3.5L naturally aspirated V6 can get ~300 hp and torque.

yrwei52,
3.0L NA engine won't put out 300hp w/o spinning beyond 7500 rpm.
How useful is that unless we are talking about a sportscar here?
3.5L? sure. That is 16% more displacement.

SPCCI just costs too much today for the benefit to customers now.
Peak power/torque happens at lower rpm. (6k for horsepower and 3k for torque)
Mazda needs to reduce cost further or increase the benefits to customers.

 

[yrwei52]

yrwei52,
Skyactiv-X 2.0L is available in several countries. Not in US, though.
Japanese market, for one, has it, and is quite popular.

The biggest car markets don’t get SkyActiv-X including USA、China, and many Asian countries usually importing lots of Japanese cars.

From Nikkei:

With no launches in next 2 years, Mazda rides rough road

“Skyactiv-X has yet to deliver on the hype. Mazda says it is installed in only 4% of Mazda3s and 2% of CX-30s -- far less than the 25% to 30% it had envisioned.

The hurdle is the added price of around $6,300 compared with regular gasoline engines.”

Why? Mazda feel that US customers won't pay for the $2k-3k premium due to low fuel price.
So, they only sell it in markets where fuel price is high.

Toyota、Honda、Tasla and many others certainly don’t think this way. Try to get a Toyota Prius / Prime、RAV4 Hybrid / Prime、or Venza and see how popular these fuel-saving vehicles are in the US.

And I said it here 2 years ago, started with a simple and efficient Homogeneous Charge Compression Ignition (HCCI) on design, ended up with a complex Spark-Controlled Compression Ignition (SPCCI) SkyActiv-X which costs $6,300 more than a SkyActiv-G with minimum gain on fuel efficiency and horse power. This simply won’t work even from the engineering point of view.

IMO the true reason why the SkyActiv-X is not popular and Mazda North American Operations don’t want to make the same mistake like their SkyActiv-D 2.2L diesel importing SkyActiv-X into US market is:

”While it produces almost the same HP (not the same, 176 vs 186), it only gains 9% better fuel economy and costs 27% more.”

 

[santa]

Here in Denmark the CX-30 skyactiv-x is about 6-7% more expensive than the Skyactiv-G (150 hp version), so not a lot.

 

[zroger73]

I'm okay with 300 HP. What's more exciting to me is the creamy smoothness of an inline-6 engine due to its natural primary and secondary balance and lack of rocking motion.

I welcome the return of inline-sixes with open arms! I can't stand the sound or feel of an inline-four. Mazda does a pretty good job hiding the vibrations most of the time, but there's nothing like an inline-six (except for a V12).

 

[CX-5um]

So where is the promised SkyActiv-X HCCI / SPCCI 2.0L??? Isn’t it supposed to be the future of the Mazda with break-throuigh technology on BOTH horse power AND fuel efficiency???

Any modern 3.0 ~ 3.5L naturally aspirated V6 can get ~300 hp and torque. Now SkyActiv-X 3.0L I6 needs some help of supercharger + 48V motor to achieve that? Unless the setup is super fuel efficient, with the complexity of the SPCCI, I don’t see any future of it, just like the SkyActiv-X 2.0L.

Its in other countries in their small cars (mazda3) which we know is not selling well in the U.S.
It would not make sense to offer it in their top U.S. selling vehicle the CX-5 as it would be too slow for the price point. Their strategy is to offer power in the U.S. hence offering the 2.5l turbo engines in virtually every car in the U.S. (CX-30, Mazda3, Mazda6, CX-5, CX-9). Remember, Mazda despite not selling high volume of cars in the U.S., has an uncanny ability to have a good amount of their sales being upper trim models. How ironic Mazda...bring back MazdaSpeed!!!

Ok so Skyactiv-x..... First of all the supercharger is not there for power but rather to provide leaner air/fuel in the high RPMs.......for better mpgs and quite possibly to even work in the first place. Yes, not only does it provide peak torque sooner compared to Skyactiv-G it now provides a wider power range band and likes to be revved into 6000 RPM territory. Its already more mpg efficient than the Skyactiv 2.0 at 90% of the power of the 2.5 gas engine. The 48v hybrid add on will boost mpgs. The larger displacement to provide more power (in the inline6). They've already tested the Mazda3 Skyactiv-x getting 40+ mpgs while doing aggressive real world driving including 100mph sprints in the autobahn. Not sure of the official MPG numbers but I see 45-50mpgs thrown around. Max speed was 134 mph which is further proof this engine won't die off past 5000 RPMs, that chassis is legit, and we need to use our tax dollars for better roads lol.

In the U.S. I predict in the next few years the 2.5l as the entry level engine (later to be replaced by 2.5l skyactiv-x?), then the next step up is the 2.5l turbo (or maybe the other way around?), and then the inline 6 skyactiv-x hybrid. This pathway will allow Mazda a bridge gap into both meeting the strict EPA requirements as well as increased presence in the entry luxury class.

 

[dougal]

A supercharged 3.0 I6 that only puts out 300hp isn't very special IMHO...

And?

 

[Unobtanium]

And?

And we want moar!!!