New Differential but ABS lights on?

Thanks for reading and any help is appreciated.

2014 Mazda CX-5 touring AWD

Car only has 50,000 miles but the differential had to be replaced. I originally went with a used replacement but that didn't work out (leaked and possible corroded solenoid). Luckily I got the money back and decided to buy a new differential through the dealership.
The new diff is installed and everything sounds smooth.
However, I am getting the following lights on the dash, none of which i had before!
TCS on steady
ABS on steady
TPS flashes then on steady
4WD and BRAKE come on for short period and then go away. Then come on together for a few minutes then go away.

Question 1: Do I have to get the codes on the new differential programmed by Mazda in order for this to work properly? Would this cause the dash lights and ABS to malfunction? I have not been to Mazda again after last time it was $150 for the reprogram and it didn't change anything. The attitude I’m getting from Mazda is unbelievable so I’m trying to do this one myself.

Question 2: Any diagnostic recommendations?

I have already tried the following:
-TPS reset
-Battery and power removed (reset) for extended period
-I installed two new rear ABS sensors during the job because I had to cut the old ones out. I just checked them with a meter and the sensors are fine. The wires to the sensors are carrying power so no issues there.
-All connectors on the diff are new and the existing connection ports are fine. Everything is tight.

Thanks again.
 
Did you try driving it any distance? Might just need to sync.

Otherwise, are you sure the new diff has the same ratio as the old?
 
Did you try driving it any distance? Might just need to sync.

Otherwise, are you sure the new diff has the same ratio as the old?
I have driven about 50 miles since installing i cant find any information on what a sufficient distance would be to clear a code. I agree it could be this but cant find information telling me about how far or how long it would take.

The new diff came from a Mazda dealer with VIN verification on ordering. I dont know how else I could tell without opening the new diff.
Thank you.
 
I installed the diff. It is a new diff and coupler and new wire connectors (complete package). Both ABS sensors are also new. Only used part on the diff is the vent on top, which I confirmed was clean before installing. Fluid filled to correct level.

I'm wondering if there is a problem with the ABS ring(s) on the wheel hubs. However, they appear clean and I didn't have any ABS problems before replacing the diff. I strongly feel it is computer related but I have no way to confirm. I’m close to buying a OBD reader for this and future fixes. The cheap one I have only reads engine codes.
Thanks
 
When you replace the coupler, new data must be calibrated into the AWD module. So my guess is maybe you are experiencing that missing piece.

Coupling Component Calibration Data Writing
1.Connect the M-MDS to the DLC-2.

2.After the vehicle is identified, select the following items from the toolbox of the M-MDS.

1. Select “Chassis”.

3.Then, select items from the screen menu in the following order.

1. Select “4WD/AWD”.

2. Select “Coupling Calibration Data Writing”.

4.Perform the configuration according to the directions on the screen.

Caution

• When the configuration is performed, CAN communication between the AWD control module and control module connected to the CAN line is cut temporarily, and communication error DTCs may be detected. After performing the configuration, verify the DTCs for the control module connected to the CAN line and clear it if any DTC is detected.

5.Verify all the DTCs for the control module connected to the CAN line.

• If any DTC is stored, clear it.

• If the DTC is cleared, finish the procedure because the configuration is completely normally.

• If the DTC remains, perform troubleshooting according to the DTC.
 

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Thank you.

Last time I went to the dealer I explained that all I needed was the new codes entered for the new (used) differential/coupler. They appeared confused and said, “ok well we only usually do that if it’s a brand new differential but we will do it anyway.” They could not explain why or what the difference would be. This is why i questioned whether or not it is necessary to recode for the system to function properly.

Based on what you said it sounds necessary. I'll have to make another appointment with the dealer and try again. Last time it was $150 for nothing but I do think you are correct.

Do you think a local shop would be able to do this or can only Mazda make these changes? I don’t have much faith in the local dealer to get it done properly.

Thank you
 
Thank you.

Last time I went to the dealer I explained that all I needed was the new codes entered for the new (used) differential/coupler. They appeared confused and said, “ok well we only usually do that if it’s a brand new differential but we will do it anyway.” They could not explain why or what the difference would be. This is why i questioned whether or not it is necessary to recode for the system to function properly.

Based on what you said it sounds necessary. I'll have to make another appointment with the dealer and try again. Last time it was $150 for nothing but I do think you are correct.

Do you think a local shop would be able to do this or can only Mazda make these changes? I don’t have much faith in the local dealer to get it done properly.

Thank you
Like Silly Wabbit said, a new rear differential requires registration to the 4WD module and may be something else. Moderator Chris_Top_Her here had done rear differential replacement with a used one. He did mention some registration procedures but didn’t go into details. You may PM him seeking for help from him.

Would you mind to tell us what happened to your factory rear differential which required replacement at 50,000 miles? And usually we’d get much cheaper used rear differential from a reputable national salvage yard such as LKQ.com or Car-Part.com, not sure what happened to your experience getting a leaky used rear differential.
 
Thanks I will do that.

I actually got the used diff from LKQ. The listed diff supposedly had 42,000 miles, less than my original. The diff I received looked much worse than mine and I live in New England (lots of salt). They were good about returning the money but it’s unlikely that the diff I received was based on the details listed.

They let me keep the bad diff. I plan to tear it open to see what was wrong with it, just for kicks, but I believe it is a corroded solenoid connection inside. Possibly fixable but a pain to repair and test. It was also leaking fluid from both seals. The seals are rusted in place. Overall it just wasn't worth messing with anymore. I decided to get a new diff from Mazda shipped to me and not have to worry about used parts. It wasn’t my first choice but I don’t have the time to screw around anymore.

I also opened the original bad diff and found a significant amount of water inside. The factory sealant between the coupling and housing was minimal at best. I noticed a lot more gasket sealant on the new diff. I don't know if the water got in through a gasket gap or through the vent. Either way the coupling was bad.
 
Thanks I will do that.

I actually got the used diff from LKQ. The listed diff supposedly had 42,000 miles, less than my original. The diff I received looked much worse than mine and I live in New England (lots of salt). They were good about returning the money but it’s unlikely that the diff I received was based on the details listed.

They let me keep the bad diff. I plan to tear it open to see what was wrong with it, just for kicks, but I believe it is a corroded solenoid connection inside. Possibly fixable but a pain to repair and test. It was also leaking fluid from both seals. The seals are rusted in place. Overall it just wasn't worth messing with anymore. I decided to get a new diff from Mazda shipped to me and not have to worry about used parts. It wasn’t my first choice but I don’t have the time to screw around anymore.

I also opened the original bad diff and found a significant amount of water inside. The factory sealant between the coupling and housing was minimal at best. I noticed a lot more gasket sealant on the new diff. I don't know if the water got in through a gasket gap or through the vent. Either way the coupling was bad.
It’s unfortunate you received a bad differential from LKQ, but Chris_Top_Her and I have been using LKQ from time to time for used parts and I believe his replacement differential and transmission were from LKQ.

A member here, Unobtanium, who once crossed a flooded road and caused water getting into the differential possibly from the top vent and damaged the clutch pack with “4WD” warning light on. He was lucky as his dealer replaced the rear differential under CPO warranty without questioning him. That’s why our CX-5 manual says to change the gear oil in rear differential whenever we cross a deep water.

The rear differential on CX-5 has gone through a couple of revisions including the front casing and input bearing to fix some premature bearing failing on the differential based on a couple of TSBs. I believe Chris_Top_Her was getting a later model year rear differential on purpose from LKQ just because of that. I hope your high-dollar OEM rear differential is the modified version, which usually do from OEM parts. Since you now have 3 differentials in hand, you can compare the front casing with input bearing and see if there’s any difference among the 3. I’d also suggest to use more expensive OEM SG1 gear oil which could have better performance. And BTW, the capacity for the rear differential actually is 0.75 ~ 0.8 quart instead of Mazda stated 0.45 quart. The front transfer case, which I imagine you’ll change it at the same time, is 0.45 quart like Mazda specified.
 
Thanks for the information. I think I came across Unobtanium's writeup about a month ago. I'm thinking water through the vent could have been the problem too, especially with the snow pack and thaw in the garage, but who knows.

I did purchase and use the SG1 hypoid gear oil. Mazda shipped me the brand new diff with oil inside. It leaked all over the box and I'm sure all over the delivery truck. I'm surprised it didn't get thrown onto my lawn. Add it to the list...

I will check the bearing if I can figure out how to tell the difference based on the numbers. I think I read somewhere that the newer version was not for 2013-2015 but I'm probably wrong. At this point I just need to get the car back to normal. It drives fine now but I want ABS back for winter.

Thanks again.
 
Thanks for the information. I think I came across Unobtanium's writeup about a month ago. I'm thinking water through the vent could have been the problem too, especially with the snow pack and thaw in the garage, but who knows.

I did purchase and use the SG1 hypoid gear oil. Mazda shipped me the brand new diff with oil inside. It leaked all over the box and I'm sure all over the delivery truck. I'm surprised it didn't get thrown onto my lawn. Add it to the list...

I will check the bearing if I can figure out how to tell the difference based on the numbers. I think I read somewhere that the newer version was not for 2013-2015 but I'm probably wrong. At this point I just need to get the car back to normal. It drives fine now but I want ABS back for winter.

Thanks again.
Haven’t seen Chris_Top_Her posting here recently. Must be busy for something. But he’ll respond to your question for sure as usual. You’ve already spent too much money and time on this problem!
 
Pm'd OP. Replaced mine with a used unit from a 2016, used all old parts, no issues with it and codes/driveability whatseover, had the code updated at the dealer anyways for good measure. Went in with the 2 or 3 pages from the manual printed out detailing the process and got it done. The DSC responds much more smoothly now too.
 
Pm'd OP. Replaced mine with a used unit from a 2016, used all old parts, no issues with it and codes/driveability whatseover, had the code updated at the dealer anyways for good measure. Went in with the 2 or 3 pages from the manual printed out detailing the process and got it done. The DSC responds much more smoothly now too.
So this dealer’s only job is to program the 4WD control module and may be other things outlined in the factory workshop manual. Thanks for letting us know!
 
Thank you for the help everyone.
Just a followup to close out the thread.
I got the car back from the dealer today (different Mazda dealer than the first time).

Before I brought the car to Mazda I had Meineke run the computer for codes (free) to see what I was dealing with before Mazda got their hands on it. The codes came back as left rear ABS sensor no signal. I then checked both rear ABS sensors with a meter and found no issues. Both connections had power and both sensors had proper resistance. Also, nothing changed with the ABS rings on the axles throughout the work so there was no reason to believe a fault with the rings. I didn't have any dash lights prior to starting the work.
Both ABS sensors are brand new from RockAuto and were installed during the diff swap. They were not Mazda sensors but OEM standard aftermarket replacements.
I also got codes for operator holding down the TCS OFF switch and the TPS RESET switch too long, which based on the service manual (supplied by Chris), will result in dummy lights. DONT GET ME STARTED ON THIS PROGRAMMING NONSENSE...
Meineke cleared the codes but it resulted in no change to dash lights and AWD function.

I brought the car to the Mazda dealer and supplied them with all diff/coupling code strings as well as a copy of the service manual reprogramming instructions. The service manager was better than the other dealer and at least helped me believe the most informed programming technician was assigned to the job.

The Mazda technician checked the codes and found the following: P182F/C0037/C003A.

The P182F code is related to a fault in the ABS control module.
Unfortunately, Mazda's standard operating procedure based on the service manual is to replace the ABS control module prior to the next step of diagnostics (cue the cashroll now...).
Mazda replaced the ABS control module and was able to receive/send signals for AWD.
Remind you, I had not issues with the ABS control module or AWD prior to replacement and no dash lights. Mazda diagnosed my grinding sound issue as a bad coupling and said the only way they would fix it is with a complete new differential/coupling package.
How can the module fail during replacement of the mechanical differential? I didn't touch anything with the computer.
Based on what I have read in the service manual and discussions with the Mazda service managers, it is faster and cheaper to replace complete components rather than diagnose and fix faulty minor components. I guess that's how it goes. Remember, all of this work is the result of a failed bearing in the coupling, nothing else.

The second two codes are related to either faulty sensor or ABS ring. So perhaps the new ABS sensors were faulty or incompatible. I cannot confirm. Perhaps Mazda has a feedback written into the Mazda sensors that report original Mazda equipment. Otherwise I don't know why the sensors would be an issue. They tested correctly with a meter and are equivalent to OEM.
Regardless, Mazda required replacement of both rear ABS sensors.

I wish they gave me back the new (removed) sensors so I could double check the sensor measurements but they threw them away and conveniently charged me a $30 environmental disposal fee (for all of the "hazardous fluids" they didn't remove from my car...).
I quickly paid my bill before taking my anger out on the service manager for a Mazda corporate screw over.
At this point I will quote Cartman from South Park, "At least buy me dinner before you.... me."


All said and done,
~$1,200 for new differential/coupling,
$802.19 for labor and parts
~$150 at the first dealer who couldn't and didn't do anything to fix the problem They may have even screwed up the ABS control module but I will never know. Something about that service manager made me unsettled from the get-go.

I still saved about $1000 by swapping the parts myself. Mazda gave me an estimate of $3000+ to do the entire swap themselves. I assume new ABS sensors would be an additional fee since the original sensors were rusted in place. However the savings are not worth all of the hours spent. All of this to essentially replace a failed bearing in the coupling which should not have failed at 55,000 miles.


So, anyone in the market for a CX-5 with a brand new differential?


UnhappyCampr out.
 
Thank you for the help everyone.
Just a followup to close out the thread.
I got the car back from the dealer today (different Mazda dealer than the first time).

Before I brought the car to Mazda I had Meineke run the computer for codes (free) to see what I was dealing with before Mazda got their hands on it. The codes came back as left rear ABS sensor no signal. I then checked both rear ABS sensors with a meter and found no issues. Both connections had power and both sensors had proper resistance. Also, nothing changed with the ABS rings on the axles throughout the work so there was no reason to believe a fault with the rings. I didn't have any dash lights prior to starting the work.
Both ABS sensors are brand new from RockAuto and were installed during the diff swap. They were not Mazda sensors but OEM standard aftermarket replacements.
I also got codes for operator holding down the TCS OFF switch and the TPS RESET switch too long, which based on the service manual (supplied by Chris), will result in dummy lights. DONT GET ME STARTED ON THIS PROGRAMMING NONSENSE...
Meineke cleared the codes but it resulted in no change to dash lights and AWD function.

I brought the car to the Mazda dealer and supplied them with all diff/coupling code strings as well as a copy of the service manual reprogramming instructions. The service manager was better than the other dealer and at least helped me believe the most informed programming technician was assigned to the job.

The Mazda technician checked the codes and found the following: P182F/C0037/C003A.

The P182F code is related to a fault in the ABS control module.
Unfortunately, Mazda's standard operating procedure based on the service manual is to replace the ABS control module prior to the next step of diagnostics (cue the cashroll now...).
Mazda replaced the ABS control module and was able to receive/send signals for AWD.
Remind you, I had not issues with the ABS control module or AWD prior to replacement and no dash lights. Mazda diagnosed my grinding sound issue as a bad coupling and said the only way they would fix it is with a complete new differential/coupling package.
How can the module fail during replacement of the mechanical differential? I didn't touch anything with the computer.
Based on what I have read in the service manual and discussions with the Mazda service managers, it is faster and cheaper to replace complete components rather than diagnose and fix faulty minor components. I guess that's how it goes. Remember, all of this work is the result of a failed bearing in the coupling, nothing else.

The second two codes are related to either faulty sensor or ABS ring. So perhaps the new ABS sensors were faulty or incompatible. I cannot confirm. Perhaps Mazda has a feedback written into the Mazda sensors that report original Mazda equipment. Otherwise I don't know why the sensors would be an issue. They tested correctly with a meter and are equivalent to OEM.
Regardless, Mazda required replacement of both rear ABS sensors.

I wish they gave me back the new (removed) sensors so I could double check the sensor measurements but they threw them away and conveniently charged me a $30 environmental disposal fee (for all of the "hazardous fluids" they didn't remove from my car...).
I quickly paid my bill before taking my anger out on the service manager for a Mazda corporate screw over.
At this point I will quote Cartman from South Park, "At least buy me dinner before you.... me."


All said and done,
~$1,200 for new differential/coupling,
$802.19 for labor and parts
~$150 at the first dealer who couldn't and didn't do anything to fix the problem They may have even screwed up the ABS control module but I will never know. Something about that service manager made me unsettled from the get-go.

I still saved about $1000 by swapping the parts myself. Mazda gave me an estimate of $3000+ to do the entire swap themselves. I assume new ABS sensors would be an additional fee since the original sensors were rusted in place. However the savings are not worth all of the hours spent. All of this to essentially replace a failed bearing in the coupling which should not have failed at 55,000 miles.


So, anyone in the market for a CX-5 with a brand new differential?


UnhappyCampr out.
What a story and thanks for the update! The only good thing coming out of this is your CX-5 finally got fixed by the second Mazda dealer, but unfortunately for additional $802.19!

The front input bearing of the rear differential has been a problem area for older CX-5 and that’s why the TSB says Mazda had to modified the rear differential front casing to prevent the premature failure on input bearing.

CX-5 AWD owners should be careful crossing the deep water, and change the gear oil afterwards with OEM gear oil SG1. Check gear oil and top off the rear differential if you don’t plan to change it soon, as the factory fill is way lower than the fill hole.
 
Quite a saga! Thanks for sharing your experience.
 
So did the dealer warrantied the new diff that you purchased/installed and replaced with another new one?

I was also wondering if you should have tried to reuse the old ABS sensors would result in any differences.
 

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