Mazda CX-50

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'17, Mazda 6 GT
Rumors from BestCar magazine of Japan:
Translated best I could...
Please take it with grains of salt .... :)

The coming CX-50 will be a derived model from next CX-5.
Think of them as Cayenne Coupe vs. Cayenne (or MB GLC coupe vs. GLC)
The next-CX-5 will be slightly lengthened to 4600mm (181in). Height will be marginally increased to 1680mm (66.1in). The more sporty CX-50 will be of the same length, but lower by 60mm. (2.36in).
Expected release date for CX-50 is 2023.

As for powertrain, high end models will have the new inline-6 (3.0L Skyactiv-X) + 48V mild hybrid, or Skyactiv-D 3.3L, making 285hp/37kg-m(267ft-lb) or 285hp/61.2kg-m(442ft-lb) respectively.
Lower end models will offer choices of Skyactiv-G 2.5L+48V(190hp/27.2kg-m:196ft-lb), 2.5T(230hp/42.8kg-m:309ft-lb) or 2.2L Skyactiv-D(190hp/45.9kg-m:331ft-lb).
On drivetrain, two choices will be offered, RWD or AWD.
Those are quite old news and while I still believe some of these are true, especially the 3.0 Skyactiv X for Europe, in NA I think we are going to get a turbocharged 3.0l Skyactiv-G (hopefully based on the ND Miata 2.0) with about 350hp.

Tbh that's all I am interest in :)
 
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2021 CX-9 Sig
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2014 CX-5 GT
Those are quite old news and while I still believe some of these are true, especially the 3.0 Skyactiv X for Europe, in NA I think we are going to get a turbocharged 3.0l Skyactiv-G (hopefully based on the ND Miata 2.0) with about 350hp.

Tbh that's all I am interest in :)

I think they have already stated that the inline 6 is a Sky X engine.
 

HardRightEdg

US 2020 CX-5 Touring AWD Soul Red
Engineering aside, I struggle to understand the marketing.

It seems to me if Mazda wanted to break away from the RAV4 / CR-V crowd, with 300+ hp engines and rear wheel drive, they should have created a new marque a la Lexus / Acura, to be accompanied by the next gen 6, or at the very least used a different naming convention than one so closely identified with the CX-5 (let alone CX-30) in the everyman class.

The reality is people pay a lot of money for a badge and unless this vehicle meaningfully undercuts the BMWs of the world on price, making it "budget premium" rather than just "premium" it might be tough sell to other than the Mazda loyalists.
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
Engineering aside, I struggle to understand the marketing.

It seems to me if Mazda wanted to break away from the RAV4 / CR-V crowd, with 300+ hp engines and rear wheel drive, they should have created a new marque a la Lexus / Acura, to be accompanied by the next gen 6, or at the very least used a different naming convention than one so closely identified with the CX-5 (let alone CX-30) in the everyman class.

The reality is people pay a lot of money for a badge and unless this vehicle meaningfully undercuts the BMWs of the world on price, making it "budget premium" rather than just "premium" it might be tough sell to other than the Mazda loyalists.
It's simple, Mazda brand does not have enough popularity, therefore not enough money to make a full premium variant of they're cars, as Toyota and Honda did and tbh you can't grow overnight into a premium segment. As an example, take Hyundai Genesis, that eventually became Genesis brand.

I even think they mentioned they don't want to go full luxury, they want to go premium at VW level type of money. Which is not a bad thing, IMO.
 

HardRightEdg

US 2020 CX-5 Touring AWD Soul Red
I even think they mentioned they don't want to go full luxury, they want to go premium at VW level type of money. Which is not a bad thing, IMO.
I wouldn't ever think of VW as "premium"--they're in there with Toyota and Honda but with poorer reliability. If some VWs happen to share some parts bins with Audi that would say something more about Audi than VW.

Like I said, at the least Mazda could come up with a name other than CX-50, so closely associated with the others in the line. That costs nothing.
 
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2019 CX-5 Signature
Mazda had planned a luxury line called "Amati", scheduled to launch in 1994. The idea collapsed with the Japanese recession in the 1990s.
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
I wouldn't ever think of VW as "premium"--they're in there with Toyota and Honda but with poorer reliability. If some VWs happens to share some parts bins with Audi that would say something more about Audi than VW.

Like I said, at the least Mazda could come up with a name other than CX-50, so closely associated with the others in the line. That costs nothing.
I would argue that, VW has a good reliability in Europe, is just the north-american market that gets the products built here, have issues with reliability and they have a higher maintenance costs. Also I would argue about the product quality when speaking about premium, because I consider VW (at least european products) to be above what Toyota and Honda is producing in NA.
 

HardRightEdg

US 2020 CX-5 Touring AWD Soul Red
I would argue that, VW has a good reliability in Europe, is just the north-american market that gets the products built here, have issues with reliability and they have a higher maintenance costs. Also I would argue about the product quality when speaking about premium, because I consider VW (at least european products) to be above what Toyota and Honda is producing in NA.
I'm not familiar with VW's European line-up. Do they sell a compact SUV/CUV with 300 hp? Or would have to move up to an Audi?
 
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2013 CX-5 Sport Manual
I would argue that, VW has a good reliability in Europe, is just the north-american market that gets the products built here, have issues with reliability and they have a higher maintenance costs. Also I would argue about the product quality when speaking about premium, because I consider VW (at least european products) to be above what Toyota and Honda is producing in NA.
I don't know man, I've been hearing, watchig, reading everywhere that the Atlas has lower maintenance cost than Highlander. Who should I trust - you or the countless commercials :D
 
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2013 CX-5 Sport Manual
The reality is people pay a lot of money for a badge
I am the opposite and I think a lot of smart people are like that out there. If VW produces a reliable car (ideally made in Japan :) ), I don't mind buying one. That will obviously not happen any time soon.
 

HardRightEdg

US 2020 CX-5 Touring AWD Soul Red
I am the opposite and I think a lot of smart people are like that out there. If VW produces a reliable car (ideally made in Japan :) ), I don't mind buying one. That will obviously not happen any time soon.
I was not talking about VW when I said people pay a lot of money for a badge. They sure don't in the US.

It seems to me an automaker building a vehicle like this would want to appeal to both--people who want bang for the buck regardless of the badge and those who go badge hunting.

It would stand to reason if the CX-50 is a "premium" 300 hp set-up, differentiated from the CX-5, it will price at least where the CX-5 leaves off, $40,000+ US then up from there if the AWD and turbo versions materialize. I can't imagine they won't at least add an AWD option in fairly short order.

This vehicle sure ain't intended to compete with the Tiguan. That's CX-5 territory. Think BMW X-3 which starts at $43,000 US with 248 hp turbo-4 RWD. It just seems to me they could at least come up with a better name than CX-50 in a move into the "premium" class. CX-50 sounds like a tweaky upgrade over the CX-5, as CX-30 was relative to the CX-3.
 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
I'm not familiar with VW's European line-up. Do they sell a compact SUV/CUV with 300 hp? Or would have to move up to an Audi?
There is T-Roc R with close to 300hp, there is Tiguan R with over 300hp (doesn't have anything to do with NA Tiguan) and there's the Touareg R with about 450hp .
 

HardRightEdg

US 2020 CX-5 Touring AWD Soul Red
There is T-Roc R with close to 300hp, there is Tiguan R with over 300hp (doesn't have anything to do with NA Tiguan) and there's the Touareg R with about 450hp .
So the homeland is certainly quite different than the US. Tiguan is the CX-5 competitor in the US and it comes in only one motor, a 183 horse 2.0L turbo even in the highest trim Tiguan R. I doubt VW would ever try to sell anything in the US with 300 hp and a Tiguan name in the US. They'd sidle you across the parking lot to the Audi showroom. There might be a 300 hp VW ID4 in the US at some point at $45,000+ before tax rebates. But that's an EV and a whole other kettle of fish.

But I come back to my original point--at least in the US market why would you give a premium class vehicle a name that sounds like a new generation of the everyman? I'd say the same about the next generation 6 if the article in post #3 is correct in speculating it is a joint development with the next gen Lexus iS currently starting at $40,000+ US. Why would you want to call that premium step-up a 60?
Mazda had planned a luxury line called "Amati", scheduled to launch in 1994. The idea collapsed with the Japanese recession in the 1990s.
I like that name, it kinda sounds Japanese (for execution) and definitely Italian (for sexy and plays like a high end violin), but with the tarnish you would not want to reuse it. If we rule out a new marque, which seems reasonable for the foreseeable future, a Mazda model name along those lines instead of CX-50 makes more sense to me.

I would assume they will be keeping the CX-5 for some undetermined time in the US. That's the high volume segment and half of Mazda's total US sales. Without it there is a massive gap between the CX-30 and CX-50. Running the 5 and 50 simultaneously adds to the cognitive dissonance regarding where the 50 sits.
As an example, take Hyundai Genesis, that eventually became Genesis brand.
They started that way with one Genesis model. You can't have a separate marque with only one vehicle. As they added more models they spun out Genesis as a distinct marque. Even still they sell out of the same dealerships like this where the cost of the extra marque may only be the signage:

 
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'17, Mazda 6 GT
The bulge over the rear fenders (circled in green) might also suggest that this car is using the new FR platform.
The more I look, the more I intend to say that this a Front wheel driven car. It is not a RWD with AWD car. Just look at the front brake calipers, they are positioned in the front end of the car, like they are for a front wheel car and not in the back of the rotor, like in RWD platforms. Kind of disappointing and my guess this is a new SUV, which seems to be on a large platform, but front wheel driven.