2016.5 CX-5 Transmission fluid change questions

[Digbicks1234]

The ATF cooler adapter plate you saw has 2 ports. But don’t get confused with these 2 ports on ATF cooler. These 2 ports on adapter plate is the ATF outlet and inlet ports instead engine coolant ports found on ATF cooler. The ATF pump does feed ATF into the ATF cooler from inside of transmission to cool down the circulating fluid by engine coolant. The adapter plate provides ATF ports which are not available on ATF cooler to let fluid exchanger hooking up and exchanging the ATF. While doing that, you just let ATF cooler hang to the side by the engine coolant lines with transmission running.

Why do you want to extract old ATF through the dipstick hole? Drain the ATF through the drain hole to promote more tiny debris or dirt if any coming out with old fluid as those usually will stay at the bottom of the pan. If you’re draining old ATF through dipstick hole, the sucking power usually only stays at one area near the pan, which is not as effective sucking most of debris or dirt out. This’s similar to engine oil change. Some like to extract used oil out through the dipstick channel, so that they don’t need to go under the car. But how are you going to know you actually got all the oil out as the suction tube may not land at the lowest point on the pan, but the drain plug is.

The alternative, to drain 1 quart at a time through the dipstick and pour in exactly 1 quart, drive the car and repeat, would be worse than a simple drain-and-fill. Because once you pour in a quart of fresh ATF after you extracted one, it’s mixed with the rest of old ATF immediately in the pan, then your next quart extracted will contain some fresh ATF after you drive around several miles, which is definitely a waste on time and money. Not to mention it’s too much hassle. Do normal drain-and-fill, you for sure have about 3.75 quarts of old ATF drained, and the similar amount of fresh fluid been poured in.

Personally I’m not afraid of doing the first ATF change closer to 100,000 miles. My 1998 Honda CR-V has 75,000-mile ATF change interval recommended by the manufacture. But the risk is there as the cleaning agent in fresh ATF may wash some accumulated residue or crud off and gets stuck somewhere in the valve body, although the ATF filter should do the job to stop that.

Changing the ATF or not really depends on how long you’d like to keep the vehicle. Most people get rid of the vehicle before reaching 100,000 miles, or they’re not interested to be a DIYer, then I’d say don’t worry about changing the ATF. That’s the next person’s problem unfortunately.

The ATF cooler adapter plate you saw has 2 ports. But don’t get confused with these 2 ports on ATF cooler. These 2 ports on adapter plate is the ATF outlet and inlet ports instead engine coolant ports found on ATF cooler. The ATF pump does feed ATF into the ATF cooler from inside of transmission to cool down the circulating fluid by engine coolant. The adapter plate provides ATF ports which are not available on ATF cooler to let fluid exchanger hooking up and exchanging the ATF. While doing that, you just let ATF cooler hang to the side by the engine coolant lines with transmission running.

Okay, that makes more sense now. I tried searching for their product on Google and I wasn't able to find anything about it aside from the datasheet containing the model #. I guess this item would be something that would need to be specially ordered.

Why do you want to extract old ATF through the dipstick hole? Drain the ATF through the drain hole to promote more tiny debris or dirt if any coming out with old fluid as those usually will stay at the bottom of the pan. If you’re draining old ATF through dipstick hole, the sucking power usually only stays at one area near the pan, which is not as effective sucking most of debris or dirt out. This’s similar to engine oil change. Some like to extract used oil out through the dipstick channel, so that they don’t need to go under the car. But how are you going to know you actually got all the oil out as the suction tube may not land at the lowest point on the pan, but the drain plug is.

I was thinking that if you insert the tube into the dipstick hole, it would reach into other areas that contain the rest of the fluid (aside from the torque converter) and would help in the process of extracting the fluid, aside from dropping the pan. But one good thing about going through the dipstick hole would be to extracting the fluid for an analysis since it would be less messy but that's about it.

The alternative, to drain 1 quart at a time through the dipstick and pour in exactly 1 quart, drive the car and repeat, would be worse than a simple drain-and-fill. Because once you pour in a quart of fresh ATF after you extracted one, it’s mixed with the rest of old ATF immediately in the pan, then your next quart extracted will contain some fresh ATF after you drive around several miles, which is definitely a waste on time and money. Not to mention it’s too much hassle. Do normal drain-and-fill, you for sure have about 3.75 quarts of old ATF drained, and the similar amount of fresh fluid been poured in.

No plans on doing the 1 qt at a time method but I was reading one of the YouTube comments mentioning that completely replacing all the fluid at once with new fluid would probably not be a good thing since all the metals that's already in there previously lubricating the transmission would be washed out. I think the basis for this claim would be that the transmission was NEVER flushed/drained before and the car is very high mileage and doing a complete flush of the old fluid would do more harm than good. Then again, it's YouTube and there's no scientific basis on any of this but an opinion so it made me curious.

Personally I’m not afraid of doing the first ATF change closer to 100,000 miles. My 1998 Honda CR-V has 75,000-mile ATF change interval recommended by the manufacture. But the risk is there as the cleaning agent in fresh ATF may wash some accumulated residue or crud off and gets stuck somewhere in the valve body, although the ATF filter should do the job to stop that.

Changing the ATF or not really depends on how long you’d like to keep the vehicle. Most people get rid of the vehicle before reaching 100,000 miles, or they’re not interested to be a DIYer, then I’d say don’t worry about changing the ATF. That’s the next person’s problem unfortunately.

I like to do what I can to prolong the life of the vehicle and also this would be a new learning experience for me as I've never performed an ATF drain/pan drop before so I don't mind.

 

[Boland01]

It does sound like your car has had an easy life compared to mine. I think in the first 24k miles, I was having a little too much fun and my gas mileage wasn't so great.

The great thing about this car is it still handles well, no rattles and has been completely reliable.

 

[Digbicks1234]

Update (9/19):
So I decided to start part (1/3) of the drain and fill process for the CX-5 and upon draining the transmission fluid out, the color was pitch black jesus. Also, when I measured the amount of fluid in my vehicle after 10-15 minutes, there was about 3.7 - 3.8 quarts in total. In addition, when I tried to put the exact/similar amount back into the ATF, my dipstick reading was well beyond the high point. I did start my car up and used the OBD II to read the ATF (Temp 1) sensor and waited until 122f to take another dipstick reading and it still read beyond the fill line. For tomorrow, I'm planning to siphon the rest of the extra fluid out to a tolerable level and then doing measuring again at 122f.

I realized I made a few mistakes since it was kind of a rush job (first attempt at doing a tranny drain/fill):

1. Didn't measure the ATF dipstick on a level surface (car was still jacked in the air)
2. Poured about 3.6 - 3.7 quarts back in without hesitating and then even after putting the car down at a level surface and starting the car back up, it still read beyond the low/high line.

Overall, it's not a very hard process and it's very similar to an engine oil change except for the fact that you have to be a little more careful and there are more things to remove such:

1. Underbody cover held by (8) 10 mm screws and (6) plastic rivets that requires a screw driver or prying tool
2. Engine filter housing held by (2) 10 mm bolts
3. Dipstick bolt held on by (1) 10 mm bolt
4. Engine Air Filter Housing Hose held on by (1) Philips/10 mm
5. Engine Air Filter Housing sensor
6. Transmission drain plug (8 mm hex bit socket)

Pictures below if it helps anyone:

1. Drain using a 12 qt container

Engine Air Filter Housing:

Transmission dipstick:
After removing the bolt and the dipstick from the ATF, I realized there was a lot of dirt caked between the dipstick and the mounting surface itself. I was read about this before in other posts but there was definitely dirt underneath the dipstick contact surface as well.

Dipstick from factory fill:

Dipstick after pouring 3.7 - 3.8 qts back

ATF Drain Bolt:
Ran into some issues removing the washer since it was pretty much stuck to the bolt and had to use a pick to pry it off.

Engine Air Filter/Housing Removed

Bottom of air filter housing:
I definitely noticed the bolts that appear to be holding the ECU/ECU mount in place appear to show signs of rust

 

[Digbicks1234]

Part 2:
Entire engine filter housing assembly removed.

Transmission Pan/Bolts
So it appears that my transmission pan and the bolts are starting to form rust. I don't know how long it would take before the whole thing starts to crack and leak but I'm guessing I'll need a new pan by 100,000 miles or my next drain/fill.

Bottom of the transmission drain bolt

I'll post a revised write up during the 2nd/3rd time I perform this. Let me know if you guys need/want any more pictures or anything.

 

[Silly Wabbit]

Fyi car has to be running otherwise fluid will drain back to the pan making the reading inaccurate

 

[HyFlyer]

I appreciate taking the time to take pictures and post your detailed write up D1234. Thank you

 

[yrwei52]

Update (9/19):
So I decided to start part (1/3) of the drain and fill process for the CX-5 and upon draining the transmission fluid out, the color was pitch black jesus.

Thanks for posting your ATF change experience especially with many pictures. I’ve bookmarked this thread as one of many ATF change informations I can reference when I need to change the ATF on my CX-5.

Also, when I measured the amount of fluid in my vehicle after 10-15 minutes, there was about 3.7 - 3.8 quarts in total. In addition, when I tried to put the exact/similar amount back into the ATF, my dipstick reading was well beyond the high point. I did start my car up and used the OBD II to read the ATF (Temp 1) sensor and waited until 122f to take another dipstick reading and it still read beyond the fill line. For tomorrow, I'm planning to siphon the rest of the extra fluid out to a tolerable level and then doing measuring again at 122f.

Based on many reports here, most say ~3.7 quarts of ATF been drained out from factory fill. But most also say it was lower than the center marker on the dipstick when they checkEd the factory ATF level using the procedure stated on Mazda Factory Workshop Manual:

“Remove the dipstick and wipe ATF off using a nylon cloth while leaving the engine idling.“

So for some reason, your ATF level before and after with said quantity seems to be inconsistent with most others.

One possible reason is the scale of the 12-quart container for used ATF may be off. You can verify this by pouring the old ATF into empty ATF bottles and see if the quantity matches the fresh fluid you actually poured into the transmission.

I realized I made a few mistakes since it was kind of a rush job (first attempt at doing a tranny drain/fill):

1. Didn't measure the ATF dipstick on a level surface (car was still jacked in the air)
   
   
2. Poured about 3.6 - 3.7 quarts back in without hesitating and then even after putting the car down at a level surface and starting the car back up, it still read beyond the low/high line.

From 1, this could be why the initial factory ATF level reading showed on dipstick was high.

Overall, it's not a very hard process and it's very similar to an engine oil change except for the fact that you have to be a little more careful and there are more things to remove such:

1. Underbody cover held by (8) 10 mm screws and (6) plastic rivets that requires a screw driver or prying tool
2. Engine filter housing held by (2) 10 mm bolts
3. Dipstick bolt held on by (1) 10 mm bolt
4. Engine Air Filter Housing Hose held on by (1) Philips/10 mm
5. Engine Air Filter Housing sensor
6. Transmission drain plug (8 mm hex bit socket)

These definitely are valuable info. So you removed the entire air box but kept all sensor connectors on to prevent rough idle and possible CELs? The only thing is you have no filtering for intake while the engine is idling, while checking the ATF level.

Pictures below if it helps anyone:

1. Drain using a 12 qt container
View attachment 227105
View attachment 227108

Engine Air Filter Housing:
View attachment 227121
Transmission dipstick:
After removing the bolt and the dipstick from the ATF, I realized there was a lot of dirt caked between the dipstick and the mounting surface itself. I was read about this before in other posts but there was definitely dirt underneath the dipstick contact surface as well.
View attachment 227115

View attachment 227111

Dipstick from factory fill:

View attachment 227107
Dipstick after pouring 3.7 - 3.8 qts back
View attachment 227106

ATF Drain Bolt:
Ran into some issues removing the washer since it was pretty much stuck to the bolt and had to use a pick to pry it off.
View attachment 227110

Engine Air Filter/Housing RemovedView attachment 227112

Bottom of air filter housing:
I definitely noticed the bolts that appear to be holding the ECU/ECU mount in place appear to show signs of rust
View attachment 227113

These pictures are definitely helpful!

 

[yrwei52]

Part 2:
Entire engine filter housing assembly removed.
View attachment 227117

Transmission Pan/Bolts
So it appears that my transmission pan and the bolts are starting to form rust. I don't know how long it would take before the whole thing starts to crack and leak but I'm guessing I'll need a new pan by 100,000 miles or my next drain/fill.
View attachment 227118

Bottom of the transmission drain bolt
View attachment 227120

I'll post a revised write up during the 2nd/3rd time I perform this. Let me know if you guys need/want any more pictures or anything.

That rust issue is a little concerning. Are you happen to be in any snow belt or salt air areas?

And what kind of OBDII reader your’re using? Some simple OBDII readers can only read the engine coolant temperature, but still use the same value displayed as ATF temperature. If you see the same temperature readings between engine coolant and ATF temperature, you’re not getting true ATF temperature.

 

[Digbicks1234]

Fyi car has to be running otherwise fluid will drain back to the pan making the reading inaccurate

Maybe you're right about that, I did have my car on and waited until the ATF temp read at 122f and turned off my vehicle, disconnected the air box assembly/filter and housing again to access the dipstick to see the level. I guess it needs to be idling?

 

[Conrad 16.5]

Nice write up and pics DB! Thanks for doing that.

Perhaps I missed it but how many miles are on that black trans fluid? I have the same year CX and the color of yours has me concerned for mine. I have less than 30k miles on mine and was planning on changing out the trans fluid at around 50-60k miles...

 

[Conrad 16.5]

Maybe you're right about that, I did have my car on and waited until the ATF temp read at 122f and turned off my vehicle, disconnected the air box assembly/filter and housing again to access the dipstick to see the level. I guess it needs to be idling?

Yes, the car needs to be running when taking the reading.

 

[Digbicks1234]

Thanks for posting your ATF change experience especially with many pictures. I’ve bookmarked this thread as one of many ATF change informations I can reference when I need to change the ATF on my CX-5.

Based on many reports here, most say ~3.7 quarts of ATF been drained out from factory fill. But most also say it was lower than the center marker on the dipstick when they checkEd the factory ATF level using the procedure stated on Mazda Factory Workshop Manual:

“Remove the dipstick and wipe ATF off using a nylon cloth while leaving the engine idling.“

So for some reason, your ATF level before and after with said quantity seems to be inconsistent with most others.

One possible reason is the scale of the 12-quart container for used ATF may be off. You can verify this by pouring the old ATF into empty ATF bottles and see if the quantity matches the fresh fluid you actually poured into the transmission.

From 1, this could be why the initial factory ATF level reading showed on dipstick was high.

Not a problem, glad it helps somewhat !

You may be right about the the accuracy of the 12 quart container. I'll try to re-measure it again after pouring it back into the old ATF bottles.

Here's the link to the 12 qt container:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/ (commissions earned)

These definitely are valuable info. So you removed the entire air box but kept all sensor connectors on to prevent rough idle and possible CELs? The only thing is you have no filtering for intake while the engine is idling, while checking the ATF level.

I did reconnect everything (sensors, the housing assembly, hose and the filter). Only thing I did not do is bolt everything back into place while.

 

[Digbicks1234]

That rust issue is a little concerning. Are you happen to be in any snow belt or salt air areas?

And what kind of OBDII reader your’re using? Some simple OBDII readers can only read the engine coolant temperature, but still use the same value displayed as ATF temperature. If you see the same temperature readings between engine coolant and ATF temperature, you’re not getting true ATF temperature.

I'm from the east coast so we get a lot of snow and salt in the roads during the winter and this possibly could contribute to the amount of rust on the pan itself. I also see rust in other areas of the car and it concerns me as well. I might post another thread about the rust in the future after I get some more photos.

I purchased this a few years back so I can't remember the exact model but this should be it:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/ (commissions earned)

I used the (2) transmission temperature settings that was offered in Torque Pro and as you can see, there was no value being listed for the 2nd temperature. I'll make a custom page with the coolant temperature in the same page as well to see if they're the same.

Note: Ignore the Roll/Pitch meter, I took a screenshot of the app while inside my house so it's not related.

Question: Would it be okay to run the car without the engine filter housing assembly and everything included/connected? I was reading about it somewhere in the forums and forgot but I would assume it wouldn't do any damage unless it was left like that for a long period of time?

 

[Digbicks1234]

Nice write up and pics DB! Thanks for doing that.

Perhaps I missed it but how many miles are on that black trans fluid? I have the same year CX and the color of yours has me concerned for mine. I have less than 30k miles on mine and was planning on changing out the trans fluid at around 50-60k miles...

Thank you!

This car currently has about 64,000 miles on it. I don't know if the mileage has more to do with it than, the environment or the way I drive the car but I guess it would be a safe bet to drain/fill it every 30,000 miles or so to see if the color has changed from blue to black. I have the oil sample in a container right now and I'm planning to send it out for an analysis sometime next week.

Yes, the car needs to be running when taking the reading.

I started working on my car pretty late and I guess I forgot to read this part of the manual and I just waited till the temp hit 122f and shut my car off immediately LOL

 

[yrwei52]

Maybe you're right about that, I did have my car on and waited until the ATF temp read at 122f and turned off my vehicle, disconnected the air box assembly/filter and housing again to access the dipstick to see the level. I guess it needs to be idling?

OK, that’s why. Like the workshop manual and others have said, you take the ATF level while the engine is idling. Or your measurement will be high as the ATF is not circling in the transmission which let plenty of ATF drain back to the ATF pan. If you plan to do drain-and-fill multiple times, I’d keep the current ATF level intact, and adjust the ATF level properly in next drain-and-fill.

 

[Digbicks1234]

OK, that’s why. Like the workshop manual and others have said, you take the ATF level while the engine is idling. Or your measurement will be high as the ATF is not circling in the transmission which let plenty of ATF drain back to the ATF pan. If you plan to do drain-and-fill multiple times, I’d keep the current ATF level intact, and adjust the ATF level properly in next drain-and-fill.

Makes perfect sense, I just used the same idea as an oil change and applied it to the transmission fluid but it seems that transmission fluid is a little more finicky when it comes to temperature ranges. I also stumbled upon this thread and it definitely relates to me very well. I'm most likely going to try measuring it again with the filter housing completely off and only the sensor connected.

How to Measure Transmission Fluid Level in Mazda3

I'm surprised that I couldn't find a thread on this which actually answers the questions I have about this basic maintenance technique. It's a simple question - How to properly measure the automatic transmission fluid (ATF) level in my 2016 Mazda 3. The owners manual doesn't mention it. Below...

www.mazdas247.com

How to Read Mazda ATF Level

Concept - Bingo! that was it. The car has to be running at temperature. Thank you for the tip. I knew the temperature part, but the few references I could find on line about measuring the ATF level all refrained from mentioning that the engine had to be running.
You can see in the attached photo now the level looks correct. I checked it on both my 2016 Mazda 3 and 2017 CX-5. Both look good now.

I did think about the possibility that the engine had to be running, but rejected it because it seems impractical. It makes you choose between two bad options.
1) Leave the air filter system in. You then can only get to the dipstick by running your arm down against the very hot radiator hose and burning yourself.
2) Removing the air filter system which gives you all the room in the world to work without a burn hazard. But to do it, you have to disconnect the wiring harness to the throttle body - and run it like that - disconnected. I figured that would generate OBD II diagnostic codes.

Neither of these options appealed to me, but I chose poison option 2. Sure enough, it generated the same 3 OBD II diagnostic codes on both vehicles. For me, this wasn't a grand issue, because with my OBD II monitoring system, it was easy enough to erase them. But for anyone without such a system, now their vehicle will be running around with those air codes logged and could cause unneeded labor charges by some car mechanic looking into why they are there. Or it could confuse a mechanic who is chasing some other problem. Perhaps there's a third option that I'm not thinking of which will allow one to work safely without generating OBD II diagnostic codes.

But all's well that ends well. Thank you again.

 

[Digbicks1234]

OK, that’s why. Like the workshop manual and others have said, you take the ATF level while the engine is idling. Or your measurement will be high as the ATF is not circling in the transmission which let plenty of ATF drain back to the ATF pan. If you plan to do drain-and-fill multiple times, I’d keep the current ATF level intact, and adjust the ATF level properly in next drain-and-fill.

Alright, so I went back out and warmed the car until close to operating temperature and I took the reading (4) times to be certain. So it looks like I was right the first time when I added back in 3.7 - 3.8 quarts. I ended up taking out about 200-300 ml (0.21 - 0.31 qts) using a syringe and a long tube last night which was a mistake on my part.

This was adding back about 8 oz (0.24 qts) back in from a new bottle today.

So I ran into two issues when testing these two things out:

1. The transmission (temp 1) on my TorquePro wasn't moving for some reason and when I tried to delete it and add it back, I couldn't find the sensor on the list. I did try to restart the app 2-3 times but it still wouldn't show up. After putting everything back together in the engine bay and walking away from the vehicle, I restarted the app again and it showed up on the list.
2. I tried to start the car and leave the engine air sensor plugged in only, but the car shut off by itself instantly along with a CEL. However, when I plugged the engine airtake cover back into the hose and started the car back, it worked fine without shutting off. Just a FYI if it happens to anyone.

 

[yrwei52]

I'm from the east coast so we get a lot of snow and salt in the roads during the winter and this possibly could contribute to the amount of rust on the pan itself. I also see rust in other areas of the car and it concerns me as well. I might post another thread about the rust in the future after I get some more photos.

Yeah rust issue on underbody and interior has been one of the complaints on CX-5, especially in snow belt area.

So, what is that soft, cardboard like material on the under body?

I purchased this a few years back so I can't remember the exact model but this should be it:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/ (commissions earned)

I used the (2) transmission temperature settings that was offered in Torque Pro and as you can see, there was no value being listed for the 2nd temperature. I'll make a custom page with the coolant temperature in the same page as well to see if they're the same.

View attachment 227132View attachment 227133
Note: Ignore the Roll/Pitch meter, I took a screenshot of the app while inside my house so it's not related.

This looks fine to me.

Question: Would it be okay to run the car without the engine filter housing assembly and everything included/connected? I was reading about it somewhere in the forums and forgot but I would assume it wouldn't do any damage unless it was left like that for a long period of time?

I saw someone said he simply swayed whole air box to the side with everything connected to access the ATF dipstick. Not sure if it’s actually doable though.

 

[Digbicks1234]

Yeah rust issue on underbody and interior has been one of the complaints on CX-5, especially in snow belt area.

So, what is that soft, cardboard like material on the under body?

This looks fine to me.


I saw someone said he simply swayed whole air box to the side with everything connected to access the ATF dipstick. Not sure if it’s actually doable though.

I recall my car looks something like that with the rust in the post that you linked. This makes me a little hesitant to purchase a Mazda again due to the rust issue as I'm not sure it will surpass 100k miles of usage before something catastrophic happens.

You could probably only sway the top portion of the housing lid but most likely not the whole entire engine filter assembly in the photo I linked. It would be much easier to just take it out to be honest, it's only held on by (2) 10 mm bolts and it's clipped into (3) little rubber grommets that requires you to pull the whole thing upwards to release.

Do you by any chance know the bolt size/part # of the below (e.g. M10 x 0.8 mm - 25 mm)? I'm planning to get some replacement bolts because the rust definitely will snap them in the future and I don't want to deal with drilling it out lol

1. (2) bolts holding the engine filter housing assembly
2. (1) Dipstick bolt

If not, I'll probably just drive my car to Home Depot and take the bolts out and measure them or something.

Never mind, so after digging around a bit, I found the part # for the Engine Air Intake Hose bolt:
9YA0-2A-608C

Part # for the dipstick bolt:
9945-40-616

 

[Digbicks1234]

Update 9/20 (2/3):
I did drain and fill again today after driving 27 miles and it went pretty smoothly. It was starting to get tedious when I was measuring the amount to pour back in>starting the car>taking the funnel out and reinserting the dipstick. Forgot to mention that I did cycle through the gears for about 3-4 seconds to lubricate everything. The OBD II/Torque Pro wasn't too much of a help because I wasn't able to utilize the ATF sensor anymore, not sure why. I'm planning to order another OBD II tool and see what happens.

I started off with 14 quarts and I used about 8.10 - 8.20 qts. Currently, I have about 5.8 - 5.9 qts remaining and I'm not sure if that's enough for the pan drop/filter drop + drain and fill.

I still noticed that the fluid was still very dark/black.