2016.5 CX-5 Transmission fluid change questions

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
Update 9/20 (2/3):
I did drain and fill again today after driving 27 miles and it went pretty smoothly. It was starting to get tedious when I was measuring the amount to pour back in>starting the car>taking the funnel out and reinserting the dipstick. Forgot to mention that I did cycle through the gears for about 3-4 seconds to lubricate everything. The OBD II/Torque Pro wasn't too much of a help because I wasn't able to utilize the ATF sensor anymore, not sure why. I'm planning to order another OBD II tool and see what happens.

I started off with 14 quarts and I used about 8.10 - 8.20 qts. Currently, I have about 5.8 - 5.9 qts remaining and I'm not sure if that's enough for the pan drop/filter drop + drain and fill.

I still noticed that the fluid was still very dark/black.

View attachment 227148
Based on Mazda’s specs total capacity on Mazda FW6A-EL and FW6AX-EL transaxle is 7.8L / 8.2 quarts and it needs 3.5 ~ 4.9L / 3.70 ~ 5.18 quarts of ATF to re-fill with ATF filter cartridge replacement. There’s a post here says he used 6+ quarts to do the same. Since we usually drain ~3.75 quarts without pan removal, I highly doubt you’d need 6 quarts to re-fill when you drop the pan with filter replacement.

So based on your experience which is the best way to handle the air box for easy access and let the engine running without CELs when you take the ATF level measurement? Yes, I’d do the same and cycle through gears before I check the ATF level with dipstick.
 
Last edited:
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
Based on Mazda’s specs total capacity on Mazda FW6A-EL and FE6AX-EL transaxle is 7.8L / 8.2 quarts and it needs 3.5 ~ 4.9L / 3.70 ~ 5.18 quarts of ATF to re-fill with ATF filter cartridge replacement. There’s a post here says he used 6+ quarts to do the same. Since we usually drain ~3.75 quarts without pan removal, I highly doubt you’d need 6 quarts to re-fill when you drop the pan with filter replacement.

So based on your experience which is the best way to handle the air box for easy access and let the engine running without CELs when you take the ATF level measurement? Yes, I’d do the same and cycle through gears before I check the ATF level with dipstick.

I really hope I don't need to make another trip to the dealership to get an extra quart since I got these for a very low price but that is good to know.

In my opinion, the best way to handle the airbox would be to only keep the top portion of the housing attached to the hose and inserted inside with the sensor connected. That way, you can still gain access to the dipstick and have enough room. I'll take pictures tomorrow of how I did it but here's a diagram if it helps. Anything in "X" means that you can remove it and the green portion is what you want to keep. The two red arrows means that those two items are connected together and can be taken out as one piece.

Another thing to note is that, if you're planning to adjust the fluid while the car is on, an extra long funnel may not work because the upper airbox housing would be in the way so I would recommend getting a medium sized funnel instead. This is the funnel that I used from Harbor Freight 18 In. Long Neck Black Funnel.

In my case, I did it the tedious way by adjusting it 4 oz - 8 oz (0.12 - 0.24 qts) at a time with the housing removed>putting the dipstick back inside> warming the car up and taking 3-4 measurements at different temperature intervals (122f - 134f) for the coolant because my ATF sensor doesn't work on Torque Pro.

1600702228545.png


For the CEL that I saw yesterday, this is what popped up on the scan. It didn't come back after clearing it:

1600702544178.png
 
Last edited:
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
Based on Mazda’s specs total capacity on Mazda FW6A-EL and FE6AX-EL transaxle is 7.8L / 8.2 quarts and it needs 3.5 ~ 4.9L / 3.70 ~ 5.18 quarts of ATF to re-fill with ATF filter cartridge replacement. There’s a post here says he used 6+ quarts to do the same. Since we usually drain ~3.75 quarts without pan removal, I highly doubt you’d need 6 quarts to re-fill when you drop the pan with filter replacement.

So based on your experience which is the best way to handle the air box for easy access and let the engine running without CELs when you take the ATF level measurement? Yes, I’d do the same and cycle through gears before I check the ATF level with dipstick.

I'm thinking of doing the pan drop/drain and fill maybe Wednesday/Thursday but I still have some thoughts and it's related to degreasing the transmission pan/mating surface. So after cleaning off the old RTV that Mazda put, I was wondering if it makes sense to use rubbing alcohol (70%) or something like krud kutter to get rid of the any traces of residue/oil or should I simply just clean it up with a scotch brite non-scratch sponge and then proceed to apply the RTV.

Also, I changed my mind about the RTV and purchased Permatex® the Right Stuff® 1 Minute Gasket™ GREY Gasket Maker instead because I don't really want to wait 24 hours for the full cure before using my vehicle again and this cuts it down to about 2 hours.

Technical Data Sheet (TDS)


This might be a little extra but would it even be beneficial to add some more magnets below/inside the pan to have more surface area when capturing metal shavings? I was thinking of ceramic magnets due to the high temperature resistance after watching the guy in Japan do the transmission pan drop.

1600710473732.png


Ceramic Magnets

1. Great for all Home, Office, Craft, Science Projects and Product Manufacturing applications. Magnets are perfect for glass gems, mirrors, for making refrigerator magnets, and more others.

2. Great Design. Our magnets have beveled edges that protect your surfaces, make separating the magnets a snap, and discourage damage to the magnets.

3. Resistance to Thermal Stress. Magnets can be used at fairly high temperatures, although their magnetic properties drop with temperature. At 175° C (350° F), approximately 75% of their room temperature magnetic properties are retained.

4. Resistance to Corrosion & Oxidation. Magnets are made by the pressing and sintering of a powdered mixture of strontium and iron oxide.

5. Can be Glued on to any Surface. These are receptive to most adhesives including hot glue, E6000, Goop, Bond 527, Liquid Nails, 2 part epoxies and more.

6. Don't Scratch Surfaces – Edges are slightly beveled.
 
Last edited:

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
I really hope I don't need to make another trip to the dealership to get an extra quart since I got these for a very low price but that is good to know.

In my opinion, the best way to handle the airbox would be to only keep the top portion of the housing attached to the hose and inserted inside with the sensor connected. That way, you can still gain access to the dipstick and have enough room. I'll take pictures tomorrow of how I did it but here's a diagram if it helps. Anything in "X" means that you can remove it and the green portion is what you want to keep. The two red arrows means that those two items are connected together and can be taken out as one piece.

Another thing to note is that, if you're planning to adjust the fluid while the car is on, an extra long funnel may not work because the upper airbox housing would be in the way so I would recommend getting a medium sized funnel instead. This is the funnel that I used from Harbor Freight 18 In. Long Neck Black Funnel.

In my case, I did it the tedious way by adjusting it 4 oz - 8 oz (0.12 - 0.24 qts) at a time with the housing removed>putting the dipstick back inside> warming the car up and taking 3-4 measurements at different temperature intervals (122f - 134f) for the coolant because my ATF sensor doesn't work on Torque Pro.

View attachment 227174

For the CEL that I saw yesterday, this is what popped up on the scan. It didn't come back after clearing it:

View attachment 227175
Thanks for the detailed explanation. I believe your suggestion makes the most sense to me about air box for ATF level measurement. Some had suggested going from the bottom side for ATF level, but I hate that idea as the dirt can be around the dipstick and I want to see the area when I take the measurement.

I thought many have been using the Torque Pro.and seeing true ATF temperature. May be you need a software update, or an additional software add-on piece specifically designed for Mazda?
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
Thanks for the detailed explanation. I believe your suggestion makes the most sense to me about air box for ATF level measurement. Some had suggested going from the bottom side for ATF level, but I hate that idea as the dirt can be around the dipstick and I want to see the area when I take the measurement.

I thought many have been using the Torque Pro.and seeing true ATF temperature. May be you need a software update, or an additional software add-on piece specifically designed for Mazda?

Yeah, I don't want to be under the car doing the measurements as well. I typically put the undercover shield back on before putting the car down so I don't need to jack the car up a second time.

I don't see any updates for my Torque Pro but it may have something to do with my OBD II reader. I ordered another one on Amazon to test if that's the case so hopefully it works out.

OUK-BT Bluetooth OBD2

All the OBD II readers pretty much perform the same function, I don't know why there's $30 - 99 ones out there lol
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
I'm thinking of doing the pan drop/drain and fill maybe Wednesday/Thursday but I still have some thoughts and it's related to degreasing the transmission pan/mating surface. So after cleaning off the old RTV that Mazda put, I was wondering if it makes sense to use rubbing alcohol (70%) or something like krud kutter to get rid of the any traces of residue/oil or should I simply just clean it up with a scotch brite non-scratch sponge and then proceed to apply the RTV.

Also, I changed my mind about the RTV and purchased Permatex® the Right Stuff® 1 Minute Gasket™ GREY Gasket Maker instead because I don't really want to wait 24 hours for the full cure before using my vehicle again and this cuts it down to about 2 hours.

Technical Data Sheet (TDS)



This might be a little extra but would it even be beneficial to add some more magnets below/inside the pan to have more surface area when capturing metal shavings? I was thinking of ceramic magnets due to the high temperature resistance after watching the guy in Japan do the transmission pan drop.

View attachment 227180

Ceramic Magnets
I’d seen some warned about scratches while he was using metal blade to clean the old RTV up. It’s the aluminum so it’s soft. I’d not use any chemical even alcohol as I suspect its effectiveness. Non-scratch Scotch brite sponge should be a good candidate but I’d try it in a small area and see if it’d scratch the surface. May be you can try these “plastic“ blade designed only for such job:

Permatex Plastic Safe Scraper

PITTSBURGH Non-Marring Scraper Set, 4 Pc.

After you have tried many options to clean up the old RTV, please let us know which is the best for the job.

When it’s time for me to change the filter cartridge, I plan to get OEM ATF-safe RTV but may change my mind from your experience.

I personally won’t consider adding the magnets as there's one already inside the pan. If I want to add more magnets I’d do it like the Japanese video attaching them below the pan. My theory is you have changed 88% of ATF with 3 drain-and-fills and replaced the filter cartridge, metal shavings now should be minimum.
 
Last edited:
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
I’d seen some warned about scratches while he was using metal blade to clean the old RTV up. It’s the aluminum so it’s soft. I’d not use any chemical even alcohol as I suspect its effectiveness. Non-scratch Scotch brite sponge should be a good candidate but I’d try it in a small area and see if it’d scratch the surface. May be you can try these “plastic“ blade designed only for such job:

Permatex Plastic Safe Scraper

PITTSBURGH Non-Marring Scraper Set, 4 Pc.

After you have tried many options to clean up the old RTV, please let us know which is the best for the job.

When it’s time for me to change the filter cartridge, I plan to get OEM ATF-safe RTV but may change my mind from your experience.

I personally won’t consider adding the magnets as there's one already inside the pan. If I want to add more magnets I’d do it like the Japanese video attaching them below the pan. My theory is you have changed 88% of ATF with 3 drain-and-fills and replaced the filter cartridge, metal shavings now should be minimum.

Okay, I'll skimp on the industrial cleaners then. I figured that it would help the RTV adhere better if I used it. I'll most likely use one side of the pan for scotch brite and one side for the non-marring scrapers which I currently have on hand right now (purchased them last week) and update the thread.

Also, for the RTV, I think Mazda actually uses the Three Bond High Viscosity Fast-Set Liquid Gasket Maker TB1217H. I think the reason why the dealer told me about the OEM ATF-Safe RTV was because it may be easier to acquire but the color matches what the guy in the Japanese video had. The only issue with the OEM Mazda RTV that I can think of is that when I looked at the pictures of the packaging, there doesn't really seem to be any indication of the cure time and such but I would assume it would be 24 hours.

I honestly wouldn't know much about the metal shavings at the moment unless I drop down the pan and inspect the magnet itself. In addition, I sent out the transmission fluid for an analysis so hopefully I hear something back in <2-3 weeks.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
Okay, I'll skimp on the industrial cleaners then. I figured that it would help the RTV adhere better if I used it. I'll most likely use one side of the pan for scotch brite and one side for the non-marring scrapers which I currently have on hand right now (purchased them last week) and update the thread.

Also, for the RTV, I think Mazda actually uses the Three Bond High Viscosity Fast-Set Liquid Gasket Maker TB1217H. I think the reason why the dealer told me about the OEM ATF-Safe RTV was because it may be easier to acquire but the color matches what the guy in the Japanese video had. The only issue with the OEM Mazda RTV that I can think of is that when I looked at the pictures of the packaging, there doesn't really seem to be any indication of the cure time and such but I would assume it would be 24 hours.

I honestly wouldn't know much about the metal shavings at the moment unless I drop down the pan and inspect the magnet itself. In addition, I sent out the transmission fluid for an analysis so hopefully I hear something back in <2-3 weeks.
The ATF pan is made of metal, so it should be easy to clean the old RTV if any. My hunch is most of old RTV should be stuck on the aluminum casing of the transmission. May be you can take a couple of pictures right after the pan is removed and see how the old RTV looks like on both side?

One guy had said he let the RTV cure overnight.

There’s a thread you can post your used ATF analysis too. Most likely your factory ATF would be thin on viscosity.

Skyactiv Transmission Fluid Analysis Thread

Finally, I want to say many would appreciate your time and effort putting out so much information on changing ATF for your CX-5. It definitely helps us greatly to do the same job in the future. My 2016 CX-5 has only 45.2 K miles and I plan to do only ATF drain-and-fill between 50K and 60K miles without filter cartridge change. (Laziness?!)
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
The ATF pan is made of metal, so it should be easy to clean the old RTV if any. My hunch is most of old RTV should be stuck on the aluminum casing of the transmission. May be you can take a couple of pictures right after the pan is removed and see how the old RTV looks like on both side?

One guy had said he let the RTV cure overnight.

There’s a thread you can post your used ATF analysis too. Most likely your factory ATF would be thin on viscosity.

Skyactiv Transmission Fluid Analysis Thread

Finally, I want to say many would appreciate your time and effort putting out so much information on changing ATF for your CX-5. It definitely helps us greatly to do the same job in the future. My 2016 CX-5 has only 45.2 K miles and I plan to do only ATF drain-and-fill between 50K and 60K miles without filter cartridge change. (Laziness?!)

I'll take a lot of photos since I need them for future reference anyways. The only reason why they would let the RTV cure overnight is because they bought an RTV that requires a 24 hour cure, which is like 90% of the items that I've seen with the exception of the Permatex "Right Stuff" that can be put together immediately and then refilled after 2 hours since it's meant for dealership/mechanic usage. It's a little more pricey but well worth it.

I don't even know what the viscosity is on the ATF FZ fluid but I'll post it on that thread as well as BITOG to get an analysis. I'm using the Wix oil analysis kit and not Blackstone anymore since it's very expensive ($30 + $10 for TAN/TBN).

Not a problem, I actually enjoy posting as much information as possible. I've encountered a lot of threads on the transmission change and other services and most of them don't have much pictures or they don't show enough to get an idea for noobs like myself haha. Hopefully the pictures don't get randomly deleted in a few years...
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
I poked around and looked at alternatives to Mazdas genuine ATF-FZ and I found the below that may be suitable replacements but then again, who knows:
  1. ENEOS ECO ATF PLUS (Fully Synthetic)
  2. LIQUI MOLY 20032 Top Tec ATF 1800 (Fully Synthetic)
  3. Valvoline MaxLife ATF Automatic Transmission Fluid
  4. RAVENOL ATF FZ (Synthetic): Doesn't seem like it's easily attainable.
  5. AISIN ATF MFZ

I'm actually quite tempted to know whether or not the AISIN ATF MFZ would be a suitable replacement. Based on what I've read on other forums, the dye is a red color. I guess the only way to find out would be to send the Mazda ATF FZ and the AISIN ATF MFZ samples in for an analysis to see the composition of the fluid...

AISIN ATF-MFZ Information:
https://aisinaftermarket.com/uploads/5h0jznj9_ATF-MFZ_Product_Annoucement_copy.pdf
https://aftermarketintel.com/aisin-two-new-automatic-transmission-fluids-for-mazda-and-subaru/
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru...tf-mfz-for-mazda-type-fz-applications.326528/
 
Last edited:
:
'15 6, '06 5
Unless you're going to send them to SWRI (or similar) for dynamic friction testing, you won't get info (as from a $20 analysis) to be helpful in answering that question.

All you'll be able to see is whether there's a _major_ formulating strategy difference with respect to metallic multi-function additives. Since Mazda's ATF uses roughly the same approach as most everyone (except Honda) in that regard, I wouldn't expect the money to be well spent. If it's fun for you, though, go for it.
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
Unless you're going to send them to SWRI (or similar) for dynamic friction testing, you won't get info (as from a $20 analysis) to be helpful in answering that question.

All you'll be able to see is whether there's a _major_ formulating strategy difference with respect to metallic multi-function additives. Since Mazda's ATF uses roughly the same approach as most everyone (except Honda) in that regard, I wouldn't expect the money to be well spent. If it's fun for you, though, go for it.

Probably won't be money well spent. Was just trying to figure out cheaper alternatives than the genuine ATF FZ fluid that's a bit harder to attain unless it's acquired through the dealership without compromising the integrity of the transmission.
 
:
2016 Mazda, CX-5 GT
Based on Mazda’s specs total capacity on Mazda FW6A-EL and FW6AX-EL transaxle is 7.8L / 8.2 quarts and it needs 3.5 ~ 4.9L / 3.70 ~ 5.18 quarts of ATF to re-fill with ATF filter cartridge replacement. There’s a post here says he used 6+ quarts to do the same. Since we usually drain ~3.75 quarts without pan removal, I highly doubt you’d need 6 quarts to re-fill when you drop the pan with filter replacement.

So based on your experience which is the best way to handle the air box for easy access and let the engine running without CELs when you take the ATF level measurement? Yes, I’d do the same and cycle through gears before I check the ATF level with dipstick.
When I did the drain and fill at 50 and 75K miles I replaced 3.5 quarts of fluid. At 105K I dropped the pan and replaced the filter too. On that service I did replace almost 6 quarts of fluid.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
When I did the drain and fill at 50 and 75K miles I replaced 3.5 quarts of fluid. At 105K I dropped the pan and replaced the filter too. On that service I did replace almost 6 quarts of fluid.
Yes, I saw your post about needing 6 quarts of ATF when you drop the pan, and that’s why I mentioned it. But Mazda says it needs 3.70 ~ 5.18 quarts with filter cartridge replacement, and the guy in the video at post #2 refilled with 4.2L / 4,200 cc / 4.44 US quarts Mazda Genuine ATF FZ during the first drain-and-fill with pan removal and filter replacement. So we’re anxious to see how much ATF OP needs when he is doing the pan drop and filter cartridge change.
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
Update 9/26: I got all the fluid drained and the bolts removed but the pan won't come loose. I tried to use a safety razor on the edge of the pan as well as plastic prying tools with a hammer but it won't budge. Can't even pull it off with my hands on a corner.

Not sure what to do next...I think I might just give up dropping the pan and filling it back up
 
Last edited:
:
2013 Mazda CX-5 Sport FWD Auto
Update 9/26: I got all the fluid drained and the bolts removed but the pan won't come loose. I tried to use a safety razor on the edge of the pan as well as plastic prying tools with a hammer but it won't budge. Can't even pull it off with my hands on a corner.

Not sure what to do next...I think I might just give up dropping the pan and filling it back up

try a 2x4 against the pan, and whack it with a mallet.
 

yrwei52

2016 Mazda CX-5 GT AWD w/Tech Pkg
Contributor
:
Plano, Texas, USA
Is there enough space to put the 2X4 as the buffer on the side of the pan, and whack it with a mallet sideway to make the pan loose?
 
:
16.5 CX-5 Tour/AWD
I'll give that a try with a 1 lb hammer and a 3-4 lb hammer as well
Is there enough space to put the 2X4 as the buffer on the side of the pan, and whack it with a mallet sideway to make the pan loose?

There's really not that much room at all or clearance given the fact that the area around the transmission pan is where you put on the underbody cover. I'll think of something though but I'm sure I'll just use a very small piece of wood
 
Top