Sport vs. Touring vs. Touring w/ Navigation Required

It appears that recently the MazdaUSA "Build It" system on their web site was changed so that selecting the Touring model automatically selects the $2000 Navigation System option.

You can confirm this for yourself. Note how on the "Select a Trim" page, in the center of the page it shows the MSRP for 5-Spd Manual Sport as $17,995 while selecting 5-Spd Manual Touring shows MSRP of $21,510. With Touring still selected, look over to the left column where the price is broken down and you'll notice the "Base MSRP" (i.e. without destination charge) as $18,950 with "Options" marked as $2,000.

If one clicks either of the "View Full Features & Specs" links, a new window will load. Click on "Options" on that page to get this subpage and you'll see "Navigation system" listed as an option (not standard) available only for Touring for $2,000.

Ok. Somehow it's selected by default, but because it's an option we can turn it off later, right? Right?

Well, actually, no. Continue to build your configuration of a Mazda5 and you'll get to the "Select Packages & Options" section, where Navigation System is indeed checked, but unchecking it does not work. It will simply recheck itself a second after you uncheck it.

Is the Navigation System now required part of the Touring package? I hope not.

Previously, I had thought the Touring package was a decent value for the options I wanted. With no other options selected, a Touring would cost $1515 more than a Sport. Here's a list of differences showing availability for Sport, then availability for Touring:

• Moonroof - Sport Option ($700) / Touring Included
• Fog Lights - Sport Option ($250) / Touring Included
• Rear Liftgate Spoiler - Sport Popular Equipment Package ($490) / Touring Included
  
• Side Sill Extensions - Sport Popular Equipment Package / Touring Included
• In-dash 6 CD Changer - Sport Popular Equipment Package / Touring Included
• Outside Mirrors Color - Sport Black / Touring Body Color
• AM/FM/CD Stereo - Sport 4 Speakers / Touring 6 Speakers
• Leather Wrapped Steering Wheel - Sport Not Available / Touring Included
• Automatic Climate Control - Sport Not Available / Touring Included
• Outside Temperature in Center Display - Sport Not Available / Touring Included
• Second Row Foldout Table / Cargo Bin - Sport Not Available / Touring Included

(If I missed something else, let me know!)

For that extra money you got the Moonroof, which is a $700 option for the Sport, and Fog Lights, which cost $250. You also got the Rear Liftgate Spoiler, Side Sill Extensions, and In-dash 6 CD Changer which you can get combined in a "Popular Equipment Package" for $490 on the Sport. All those options combine for $1440, and personally, I thought all those were nice options to have, with the exception of the CD Changer. (Mazda, I have an iPod, would it kill you to give an Auxiliary input instead of or in addition to the silly CD changer?)

Remember $1515 separates Touring and Sport, and we've now accounted for $1440 of that. For an additional $75 dollars you get all the other listed included options that don't really have an equivalent on the Sport. Ok, I can live with a difference in outside mirror color. Going from 4 speakers to 6 speakers is nice, and so is the leather wrapped steering wheel, but both are luxuries I could also live without.

I didn't play much with Automatic Climate Control, but it added a lot of value I think to that $75 difference. The Outside Temperature Display, which I assume sort of comes with the climate control, is a little more gravy.

However, the thing my kids really, really liked was the "Second Row Foldout Table / Cargo Bin" which isn't even an option on the Sport. If it was, I'd be tempted to get a Sport and be a little more picky on some of the options.

Overall though, I originally thought Mazda did a good job with the Touring package. But now if they are adding an additional 2K for a feature I don't want and would probably never use they're making me reevalute my choices. I thought Touring was worth a rough $1500, but not worth $3500 to me. It's more than all the other options combined! That's quite significant on a car that I was previously pricing right around 20K.

Sorry about the long rant, but I wanted to get this information out there, both the general differences between Sport and Touring and the possibility that the Navigation System might now be required for Touring, which in my opinion would be a stupid thing for Mazda to do. I hope this is either a glitch in the system (which I don't think is likely) or a temporary situation that will get better at a later date.

Maybe it will only be required for the 1st batch?

Or you guys could go up to Canada and pick up one there (Navi is not available).

Navigation system

$2000US for the Nav system (wow) . You can get a very good system from Garmin (the StreetPilot 2610 for example) for about $1000CDN. This is crazy.

I have a 2610 in my P5 and it is a must when travelling.

I just tried the Build & Price. While the NAV was automatically pre-selected for the Touring trim (which is a bug), I could uncheck it and continue to the end. Knowing the build combinations of the US-spec Mazda5, I can confirm that yes you can get a Mazda5 Touring that does not have NAV (i.e. NAV is not mandatory for Touring, NAV is simply an option you can have on the Touring trim).

wongpres said:

I just tried the Build & Price. While the NAV was automatically pre-selected for the Touring trim (which is a bug), I could uncheck it and continue to the end. Knowing the build combinations of the US-spec Mazda5, I can confirm that yes you can get a Mazda5 Touring that does not have NAV (i.e. NAV is not mandatory for Touring, NAV is simply an option you can have on the Touring trim).

Click to expand...

Well, I can still reproduce the problem. Perhaps it's a browser problem? I'm using Safari on Mac OS X Tiger. In any event, I clearly recall when the build system first rolled out and I played with it the auto-selecting of navigation wasn't an issue at all. Once I wrote down some figures I left the build pages alone for awhile until someone at Edmunds forum brought up the problem, so unless my memory is faded it certainly seems that behavior has changed. However, I can also accept this as just a bug in the behavior of the build system.

In any event, I'm using the Search Inventory system more, checking it every few days to see if any Tourings are local to me w/o navigation. At the moment there are now supposedly 56 Mazda5s within 150 miles of me, 12 of which are Touring Automatics, and 4 of those 12 are without navigation which is good news. Those 4 are all Platinum Silver. But hey, that proves there are some Tourings w/o nav.

Unfortunately, there are zero Touring Manuals out there. I suspect if I want a Phantom Blue Touring Manual I'd have to ask a dealer to order it special for me? I'm currently hoping that I might get lucky and that combination would appear near me soon.

I test drove the Mazda5 yesterday.

The very first thing that I want to say is that the folding tray is non-existent. It was the first thing that I checked when I opened the side door. So I thought I was looking at the lowest model, I checked the front and saw immediately that it had a Navigation system. I looked up, and it had a sunroof. I went outside, and it had side sills. The rear said nothing about which model it was. So I asked the saleman what model it was, and he told me "Touring." (flame)

Okay, so I was already in flame when I heard that news. I was thinking that either the saleman didn't know what model it was, or that it was just the first batch of Mazda5 that didn't have it. Either way, I'm not buying one this year.

I personally tested the interior size capacity myself, though my wife and 1 year old daughter were there. I'm 1 meter 72 centimeters high, or 5 feet 7. I adjusted the driver seat to my height, adjusted the front passenger seat too, went to the second row to do the same with comfortable spacing for the legs, and finally went to the last row to feel the spaciousness. I have to admit that the Mazda5 have plenty of space for 6 adults of my size. Seats are firm, but I'm not certain that they are supportive for longer trip. However, I think that the seats are firm enough for 1-2 hour trip. Enough to go from Chicago to the Woodfield mall in traffic.

Walking though the second and third row is possible. It's a little bit tighter than let's say Nissan Quest, but the roof is high enough even for someone like me to walk through. The floor is flat (somewhat), so that facilitates the transistion. When walking through back and forth, it is, of course, best to raise those elbow supports in the 2nd row seats.

Okay, cargo size with all the seats in position is not much. I didn't check the size with a ruler, but I can only tell you that the length is good enough for a regular shopping bag such as Dominick or Jewel, not shoe size bag. (wow)
So if it happens that you go shopping in a real mall with all 6 passengers, watchout. You'll need this (help) . The only thing that I can think is a roof storage, but the roof rack is not optional at all. (eyeballs)

Afterall these checkups, I went for a drive. (drive) The car handles awesomely. I got an automatic transmission Mazda3 SP23 hatchback, and the Mazda5 is even more easy to manoeuver than my car. Here are the reasons that I can think of. One, the steering wheel is more assisted, therefore it's lighter. Two, the Mazda5 is more peppy in town (i.e. low speed) because gearing ratios have to be different. Three, the drive is more commanding because the car is heavier, and taller, hence there's a better view of the road with a bigger windshield. Four, the Mazda5 stops easier because I believe that it has bigger disc brakes.

Too bad that the car doesn't have HID, DVD system, and roof rack, let alone the folding tray. (rant)

BTW, the sticker price is $24k. (uhm) Well, a 7 seat Toyota Sienna with 6 cylinder costs $24k starting price. DVD system is optional. Duh.

My purchasing date has been pushed. Next candidate please...

psychoart said:

I test drove the Mazda5 yesterday.

The very first thing that I want to say is that the folding tray is non-existent. It was the first thing that I checked when I opened the side door.

Click to expand...

You were looking under the right hand second row seat, yes? The seat behind the driver is empty.

BTW, the sticker price is $24k.

Click to expand...

That definitely sounds like the Touring w/nav and dealer markup price, at least. If you want to quickly know whether you're in a Touring vs. a Sport, check out the climate controls. If you see three "turn-dials" with three buttons below, you're in a Sport. If you see something that looks like "push button with dials" with four buttons below the dials (the fourth one on the far right will have "AMB" which is used to display the temperature), then you're in the Touring.

I was going to say the same thing, did you pull up the seats to unfold the tray?

From my information from Mazda, there WILL be a Roof Rack and a DVD option offered at some point during this model year.

Kaian,

I was using Mozilla Firefox when I did the Build & Price. But the key is that it is possible to get a Touring without NAV (as you noticed in your dealer search). It's not a surprise the Build & Price may have a bug or two - has happened with other vehicles on that website when they were first released.

As for getting the color & option combo you want, a dealer can always order one in your exact color and option combo assuming that combination can be built (e.g. they can't order a Sport with NAV as that isn't a valid option combo). The vehicle has just been released, so dealer inventories are small, and even those shown on the MazdaUSA inventory are incoming and not necessarily at the dealer lot as of the moment.

psychoart,

The Mazda5 brake size is identical to the Mazda3s trim (300mm front, 280mm rear). As for the tray - ditto what perfecto and kaian said.

wongpres said:

Kaian,
As for getting the color & option combo you want, a dealer can always order one in your exact color and option combo assuming that combination can be built (e.g. they can't order a Sport with NAV as that isn't a valid option combo). The vehicle has just been released, so dealer inventories are small, and even those shown on the MazdaUSA inventory are incoming and not necessarily at the dealer lot as of the moment.

Click to expand...

I knew ordering a specific combination from a dealer was generally an option, but I had a few concerns. My first concern was that a dealer would have similar problems trying to do a config of Touring Manual w/o nav, but I don't think that'll be a problem. My next concern is that ordering in this way might be difficult for me to get a decent price, seeing how they were asking for more than MSRP on what they've received already. Finally, I was concerned that ordering in this way might take forever to get in, where another dealer might have the config I want sooner.

I know I want Phantom Blue. I know I want a moonroof. I'd rather have a manual transmission, but I might live with an automatic. I'd rather have a Touring, but a Sport might be acceptable. If I could get the folding tray installed later on as an option that would be pretty sweet.

If I really had to have something today, I could get a fully loaded Phantom Blue/Touring/Auto/Nav. They were asking 23K, but if I were to get that I wouldn't pay more than 21K. Someone at Edmunds just got that config for "$21322 + TTL" so 21K might be possible someday. But I really want the price to be under $20K (not including TTL).

If I do order it it'll be Touring w/Manual for MSRP of $19,510.

A third option is that another dealer about 40 miles away has a Phantom Blue/Sport/Moonroof/Manual/Fog Lights/Wheel Locks config in the system for MSRP $18,985 which hasn't arrived yet but should be around in a week or so.

So we have expensive with everything now, cheap with most basic options in a week or so fates willing, or the middle ground and I get exactly what I want .... but when, who knows?

To better understand the tradeoffs involved, I made a small list of combinations by Price MSRP / Invoice sorted by price (assuming my math is correct.):

• $18,695 / $17,466 Sport + Moonroof + Manual
• $18,945 / $17,666 Sport + Moonroof + Manual + Fog Lights
• $19,435 / $18,087 Sport + Moonroof + Manual + Fog Lights + Popular Equipment Package
• $19,510 / $18,277 Touring + Manual
  
• $19,595 / $18,276 Sport + Moonroof + Auto
• $19,845 / $18,476 Sport + Moonroof + Auto + Fog Lights
• $20,335 / $18,897 Sport + Moonroof + Auto + Fog Lights + Popular Equipment Package
• $20,410 / $19,087 Touring + Auto

And even though I don't want nav, here's the prices for those, just for comparison:

• $21,510 / $19,997 Touring + Manual + Navigation System
• $22,410 / $20,807 Touring + Auto + Navigation System

For me, Touring Manual seems to be the best bang for buck for my budget. (drive)

wongpres said:

Kaian,

I was using Mozilla Firefox when I did the Build & Price. But the key is that it is possible to get a Touring without NAV (as you noticed in your dealer search). It's not a surprise the Build & Price may have a bug or two - has happened with other vehicles on that website when they were first released.

As for getting the color & option combo you want, a dealer can always order one in your exact color and option combo assuming that combination can be built (e.g. they can't order a Sport with NAV as that isn't a valid option combo). The vehicle has just been released, so dealer inventories are small, and even those shown on the MazdaUSA inventory are incoming and not necessarily at the dealer lot as of the moment.

psychoart,

The Mazda5 brake size is identical to the Mazda3s trim (300mm front, 280mm rear). As for the tray - ditto what perfecto and kaian said.

Click to expand...

The model that I test drove has auto-climate AC. Guess which model it is then.

Yes, I'm no dummy. The tray would be FOR the second row seats of course. Once again, no folding tray on either behind the driver or front passenger seat, period. Even the dealer confirmed to me that "it ain't no folding tray."

I don't know about the size of the disc brakes, but I'm certain that the Mazda5 brakes faster than my SP23. If it's not the disc brakes, then it must be the level of sensitivity of the brake pedal. (poke)

psychoart,

I now see you're referring to the airplane-style folding tray behind the front seats rather than the foldout table/tray that folds out of the seat cushion.

Yes, you and your dealer is correct in that there is no airplane-style folding tray on N. American-spec Mazda5. N. American-spec only has the foldout table/tray that folds out of the seat cushion (and not all trim levels have it).

The Mazda5 brake/rotor size is identical to your SP23. The difference you feel could be different tuning, the higher center of gravity of the Mazda5, or other factors.

my phantom blue mazda5 gets here in 2 weeks! woot!

Nice thread guys...packed with great info! Keep it up!