Why does my 2015 CX5 constantly want to up-shift when in automatic mode?

Q

Quentus

Member
:
Mazda, CX-5 2015 Touring
My first guess was fuel economy. The lower rpms while driving on level roads reduces overall fuel burn. And while this all makes sense, I am finding myself so annoyed when I am in 4th gear and need immediate power (like to pass a car or speed up) and have to push the gas pedal aggressively to get the transmission to drop back to 3rd and kick the rpm up. What I think is most annoying is that there is simply no punch when running a little over 1000 rpm, which is where the CX5 tries to maintain the rpm. As the gas is applied, the motor immediately runs rough with little to no power (as would be expected at such a low rpm). This makes the wait until the transmission drops down a gear even longer.

Now, before I go on, there is a small disclaimer that I should note. My CX5 (which is the Touring model) is the first automatic transmission car I have ever owned. I was raised and have always had a stick. However, I do not experience this same behavior in my other car, which is a 2003 Honda Accord. With a weak 160 horse-power, my Accord always has low-end power and is quick to up-shift when needed. Unlike the CX5, the low-end rpm is higher than the CX5, like at or above 2000 rpm, whereas my CX5 will up-shift until it is just above a 1000. I have become so annoyed by this that I often will switch to manual (such when the road starts to go up-hill) so that it will stay around 2000 rpm and have the needed power.

My wife thinks that I am crazy. She simply says that you have to press the gas pedal harder. That how automatics are. She has also driven an automatic all her life, so maybe this is all simply a matter of learning to be comfortable with pushing the gas pedal down harder to get to the desired gear and power out-put. I have tried doing this many times, but never have felt comfortable with the experience. For example, by the time the transmission decides that the gas pedal has been pushed far enough and down-shifts, the RPM jump is so aggressive (because the gas pedal is pushed so far) that the engine sounds like you have the pedal to the floor. The whole car jumps forward as it responds to the high rpms. I find this whole experience avoidable by simply running the car in manual and maintaining a higher rpm that gives you power on demand without the car jumping 1000 rpm and the engine noise being heard by everyone in the car.

Is this behavior (need to constantly up-shift to reach a low rpm) typical for the 2015 Touring model? Is it okay to drive the CX5 in manual mode for extended periods? Should I have stayed with a stick?
 
Quentus said:
My first guess was fuel economy. The lower rpms while driving on level roads reduces overall fuel burn. And while this all makes sense, I am finding myself so annoyed when I am in 4th gear and need immediate power (like to pass a car or speed up) and have to push the gas pedal aggressively to get the transmission to drop back to 3rd and kick the rpm up. What I think is most annoying is that there is simply no punch when running a little over 1000 rpm, which is where the CX5 tries to maintain the rpm. As the gas is applied, the motor immediately runs rough with little to no power (as would be expected at such a low rpm). This makes the wait until the transmission drops down a gear even longer.

Now, before I go on, there is a small disclaimer that I should note. My CX5 (which is the Touring model) is the first automatic transmission car I have ever owned. I was raised and have always had a stick. However, I do not experience this same behavior in my other car, which is a 2003 Honda Accord. With a weak 160 horse-power, my Accord always has low-end power and is quick to up-shift when needed. Unlike the CX5, the low-end rpm is higher than the CX5, like at or above 2000 rpm, whereas my CX5 will up-shift until it is just above a 1000. I have become so annoyed by this that I often will switch to manual (such when the road starts to go up-hill) so that it will stay around 2000 rpm and have the needed power.

My wife thinks that I am crazy. She simply says that you have to press the gas pedal harder. That how automatics are. She has also driven an automatic all her life, so maybe this is all simply a matter of learning to be comfortable with pushing the gas pedal down harder to get to the desired gear and power out-put. I have tried doing this many times, but never have felt comfortable with the experience. For example, by the time the transmission decides that the gas pedal has been pushed far enough and down-shifts, the RPM jump is so aggressive (because the gas pedal is pushed so far) that the engine sounds like you have the pedal to the floor. The whole car jumps forward as it responds to the high rpms. I find this whole experience avoidable by simply running the car in manual and maintaining a higher rpm that gives you power on demand without the car jumping 1000 rpm and the engine noise being heard by everyone in the car.

Is this behavior (need to constantly up-shift to reach a low rpm) typical for the 2015 Touring model? Is it okay to drive the CX5 in manual mode for extended periods? Should I have stayed with a stick?
Click to expand...

The car wants to run at as low an RPM as it can. You have to tell it what you want with the gas pedal, that is just how it is. There is a clicker at the end of the gas pedal travel that tells you where the shift point is.

You can drive in manual mode as much as you want, you will not harm anything.

2016 and newer models now have a SPORT MODE switch, which keeps the REVS up, and is what you would probably would like to have and would use often...
 
Last edited:
I was annoyed at first just like you are. This is also my first automatic transmission car and while I have driven many auto tranny cars before (most my dad's Accord and rentals every month or so) I found that the setup for the CX-5 was too fuel economy oriented. What I do is to flip the Sport mode around town and leave it on automatic so I get crisper throttle response when needed. This city has awful traffic jams so there is little I can do to avoid that. During road trips I tend to use the manual mode with sport mode engaged a lot, that way I keep the engine inside its power band.
It is only a matter of getting used to it.
 
Okay, that is what I thought. However, I'm kicking myself right now because had I know this before I bought the car, I would have certainly gone with the newer CX-5's that have the "Sport option". It's funny, as I have no memory of this shifting behavior when I test drove the CX-5. I was probably too distracted by the new car smell. On the positive end, it is good to know that I can use the manual mode as much as I like. While this does help a lot when I want to keep the RPMs higher, I have forgotten several times that I am in manual mode. The CX5 will down-shift automatically when the car is slowing down in manual mode, like for a traffic light giving me the impression that it is in automatic mode. Once the light turn green, I quickly discover that I am still in manual when I accelerate and the car is not shifting itself.

I find it interesting that since much of the decision made by a car to shift either up or down is controlled by a computer, why would it not be possible to simply "re-program" the computer to run at a higher rpm band. Is this not what the "Sport" function does on the newer models. You flick a switch which then simply tells the computer to not shift up so aggressively. It would be a lot easier than buying a newer model that has the function. Maybe there is more to the function than I know.

Did Mazda introduce the "Sport" function in 2016? I don't recall the option for the 2015s, not even the fully loaded GT.
 
Quentus said:
Okay, that is what I thought. However, I'm kicking myself right now because had I know this before I bought the car, I would have certainly gone with the newer CX-5's that have the "Sport option". It's funny, as I have no memory of this shifting behavior when I test drove the CX-5. I was probably too distracted by the new car smell. On the positive end, it is good to know that I can use the manual mode as much as I like. While this does help a lot when I want to keep the RPMs higher, I have forgotten several times that I am in manual mode. The CX5 will down-shift automatically when the car is slowing down in manual mode, like for a traffic light giving me the impression that it is in automatic mode. Once the light turn green, I quickly discover that I am still in manual when I accelerate and the car is not shifting itself.

I find it interesting that since much of the decision made by a car to shift either up or down is controlled by a computer, why would it not be possible to simply "re-program" the computer to run at a higher rpm band. Is this not what the "Sport" function does on the newer models. You flick a switch which then simply tells the computer to not shift up so aggressively. It would be a lot easier than buying a newer model that has the function. Maybe there is more to the function than I know.

Did Mazda introduce the "Sport" function in 2016? I don't recall the option for the 2015s, not even the fully loaded GT.
Click to expand...

The SPORT mode was introduced here on the CX-5 on the 2016 models. It totally changes the shifting behavior, and also changes the ratio of throttle input. If the normal pedal was at a 1:1 ratio before of Pedal travel to throttle travel, then during SPORT mode it changes it to say a ~ 1:1.5 ratio making it very quick to throttle inputs and enhancing the response "feel".

You can add Paddle Shifters to yours. It is a great improvement, and allows you to have your manual mode always at your fingertips for downshifting and upshifting. With the REV-Matching of the transmission, It makes it a real joy.

mazda-cx5-interior-3.jpg
 
Last edited:
I remember another forum member saying that the throttle mapping not only cares about the throttle position itself, but how it got to that throttle position. So just slowly rolling into the throttle will cause the transmission to hold the high gear and let the engine do it's best by "lugging" itself and giving as much low end torque as possible. This is actually one of my favorite things to do, as I normally drive alone and this provides the moderate acceleration that I'm generally looking for without the engine having to rev high. If i were to do this in other cars (my wife's 2010 4cyl accord), it would try to hold the gear, but quickly downshift because the engine doesn't have that much low end torque.

However, after some experimenting, if I really wanted to get the transmission to downshift in the CX5, I would just be more aggressive with the throttle and give it a quick stab (even to the same position as if i were to roll into the throttle). This quick 'stab' was recognized by the transmission and elicited a downshift to get the higher engine rpm needed for a pass.

It's just something you have to get used to, but once you figure out how easily you can control the transmission with Mazda's throttle/transmission control logic, it's actually really responsive. I haven't found much need for manual control. In my previous car (2003 auto P5), I was in manual mode 95% of the time because I didn't like the transmission shift logic, but the CX5's logic is smart enough to sense different types of throttle application.

So if you want to get downshifts, be quick with the throttle application, but if you just want moderate acceleration from the low end torque, be slow and roll into the throttle. It's cool to be able to have this control with just the throttle and not have to mess with manual mode or sport mode for these 1 time passes.
 
Last edited:
Keep in mind that the rate of throttle pedal movement is critical to downshift as much as the distance of pedal travel. If you slowly press on the pedal, not much happens. If you stomp down the pedal, you'll be rewarded with a rapid downshift to whichever gear is needed to get the engine rpm into the sweet spot for acceleration. Varing degrees of rate and travel will give varing responses.

Also, the transmission is adaptive. If you drive agressively on a regular basis, you'll be rewarded with higher rpm and even having the trans hold the lower gear when you lift off the throttle.

When driving in heavy traffic and you want better throttle response and some engine braking, use the manual shifting option.
 
Right, the speed at which the pedal is pressed and not just how far it is pressed matters for down-shifts. In fact, you can briskly press then release to get back to original position even less than half way to make it shift, then you get some time before the system will shift back up. Think of it as a quick down-shift to get ready for some upcoming maneuver.

I also drove an Accord with 5AT which I felt shifted very naturally, smoothly and very quickly. The latency between when the transmission started to shift until it was complete was very quick and it was also very eager to down-shift when slightly increasing pressure on the pedal. However, it too was eager to up-shift as soon as possible and with low pedal pressure was attempting to hold on to gears. I found that transmission very convenient and optimal.

With the CX-5, it would sometime hold on to gears even when it makes no sense. I find that in the ~40MPH range, when going up hill, the transmission will sometime keep RPM at ~1500, where the engine makes sounds of protests and there is almost no power. I believe that programming needs to change for this situation as it seems that the car does not take into account the climb angle.
 
ALafya said:
Right, the speed at which the pedal is pressed and not just how far it is pressed matters for down-shifts. In fact, you can briskly press then release to get back to original position even less than half way to make it shift, then you get some time before the system will shift back up. Think of it as a quick down-shift to get ready for some upcoming maneuver.

I also drove an Accord with 5AT which I felt shifted very naturally, smoothly and very quickly. The latency between when the transmission started to shift until it was complete was very quick and it was also very eager to down-shift when slightly increasing pressure on the pedal. However, it too was eager to up-shift as soon as possible and with low pedal pressure was attempting to hold on to gears. I found that transmission very convenient and optimal.

With the CX-5, it would sometime hold on to gears even when it makes no sense. I find that in the ~40MPH range, when going up hill, the transmission will sometime keep RPM at ~1500, where the engine makes sounds of protests and there is almost no power. I believe that programming needs to change for this situation as it seems that the car does not take into account the climb angle.
Click to expand...

I noticed the same, sometimes uphill the engine/transmission set take too much time or pedal pressure to downshift and take care of the hill properly. In fact you can hear the throaty sound on the inlet manifold coping with the high load/low rpm situation.
 
Yes, and that (sometimes uphill the engine/transmission set take too much time or pedal pressure to downshift and take care of the hill properly) is what really prompted me to post. While the CX5's tendency to always want to up-shift to keep the lower RPM band, the fact that it does not recognize (consistently) when starting a hill that it needs to down-shift is very annoying. Interestingly, (and why I noted that it is not consistent) there are times when it is very quick to detect a hill and down-shift. But these events occur much less frequently than the times when it does not respond. I will try the brisk press of the pedal (and quick return to the original position to avoid the sudden high RPM) as this is something I have not tried. Thank you for everyone's responses.
 
Quentus said:
I will try the brisk press of the pedal (and quick return to the original position to avoid the sudden high RPM) as this is something I have not tried. Thank you for everyone's responses.
Click to expand...

You could but don't have to return to original position because the brisk press does not require a lot of overall pedal travel, you will not reach a point of overshooting the need for more power. Experiment with this until it will become 2nd nature.
I think the theory behind this is that should you want to lug it on purpose, e.g. on a flat road where only a tad more power is needed, and avoid the behavior of traditional automatics which could easily overreact, you could easily do that with the CX-5.
 
I've got used to the 2015 CX-5 auto and love it. I can shift down whenever I want by giving it a quick poke with my foot. Not flooring it, not jamming it, just depressing it an inch or so quickly. There's no need to lug the engine at 1100 rpm when you need to accelerate more briskly. Simply poke it about an inch, and it shifts. I find there is no need to use the manual shift mode 95% of the time, and while I think paddle shifters might be nice, I don't think they'd add much once you educate your right foot.
 
Quentus said:
My first guess was fuel economy. The lower rpms while driving on level roads reduces overall fuel burn. And while this all makes sense, I am finding myself so annoyed when I am in 4th gear and need immediate power (like to pass a car or speed up) and have to push the gas pedal aggressively to get the transmission to drop back to 3rd and kick the rpm up. What I think is most annoying is that there is simply no punch when running a little over 1000 rpm, which is where the CX5 tries to maintain the rpm. As the gas is applied, the motor immediately runs rough with little to no power (as would be expected at such a low rpm). This makes the wait until the transmission drops down a gear even longer.
This is normal, although you should just apply the correct amount of pedal instead of playing pushituntilitgoeseverysoslowly.

Now, before I go on, there is a small disclaimer that I should note. My CX5 (which is the Touring model) is the first automatic transmission car I have ever owned. I was raised and have always had a stick. However, I do not experience this same behavior in my other car, which is a 2003 Honda Accord. With a weak 160 horse-power, my Accord always has low-end power and is quick to up-shift when needed. Because it has a 4-speed automatic, right? I mean, that's only 1 gear that is under 1.00. Unlike the CX5, the low-end rpm is higher than the CX5, like at or above 2000 rpm, whereas my CX5 will up-shift until it is just above a 1000. I have become so annoyed by this that I often will switch to manual (such when the road starts to go up-hill) so that it will stay around 2000 rpm and have the needed power.

My wife thinks that I am crazy. She simply says that you have to press the gas pedal harder. Your wife is right. That how automatics are. She has also driven an automatic all her life, so maybe this is all simply a matter of learning to be comfortable with pushing the gas pedal down harder to get to the desired gear and power out-put. I have tried doing this many times, but never have felt comfortable with the experience. Makes no sense. I've owned standards and automatics. This is normal. For example, by the time the transmission decides that the gas pedal has been pushed far enough and down-shifts, the RPM jump is so aggressive (because the gas pedal is pushed so far) that the engine sounds like you have the pedal to the floor. The whole car jumps forward as it responds to the high rpms. I find this whole experience avoidable by simply running the car in manual and maintaining a higher rpm that gives you power on demand without the car jumping 1000 rpm and the engine noise being heard by everyone in the car.

Is this behavior (need to constantly up-shift to reach a low rpm) typical for the 2015 Touring model? Is it okay to drive the CX5 in manual mode for extended periods? Should I have stayed with a stick?
Click to expand...

I think you have absolutely no concept of throttle modulation because you're used to ham-fisting a vehicle by selecting the appropriate gear for your desired response, and doing "whatever" with the throttle. If you treat the gas pedal more like the brake, I think you will be pleasantly surprised. If you need to stop fast, HIT IT, if you need to slowly stop, you caress it, and all in between. The gas pedal in an automatic is identical, and it can downshift a LOT FASTER than any human can reach over and stab the clutch and jam the shifter. I think your wife is on point.

Here is a little video I made showing how to properly drive an automatic CX-5 in various throttle-demand situations:
 
mazdadude said:
The SPORT mode was introduced here on the CX-5 on the 2016 models. It totally changes the shifting behavior, and also changes the ratio of throttle input. If the normal pedal was at a 1:1 ratio before of Pedal travel to throttle travel, then during SPORT mode it changes it to say a ~ 1:1.5 ratio making it very quick to throttle inputs and enhancing the response "feel".

You can add Paddle Shifters to yours. It is a great improvement, and allows you to have your manual mode always at your fingertips for downshifting and upshifting. With the REV-Matching of the transmission, It makes it a real joy.

mazda-cx5-interior-3.jpg
Click to expand...

It doesn't enhance pedal feel. It removes pedal feel, and in return, makes it closer to a binary input system rather than a variable one.
 
I was expecting an Erkel voice. You should add this to the how to section Lol. I can't really tell for sure, but I bet a tune would clean up that bog. But that is more likely a attribute of the stock exhaust.
 
Unobtanium said:
It doesn't enhance pedal feel. It removes pedal feel, and in return, makes it closer to a binary input system rather than a variable one.
Click to expand...

That made me laugh: I've known plenty of binary drivers (foot either flat on accelerator or flat on brake). They'd love this.
 
My kickdown movement might be half an inch. The trick is to do it quickly. If it is a long uphill ride I just slip it in manual mode to hold it in that gear. I also like the downhill hit- the -brake auto shift to a lower gear feature. Again when this happens just pull it over to manual for engine breaking. Still not enough braking? Push shifter forward and engine matches transmission revs. After a year and a half I am learning the tricks of these transmissions. I also have a 2015 GT. It also likes to upshift fast but I also like 30 mpg loaded on the open highway result. I am glad it is not a CVT. I live in West Virginia were hills are the norm. The AWD is great in snow.
 
Unobtanium said:
It doesn't enhance pedal feel. It removes pedal feel, and in return, makes it closer to a binary input system rather than a variable one.
Click to expand...

Yes, sorry you are correct. I agree that using "feel" was a poor word choice. Reaction, response, feel, etc., none seemed to sound right.
 
Please log in or register to reply here.

Similar threads

J
2019 CX-5 2.0L Petrol: Auto Transmission jerky…Help
Replies
11
Views
1K
ceric
ceric
N
CX-5 Jerks back and forth when warmed up and pushed hard
2 3
Replies
40
Views
6K
Snorting2.5
S
M
2017~2024 Mazda CX-5 acceleration noise at low revs
Replies
17
Views
7K
Mramalho
M

Latest posts

Back