2016 CX5 competition, impression, etc.

ColtX-5 said:
My 2015 Blose systems sucks. Worst I ever heard in a car audio system. I should have listened to it closer. I didn't think I'd detest it this much.

Actually, I'm looking for midrange, especially upper mids.

Is Ortofon still in business? I gave up vinyl when I found 24/192 DVD audio. I still have my old Thorens with Decca London arm and A-T MC cartridge, want it? :D
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I didn't give up vinyl because replacing vintage vinyl, mastered when the session tapes were new, with any digital copy made when the tapes were 40+ years old is a huge step backwards in quality. It's not that digital doesn't sound good, its that you can't get the music off those tapes that time has removed. You get a dullness in the highs and upper mids combined with hiss that comes up when the mastering engineer tries to EQ in what time forgot. If you never listen to music recorded earlier than the 80's vinyl is a waste of time. Yes, Ortofon is still in business.

If the CX-5 system is the worst car audio you ever heard, you must have been driving some pretty expensive cars or all aftermarket systems. As far as stock systems go, mine is in the upper third. Everyone that has ridden in my car thinks the Bose system sounds pretty good. Surely there is room for different tastes but "worst ever" makes me think there is something wrong with it or you are using lousy sources. The FM tuner sounds bad, XM is acceptable but just so. USB and CD sound good. I have had Subaru's, an Audi, a VW, a Jeep, a couple of Mitsubishis, Fords, and a BMW that were far worse, most of which I either upgraded speakers or threw out the whole system.

If you are saying that the system is lacking upper midrange, you are wrong. If Bose knows anything, they know how to EQ a system. If you are saying you don't like the way the upper midrange sounds, then you are probably playing it way louder than I do. The system has its limits. Played at reasonable volume levels (up to 60 or 70 %) it sounds good. When you really push it, things fall apart starting with upper midrange glare. This just happens to be at volume levels I rarely use. If I was a heavy metal fan, I would probably not like it.

If you own a Desmoquattro, you have plenty of discretionary funds. Replace the awful Bose system with something better.
 
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Pototoy said:
New Owner here. Picked her up last Saturday.

Overall a really nice CUV for $30K (AWD GT with Tech). However there's a lot to improve

*Bose SUCK! Agreed.
*noisy engine, interior, NHV is not good Agreed x2
*AC, heat doesn't adjust (down) when you do voice command Wouldn't know.
*headlight not that good, I wish it was HID's. I have HID's and they are fine.
*transmission is jerky Transmission is great. Love it. It doesn't slip itself to death...

OK, OK, I like the CUV but I wish there's a better competition, but there's none in this category.

Also, I test drove the new Sorento. It was way better, like way better in driving dynamics. the suspension was a revelation-- just test drive it guys! BUT it's KIA so I didn't buy. :D


sorry, I didn't proof read. hehe. grammar and spelling police please rescue
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For $30K, there is no WAY I would have bought a CX-5. Got mine for $21K and change. I think that is a very appropriate price for what I got.
 
rwortman said:
Hmm. That's always a tough question and often starts a flame war. If you're not an audiophile you won't know what most of it is. If you are a seriously wealthy audiophile or a strict two channel purist you might turn your nose up at some of it.
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I'm just thinking of all the ammo I could buy with $10K!
Seriously though, sounds like you have a passion and pursue it! Props to you! Screw the haters.
 
rwortman said:
I didn't give up vinyl because replacing vintage vinyl, mastered when the session tapes were new, with any digital copy made when the tapes were 40+ years old is a huge step backwards in quality. It's not that digital doesn't sound good, its that you can't get the music off those tapes that time has removed. You get a dullness in the highs and upper mids combined with hiss that comes up when the mastering engineer tries to EQ in what time forgot. If you never listen to music recorded earlier than the 80's vinyl is a waste of time. Yes, Ortofon is still in business.

If the CX-5 system is the worst car audio you ever heard, you must have been driving some pretty expensive cars or all aftermarket systems. As far as stock systems go, mine is in the upper third. Everyone that has ridden in my car thinks the Bose system sounds pretty good. Surely there is room for different tastes but "worst ever" makes me think there is something wrong with it or you are using lousy sources. The FM tuner sounds bad, XM is acceptable but just so. USB and CD sound good. I have had Subaru's, an Audi, a VW, a Jeep, a couple of Mitsubishis, Fords, and a BMW that were far worse, most of which I either upgraded speakers or threw out the whole system.

If you are saying that the system is lacking upper midrange, you are wrong. If Bose knows anything, they know how to EQ a system. If you are saying you don't like the way the upper midrange sounds, then you are probably playing it way louder than I do. The system has its limits. Played at reasonable volume levels (up to 60 or 70 %) it sounds good. When you really push it, things fall apart starting with upper midrange glare. This just happens to be at volume levels I rarely use. If I was a heavy metal fan, I would probably not like it.

If you own a Desmoquattro, you have plenty of discretionary funds. Replace the awful Bose system with something better.
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Mine is middle of the road. My Z06 was the worst (ironically, I bought the base sound system, because it sounded better than the upgrade, which was a Bose, according to MANY C6 owners), my Grand Jeep Cherokee was the best. My CX-5 is "meh". I am not an audiophile, but in the Grand Jeep Cherokee, I kept wondering if I was listening to a remix of various songs, because I was hearing clearly instruments, etc. that I had never heard in the songs before.
 
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rwortman said:
Front mains = PSB Stratus Gold I. $2300 in 1999 This was PSB's flagship speaker 17 years ago when I bought them and they still sound great I just recently made the plunge into surround.
Surrounds PSB Imagine Mini $750
Center PSB Imagine Mini C $600
Sub JBL ES250 $ 350
Marantz SR6006 $1000 receiver driving the surrounds and center with the pre out going to
NAD C275BEE amplifier $1300 driving the PSB towers
Yamaha BD A1010 $400 all disk player
VPI Scout TT $1600
Ortofon Rondo Blue MC cartridge $800
Custom step-up transformer assembled by me $300
Tascam CDRW 900 CD recorder $400 for the occasional LP to digital transfer.

A few of these items were purchased on special offers and as refurb's so I paid a bit less. Those are typical retail prices.

750+ CD's and high res files loaded on my PC and delivered to the Marantz via server software, controlled by a tablet.
Around 450 LP's of various vintages.


I have some other stuff not currently in the system since I went to 5.1. Tuner, DAC, phono pre. The one in the Marantz is actually pretty good. I also have vintage turntable, mono tube amp and single large speaker in a dedicated mono system for fooling around with 40's and 50's mono jazz and pop recordings. I also have workshop, garage, and living room systems with bargains and homebuilts so I have music everywhere. My PC has a Focusrite Scarlett 2i2 usb interface feeding a pair of JBL LSR 305 powered studio monitors for checking out new music and occasionally mixing down recordings of my church's worship band. It's not like I have tin ears and listen to a clock radio. I think the CX-5 Bose system, while not great, is pretty good. Good enough for me to enjoy it. I have the whole digital collection compressed down to 320kb AAC files onto a 128 gig usb stick in the car. The interface is a laggy PIA and it often forgets what it was playing when you turn the car off but when it is playing it sounds pretty good. If you are judging the system using XM, radio or bluetooth from a phone, try CD or high bit rate digital via usb. It sounds better with better sources.
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OT, I'm sure, but how the hell do those "sound bars" work? To me, they sound pretty good, even though not "speakers all over the room", it sounds nearly surround. Short version, if you don't mind? I'm not an audiophile, but was impressed even with a "cheap" "sound bar", if you know what I'm talking about? Sits on/under TV, sounds like surround sound?
 
Unobtanium said:
OT, I'm sure, but how the hell do those "sound bars" work? To me, they sound pretty good, even though not "speakers all over the room", it sounds nearly surround. Short version, if you don't mind? I'm not an audiophile, but was impressed even with a "cheap" "sound bar", if you know what I'm talking about? Sits on/under TV, sounds like surround sound?
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Most sound bars assume the typical TV programs are dialogues, so they compromise by optimizing for the voice frequencies. You know how tweeters, mid-range drivers, and bass drivers are of different diameters (1", 5", 8"-12", ...)? Because each is good at their own frequency range, and you need to combine them together, the sound bar' size doesn't allow that. Just like tiny desktop computer speakers with a sub, they sound pretty decent but when you have trained ears, it will bug you a lot when you can easily recognize "holes" and missing bands.

One trick sound bars usually have is analyzing the input sound, then adding delays/splitting channels to improve the difference between left and right, giving you the impression of wider stereo/surround. However, without the rear surround speakers, it's not really an immerse surround experience (I don't have rear surrounds, I prefer to use those speakers as front presence speakers instead).

If you have a decent system or headphone, you can have fun training your ears with the Golden Ears site (I used the inexpensive Grado SR-80e and most of the tests were easy):
http://goldenears.philips.com/
 
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sillyxone said:
Most sound bars assume the typical TV programs are dialogues, so they compromise by optimizing for the voice frequencies. You know how tweeters, mid-range drivers, and bass drivers are of different diameters (1", 5", 8"-12", ...)? Because each is good at their own frequency range, and you need to combine them together, the sound bar' size doesn't allow that. Just like tiny desktop computer speakers with a sub, they sound pretty decent but when you have trained ears, it will bug you a lot when you can easily recognize "holes" and missing bands.

One trick sound bars usually have is analyzing the input sound, then adding delays/splitting channels to improve the difference between left and right, giving you the impression of wider stereo/surround. However, without the rear surround speakers, it's not really an immerse surround experience (I don't have rear surrounds, I prefer to use those speakers as front presence speakers instead).

If you have a decent system or headphone, you can have fun training your ears with the Golden Ears site (I used the inexpensive Grado SR-80e and most of the tests were easy):
http://goldenears.philips.com/
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Thanks for the link. I will check it out when I wake up. Dunno how useful it will be, as I have significant notches around the 5500-6500 range in my hearing.
 
rwortman said:
If you own a Desmoquattro, you have plenty of discretionary funds.
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Not necessarily. I know a number of Ducati enthusiasts whose love of riding has severely restricted their remaining discretionary funds.

The factory recommended 6,000 mile tune-up costs $1200-$1600 depending upon the regional market. However, I trained myself to do all my own maintenance years ago because I have always refused to let anyone else work on my two wheeled vehicles. A lot of discretionary funds can be consumed if a rider is not set up to do this but the real benefit I get is knowing the job was done right and I don't have to worry about potentially fatal defects in the work.
 
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Sound bars work by altering phase to the outermost speakers to fool your ear into locating the sound somewhere else. If you listen to a stereo system, a centered sound played with the right and left 180 out of phase will sound like its coming from somewhere behind you.
 
A Desmoquattro, as you know, is no ordinary Ducati. I have an "ordinary Ducati" bought used and it's not even my most expensive bike. A Desmoquattro, even used, costs more than all my motorcycles combined. If one can afford that, one can afford to put some money into car audio.

Perhaps in the world of internet hyperbole, "sucks" doesn't mean what I think it does. I love to listen to music. When I had a car with a stereo that sucked, I changed out the parts that sucked in the first month or so I owned it. If you have had your CX-5 for months or years and haven't done so, it either doesn't really suck as bad as you say or you don't really care as much as you say. In that world of internet hyperbole people often talk about how bad things "suck" to prove how discerning they are.
 
rwortman said:
If you own a Desmoquattro, you have plenty of discretionary funds. Replace the awful Bose system with something better.
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She is a demanding testarossa mistress! BUT, mine could have been a Honda. Its reliability has been outstanding and maintenance cost has been about the same as a modern 4-valve bike. OTOH, the blueprinted engine with 853 kit, Ohlins, and ............

When I find out how to replace my Blose, elegantly, I will. Perhaps one of our systems is defective, or maybe there was a production change between 2015 and 2016.
 
rwortman said:
A Desmoquattro, as you know, is no ordinary Ducati. I have an "ordinary Ducati" bought used and it's not even my most expensive bike. A Desmoquattro, even used, costs more than all my motorcycles combined. If one can afford that, one can afford to put some money into car audio.
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I would argue that, with perhaps a couple of exceptions, no Ducati are ordinary. I have three of them (two desmoquattro and one desmoduo). All three are amazing riding machines. I paid more for the used 20 year old desmoduo than I did for one of my desmoquattro's new off the showroom floor.
 
MikeM. said:
I would argue that, with perhaps a couple of exceptions, no Ducati are ordinary. I have three of them (two desmoquattro and one desmoduo). All three are amazing riding machines. I paid more for the used 20 year old desmoduo than I did for one of my desmoquattro's new off the showroom floor.
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I was sleepy. I read Desmoquattro and thought Desmosedici which is an outrageously expensive machine. I have a 03 800SS. The only year of this particular variant. I emailed Ducati the VIN number and they told me they made 50 of them. I think that probably means 50 red ones but still a small number. For 04 and up they dropped the SS as configured in 03 and renamed the 800 Sport as the 800SS. It's not that expensive and not very fast but it is a blast to ride. In a straight line my FJR1300 will eat it alive. Maybe it's rare enough to go up in value someday. Probably not since you have to be pretty knowledgeable about 2 valve Ducati's to even know what it is and all the 1999 up SS models have the same bodywork. The 03 SS is the only 800 with the aluminum swingarm, Marchesini wheels , fully adjustable shock and forks, and Brembo brakes. Mine has a Sargent seat, black tank pad off a 99 to match the black seat, carbon cans, and some adjustable clip ons. The PO had the fork internals reworked, added a Power Commander. and had the flywheel lightened.
DucNovRide1sr.jpg
 
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In all honesty... two wheel street bikes just scare me. No adrenaline junkie here :)

My limits are ATVs and snowmobiles.... even on the snowmobile front I have limits. My nephew keeps wanting me to ride up to see the steaming crater at Mt Baker but am averse to potential avalanche conditions as well.

crater-steam-vent_18x22.jpg

Mt-Baker-North-Face-at-Pink-Summer-Sunset-7703-Buff-Black_w940_h406.jpg
 
MikeM. said:
Not necessarily. I know a number of Ducati enthusiasts whose love of riding has severely restricted their remaining discretionary funds.

The factory recommended 6,000 mile tune-up costs $1200-$1600 depending upon the regional market. However, I trained myself to do all my own maintenance years ago because I have always refused to let anyone else work on my two wheeled vehicles. A lot of discretionary funds can be consumed if a rider is not set up to do this but the real benefit I get is knowing the job was done right and I don't have to worry about potentially fatal defects in the work.
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Well, at least we agree on one thing. Just owning nice stuff does not mean money. Hell, yiu claim to be a multimillionaire and drive a cx5. I still make less than 6 figures, and I have some really expensive stuff in its genre. Why? Passion. People spend money where their heart is. Hell, I just bought a $2300 rifle scope (kahles k16i, for those who care), while I know people who make 5x what I do that would freak out buying anything more than a Tasco.
 
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Unobtanium said:
Well, at least we agree on one thing. Just owning nice stuff does not mean money. Hell, yiu claim to be a multimillionaire and drive a cx5. I still make less than 6 figures, and I have some really expensive stuff in its genre. Why? Passion. People spend money where their heart is. Hell, I just bought a $2300 rifle scope (kahles k16i, for those who care), while I know people who make 5x what I do that would freak out buying anything more than a Tasco.
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Yup. I know people with way more money than me that listen to music on a Bose wave radio. Whatever floats your boat.
 
Kedis82ZE8 said:
In all honesty... two wheel street bikes just scare me. No adrenaline junkie here :)

My limits are ATVs and snowmobiles.... even on the snowmobile front I have limits. My nephew keeps wanting me to ride up to see the steaming crater at Mt Baker but am averse to potential avalanche conditions as well.
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The throttle has intermediate positions.
 
rwortman said:
The throttle has intermediate positions.
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Lost a neighborhood friend when I was younger. He was extremely careless with his bike and plowed into a telephone pole on a Ninja at around 90MPH. A grisly scene that undoubtedly left a footprint in my psyche.
 
rwortman said:
I have a 03 800SS. The only year of this particular variant. I emailed Ducati the VIN number and they told me they made 50 of them. I think that probably means 50 red ones but still a small number.
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That's a great sporting motorcycle! Not too expensive to buy or to own. Yes, relative to other offerings, way down on power but not on fun. On a twisty road a good rider on your 800SS will wish the bigger, more powerful bikes would get out of his/her way. This is a bike that will help teach good riding skills, unlike most small sportbikes.

Of course any bike is only as good as the suspension setup. That bike came well balanced from the factory. Some claim the front end is too soft (and if you are a big rider it is) but Ducati does a good job of making bikes that ride well off the showroom floor. There are modern exceptions but this is not one of them. Most people are not qualified to dial in a suspension. Often, the change they think they want is the opposite of the one they really need. They might make the front end harder and rave about their new found feeling of "control" not realizing they have just messed up the balance of the front/rear bias, etc. It gets complicated and my observation is most stock bikes ride better, corner faster and are more balanced when pushing a corner hard than bikes that have been "dialed in" by the owner (or even a suspension "expert"). But if you don't track it or ride at the limits it doesn't matter much. If you do, and the bike gets perfectly dialed, it is a thing of beauty.

Good to see other Ducatisti here!
 
Kedis82ZE8 said:
Lost a neighborhood friend when I was younger. He was extremely careless with his bike and plowed into a telephone pole on a Ninja at around 90MPH. A grisly scene that undoubtedly left a footprint in my psyche.
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I know a car offers much better crash protection but haven't you ever seen a deadly car accident? They are almost always very grisly as well.

I don't see motorcycles as primary transportation, more of an activity that is enjoyable. Yes, they take you to cool places, creating lasting memories in the process. But it is a commitment, not for those not willing to train and learn the ropes.

Snowmobiling is another. Why not take a beginning avalanche course so you know what you're doing and then plan a trip to the steaming crater during a period of consolidated snow/low avalanche probability? Not many snowmobiling meccas have such amazing destinations!
 
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