Rumor about the original design of the MSP and why so many bugs now

[HarmlessJohnny5]

Hi, I'm new, been reading the forums here for a few months and decided to join up and post a rumor (I was told it's true, but it's farfetched;) that I will try to verify concerning the origin of the MSP and what happened to it.

Supposedly someone in the Lincoln division of ford motor co. was set to oversee the mazdaspeed production of the protégé and towards the end this resulted in a number of significant changes (also reducing the cost by about 12 grand, $30,000 I could NOT have shelled out; ). Originally the MSP was on a different frame (slightly shorter) as a 2 door 2 seater with fiberglass hood and plastic sides (as opposed to the aluminum foil we have). It was to be 850 lbs lighter and use the same turbo, but the engine that was used in the Mazda millennia S. It was to produce 275 HP and have an amazingly good suspension (i.e., a high-end expensive suspension that is tightened up to hell and gone, instead of the supposedly cheap shocks we have that are supposed to be not much better then "standard" McPherson’s (which are better than protégé's I bet), but a tightened up suspension and over pressurized shocks with the potential for exploding the shocks if hit a hard bump (I have done this atrocious and wheel scraping act and have not blown shocks), being capable of the most amazing feat of a skid pad of .94!! It was to be "faster than anything else on the road for close to 30 thousand" (quote from the guy spoken to by the source of this story, the guy works in a mazdaspeed shop (not a dealership, just mazdaspeed shop). The car was also to have a mechanical clutch (whooHOOO!) that was really light weight. There was a prototype with craploads of bugs (never made it base flat grey primer) that were worked out quite nicely. As the production date approached, the Lincoln influence resulted in a hydraulic clutch (since they're going to sell the car and most drivers don't have a freaking clue), the basic protégé frame (resulting in the affordable larger 4 door frame/body we have, instead of a very limited production run), the engine was changed to the 2.0L we have now, the instead of the 12 lbs of boost the moded Melinia S engine (which was supposed to make 235 ft-lbs of torque from about 2000 to about 5300, now that is streetably convenient) we got some varying number of about 5. Most of these changes were supposed to have been made near the end of 2002 and the speed department didn't have time to properly trouble shoot and big find/fix the new version. Also the prototype was supposed to have a dinky light radio with one speaker, no AC and several other conveniences (read, not true race car material) not present.

Also, I was told that this mazdaspeed shop will, for about 11 grand do some serious mods to upgrade the car to be more like what they envisioned (however the .94g skid pad was partly a result of the frame they were going to use and is gone; ( The power upgrade is supposed to be high two hundreds (maybe 275, dunno), replace the entire stereo (even the head unit is replaced with a lighter version (special materials, I'm guessing maybe carbon fiber??), They put panels on the back door places and remove the rear seat and doors. I will try to find out more about this story and get a phone number and address that can be independently verified be anyone here who wishes to do so... or I will discover it's BS : )

Quote:
"NNOOOOOoooo disassemble no.5!!!!"

OH YEAH! btw, if screwed any posting rules, my bad, I'm new, but let me know ; )

[chillinmcmillan]

ummmmmmmm yaaaaaaaaaa.......pass that spliff

[Dexter]

Wow ... yeah how can you have a Protege without a protege chassis or frame? 2 door fiberglass hood? no fucking way. whoever came up with that is lame.

[FSDET]

lmao

[DSM2MSP]

A prototype will always be better than the produced model. Although it wouldve been nice to have that millenia engine. But wtf, one speaker? HAHAAAHAHAAA!!!!!

[uclap5]

sounds like a heaping load of bs to me.

[FSDET]

where were they gonna put that one speaker ?

[peepsalot]

Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Oh and for about 11 grand, I could get a new turbo, intercooler, exhaust, intake, engine managment, forged internals, etc, and I would be able to make 275 easy with a few grand to spare.

Carbon fiber headunit? And why would you even bother putting a radio in with just one shitty speaker? If they are going for weight reduction, they might as well leave it out entirely, like they did with the STI.

[lasermp5]

all that and you guys ask about the speaker? lmoa

And hey don't bash the guy, he clearly said "I WAS TOLD IT WAS TRUE, EVEN THOUGH I THINK IT'S FARFETCHED" god get off his case... He is simply trying to confirm rumors that he heard... never once did he say he thought this stuff was true....

[FSDET]

Mr. Madison, what you've just said is one of the most insanely idiotic things I have ever heard. At no point in your rambling, incoherent response were you even close to anything that could be considered a rational thought. Everyone in this room is now dumber for having listened to it. I award you no points, and may God have mercy on your soul.

Oh and for about 11 grand, I could get a new turbo, intercooler, exhaust, intake, engine managment, forged internals, etc, and I would be able to make 275 easy with a few grand to spare.

Carbon fiber headunit? And why would you even bother putting a radio in with just one shitty speaker? If they are going for weight reduction, they might as well leave it out entirely, like they did with the STI.
any news from the ... u know what ..... im still waitin:) (dance) (nuts)

[low_psi]

(rlaugh)

[Smork]

the Rumors I heard was that it was supposed to be AWD, bigger turbo, full frontmount, and better suspension. And thats not too hard to believe. but still, quite a big jump from what they cranked out.

[HarmlessJohnny5]

quote
Oh and for about 11 grand, I could get a new turbo, intercooler,
exhaust, intake, engine managment, forged internals, etc, and I would be
able to make 275 easy with a few grand to spare.
end quote
crazy i know, but guess what, FACTORY HP and performance cost more than aftermarket performance (like mazda, ford bmw etc). an example I'm famaliar with is DENIN, BMW modification people, very nice, professional, well respected, not factory and a bit expensive; a factory example is AMG, Mercedes's high performance people, better grip and lots more power, and extreemly costly (well, compared to normal mercedes bens: ), and a final example is us here (most of us anyway), we used "kits", or choose our own parts and put them on. they do NOT have a warrenty that extends to the vehicle (read drivetrain) and will usually invalidate any existing warrenties (again, without replacing the warrenty with a well respected one of their own <denin will do this and BMW will not void anything but the engine on a denin moded BMW, which denin will cover with their own warrenty 2 years min, maximum of remaining factory (or extended) warrenty).

quote
Carbon fiber headunit?
end quote

did I say the headunit in the "story" was carbon fiber, or did I say "I'm guessing maby,--carbon fiber??"

quote
And why would you even bother putting a radio in with just one shitty
speaker?
end quote
head unit with one speaker? you are confusing the prototype in the story with what they will do to your "CURRENT" (read, the version that people can buy and is commonly spoken of here; ) MSP.

quote
If they are going for weight reduction, they might as well leave it out
entirely, like they did with the STI.[/QUOTE]
end quote

"IF" (and that's a big if, but hey, I'll be glad to clear up anything that you misunderstood about my post) the story is true, then the ultra weight reduction and no AC and such is not what they will do to the current MSP, it would be what the "pro-toe-type" had. Obvisously a lightweight high end headunit would not be used to back up... a speaker (read the previous post carefuly).

again,"IF" (and that's a big if)

[122 Vega]

Yeah and the techs were supposed to come to your house weekly to wash it witha special "Mazdaspeed" wax that reduced the coefficient of drag to .11.

They also gave you annual vacation packages to places like Fiji, Mt sanai, Jeruselum, Moscow and Paris. BTW they would fly your car there so you could drice it on the highways of the world.

Oh, did I mention that it came witha "special" owner's manual that had the phone numbers of willing women that had volunteered to be the whores of the limited production super car? You just looked though the book, picked one you liked and they would ship her right to your door. The only cathch was taht the women were lease option, so if you put too many miles on them, you had to pay some extra when it came time to trade her in on a newer lower mile model.

Nitrous?

Free Skip Barber Driving School?

Plasma screen?

Free rentals at Blockbuster for life?

BAchelor's Degree in whatever field you want?

Two free houses anywhere you wanted?


Your retard...how lame is your life that you actually thought that out?

Britt

[122 Vega]

example I'm famaliar with is DENIN, BMW
Do you mean DINAN? Isn't it past your bedtime?

[HarmlessJohnny5]

Yeah and the techs were supposed to come to your house weekly to wash it witha special "Mazdaspeed" wax that reduced the coefficient of drag to .11.

They also gave you annual vacation packages to places like Fiji, Mt sanai, Jeruselum, Moscow and Paris. BTW they would fly your car there so you could drice it on the highways of the world.

Oh, did I mention that it came witha "special" owner's manual that had the phone numbers of willing women that had volunteered to be the whores of the limited production super car? You just looked though the book, picked one you liked and they would ship her right to your door. The only cathch was taht the women were lease option, so if you put too many miles on them, you had to pay some extra when it came time to trade her in on a newer lower mile model.

Nitrous?

Free Skip Barber Driving School?

Plasma screen?

Free rentals at Blockbuster for life?

BAchelor's Degree in whatever field you want?

Two free houses anywhere you wanted?


Your retard...how lame is your life that you actually thought that out?

Britt


i see you got the promo deal to huh? :)


quote
Your retard:
end quote

additional and supportive quotes ; )
The only cathch was taht
BTW they would fly your car there so you could drice it on the highways of the world
end supportive quote

if only we all had as much to contribute as you.

[StuttersC]

Man, people will put anything on the internet...

This story posted here is really funny, particularly when you know how the car was really developed and how it came to be in the real world.

[HarmlessJohnny5]

Man, people will put anything on the internet...

This story posted here is really funny, particularly when you know how the car was really developed and how it came to be in the real world.


yeah, well, ya learn something new every day. since I (obviously: ) don't know how the car was developed fill me in please, I'm interested.

[shaolin]

Hmmm...do a search on the MP3, its history, design emphasis, and overall goal of that vehicle. Then read some reviews on it, particularly the banditos review by car and driver. Then you'll see where the MSP evolved from and what it's all about. Heck, you can just read some MSP reviews and they mostly tell why it came about.

[HarmlessJohnny5]

Hmmm...do a search on the MP3, its history, design emphasis, and overall goal of that vehicle. Then read some reviews on it, particularly the banditos review by car and driver. Then you'll see where the MSP evolved from and what it's all about. Heck, you can just read some MSP reviews and they mostly tell why it came about.


yup, car and driver explains it pretty clearly, thanks : )

[StuttersC]

yeah, well, ya learn something new every day. since I (obviously: ) don't know how the car was developed fill me in please, I'm interested.Yeah, its been covered quite a bit on this board alone.

A quick run down for you, the MP3 was in development in 1999 to try to start the Mazdaspeed brand in the US, however because of the lack of power, Mazdaspeed Japan wouldn't back it. So, the car was released in mid-2001 as a 2001 model and labeld MP3 because of the stereo in the car. Mazda also released the Protege 5 at the same time as a 2002 model.

If you understand what Mazdaspeed is about (a solid blend of handling, power and looks), then you will understand the marketing move to bring Mazdaspeed to the US (competition for TRD which had been here for years, and the rumors of NISMO and STi coming).

The MSP was in development from 2001, shortly before the MP3 was released. They were working on the turbo design up through and past the initial release date. They used the MSP as the launch vehicle for Mazdaspeed in the USA and took the Mazdaspeed name in a slightly different direction than the JDM version of the same entity (US version builds whole vehicles as where the JDM version sells individual parts in order to make a total package car).

The move to bring Mazdaspeed to the US was an attempt for Mazda to garner some share of the performance market...

That's the basic idea. The MSP was never going to be a two door anything. The Protege platform has been a sedan since day one of the the first generation when it replaced the 323 sedan in 1990. The 323 sedan was based on the popular 323 three door hatch which pulled its ties from the GLC...And now the Mazda3 is carrying on the torch of that blood line.

Mazda is very traditional in that manner. Just like the Mazda6 is carrying on the 626 platform which has gone through a number of revisions and name changes as well since the '70s.

As for the Lincoln connection of your story, I don't think the head of Mazdaspeed USA had any ties with Lincoln before he became a part of Mazdaspeed.

[girth]

Most of these changes were supposed to have been made near the end of 2002 and the speed department didn't have time to properly trouble shoot and big find/fix the new version.
As everyone has already said, it's BS....and here's another reason why. My car was manufactured in July 2002....so if they were still "making changes near the end of 2002", the MSP wouldn't have came out until the end of 2003. Or maybe I just own one of the prototypes then?(freak)

[murph1379]

It's obviously bullshit, but is it so implausible to think that mazda might want to make something that could compete with the STi's and the EVOs?

I hear the speed RX-8 won't even have a turbo???

[FSDET]

i heard the msp was orignaly planned to be a minivan

[shaolin]

The Mazdaspeed RX-8 is still under wraps, but it's been confirmed by many sources it will be supercharged and be in the 360 HP range.

[Grip & Drift]

A quick run down for you, the MP3 was in development in 1999 to try to start the Mazdaspeed brand in the US, however because of the lack of power, Mazdaspeed Japan wouldn't back it.
almost correct... but the MP3 was infact the true blue Mazdaspeed version from Japan. what happened was Mazdaspeed USA.. did not think it had enough power.. due to the SRT-4 being in the works.. the WRX out already and the EVO coming out soon (we all know it was not meant to compete with those 2 from the get go anyway) so they did not want to release it as a Mzdaspeed USA car.

so waht they did was have Callaway cars (famous for their work on the Corvette) design a turbo kit, and then they went to Racing beat, and that company designed the suspension system, and exhaust kit. they contaced Sparco for some interior enhancements, and thus the american Mazda speed was born.

now about a month after the car was released... Mazdaspeed Jpn found out they were doing more work to it.. and keeping it as the mazdaspeed car. They were not to happy about it... but instead of being jerks.. they designed a new aerodynamics kit to provide better lift reduction for the higher output motors, and put in their own inter stuff instead of sparcos.

thus the 2003.5 hit the delears as the final version :D


oh and that thing about them using a millenia S motor is nonsense.. since it is a V6 with a roots type supercharger.. no turbo. so that says its BS in all its form =)

[Drmdriver03]

Whats a Mazdaspeed? :)

[jersey_emt]

Ummmm...riiiiight.

Closed before things get out of hand even more