Its not just me...

[SpicyMSP]

Well ive been through 3 cars in the 3 past years,and I thought THAT was bad.... but have had my MSP the longest so far... Almost 2 years now.
But Why do people get bored so easily?
There are SOO many people that just got tired of the MSP and are selling them now, even less then a year of ownership. Why is it that people are getting rid of the MSPs so quickly for something 'bigger' and 'better'?
:confused:

[YellowSpeed1229]

hey steph i was thinking that too... y not just buy the bigger and better car from the beginning and not deal with a car you dont like for less than a year. humm.. who knows.. but honestly i was lookin to sell mine at one time as well. but im glad i kept. it.

[mspdfreak]

I agree. People are losing a ton of cash doing this...it boggles my mind how people afford this.

[pdhaudio83]

only in the US... i swear.

[noclue119]

I wanna sell cuz i wanna buy a house.

[wicked]

selling it has crossed my mine,just because the motor is so temper-mental=)
but I end up keeping it,I don't get bored with it,just frusterated.in the end I keep it,because I like the fact that I live in a town of 125,000,with lots,and lots of imports,and tuners,but I am the only titanium MSP of only 2

[Heathen23]

I think it has a lot to do with the fact that people in the age category that bought the car don't fear taking on debt like the previous generations did and still do. Because financing is so readily available, as is credit in general, you can roll over debts so easily and just move on to something newer. Not to overthink the matter but being we are in such a "consumer" era people just buy new to buy being that it is what we know how to do.

[wicked]

selling it has crossed my mine,just because the motor is so temper-mental=)
but I end up keeping it,I don't get bored with it,just frusterated.in the end I keep it,because I like the fact that I live in a town of 125,000,with lots,and lots of imports,and tuners,but I am the only titanium MSP of only 2 MSP's in the town.
plus the other MSP oner is a lady in her 30's that has no idea what a MSP is.it's just a car to her.

so I'm all alone with this car here,and it's nice.
even when I go to the track,I'm the only MSP at infineon raceway

[MSP #167]

I don't understand this either, i've had this car for 6 months so far and i love it, I've just recently started some major mods and i love it even more. All these little problems people are complaining about aren't that bad.

I plan on keeping this car for at least another 2 years or before i hit 50k miles.

I had my previous car for 4 years which was a 91 240sx.

I don't understand why people aren't happy with their MSP.

[mdaj]

Well, I can say I for one want to upgrade from a 4cyl FWD sedan. Of course there are exceptions, EVO, STI, but I am wanting awd or rwd with a coupe feel. I test drove many but they are really out of my price range and it would not be smart to trade to something else after just trading in for the Speed a year ago. I will keep her and buy my Cosworth Escort, FD, or Z32 once she is paid off.

For her 1 year anniversary I am taking her to the track (naughty)

[SpicyMSP]

All these little problems people are complaining about aren't that bad.

Ditto.

[mdaj]

Ditto.
Hehe I agree. I hate seing posts like:

Hater- "Don't get a msp they have soooooooo many problems"
Buyer- "Like what..."
Hater- "ummm...BRB"

[YellowSpeed1229]

hahaha nice.... i admot i have had my share of problems. but i still like it

[BOOSTR]

Not sure why some MSP owners want to get rid of their cars. Some MSP's might just be lemons. I personally plan on keeping mine for ever. I still have the first new car that I bought. I cannot afford to suffer a loss on trading in the MSP either. I am not upside down on it, but the trade-ins reported on here have not been good.

I have had good experience with mine. They have yet to build a car that offers the same level of enjoyment at its price level. I am referring to performance, handling, and looks.

[stevesMSP]

Well ive been through 3 cars in the 3 past years,and I thought THAT was bad.... but have had my MSP the longest so far... Almost 2 years now.
But Why do people get bored so easily?
There are SOO many people that just got tired of the MSP and are selling them now, even less then a year of ownership. Why is it that people are getting rid of the MSPs so quickly for something 'bigger' and 'better'?
:confused:I live in mass. and it sucks in the snow! Thought about getting rid of it but never did.

[Gbourdon]

In all honesty. I would like to keep the car and buy another car. I really like having a different car to drive. It doesnt need to be faster or handle better. Just different.

[MazdaDryvr]

It be may this..... I see people buy things on the cheap all time without realizing the old saying "you get what you pay for". These may be the dissapointed, the bored, the frustrated that move on to faster cars. The MSP is a great car for what it is. I wouldnt part with it for a SRT, RSX, WRX or whatever because I love its style and performance and value. IMO. :D

[girth]

The main reason I want to get rid of mine is because it runs (hesitates) like a$$.(boom02)

[FSDET]

I think it has a lot to do with the fact that people in the age category that bought the car don't fear taking on debt like the previous generations did and still do. Because financing is so readily available, as is credit in general, you can roll over debts so easily and just move on to something newer. Not to overthink the matter but being we are in such a "consumer" era people just buy new to buy being that it is what we know how to do.what he said

[thunder]

Who knows... for some (or many) this was their first manual (or sports) car! They beat the s**t out of it (dump-clutch at 4500 rpm at every stop light), whack it out of balance with mods and then feel that it isn't strong or powerful enough, Mazda sucks and that a WRX or EVO is much better... They probably will be disapointed again... IMO
Personally, my car seems to run better and better... No complaining from me, exept for the klunk (fixed now) :)

[sXe]

Well, I can say I for one want to upgrade from a 4cyl FWD sedan.

I hear that

[pip7441622]

I want a convertible...and the S2000 is calling my name. Not untill I can come out at least even on the MSP though. I can wait.

[FC3s Boy]

i've never sold any of my mazda's that i have owned they are the best

[chillinmcmillan]

hey I sold mine and it's not cause I got tired of it, I loved my MSP and I will miss it dearly, it was a great car, but I just love the rsx s that much more, it's a stronger car all around than the MSP. Another reason for selling is that this coming spring I was planning to do basically everything to the MSP (FMIC, turbo back exhaust, forged, new turbo, the whole nine yards) I thought it over and getting into the rsx is just a better idea for me. Bottom line is though that I will miss my MSP and it was a great car!

[CommieSpeed]

Iv'e been thinking about this quite a bit lately as well. I was entertaining the idea of getting an RX8....as I work at a Mazda dealership and all. Well, as easy as it would be for me to do this, I decided against it. The power and handling difference just isn't significant enough for me to justify making the switch. Another thing....with all the problems people are having, they really aren't that bad. MOST new cars...ones that aren't even limited production, have issues similiar to ours, if not worse. I can tell you that I drive every car under the sun at my dealership...and soooooo many nice, new cars (anywhere from 0 - 10,000 miles on them) make squeaks, clunks, rattles...have shitty brakes, hesitation, crappy shifting trannys, etc etc. GM products have so many recalls and TSBs it's rediculous. When it comes down to it, there are really few cars that have that Crisp, Clean, Delicious taste of a Mazdaspeed Protege.....Mmmmmmm...boosty.

[sickspeed94]

i live in STR-4's ville USA, and i'm TIRED of getting my ass handed to me in a straight line... lol but i don't think i'll let my car go except if i do i have a VERY legitimate reason. call me the exception if you will. still love it, and will love it more with MBC soon

[Newf]

still got mine here, and planning on keeping it until 2006.

I have also had 3 cars since 2001. But I do love the speed. The hesitation drives me crazy sometimes, but I still love it.

That being said, I've already been offered to work some sort of deal for a Mazdaspeed 6 :) So ya never know.

[mspdfreak]

When is the ms-6 coming out? 2006?

[Newf]

When is the ms-6 coming out? 2006?may 2005. Yeah, that's what their saying now. That'll change.

Anyways, I said 2006 because of the MAzdaspeed 3, assuming it comes out then. Or I'll get a Mazdaspeed 6, but the 2nd year run as I don't really like the looks of the 2005 one enough to slap down 40 grand on it. I'm hoping the refresher model in 2006 will at least have some decent wheels and ground effects on it.

Confused yet?

The deal I was kind of offered as a joke, but a serious and possible joke, would be on a 2005 speed 6. But, I am trying to hold off on getting another car until 2006 as we are redoing the basement in the house in the spring.

But, I'm weak, and you never know. once I see the speed6 in person, I might cave in, and I"ll just "need" to get it :)

[Hercdriver]

When I bought mine I planned on keeping it for a long time. Unfortunatly mine is up for sale too. I don't have any problems with my MSP. It's just the way things have turned out. My wife doesn't know how to drive a standard and is pretty adamant about not learning on my "baby". We'll probably take it in the shorts in the end but she has to drive something and 3 of the 4 cars are standards. I love the speed and I hope I can find someway to hold onto it. If I keep my asking price where it is I'll never get rid of it so everything might work out in the end after all.

[kicker22705]

i'll play devils advocate: i love my car (when it doesn't hessitate)

people, myslef included, are getting bord of the msp because despite it being only 2 years old, it is already lagging far behind in the performance industry and it simply doesn't have the potential nor aftermarket support to catch up without spending some serious cash.

when it first came out, the only comparable vehicles were the SVT Focus, Sentra SE-R, GTI, Tiburon GT, Civic Si, RSX type S, and WRX.

the MSP was one of the creme of the crop cars in the sport compact car industry, but life on top was short lived.

Since then, we have seen new, more powerful cars that have such greater potential than the msp that all came out in such a sort amount of time. suddenly the msp has fallen from contender to pretender.

since the msp we have come to see the arrival of: the SRT-4, new RSX type S, still potent WRX, RX8, 350Z, EvoVIII, and STi. (i know lot of them cost more than the MSP, but they are the cars you see on the streets, they are the cars that own the streets)

simply put, the msp can't compete w/ these cars unless some serious mods are done. Most tuners are only willing to go up to the last bolt on part and maybe a piggyback. the potential the msp can reach w/ just bolt on will take you to stock to slightly moddified performance levels of the new breed of scc i listed above. and who wants to spend all thier money and hard work catching up to a stock evo, just to get smoke by him after heputs on a boost controller.

only thing msp got on these cars is handling, but serious how many people go downhill mountain racing in the US. forget sti and evo, the msp would own in that.

[ping]

I don't know about contender to pretender... if you rate cars by the stopwatch the MSP will never be the fastest except maybe on a coned course, but on a smiles per mile or fun-to-drive scale it's near the top. The only things I'd add would be cruise and a sunroof and it'd be about perfect - oh, and an '035 wing...

[Newf]

but see, that's where the wrong mentallity comes into play.

I love my car for what it is. Not because I can or cannot keep up with some other car. Yet alone when that other car is probably being driven by some pimple'd face teenager who's mommie and daddie but them a EVO.

It's not about who's dick is bigger. It's just about a car. I love my car because it fits my needs perfectly right now. A 4 cyl, fwd, that's good on gas, easy on insurance, has a good stock stereo, fun to drive and looks great. When I see an evo/sti or whatever on the road, the thought of "shit I can't keep up with him because my car is a @#$#@$%" never even crosses my mind. I admire their car for what it is, and mine for what it is. It stops there. This is where maturity comes into play.

Street racing is for punk kids that know no better. Autocross, and 1/4 are great and all, but are not the reason why I bought this car. In fact, it never even crossed my mind during the entire process of looking at, and test driving this car.

If it did, then I'd be driving something else. Sure, I could drive a mustang, heck it the gt would have cost me the same around here. Yes, i would have been a bit faster. But, the insurance and gas go up, and there's no way in hell I'd drive a mustang in the winter around here.

The car suits my needs and budget better then ANYTHING else out there imho. That's why I have it. And until either my budget changes, or there's another car that's a better buy, I'll keep the speed.

[kicker22705]

i was speaking for those who were trading in their cars for the faster one.

obviously you aren't one of them, which is why you don't share the same feelings. props to you on a great decision.

[t3ase]

Someone mentioned aged earlier but then rolled in to a credit thing..

I think it's the age thing plus the crowd that's getting rid of them didn't share the same "wait" and don't have the same "lust" as many of the older members here do. There are some that bought this car just to be cool.. Then there are those that bought this car because they spent night after night reading about it, looking at every picture they could, and just became obsessed, for lack of a better phrase.

[t3ase]

Instead of multiple posts, I'll make it all one and split it up..


i'll play devils advocate: i love my car (when it doesn't hessitate)Love it then and fix the problem. If you're in a relationship and you truly love the other person, you don't overlook problems, you address them. You fix them. Save money, get a better job, finish school, rig it up, research.

PCM reflash didn't work? Try MPI or Unichip. Hell, LinuxRacr has a standalone that not many others have. Why? Because he researched it.


people, myslef included, are getting bord of the msp because despite it being only 2 years old, it is already lagging far behind in the performance industry and it simply doesn't have the potential nor aftermarket support to catch up without spending some serious cash.It has potential, just not the same aftermarket support as a Civic. Again, just because you cannot easily find something on google doesn't mean it's not an option. If you actually take your time and show initiative, you can have a bad ass car.

New cars are just that. New. New technologies, new engines, new designs. We're CONSTANTLY seeing more power; people want it. You will NEVER be able to keep up with it, regardless of if you have a Civic, a Diablo or a Protege. People always want more. Always.


when it first came out, the only comparable vehicles were the SVT Focus, Sentra SE-R, GTI, Tiburon GT, Civic Si, RSX type S, and WRX.

the MSP was one of the creme of the crop cars in the sport compact car industry, but life on top was short lived.a) It's a limited production car.
b) We don't have huge magazines throwing out ads for our parts. Nor will we have it because of point a).
c) *WAS*? In it's price range, it still is, opnionly, the best overall car on the market. Handling, exterior styling, audio, interior comfort/design, general performance. While 170 out of a turbo'd 2.0 isn't the greatest, it isn't bad at all considering the base it was built upon.


Since then, we have seen new, more powerful cars that have such greater potential than the msp that all came out in such a sort amount of time. suddenly the msp has fallen from contender to pretender.What?! We're still hearing stories of amateur autocrossers beating experienced drivers. We're still hearing racing kills. We're still hearing our cars are great. Potential isn't the same as mass marketed. EVOs are marketed very well. Why? They're not limited. They have been here and will be here for a while.


since the msp we have come to see the arrival of: the SRT-4, new RSX type S, still potent WRX, RX8, 350Z, EvoVIII, and STi. (i know lot of them cost more than the MSP, but they are the cars you see on the streets, they are the cars that own the streets)
Own the streets? I've personally beat one SRT-4, 3 RX8s, 2 350Zs. If street racing is owning the streets, sure there are more powerful cars. However, you also have to consider the "ohhhh, what kind of car is that" and the uniqueness of our cars. I know people around here know me because of my car and solely because of it; even when I had a stock exterior appearance. How many silver 350Z owners can say that with a stock exterior appearance? Maybe their neighbors that see them driving down the street everyday. I'm talking Austin, a decent sized city.


simply put, the msp can't compete w/ these cars unless some serious mods are done. Serious mods? The 350Z kills and one RX8 was with a boost controller. Period. Serious mod? No. For your point though, again consider the base our car is built upon. An economy family sedan. This was not a competive vehicle.


the potential the msp can reach w/ just bolt on will take you to stock to slightly moddified performance levels of the new breed of scc i listed above. I'm assuming your whole arguement is about power. However, the reason I chose this car is not. If I wanted raw power, I'd buy some old mustang. Winning the streets is not always about how much pwoer your engine puts out.


and who wants to spend all thier money and hard work catching up to a stock evo, just to get smoke by him after heputs on a boost controller.Who wants to have a car that the EVO owner then pulls over to talk to you about? I do. Uniqueness owns cookie cutter anyway.


Most tuners are only willing to go up to the last bolt on part and maybe a piggyback.
Wrong. A tuner is just that, a tuner. They tune every aspect of their car for peformance, not just bolt on parts.


only thing msp got on these cars is handling, but serious how many people go downhill mountain racing in the US. forget sti and evo, the msp would own in that.Again, how about styling? Uniqueness? Stock audio?

Also, you don't have to go "downhill mountain racing" to appreciate handling. Try driving in traffic and having to maneuver around a wreck without spinning out and wrecking out yourself. Try finding a nice windy road just to go on. Try taking that exit just a bit faster than you know you should. Try finding a parking lot and just going at it for a while learning what your car CAN do and WILL do with everyday driving. You'd be surprised how much the handling of this car can affect your everyday driving when you actually actively think about it.


Since then, we have seen new, more powerful cars that have such greater potential than the msp that all came out in such a sort amount of time.
You're correct if potential to you means looking through Super Street to find cheap parts, as anyone else can do. This car has insane potential, you just have to think outside of the box.

Just because you cannot point and click on 50,000 websites for parts doesn't mean our car lacks potential. Go enjoy your car. Quit trying to be the best. This whole world is about evolution. Life. Love. Hobbies. Music. Cars. Clothing. It's all changing. Thats how it is. Make the best with what you have, you'll be much happier than being a slave to the "hottest" or the "newest"

[msp35]

i'll play devils advocate: i love my car (when it doesn't hessitate)

people, myslef included, are getting bord of the msp because despite it being only 2 years old, it is already lagging far behind in the performance industry and it simply doesn't have the potential nor aftermarket support to catch up without spending some serious cash.

when it first came out, the only comparable vehicles were the SVT Focus, Sentra SE-R, GTI, Tiburon GT, Civic Si, RSX type S, and WRX.

the MSP was one of the creme of the crop cars in the sport compact car industry, but life on top was short lived.

Since then, we have seen new, more powerful cars that have such greater potential than the msp that all came out in such a sort amount of time. suddenly the msp has fallen from contender to pretender.

since the msp we have come to see the arrival of: the SRT-4, new RSX type S, still potent WRX, RX8, 350Z, EvoVIII, and STi. (i know lot of them cost more than the MSP, but they are the cars you see on the streets, they are the cars that own the streets)

simply put, the msp can't compete w/ these cars unless some serious mods are done. Most tuners are only willing to go up to the last bolt on part and maybe a piggyback. the potential the msp can reach w/ just bolt on will take you to stock to slightly moddified performance levels of the new breed of scc i listed above. and who wants to spend all thier money and hard work catching up to a stock evo, just to get smoke by him after heputs on a boost controller.

only thing msp got on these cars is handling, but serious how many people go downhill mountain racing in the US. forget sti and evo, the msp would own in that.


Okay, assuming you meant the new RSX atleast 5-7k more than MSP. SRT-4 2-3k more. Evo, WRX, STI, at least 7-10k more. If you managed to get an MSP for around 18,000 or less, put the remaining $$$ into performance now, whatcha got?

[protegeV]

i got bored of my P5 after 6 months, and Im pretty happy with my MSP...If I ever get rid of it, it will be a large downgrade when the time comes to buy a house(getting nearer every day) not getting bigger and better, so Im gonna enjoy it wheil I can :D

[t3ase]

Also, keep in mind many of us bought our MSPs when they were 20.5k, no bargaining. Sticker price only; like it or leave it. I hate to generalize but like I said before, it seems as though the people lately that have been getting them and then trading them are the ones who thought "oh, its cheap, has a turbo and looks cool. lets get it" and then they are disappointed. I have yet to see more than a couple of the original "OG" MSP owners who did pay the 20k trade in for something else; however I see numerous newer owners talking about trading every day.

There's a love that just doesn't seem to be shared amongst some of us.

[kicker22705]

i want to get something clear. i am not bashing the msp i'm am simply stating it has limits that has caused other msp owners to move on.

i should clarify what i meant, when i said "potential" of the car. to me the potential of the engine is what it can handle before the integrity of the engine and its components are compromised while running stock internals. i say this to maintain an common ground every car is limited by.

if modified internals are put into play, the potential of any car is raised dramatically skewing the actually potential capabilities of the engine.

that being said, a msp running stock internals and turbo may reach 250 whp under normal conditions. from now on out, its would be wise to invest in internals. why, b/c the engine wasn't meant to make any more hp. it has reached its potential at 250 whp. thats pretty good i say, however thats just where the evo's, sti's, z's are getting starting, w/ the srt4 and wrx merely a boost controller and downpipe away.

although many people appreciate the msp as a whole, some people simply just wanna be the fastest and don't really care about anything else. unfortunely for many people 250 whp isn't enough, and forged internals is not an appealing options. a more appealing option for them is to move on to an already faster car thats begging for easy mods to make their cars fly.

"Okay, assuming you meant the new RSX atleast 5-7k more than MSP. SRT-4 2-3k more. Evo, WRX, STI, at least 7-10k more. If you managed to get an MSP for around 18,000 or less, put the remaining $$$ into performance now, whatcha got?"

you have a point to an extent. how many people usually have 30g's laying around for a car. its not like they're gonna spend 20 k on the msp and have an extra 10 grand lying around to hook it up. most people fiance their cars 4-5-6-7 years and get incredible low rates. how many banks are gonna approve you on a 10k loan to mod out a car? and if they do it would be much higher rate than the interest rate for buying a brand new car. it would be easy to buy the more expensive car, spread out the payment over 6 years, and spend a little extra cash here and there for little bolt on parts. you'll have the FQ car you want plus the warrenty.

[JDM Sam]

Also, keep in mind many of us bought our MSPs when they were 20.5k, no bargaining. Sticker price only; like it or leave it. I hate to generalize but like I said before, it seems as though the people lately that have been getting them and then trading them are the ones who thought "oh, its cheap, has a turbo and looks cool. lets get it" and then they are disappointed. I have yet to see more than a couple of the original "OG" MSP owners who did pay the 20k trade in for something else; however I see numerous newer owners talking about trading every day.

There's a love that just doesn't seem to be shared amongst some of us.Old gambino fo lyfe! (upyours)
BTW patrick has the mpi tuner, he doesnt have the old perfect power anymore.
You need to arrange for a TX meet again in DFW this time.

[shaolin]

Hey guys, I'm one of the people you guys are talking about. I recently traded in my MSP for an RX-8. I severely miss the MSP, as it was one helluva spunky little car with alot of character. If I had my choice I woulda kept both cars, but my budget just won't allow, and neither will my already cramped garage. I know alot of you have beaten RX-8's with your MSP's, but I've always been someone who enjoys real "driver's cars." Not that the MSP wasn't, but simply put, the RWD, 50/50 weight distribution, 9K Redline, creature comforts, and honestly....the maturity of the RX-8 made it worth it to me. I also needed useable back seats, and I've been a rotary fan since my father bought his FD3S in 1994. I got 18K for my MSP...so it really was a no brainer.

The MSP compared to the RX-8 is like apples and oranges in a sense. I've been asked which one I preferred power wise a couple of times now, and I'll say that the MSP definitely has more USABLE every day power. Stop and go traffic, and stop light tire shredding, the MSP definitely gets the nod in that department.

However, the RX-8 very much matches my driving style better. I'm someone who likes to rev high, and rev hard, especially when entering corners and exiting. I heel-to-toe drive on the norm, and like to attack apexes like a bat out of hell.

Recently, the vegas mazdas went on a drive through red rock canyon, and for a portion of the drive I took the lead. I will say that the MSP behind me (TheJohnny) kept up quite well. However, when I pushed the 8 to its limit there wasn't anyone in my rearview in sight. The Mazda 6's that were out there also held up extremely well.

Sorry to have gone off topic a bit, but what I'm trying to say is that the MSP is definitely a great car, and if I had to have a FWD car, it would be my choice. But the potency of the rotary RX-8 that originally drew me to Mazda dealers in the first place, when I bought my MSP was just too hard to pass up. (By the way I would have bought it last year, if it wasn't for the fact that I had no automotive credit, and that's what I have now thanks to the MSP.)

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/andy.wray/topgear.wmv (http://homepage.ntlworld.com/andy.wray/topgear.wmv)

Check this out, Jeremy Clarkson, one of the industry's toughest critics takes on the RX-8. By the way, my insurance loves the fact that I drive a 1.3L 4 door (upyours)

[t3ase]

i want to get something clear. i am not bashing the msp i'm am simply stating it has limits that has caused other msp owners to move on.It has it's limits to those owners that have limits, as do all cars.


i should clarify what i meant, when i said "potential" of the car. to me the potential of the engine is what it can handle before the integrity of the engine and its components are compromised while running stock internals. i say this to maintain an common ground every car is limited by.You say you're using that to maintain a "common ground" for every car yet you want to compare the engines of an economy grocery getter car to those engines in a RSX (race inspired), WRX (race inspired), RX8 (race inspired), and a SRT-4 (race inspired). Every other car that I can think of other than the SE-R, which I don't think is built up, has been designed since introduction for a performance status using a performance platform. For the price of some of the other cars mentioned, you can afford internals and go easily kick some ass.

However, since you can't add aftermarket internals in to your monthly car payment, not many people can do it.


if modified internals are put into play, the potential of any car is raised dramatically skewing the actually potential capabilities of the engine.Mhmmmmmm, and if the car is, in general, built to be a performance vehicle, the potential is raised dramatically. People see the RSX-S as a "popular fast car", thusly the aftermarket support. That's what it is mass marketed as. Not many people, when compared to the general crowd as a whole, see the Protege family as a performance vehicle. Why? Because it never has been marketed as such and when it was, it was only done for a year. EVen then, it wasn't a specialized performance line up.


that being said, a msp running stock internals and turbo may reach 250 whp under normal conditions. from now on out, its would be wise to invest in internals. why, b/c the engine wasn't meant to make any more hp.You made a point I've been trying to make right there yet you don't see to get it as you keep comparing the MSP, or any Protege for that matter, to a 350 or WRX.


it has reached its potential at 250 whp.thats pretty good i say, however thats just where the evo's, sti's, z's are getting starting, w/ the srt4 and wrx merely a boost controller and downpipe away.Again, these vehicles are/were/will be designed with a racing inspired background. You're missing the point of this car if you want that. Hell, why not compare the Protege to a Ferarri or a Diablo? MR2? Delorean? They all have engines, too.


although many people appreciate the msp as a whole, some people simply just wanna be the fastest and don't really care about anything else.Ah ha! There it is. If this is your case, you bough the car for the completely wrong reason. This car was never marketed as a "quick" or "fast" vehicle. If you did research, you'd know that. Just because it has a factory turbo does not mean it was designed to be a performance vehicle. That seems like the only reason that many newer people here bought this car, because it was a <$20k turbo'd car. They thought, "OH A TURBO#!@$ CHEAP!#$ THE BOVS GO WOOO WOOOOOOOOOO"

Also, on that note why not mention the Ford F350 turbodiesels? Are there people on the Ford truck forums trading their trucks in because they can't go out and whoop some street ass? I doubt it. However, I know there are several members on Ford truck forums that have tuned the hell out of their trucks and they can kick some serious ass.

It all boils down to being passionate about what you have. Key phrase there; what you have.

I can say that in the months prior to getting my MSP, I spent countless hours reading everything I could find and from that I did come to the conclusion that this was not meant to be the fastest car eVAR!@# It's just a Protege with a bit of help on the engine side and massive help with handling.

Handling can potentially save my life in every day driving situations; I doubt having 700hp can do that.


unfortunely for many people 250 whp isn't enough, and forged internals is not an appealing options. a more appealing option for them is to move on to an already faster car thats begging for easy mods to make their cars fly.Forged internals + management can both be bought and installed probably less than you can get a new car for. Especially if you're one of the folks that bought their MSP when they were like 16k. Is it more appealing because it's easier? You can just bolt on things? You don't have to use your own time to research things? You don't have to come up with your own ideas? You don't have to be unique? That's not easy to me. That's mudane and ridiculous. However, since you're for all out power, go for it. You obviously bought this car for the wrong reason and now you're finding that out.


you have a point to an extent. how many people usually have 30g's laying around for a car.Whether you put it in payments or a lump sum, not many people in the crowd Mazda targeted the MSP for have 30k for a car anyway.


its not like they're gonna spend 20 k on the msp and have an extra 10 grand lying around to hook it up.Lying around? No. Taking your time and doing it right as you get the money? Yes. If you can afford the 30k car in monthly payments, you can now save the difference in those monthly payment and insurate rate differences and there ya go.


most people fiance their cars 4-5-6-7 years and get incredible low rates.Again, with the demographic Mazda marketed to, this normally doesn't happen in this age range.


how many banks are gonna approve you on a 10k loan to mod out a car?Actually, a) you don't need 10k to make this car seriously different power wise and b) there are a few memebers here who have had their banks/credit unions approve loans for car upgrades.


and if they do it would be much higher rate than the interest rate for buying a brand new car.Not really.


it would be easy to buy the more expensive car, spread out the payment over 6 years, and spend a little extra cash here and there for little bolt on parts.Maybe for some. However, for the rest, it's about making something they already love better while using what they can. If you want to go buy bolt ons like every one else in the world, go for it.

Again, it sounds like you've missed the entire point of this car. (bang)

[Hercdriver]

Thanks for sharing the video link. Hmmm, maybe the wife will drive an automatic RX-8........

[Protege52003]

I live in mass. and it sucks in the snow! Thought about getting rid of it but never did.
did you get some snow tires? i wish I had a MSP!!! will lose money on my P5 though, which I like a lot.

[yashooa]

Also, keep in mind many of us bought our MSPs when they were 20.5k, no bargaining. Sticker price only; like it or leave it. I hate to generalize but like I said before, it seems as though the people lately that have been getting them and then trading them are the ones who thought "oh, its cheap, has a turbo and looks cool. lets get it" and then they are disappointed. I have yet to see more than a couple of the original "OG" MSP owners who did pay the 20k trade in for something else; however I see numerous newer owners talking about trading every day.

There's a love that just doesn't seem to be shared amongst some of us.It is all too easy to forget what a balanced car the MSP really is.
It does everything well looks, handling, and yes Speed. It will never be an Enzo but with a simple MBC it is a fairly quick everyday commuter car.
Heck I am one of the ones who bought one in Feb03 and they would barley let you test drive one then. I paid 19k for mine and I don't feel the least bit ripped off.
I have 50k miles at 12PSI and I can still pull down more than 30MPG. It uses no oil, makes no funny noises (thanks to three sets of bushings), has more grip than I am willing to use, looks great, has a kickass stereo, carries all my kids, and has been as soild as a rock all but a couple of minor warrantied repairs. If it weren't for the fact I am spending 10's of thousands right now to buy crap for my newly built home I would have added a street legal exhaust, an SMIC with hardpipes, Desling's brackets, and thats it because this, for the most part, would correct the only major mechanical deficiencies the car has.

[t3ase]

It is all too easy to forget what a balanced car the MSP really is.
It does everything well looks, handling, and yes Speed. It will never be an Enzo but with a simple MBC it is a fairly quick everyday commuter car.
Heck I am one of the ones who bought one in Feb03 and they would barley let you test drive one then. I paid 19k for mine and I don't feel the least bit ripped off.
I have 50k miles at 12PSI and I can still pull down more than 30MPG. It uses no oil, makes no funny noises (thanks to three sets of bushings), has more grip than I am willing to use, look great, has a kickass stereo, carries all my kids, and has been as soild as a rock all but a couple of minor warrantied repairs. If it weren't for the fact I am spending 10's of thousands right now to buy crap for my newly built home I would have added a street legal exhaust, an SMIC with hardpipes, Desling's brackets, and thats it because this, for the most part, would correct the only major mechanical deficiencies the car has.
I think that's the most understandable post you've made...evAR!$

(2thumbs)

[SpicyMSP]

t3ase, there isnt really a need to sit here and argue each and every point someone is making. Everyone buys cars for different reasons, and thats ok. Argument and trying to make YOUR point was not the intention of this thread.
I just wanted to get a general idea why.

[noclue119]

t3ase, there isnt really a need to sit here and argue each and every point someone is making. Everyone buys cars for different reasons, and thats ok. Argument and trying to make YOUR point was not the intention of this thread.
I just wanted to get a general idea why.
I think most people are feed up that they can't be after market parts off the shelf for our cars which make them go faster then the srt-4.

I.E. There is not such thing as Hondata for Mazda or Swapable engine like the 240sx

[Gbourdon]

I want more luxury. I went out shopping for something that was "top of the line" for its model. I refuse to buy base model anything.

I told myself that I would not get a car without leather and it had to have a sunroof. I found the MSP and chose that. I looked at the SVT, Spec-V, Altima 3.5 and for the money and style the MSP was the winner.

If I decide to keep it then the car will get leather upholstery and possibly a sunroof.

[kicker22705]

t3ase, there isnt really a need to sit here and argue each and every point someone is making. Everyone buys cars for different reasons, and thats ok. Argument and trying to make YOUR point was not the intention of this thread.
I just wanted to get a general idea why.thank you, and thats all i was getting at. i was just giving an oppinion in a different perspective. imo, nobody was giving the completey obvious reason why people were trading in the msp. whether they didn't know, denied it, or simply b/c they were worried to get bashed for saying it.

i got the msp b/c it was the car for me. i researched this car for 6 months before i bought it. i digested every piece of information i could find in mags, web ariticles, and theses forums. i knew exactly what i was getting into when i bought it. in the end, it came down to a this, a used 00 s2k, and a 01 wrx. in that impressive group of cars, i opted for the msp. i chose that for many of the same reasons you stated tease. i liked the fact the car was came already fully loaded, i like the car was quick, i liked how the car looks, i loved how the car handled, but the edge that won me over was how rare it was. i was about to buy a msp half a country away in texas, before i was lucky enough to find one in my back yard an hour away.

tease we seem to agree on many aspects of the car and we share the same reasons why we bought it the first place and aren't trading it in. try to understand, i'm just trying give my pov of why people are trading in their cars. is it that hard to believe, many people don't see the same potential you do in the msp. they don't look that far ahead. people have different limits when they think of potential. obviously yours is well beyond what the people trading in their msp tend to view at as the limit. you said it very well here.

"It has it's limits to those owners that have limits"


"You say you're using that to maintain a "common ground" for every car yet you want to compare the engines of an economy grocery getter car to those engines in a RSX (race inspired), WRX (race inspired), RX8 (race inspired), and a SRT-4 (race inspired)"

those engines are how they came straight out from the factory - its a common ground. they are race inspired, yes, thats exactly my point. this is why they have greater potential in the factory form. they were meant to be fast and be able to handle a beating. the protege is a grocery getter like you said and they weren't meant to handle as much.

You made a point I've been trying to make right there yet you don't see to get it as you keep comparing the MSP, or any Protege for that matter, to a 350 or WRX.

OMG we are arguing on a matters we completely agree on. this is exactly what i'm saying. the msp engine is not comparable to the those of the WRX and 350z. they are on a another level above. that is exactly why people have moved on, or should i say moved up a class to the evo's, sti's, z, etc.

if people bought a msp to compete with those cars, then they are a complete idiot or genious. idiots if they thought they could keep up with the fast cars with only bolt ons b/c it was turbo. genious if they knew the power that can be achieved beyond the bolt on stage, to go along w/ its already steller handling would make it a worthy car in any scene.

[SpicyMSP]

Dam STFU already

[thunder]

Regardless of all the bla-bla, pro or against, this car is just great, period! I mean, for your dollar you don't get the best power (that's the SRT-4), but you get best FWD handling, best looks, best stereo, 4 doors, and best smiles per mile! It's useless to compare it with cars that are $5000+ more expensive, they belong to another class. Whenever in doubt, just read again what Bryan Herta said about the MP3 (an article comparing grip of Ferraris, Porsches...) a couple of years ago, and think that you have a car that's even better than that!

[Gbourdon]

I like chocolate milk. The kind I make myself is best. I do not like chocolate syrup to make my chocolate milk. I use the Nesquick powder.

[Swerny]

I don't understand the trading it in part, or the need to be the fastest car on the block.
I bought mine thinking it had everything I wanted at the time (4 doors, looks, handling, stereo, good power) and that I wouldn't need to mod it.
I was also one of the original group, i waited for it and paid sticker.
As time went on, i was craving more of everything (as I always do and I think everyone does to a lesser or greater degree).
An MBC, intake, exhaust, more stereo, the car is still perfect for me in every way.
Then again, i don't need to be the fastest, I don't drag race and couldn;t care less if the WRX or SRT are faster, have more power or whatever.
I agree with what people have said here, if you bought this car thinking you would blow the doors off other cars, you bought it for the wrong reason. There are better options out there for a 1/4 mile beast etc.

[kicker22705]

Dam STFU already
STFU??? where do you get off telling me that. you asked the question. is that how you go about all the answers to the questions that are replied to you? or just the ones where you don't agree w/ the reply.

i didn't have to answer this question, especially b/c i'm not one of the people who isn't satisfied w/ the msp and want to sell it, but you asked and you weren't getting any answers. You got a bunch of i dunno's, so i politely answered w/ a different pov.

if you don't wanna hear the answers to your questions, don't waste anyone's time asking it next time.

[SpicyMSP]

crap your going on and on and on.... I have A.D.D mmm kay.. I read about 1/4 of your posts because they ARE SOOO LONG for no reason.. thanks for your feedback about the car, which IS what i was asking yes. But I just went and told clay to back off you, and he did, and now your jumping back on him. .. so leave it be with your oppinion about the car, its all i asked for.

[kicker22705]

point taken. sorry i tend to ramble when i try to make my point. hope ya got the answer you were looking for.

[CommieSpeed]

I like chocolate milk. The kind I make myself is best. I do not like chocolate syrup to make my chocolate milk. I use the Nesquick powder.That is total bullshit man. Don't come on this forum talking that shit unless you have knowledge to back it up. The chocolate syrup, when mixed properly, produces a more creamy and delicious milky treat. The powder continually clumps and sticks to the bottom, resulting in little floating bitter dust chunks in my milk. I think I'll make some with Hershey's Syrup right now....

[C-Bass]

The main reason I want to get rid of mine is because it runs (hesitates) like a$$.(boom02)

(werd)

Mine runs like crap too, although I'm pretty sure the dealership never actually flashed it when I asked them to. If I was going to end up getting rid of mine (a very real possibility) it would be so I could afford to put myself through school without working a full-time job at the same time.

[C-Bass]

That is total bullshit man. Don't come on this forum talking that shit unless you have knowledge to back it up. The chocolate syrup, when mixed properly, produces a more creamy and delicious milky treat. The powder continually clumps and sticks to the bottom, resulting in little floating bitter dust chunks in my milk. I think I'll make some with Hershey's Syrup right now....

(screwy) F'kin' noob. Everybody knows the powder is the best when you mix it with 2% milk and mix it in a blender. Sure, if you're a lazy little B then the syrup is better, but true chocolate milk afficianados will tell you every time that powder is the way to go.

[thunder]

I don't understand all this about the hesitation, it's an easy (and cheap) fix... Get it flashed asap. You can also improve this further by switching to iridium plugs AND, to make sure, add Joe's FPR. I'll guarantee you that the car will run VERY smooth!

[yashooa]

[QUOTE=SpicyMSP]crap your going on and on and on.... I have A.D.D mmm kay.. I read about 1/4 of your posts because they ARE SOOO LONG for no reason.. QUOTE]

I do to :) That's why I take lots-0-METH (stoned) In fact it is about time for my afternoon Ritalin mmmm sweet, sweet Rit...
Not as smooth as Concerta but twice as tasty. Concerta is like pussified Ritalin, Adderall is like fucking SUPER strength triple mixed Meth cocktail.
STRATERA SUCKS T3H BAWLS!!!

Oh yes, I like my car.

[shaolin]

Dammit, I posted why I traded mine in, and you people still continue to ponder this question. WTF is with this thread...geez...you guys are like a bunch of cry babies.

[JDM Sam]

Its kinda good for the people who wanted em in the first place. They can now buy ones used for a whole lot cheaper now. just gotta fix all the fuck ups the previous owner did.

[MazdaSpeedTurbo]

Well ive been through 3 cars in the 3 past years,and I thought THAT was bad.... but have had my MSP the longest so far... Almost 2 years now.
But Why do people get bored so easily?
There are SOO many people that just got tired of the MSP and are selling them now, even less then a year of ownership. Why is it that people are getting rid of the MSPs so quickly for something 'bigger' and 'better'?
:confused: ill have my msp till i cant get parts anymore or well it falls apart to the frame.. paying this much for a car i will ge tmy use out of it and to think when it is gone be time to move onto the next big thing while my old speed will be running 13's or lower who knows.

[GI-]

I just got a trade in offer of $11,000.00 on mine. I was fucking floored...I told the dealership to get fucked!

[muohio]

People trade in cars all the time. You hear more abou this car because there's a dedicated forum and a small amount of owners. I'm sure if you look at any other type of vehicle, the same thing happens. Hell, I've had 3 cars in 2 years and lost some money, but I never planned on not having a car payment. As long as I'm not rolling over more than a grad, I really don't mind getting something new. As far as the MSP goes, the car was great, but it was time for something a little more comfortable.

[trippertripp]

well i am in the market for an msp i have a P5 i want something faster than it. i got my P5 cheap as hell kelly blue book tells me it is worth at least 11,900 i got it for 10,900 this was a year ago the P5 is in great condition so if any of you that are saying they want to trade int he msp and get something different take my P5 off my hands and ill gladly take the msp off yours

[Wha'Happened]

I find it odd that some of the longest posts on this forum are all about people re-justifying their purchase of an MSP. All I know is I like mine and I wont sell it until I reach its full tuning potential.

[t3ase]

crap your going on and on and on.... I have A.D.D mmm kay.. I read about 1/4 of your posts because they ARE SOOO LONG for no reason.. thanks for your feedback about the car, which IS what i was asking yes. But I just went and told clay to back off you, and he did, and now your jumping back on him. .. so leave it be with your oppinion about the car, its all i asked for.
Sorry Steph, I'll keep my views and opinions off of the board from now on; especially those regarding my Mazda.

[t3ase]

[QUOTE=SpicyMSP]crap your going on and on and on.... I have A.D.D mmm kay.. I read about 1/4 of your posts because they ARE SOOO LONG for no reason.. QUOTE]

I do to :) That's why I take lots-0-METH (stoned) In fact it is about time for my afternoon Ritalin mmmm sweet, sweet Rit...
Not as smooth as Concerta but twice as tasty. Concerta is like pussified Ritalin, Adderall is like fucking SUPER strength triple mixed Meth cocktail.
STRATERA SUCKS T3H BAWLS!!!

Oh yes, I like my car.
Yanno, Adderall was very short lived with me and it didn't do much energy wise, as meth did. Then agaain, I had a huge meth history so comparing the two may be useless. *shrug*

[Replica]

I'll keep my car until I get bored of it. Do people not have the right to get bored with their cars?

[SpicyMSP]

Sorry Steph, I'll keep my views and opinions off of the board from now on; especially those regarding my Mazda.

um, yea... (crazy)

[yashooa]

Yanno, Adderall was very short lived with me and it didn't do much energy wise, as meth did. Then agaain, I had a huge meth history so comparing the two may be useless. *shrug* Man all the Meth damn near puts me to sleep. Adderall made me like zombie, but Rit knocks me down just enough to not talk constantly and irritate everyone around me :)
Allthough it feels like I am in super slow-mo until it levels out. Stratera just makes me want to kill everyone. (argh)
Funny thing is Adderall was a diet drug composed of THREE methamphetamines and they did not know it made hyper people calm until they gave it to fat kids LOL.

[yashooa]

I'll keep my car until I get bored of it. Do people not have the right to get bored with their cars?NO you do not! You filthly sell out WHORE!!!! (boobs)

[Gbourdon]

Man all the Meth damn near puts me to sleep. Adderall made me like zombie, but Rit knocks me down just enough to not talk constantly and irritate everyone around me :)
Allthough it feels like I am in super slow-mo until it levels out. Stratera just makes me want to kill everyone. (argh)
Funny thing is Adderall was a diet drug composed of THREE methamphetamines and they did not know it made hyper people calm until they gave it to fat kids LOL.
Glass. I dont care for much of that stuff anymore because the next day I feel like a bad citizen. LOL

Chocolate milk on the other hand.... Have you seen those cups that have the little electric motor built right in for making chocolate milk. I might have to get one of those bad larrys

[Dr.Sound]

i know someone here who likes pez, who arround this time last year was REALLY thinking of trading in her MSP for an evo.......hmmm, who might that be?

[SpicyMSP]

wasnt me... I think about it, but I would not do it now.

[Grip & Drift]

shoot had mine for a year now and love it..

almost almost sold it though this weekend to buy my Friends NSX... still might.

but i love the car.. its loads of fun.

[MSP Pro]

Sigh. As the old man of the group (yep, gray hair and all) who bought one of the first ones in Jan 03, I'd have to say that I enjoy the hell out of my MSP. Of course, I get my jollies autocrossing and this car is the BEST for autox. I've finished my second year of competition, and my MSP has taught me soooo much about car control at the edge of adhesion, I can't believe how much fun I'm having! I've gone from placing 25th out of 100 drivers at a local event to placing consistently in the top 5. And weekend before last I won the stock class at the Oregon Shootout, and placed 3rd overall. I'm looking forward to next year when I hope to continue to improve my driving to where I'm starting to catch up to the national class autox drivers in the Seattle club. My point is, this car is tuned so well right out of the box, that you can learn a whole lot about car control at the limits, if you just compete and listen to what the car tells you.

The iceing on the cake is that I can put my whole family in it, get 26 to 30 miles per gallon, and enjoy my tunes on mp3s through the cd player while I drive. What a great car! Thank you Mazda!

[t3ase]

Steph, I love you.

The picture of you with white creme all over your face kinda helps, though.

[122 Vega]

I went through a period where I really hated Mazda for may car. I have always loved the car, but Madza is a piece of crap. Life has become a lot better since I decided to enjoy the car for what it is (which is what I bought it for) and to just fix stuff as it breaks. No more arguing for weeks with the dealerships just to get little things fixed. My health and sanity are not worth it.

I love my Mazdaspeed. My wife told me that now she knows that I will have it forever, as long as I don't wreck it at a track day or something.

Britt

[ONRAILS]

I Love my car!!! With the right bolt-ons, this car is awesome. Still having fun with it after a year. 21kmiles

[thunder]

It's interesting to see how things sometimes evolve in well defined phases: on this forum we first had people wanting (badly) to buy the MSP and those who just bought it and everyone was excited. Then, is was the "bolt on" phase (CAI vs SRI and the like) as well as the "boost up". Of course the next stage was the "blown engine" period, and the search for more sophisticated mods (ECU, forged stuff...). Now it seems we are in the "period of disappointment" and lots of people are selling, although some have totally valid reasons fo this. I bet (hope) that the next phase will be the regret or missing of the MSP when the new car factor will fade out. And maybe then, some will rediscover how good this car is (within it's class). And for those who soldier on, it will be the inevitable: "I told you so!" The MSP will never be a WRX Sti, EVO or Supra... It's just a very, very nice go-kart that's perfect for some serious driving and learning while also being practical and unique :)

[mspdfreak]

I'm waiting for the stage where all those who sold their MSP for the SRT-4 come back here and say "man, this car sux! The knobs are falling off, the stereo blows, Dodge really DOESN'T cover the stage 1,2,3 under warranty..but I ran a 13 right before the motor blew!" Ahh...I will be loving my MSP even more!

[H-Town Speed]

Well I've had my MSP for 11 months now and after 18k miles I'm still in love with it. Even though it's a tempermental little bitch at times, it always seems to reward me with trouble free miles. I don't continously beat on it with 4.5k rpm clutch dumps but rather drive it in a very inspired way and it always seems to please. And the occasional 3.0k rpm tire shredding launch rewards me with a huge shit eating grin on my face. I realize that it's not the fastest car around the block, but it is a badass car for what it is(a turbo'd family sedan). And don't even get me started on the handling of this car. All I'll say is that there's this little short winding road called "Old Katy Road" that you can turn onto from the feeder road of Beltway 8 before you reach I-10(You Houstonians might know what I'm talking about) that is absolutely awesome to take at about 50mph in 2nd gear. (naughty) I can't think of anything, short of a serious mechanical problem, that would cause me to trade in this car before the loan period is over. Then again, in my family we tend to keep our cars for atleast 10 years and over 100k miles. My other vehicle a 93 Ford Ranger has 202,000 trouble free miles on the stock engine and auto tranny(neither have been rebuilt), so maybe I'm just a little easier on vehicles than others are. Anyway did I mention that I ABSOLUTELY LOVE MY MSP!!!!!(dance)

[protegeV]

had the car only two weeks and one mod(injen) and Im loving it, but damn this turkey needs to GO(lol2)

[Dr.Sound]

^ LMAO.
oh......i remember the times when turkey was just emerging......only a hand full of people with prototype injens, a few with cone filters......people loved the turkey........those were the days........

i love my turkey, and i love my speed.

[Grip & Drift]

i love my turkey hehe... always wanted a car that had that awesome rally car blowoff sound to it. =)

[SpicyMSP]

Steph, I love you.

The picture of you with white creme all over your face kinda helps, though.OMG(headshake


^ LMAO.
oh......i remember the times when turkey was just emerging......only a hand full of people with prototype injens, a few with cone filters......people loved the turkey........those were the days........
i love my turkey, and i love my speed.
OMG Vic did you hear the Injen CAI is out NOW~??~ OMG OMG OMG no one knows yet!(kissass)

[ZoomZoomH]

dudes (and steph), your car is ONLY 1 year old (2 for the really old MSPs), it's the arguably the best stock Protege ever (save for the 323 GTX/GTR), you should be out enjoying the p!ss out of it instead of flaking out on such a wonderful car!

[SpicyMSP]

2 years old y0. 43k miles later.

[Grip & Drift]

7 months old... and um.. 2900 miles...
but i really do love the car :D

[SpicyMSP]

Hank I think your the only one who has the mochi pic.. I dont even have it..