Stupid Fast W/Water Injection

[jeffmsp]

hey guys,

I finnally got my water injection kit installed and working properly. This is by far the best mod on the car. I installed it a bit differently than others by removing the lower section of the stock airbox and mounting the pump on the bracket usually used for the coolant res overflow and callaway elbo. It took me a while to get everything installed right. I got the kit from aquamist. They have great customer support and all of my e-mails where answered within a day at the most! The wiring harness was a real pain since mine had contradicting numbers for the wires, but through trial and error I got it figured out. The car is stupid fast now, Ive got my first taste of making power in this car and I must say it is great. The only problem I am having is with my JoePMBC. The boost is spiking to 1 bar and then holding 10 to redline. There is no sign of deto, my stock plugs look fine even after 25,000 kilometers of hard driving before the install, but I think I should look into somethig cooler and copper in the near future. The car finnally has top end power. It never had any before, even with the 8psi to redline I used to have, it nothing compared to 10 to redline. The only thing I am starting to worry about is the rods going. Do you guys think I am living a little too dangerously with that spike or can I pull it off. I am running 94 octane and windshield washer fluid for the injection. The car seems to be running fine, but from what I understand the stock rods could go at any time when boosting this high right? Ive already bought a head to work on, and a block with 8:5:1 pistons and nice rods are going to be installed in the spring but do you guys think I can pull it off until then? The only other mods I am planning on is to relocate the maf to the IC-TB pipe and to add a CAI (or should I just put a cone on the turbo?) Anyways, I cant tell you guys enough about how well the car pulls. 2nd gear is gone so fast compared to before you guys wouldnt believe it. (thumb)

I will post vids and pics later, gotta go have fun (boobs) (burnout)

[jersey_emt]

How much did the kit run you?

I've never heard of using windshield washer fluid....only water, alcohol, and a water/alch mix.

[msp4you]

How much did the kit run you?

I've never heard of using windshield washer fluid....only water, alcohol, and a water/alch mix.Windshield washer fluid contains methyl alcohol, more known as methanol. Among other ingredients, which a google will give you, it works just as well.

[jersey_emt]

Yes but won't the other ingredients cause problems?

[Puckpimp71]

As long as they evaporate easily and leave very little or no residue, I don't think they'll hurt. Plus it'll keep bugs from sticking to the pistons... they're a PITA to remove.

[YP5 Toronto]

My only concern is would be making sure you are supporting the higher PSI with the proper fuel ratios.

Water/Alch injection is traditionally used as the "final" steps in a FI project.... it is used when all else has been done to peak efficiency (timing, a/f ratios)...and injections allows you to take it further.

Water/alch injection should not be used IN place of proper tuning --> with the goal being higher PSI without detonation.

Still good news.

[Wesman II]

I am using windshield washer fluid mixed with a small amount of HEET.

[jeffmsp]

how much boost do people with fmics run, I would imagine 10-12 psi using the same fuel maps as I am so I think I will be ok. The car also has a very small exhaust leak on the downpipe-cat flange so it is running a little richer than normal also. I think the 94 helps too. Unflashed too :)

[Stormtrooper77]

Where does this "water" get injected?

[Jeph]

How do you know you're not detonating? You might not be able to hear it, but its still probably there. You should invest in the J&S next just to be safe.

[jeffmsp]

well, having blown a few 1.8lbps, ive learned to listen for it lol. Pulled all plugs and they look good. Piston tops appear fine, no timing is being pulled by the
ecu, I dont even have my intake temp sensor pulled out anymore.

The car just doesnt stop pulling (headbang)

(it would be funny if my next post is like "well, the motors blown..." lol)

[Jeph]

haha i hope not! I just think the J&S would be a very good addition to your setup

[acidbbg]

Well the reason why it drops back down to 10 psi is b/c of the wastegate spring/rod. If you changed it..you should be able to get the psi dialed in the way you want!

Good luck..and keep us uptodate!

Chas

[jeffmsp]

yeah, thats what i think you where saying earlier. Do you have a link or any info on how to do so, what kind etc.

[Glowmunkey]

Great news, can I see some pics of Aquamist's kit?

Others are having success running boost that high with race gas, so I can't imagine it's an issue. If you aren't detonating, you should be fine. We're running a similar setup (washer fluid and all) on a supercharged Prelude, and I was thinking about trying this on the Speed.

I'd definately rock the colder copper plugs though.

[Mallard]

got any pics of the set up? Or a link to the company's web site? Also what scan tool are you using? (since you say it's not pulling timing)

[BlkZoomZoom]

Damn, I just ran a 13.44 @ 104.8 with only 10psi... a 13.6 @ 8-9psi. I'm thinking 15psi isn't needed anymore....or is it just me? lol

[Wesman II]

Where does this "water" get injected?

It goes into the charge pipe before the throttle body. Its not like a fire hose its more like a hairspray mist. It mostly evaporates by the time it hits the intake valve.

I was running about 12psi with a FMIC, then 14psi with the water injection.

Jeff your clutch is OK?

[jurgs01]

Glad to see you went with aquamist instead of one of the cheap knock-offs. Everyone who is thinking about doing this should educate themselves:

http://www.aquamist.co.uk/info/

This site has all the info you could want plus a forum discussing the subject. There are some highly educated people on that forum that not only know about water/alcohol injection, they are very knowledgeable in tuning cars. It all comes down to the specific heat of water and it's unparalleled cooling ability on the inside of the cylinders. Educate yourselves. There are many rights and wrongs in doing something like this.

[jeffmsp]

Damn, I just ran a 13.44 @ 104.8 with only 10psi... a 13.6 @ 8-9psi. I'm thinking 15psi isn't needed anymore....or is it just me? lol

Its not, I am spiking cause of the shat mbc. 10ish to redline has been my plan from the beginning. I dont know how the fuck you are running 13.6@9psi cause at 9 with no injection I couldnt even beat a 14.5 car...You must be a amazing driver or not telling us something (uhm)


Jeff your clutch is OK?

Well, since I realized in the other water injection post that my clutch shouldnt hold the power, I have been having the majority of my fun going 2nd-3rd and it seems to hold up fine. (for testing purposes I went through 1-5 a few times on the first night and it held fine)The LSD actually works pretty well also ( weird ) Shifting into 3rd I hardly get any wheelspin, but you definately feel when the car gets traction.

[blynzoo]

Do you guys think I am living a little too dangerously with that spike or can I pull it off. I am running 94 octane and windshield washer fluid for the injection. The car seems to be running fine, but from what I understand the stock rods could go at any time when boosting this high right? Ive already bought a head to work on, and a block with 8:5:1 pistons and nice rods are going to be installed in the spring but do you guys think I can pull it off until then? The only other mods I am planning on is to relocate the maf to the IC-TB pipe and to add a CAI (or should I just put a cone on the turbo?) Anyways, I cant tell you guys enough about how well the car pulls. 2nd gear is gone so fast compared to before you guys wouldnt believe it. (thumb)

I will post vids and pics later, gotta go have fun (boobs) (burnout)In the past 3 weeks alone we have 4 posts of people blowing at 10psi. Hitting a bar (14.7) without mgmt is going to kill you.

Just my .02, of course, but I think you are going "right into the danger zone" to borrow that lame song from Top Gun. :)

[BlkZoomZoom]

check out my thread in general performance section. I've been doing alittle "playing" this past weekend. Oh 60's still suck balls.

[Brian MP5T]

__________________________________________________ _____

Quote Corkey Bell - "The water injector is not a very interesting device. It has little place in a properly conceived turbo system...A water injector on a turbo car is a poor excuse band aid for not doing the job correctly in the first place" Pg.70 of Maximum Boost

__________________________________________________ ____________

Hey Jeff, I just want to say that I am personally not impressed with your idea. Sorry man... Brian

[tekkie]

Brian who are you talking to ? JeffMSP or Corkey Bell?

[Brian MP5T]

Brian who are you talking to ? JeffMSP or Corkey Bell?
(hand)


The quote was from Maximum Boost.

[tekkie]

lol yeah I know that, what I meant was were you agreeing with Corky Bell..... ok that was dumb how can you not agree with that guy, lol

yeah I agree I dont like this injection idea either, sorry guys

[mspdfreak]

Two Words...Ka-Boom!

[jurgs01]

lol yeah I know that, what I meant was were you agreeing with Corky Bell..... ok that was dumb how can you not agree with that guy, lol

yeah I agree I dont like this injection idea either, sorry guys
Read about it. There is no reason to agree or disagree with the whole idea. Water has about four times (off the top of my head) to specific heat of fuel (for cooling). This is a great way to keep your cylinders cooler during higher boost pressures. It is not a band-aid, it is a great addition to a car with engine management.

[tekkie]

Im not saying that it does not work, I'm just saying not for me, if I was running forged I would probably go for it. (shrug)


Read about it. There is no reason to agree or disagree with the whole idea. Water has about four times (off the top of my head) to specific heat of fuel (for cooling). This is a great way to keep your cylinders cooler during higher boost pressures. It is not a band-aid, it is a great addition to a car with engine management.

[Brian MP5T]

JURGS01

That does not change the tensile loading on the rods... Forged internals is a documented requirement for this car before any attempts to up the boost...

Count the Dead Motor threads. There are MODS here that have learned at the school of "REBUILD THE SHORT BLOCK" and got an A+.

[jeffmsp]

That does not change the tensile loading on the rods... Forged internals is a documented requirement for this car before any attempts to up the boost...

Is there anyone here who is running stock boost on an msp? j/k I will take your guys advice and turn the boost down a bit, I hit fuel cut for the first time ever last night (FCD was off cause I was rewiring everything nice) racing a 1s gen talon. He had mbc, intake exhaust blah,blah he kept blowing off beside me so I got pissed off after a while and ran him. In 2nd gear I went WOT @ around 4k, spiked to 14ish and took off hard, I got ahead of him but then hit what I gues was fuel cut, so I shifted 3rd and gave like 95% throttle, pulled fine and I beat him. Oddly enough it didnt happen later on in the night, but i think it warmed up a few degrees. Went home and checked the plugs and tops of pistons, everything looks nice and clean, no signs of deto etc. (running 90% methenol, 10% washer fluid) but I get what your saying about the rods so I guess its time to smarten up, payments havent even started on the msp and a blown motor would be quite the bitch, I would have a $25,000 paper weight lol Guess this will motivate me to get the new motor done.

gay,gay 10 psi here I come... (hand)

[acidbbg]

JURGS01

That does not change the tensile loading on the rods... Forged internals is a documented requirement for this car before any attempts to up the boost...

Count the Dead Motor threads. There are MODS here that have learned at the school of "REBUILD THE SHORT BLOCK" and got an A+.
True..it don't change the fact that the internals can only handle so much power. But it's been proven that the protege engine can handle well over 250whp!

the reason why people have blown so many engines (msp)..is b/c they didn't/don't get the necessary upgrades that will/should save their engines.
EX. FMIC, Water injection, EMS.

-Chas

[acidbbg]

Is there anyone here who is running stock boost on an msp? j/k I will take your guys advice and turn the boost down a bit, I hit fuel cut for the first time ever last night (FCD was off cause I was rewiring everything nice) racing a 1s gen talon. He had mbc, intake exhaust blah,blah he kept blowing off beside me so I got pissed off after a while and ran him. In 2nd gear I went WOT @ around 4k, spiked to 14ish and took off hard, I got ahead of him but then hit what I gues was fuel cut, so I shifted 3rd and gave like 95% throttle, pulled fine and I beat him. Oddly enough it didnt happen later on in the night, but i think it warmed up a few degrees. Went home and checked the plugs and tops of pistons, everything looks nice and clean, no signs of deto etc. (running 90% methenol, 10% washer fluid) but I get what your saying about the rods so I guess its time to smarten up, payments havent even started on the msp and a blown motor would be quite the bitch, I would have a $25,000 paper weight lol Guess this will motivate me to get the new motor done.

gay,gay 10 psi here I come... (hand)
With the setup you are runnin..10-14psi..is very do able. Just be sure that you don't run out of the methanol/washer fluid mix.

Also, people say that runnin a water injection kit is a band aid..

What do you think runnin racing fuel is?
(wink)

[jeffmsp]

well, I made my way up to woodbridge tonight taking the fight to the hondas. One of my buddies has a H22 in his civic coupe, suppost to be running mid 13s without N02, we did not go from a stop, but several times 2nd gear on. Had no problems keeping up beside him the whole way, he never pulled a car length on me and he has a nice build too, cam gears (for the n02 I guess?,,) headers, intake blah,blah then tried to take my buddies Type-R civic hatch, after 2nd he had me by a length, two at the most at times, still though, I am very impressed with how the car is running. Pulled the plugs again and all is good in the world of higher boost. Car runs like a champ, idles fine etc. Hit fuel cut again, but the parking lot FCD reinstall took care of that lol (ran 12ish spike, 10ish - redline for the night, back to 10 for daily driving........for now)

Good times and only a few more paychecks to go before shit really starts hitting the fan :D

[BlkZoomZoom]

Since when does spraying water in your engine make it faster? Or am I reading this wrong? I always thought it actually slowed you down alittle (not too much), but kept things cooler to stay away from detonation. I know one thing.....I only use water in the engine when I do a top engine clean.

[mp5jeff]

ive only seen water injection as a substitute for an intercooler...

[jurgs01]

Since when does spraying water in your engine make it faster? Or am I reading this wrong? I always thought it actually slowed you down alittle (not too much), but kept things cooler to stay away from detonation. I know one thing.....I only use water in the engine when I do a top engine clean.
It doesn't make you faster, but it does allow you to push more boost and advance timing without as much chance of detonation. This is a must for someone messing with engine management in my opinion. It's better for someone who is going to run 13psi anyway to get this, but I would not run higher psi without better internals period. I'm conservative though.

[Brian MP5T]

It doesn't make you faster, but it does allow you to push more boost and advance timing without as much chance of detonation. This is a must for someone messing with engine management in my opinion. It's better for someone who is going to run 13psi anyway to get this, but I would not run higher psi without better internals period. I'm conservative though.
Why the hell don't you dump something more usefull than watter into your intake to cool it... Fuel perhaps... The EIC-2 that I am running does the same thing except it's adding fuel and cooling the intake at the same time.. (boobs2)

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/LOGO%20OPO%20-%20(1).jpg

[jeffmsp]

im dumping 99.9% methenol now, guess the title is misleading. It works beter than fuel, makes the car run rucher and gives me a crazy octane rating, plus 94 to run on helps to.

I get what you guys are talking about needing to tune, so it will stay around 10 (what i have been trying to do in the first place) the spike isnt there purposely, my damn mbc just sucks. Ive got it going 12ish-10ish now but it still has issues.


Do any of you know of a decent dual stage mbc that would work well with my setup?

BTW-started drawing up the plans for the custom fmic install, its gonna be nice.

[Wesman II]

__________________________________________________ _____

Quote Corkey Bell - "The water injector is not a very interesting device. It has little place in a properly conceived turbo system...A water injector on a turbo car is a poor excuse band aid for not doing the job correctly in the first place" Pg.70 of Maximum Boost

__________________________________________________ ____________

Hey Jeff, I just want to say that I am personally not impressed with your idea. Sorry man... Brian


Brian I am pretty sure Corky would hold his nose if he saw our turbo setup. Its not 'properly conceived' by a long shot! Parts borrowed from here, there, and everywhere, and bolted to a N/A sewing machine.
That being said, that is only one engineers opinion on it. In WWII they thought enough of it to use it in supercharged warplane engines. They used it in F1 in the turbo cars of the 80's and it worked so well they banned it.
No wonder my friend was ripping on it after he read Maximum Boost.

[mp5jeff]

did supercharged warplane engines have intercoolers? my guess is no although i don't know...brings me back to what i said before, i have seen alot of people trade water injection/alch injection instead of using a intercooler(which is what i was going to do before i decided to go with a fmic)

[jeffmsp]

well soon enough i will be in the fmic club so the charge will be like ice by the time it gets into the motor, fmic, full exhaust and injection = bliss

btw brian, is your motor built?

[mp5jeff]

yea lets see some track times when you are done with fmic and such..

[Brian MP5T]

Brian I am pretty sure Corky would hold his nose if he saw our turbo setup. Its not 'properly conceived' by a long shot! Parts borrowed from here, there, and everywhere, and bolted to a N/A sewing machine.
That being said, that is only one engineers opinion on it. In WWII they thought enough of it to use it in supercharged warplane engines. They used it in F1 in the turbo cars of the 80's and it worked so well they banned it.
No wonder my friend was ripping on it after he read Maximum Boost.
Yes, Agreed. The point I was trying to make was that, there has to be a more suitable long term solution...

[Brian MP5T]

well soon enough i will be in the fmic club so the charge will be like ice by the time it gets into the motor, fmic, full exhaust and injection = bliss

btw brian, is your motor built?
Absoloutely!
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/MP5T%20RUN.jpg

[Glowmunkey]

I don't see why these water injection kits can't be seen as a perfectly viable way to intercool... they've been used for a while now, with good success, and right now, I think the LAST thing most of us MSP drivers need is more fuel - I think we all know that they deliver MORE than enough. I realize that Corky Bell doesn't like water injection, but oh well, he doesn't like the idea of running a motor pig rich to fight detonation either. It's not a perfect world, and if it works, go for it.

[Brian MP5T]

I don't see why these water injection kits can't be seen as a perfectly viable way to intercool...
There are many problems that have to be dealt with getting more out of a car with a turbo. Personally, running rich was not ever going to be a problem, flash, fuel cut ETC... were never an issue as I have a P5 ECU and for some reason the Extra injector controller and the P5 seem to run great right up to 15 Psi on 8.5:1. I'm dropping to 8:1 in the spring and going for 17 PSI.

[Wesman II]

That is an impressive 60 foot time Brian. What tires is that with?

[Brian MP5T]

That is an impressive 60 foot time Brian. What tires is that with?
Yokohama Parada Spec-2. They don't last very long on my car for some reason or another and at $643.00 a Pair installed with tax, I try to make my runs count. Recently, I've stopped doing massive burnouts to get them hot. Rather, run the car up to 160km/h for a bit and then a small burn to clean em off as it were. Works the same. If you are going to look into some new tires, they are quite good, however, be careful not to get "Fooked" by the dealer. The Spec-1 are A for traction and the Spec-2 are AA. The Spec 1 are cheaper and the tires look almost identical unless you start reading the sidewall. The Spec-1's have been discontinued but some companies are still trying to unload the old stock...

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/1.jpg

[Brian MP5T]

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=5356

Injection...

[Riles]

I'm glad you're having good results with your water injection. I hope you can put up those good numbers to shut up the nay-sayers I had because I can't drive FWD very well at the track.

I need to get an FCD before hitting the track again- I've been working with my boost controller a little more, and now I'm hitting fuel cut in the 12 psi area when I use ice in the water/meth tank. I am also considering getting one of those frame-rail fuel coolers that hot-rods use to cool the mix down even further before it gets to the engine.

Jeff- you from Jersey? I noticed that you said Woodbridge, and I was wonderin if that meant Woodbridge NJ. I'll be back in town in October and I'm going to get a good run at Englishtown before it closes for the season.

FCD is the top of my list now, but there is also a CAI on the way- I was using just a filter on the MAF, and some damn hot air was getting into the engine.

So, to sum up this too-long post, put up good numbers! I'm glad you felt the seat-of-the-pants improvement like I did!

[Wesman II]

Yokohama Parada Spec-2. They don't last very long on my car for some reason or another and at $643.00 a Pair installed with tax, I try to make my runs count. Recently, I've stopped doing massive burnouts to get them hot. Rather, run the car up to 160km/h for a bit and then a small burn to clean em off as it were. Works the same. If you are going to look into some new tires, they are quite good, however, be careful not to get "Fooked" by the dealer. The Spec-1 are A for traction and the Spec-2 are AA. The Spec 1 are cheaper and the tires look almost identical unless you start reading the sidewall. The Spec-1's have been discontinued but some companies are still trying to unload the old stock...

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/1.jpg

I am running those tires in my Speed. They hook better than stock in a straight line, but not like a drag radial. Your 60 ft time is .3 - .4 lower than any other protege I have seen on streets. XSIVSPD's with drag radials was 1.9 which is flying !

[Brian MP5T]

I am running those tires in my Speed. They hook better than stock in a straight line, but not like a drag radial. Your 60 ft time is .3 - .4 lower than any other protege I have seen on streets. XSIVSPD's with drag radials was 1.9 which is flying !
I had to ride the clutch a bit on the launch. I hold 3,000 Rpm and let go about 95% of the friction point. It harldy looses any traction. What a rush...

[azian6er]

so im assuming that dyno graph was a g-tech pro right?

Go to a real track and see if you can still make those numbers. I have heard that the g-tech isnt really the most accurate device. im not doubting you i am just curious.

And for the paradas, they are about the crappiet tire you can buy other than hankooks. I know this because my best friend has worked at Discount tire for 3 Years and he has relayed this to me. They are cheap, and dont perform very well.

I dont mean to sound harsh, but I am just curious what your car would run on the track. Also, i am letting you knwo that the parads really arent that great of a tire.

-Bryan

[Brian MP5T]

so im assuming that dyno graph was a g-tech pro right?

Go to a real track and see if you can still make those numbers. I have heard that the g-tech isnt really the most accurate device. im not doubting you i am just curious.

And for the paradas, they are about the crappiet tire you can buy other than hankooks. I know this because my best friend has worked at Discount tire for 3 Years and he has relayed this to me. They are cheap, and dont perform very well.

I dont mean to sound harsh, but I am just curious what your car would run on the track. Also, i am letting you knwo that the parads really arent that great of a tire.

-BryanIt's cool that everyone has an opinion. Don't take that the wrong way, it was not meant to be offensive.

I've had Nitto and Goodyear on some of my other cars and I will never trade the Yokohama brand. So far I have been extreemly happy with everything to do with the tires. Whatever your friend said to you isn't gospel. I'm sure he is a very smart chap, but Independant comapnies have tested the Z range tires for "Protege Vous" (Protect Yourself in French) Magazine here in Canada, and the Parada-2 came in second only to the TOYO T-1 out of 15 tires tested.

On your question of accuracy. Even if it is off by 5%, the numbers are still rather impressive for a Protege5. I have taken the car to a weigh scale and got the weight down to within 5 pounds. See you on the 1/4.

Good luck with your quest for 12's

[jeffmsp]

i know this thread is really old but i had some stuff to add about the system now that I have used it for over a year and Ill try to explain some of the benefits etc.

injecting only water will chemically intercool the intake charge. I did not see the same results at say 8psi with only injection compared to 8psi with the FMIC and no injection. Obviously the water isnt the greatest way to intercool, however it does work. injecting water will also cool the cylinder temps which helps prevent detonation from advanced boost or ignition. Injecting water will be beneficial regardless of boost level.

Injecting methenol is even more effective. I usually run around 70meth / 30water mix. The methenols cooling capabilities are greater than running h20 alone. If you have ever put your finger in some meth you can get a first hand experience. It costs about $9 for a decent sized container at home depot(cdn-i think its a little over 4 liters, cant remember off the top of my head) The methenol does an even better job of fighting off detonation since it is a highly potent fuel. I cant find the exact equation, but I read somewhere injecting methenol with a needle sized for apps. under 300HP combined with 94 octance gas will give you the detonation equivilancy of running over 100 octane + the cylinders and intake charge are further cooled. Running a strong mix (say 80 / 20) and injecting it when it is not need will result in the car running slightly rich (msps are rich enough) so it can hurt performance if not properly setup. I have mine set to begin injecting after 9psi since I am still using the stock fuel system. I have run the car up to 14psi on the stock motor with no problems, however that is not something I would do daily and it doesnt mean that the motor will not blow up, it just means its been done. I am still in perfect compression land after 60K and I am sure the methenol is responcible for my motors well being. (though adding a J&S would be icing on my cake :) ) Many EMS are able to handle methenol injection and when combined with good tuning, methenol injection has proven to be a great resource to the MSP enthusiast.

[Boosted Orange]

Yes but won't the other ingredients cause problems?

It will work fine. The Evo's come with a intercooler sprayer button in them and it uses windshield washer fluid...

[jeffmsp]

your are correct the washer fluid is fine, but the evo sprays it on the intercooler, I am injecting it into the IC pipe similar to a n20 needle setup, the liquid is then evaporated before it reaches the intake valves.

[MsP_DeViL]

hey guys,

I finnally got my water injection kit installed and working properly. This is by far the best mod on the car. I installed it a bit differently than others by removing the lower section of the stock airbox and mounting the pump on the bracket usually used for the coolant res overflow and callaway elbo. It took me a while to get everything installed right. I got the kit from aquamist. They have great customer support and all of my e-mails where answered within a day at the most! The wiring harness was a real pain since mine had contradicting numbers for the wires, but through trial and error I got it figured out. The car is stupid fast now, Ive got my first taste of making power in this car and I must say it is great. The only problem I am having is with my JoePMBC. The boost is spiking to 1 bar and then holding 10 to redline. There is no sign of deto, my stock plugs look fine even after 25,000 kilometers of hard driving before the install, but I think I should look into somethig cooler and copper in the near future. The car finnally has top end power. It never had any before, even with the 8psi to redline I used to have, it nothing compared to 10 to redline. The only thing I am starting to worry about is the rods going. Do you guys think I am living a little too dangerously with that spike or can I pull it off. I am running 94 octane and windshield washer fluid for the injection. The car seems to be running fine, but from what I understand the stock rods could go at any time when boosting this high right? Ive already bought a head to work on, and a block with 8:5:1 pistons and nice rods are going to be installed in the spring but do you guys think I can pull it off until then? The only other mods I am planning on is to relocate the maf to the IC-TB pipe and to add a CAI (or should I just put a cone on the turbo?) Anyways, I cant tell you guys enough about how well the car pulls. 2nd gear is gone so fast compared to before you guys wouldnt believe it. (thumb)

I will post vids and pics later, gotta go have fun (boobs) (burnout)

Sweeeetttt asss Sweeeet Please keep me updated I would love to mess around with that mod!

[GNO]

I can't believe I missed this thread last year. Thanks for resurrecting it! I've had a chance to play with different systems and currently own an Aquamist System 2c with an accumulator. The car it was on isn't running at the moment, but I too will be coupling it with an intercooler.

For those considering adding a water injection kit, DO NOT buy one of those cheap systems off eBay. I take that back. . . ensure the system has a substantial pump. I've actually purchased an Aquamist system 1s on eBay for under $100. A major difference between those cheap kits like Sparco and Edelbrock and something like the Aquamist is the pump. As mentioned in Aquamist's website, the high pressure allows fine atomization of the water. The smaller the water/alcohol droplets, the higher the ratio between suface area to volume. With the increased surface area, the water undergoes the phase change more rapidly. The phase change from liquid to vapor is what absorbs a the majority of heat energy.

For those still tempted to purchase a cheap Sparco kit from eBay, save your money and just divert a washer fluid tube to your intake. Yeah, it won't work well. . . neither do those cheap kits. I've purchased a Sparco kit for comparison sake a few years ago. It is literally consisted of a washer fluid pump, reservior, hobbes switch, tubing, and nozzle.

[jeffmsp]

ya that would be crap.


http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/11/web/383000-383999/383561_59_full.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member_images/11/web/383000-383999/383561_62_full.jpg


those are the only pics i have lying around of the first time I installed it back in the stock smic days. pump mounts on a tray that is attached to a bolt on the battery tray.

[GNO]

Jeff - In the first pic, it looks like you have the nozzle spraying into a brass 90° elbow which turns into the intake section. By having the elbow so close to the nozzle, you risk having the finely atomized water particles hitting the walls of the elbow and pooling together to form large droplets. Essentially defeating the purpose of having the high pressure pump. By having the nozzle unobstructed, you'd substantially increase the efficiency of the system.

I don't mean to sound so critical, I just hope to help you maximize performance of the system.

[Brian MP5T]

Agreed, A better spread would be gained by swaping out the elbow...

[jeffmsp]

that pic was of the first install, now it is still on the elbow but it is pointed downstream spraying directly at the charged air coming towards it and not at the side of the elbow. Even with the needle like in the pic, I never had any traces of puddling, think about how hot 10+psi intake charge is with the stock interwarmer, it got evaporated no problem but the new setup is much better and more efficient.