Upping the boost

[chillinmcmillan]

I just got my boost gauge installed and I'm running 5 psi, I want to get a boost controller and maybe go with 8 psi just to be safe. What do you guys think, all my mods are in my sig and I always run on Sunoco Ultra 94 gas. I'm pretty sure I'll be safe but I just want to know what the experts think (you guys) Thanks!

[chillinmcmillan]

bump

[unwrittenLaw]

8psi shouldn't be a problem. but get a good boost controller, and listen for knock/pinging.

[Wiggles422]

being flashed i dunno if you should go much higher than 8

[chillinmcmillan]

I am going to go with this controller http://www.boostsciences.com/accuboost.html people on here say these guys make good stuff. I don't plan on running anything higher than 10 psi and thats only when I get some more supporting mods, but I think 8 should be ok with 94 octane, right?

[ChiMSP]

I went w/ a Joe P. MBC, it works just fine and its alot cheaper. I think you can run up to 9 psi w/o getting any fuel cut. If you're gonna boosting more you should get a Fuel cut deffenser and fuel press. reducer.

[Wiggles422]

Yeah supporting mods would make it much safer to boost more.

[Glowmunkey]

I'd get copper plugs, FCD and run 8 with no fear. Fuel pressure reducer is questionable on a flashed car, especially when upping the boost. Can anyone that's datalogged a flashed car with fuel pressure reducer chime in?

[irr5302]

Not put a FPR
8psi is safe

[jersey_emt]

You shouldn't need an FCD to run 8psi.

My car is running at 8.7-8.9psi without any boost controller (8psi with no mods, SMIC and hardpipes raised it a bit)

[03MSP]

You should be fine with that setup, some people run almost that stock, with no boost controller.

I am flashed and I run 10psi...on 92 octane, no pinging, no cut. My theory (be it an uneducated one) is that if you are running under the flow that spark cut hits, then you are in the area that Mazda deemed safe.

[StreakinOraNgeX]

with 94 octane, you should be plenty safe, possibly even moreso. I have only 91 octane here in cali and a higher knock resistance gas....will do what its supposed to do, especially with a conservative 8 psi boost.

[Spooled]

with 94 octane, you should be plenty safe, possibly even moreso. I have only 91 octane here in cali and a higher knock resistance gas....will do what its supposed to do, especially with a conservative 8 psi boost.
I don't understand. 91 octane has a higher resistance to knocking (it doesn't)? Or is there something in the gas that helps without raising the octane?

[DragonSpeed]

i have the accuboost mbc too with basically same setup as you and i'm running 9psi, sometimes spiking to 10psi, for about 2 weeks now with no problems. I use my msp as my daily too and haven't had any issues. I'm also flashed with injen cai, so i'd say you'll be pretty safe doing 9.

*sigh* it was kinda shameful when i told my car club buddies i got my mbc and they asked how many psi i'm pushing now, i was like "9..." and they laffed their asses off :P oh well, little do they know that 9psi is actually a big jump from 5, my car pulls much harder than it did at 5.

Anyhow, gl to you.

[Puckpimp71]

Let your Turbo breathe before putting more air in it... supporting mods are your friend. I know 8psi isn't much, but it's still higher than the 5 your car is used to. I'd at least open the exhaust a bit and get colder plugs as a precaution.

[chillinmcmillan]

ya I plan on going up to 6 psi for a week or so, then to 7 then to 8, not sure if doing that is going to make any difference but what the hell

[Glowmunkey]

You shouldn't need an FCD to run 8psi.

My car is running at 8.7-8.9psi without any boost controller (8psi with no mods, SMIC and hardpipes raised it a bit)
I used to hit the fuel cut at 8 psi in cold weather... I've heard of others having this issue as well.

[zzooomm]

People running 8 psi on pumped gas on mazdaspeed rods are bending them into a cresent moon shape. in cylinder number 4. Many Many have been to the dealer for rod replacements. $65 can cost you $4000 to $6000 if you arent careful. If you want more boost, at least upgrade the rods. Just keep that in the back of your mind. I just got my car running after three months. Total cost for block, gerdle, crank, pistons, rods, head work to fix bent valves, bearings $3800.00 No labor included Engine blew at 8 psi leaving the line normal, no racing.

[chillinmcmillan]

now in terms of taking the MBC off when going to the dealership, how easy is that? Can they tell that one has been on there if I take it off before I go?

[zzooomm]

They look for the glue line to be broken on the tee where it goes to the wastegate. They can also pull the amounto of boost that the car is running from the computer, so always clear the computer before taking it to mazda.

[warrier04]

it seems like many many msp's on this board run above stock psi w/out any problems - seems like rods bending is a very one-off case. not that it can't happen or anything, but it seems unlikely unless you are goin over the edge w/ the boost.

would it be safe to run 9 psi using a joep mbc if my mods are intake, hardpipes, dp, catback? i have a fcd and fpr available, but would those be necessary if i'm flashed and don't plan on doing crazy boost?

drew.

[zzooomm]

They is now over 500 blown up mazdaspeeds right now with problems in cylinder 4, bend rods to holes in the block. Numbers don't lie. I have a very tight connection with Mazda. Mazda is branding all cars that come in with blown motors and no warranty. There is a master list that is accessable at any Mazda dealership of cars branded with this. If any mods are on the car when they arrive, they will refuse the warranty work.

[xxxcool21]

500 holy S*, i'm prob. going to turn my flashed msp off now damn i've been running 13 psi for like 10 months 12,000 miles with just colder plugs, hmmmm i guess my intuition says i need some forged internals

[zzooomm]

At one point there were almost 800 that mazda knew of. Also Many Mazdaspeed Miata's have returned with the same problem. Too much boost for the rods. I will never own another Mazdaspeed product. They cut corners. Now I can run 20 psi My car will be dyno'd in November and tuned with AFC 2 and fuel management, and a Greddy E-01 boost controller. I have to brake in the new motor.

[xxxcool21]

how much does labor run for a tear down and rebuild....
not meaning to thread jack

[zzooomm]

I did mine myself so I have no Idea, I have a shop in Arizona, but it only took 2 hours to pull the motor, one day to rebuild it and one day to stab it back into the car. It took 14 weeks to get the rods and pistons. I also did a turbo upgrade at the same time and exturnally wastegated the stock manifold. It fired the first try. You could save alot of money pulling and stabbing the motor yourself. It cost me $400.00 to have the valves fixed and the head ported and polished, and $100 to have the crank polished.

[warrier04]

I did mine myself so I have no Idea, I have a shop in Arizona, but it only took 2 hours to pull the motor, one day to rebuild it and one day to stab it back into the car. It took 14 weeks to get the rods and pistons. I also did a turbo upgrade at the same time and exturnally wastegated the stock manifold. It fired the first try. You could save alot of money pulling and stabbing the motor yourself. It cost me $400.00 to have the valves fixed and the head ported and polished, and $100 to have the crank polished.
what are the benefits to porting and polishing the engine internals?

also, is it possible to install forged rods w/out having access to a shop? would i need to take the car to a dealer or shop to have them installed?

[Glowmunkey]

also, is it possible to install forged rods w/out having access to a shop? would i need to take the car to a dealer or shop to have them installed?
Of course you can do it yourself, but if you have to ask, you'll need some experienced assistance. Not a huge deal.

[warrier04]

understandable. on the other hand, there's no such thing as instant experience.

on a side note - how beneficial is it to just go forged rods instead of pistons and rods? would just doing the rods be half-assing it, or is that eliminated the problem w/ boosting at stock engine internals?

drew.

[Wiggles422]

The pistons aren't as weak as the rods. But my philosophy would be to do it all at the same time and not have to do again. However, Juan (Hiboost TS) doesn't have forged pistons in his 12 second P5.

[DragonSpeed]

As far as forged internals go, are they all the same? brand preferences? price differences? Anyone here with forged rods/pistons? Where from and how much?
Blah?

[jersey_emt]

They look for the glue line to be broken on the tee where it goes to the wastegate. They can also pull the amounto of boost that the car is running from the computer, so always clear the computer before taking it to mazda.

The computer does not control or monitor boost in any way.



They is now over 500 blown up mazdaspeeds right now with problems in cylinder 4, bend rods to holes in the block. Numbers don't lie. I have a very tight connection with Mazda. Mazda is branding all cars that come in with blown motors and no warranty. There is a master list that is accessable at any Mazda dealership of cars branded with this. If any mods are on the car when they arrive, they will refuse the warranty work.


You're trying to tell me that over 10% of all Mazdaspeeds have blown their motor?

Sorry dude, your 'tight connection' is blatantly false.

[ChiMSP]

I did mine myself so I have no Idea, I have a shop in Arizona, but it only took 2 hours to pull the motor, one day to rebuild it and one day to stab it back into the car. It took 14 weeks to get the rods and pistons. I also did a turbo upgrade at the same time and exturnally wastegated the stock manifold. It fired the first try. You could save alot of money pulling and stabbing the motor yourself. It cost me $400.00 to have the valves fixed and the head ported and polished, and $100 to have the crank polished.
Whre did you get you froged internals?

[yashooa]

The computer does not control or monitor boost in any way.



You're trying to tell me that over 10% of all Mazdaspeeds have blown their motor?

Sorry dude, your 'tight connection' is blatantly false.Yeah, no shit I have 48k miles almost all of it at 12-16PSI on 93 octane with sweet, sweet reliability. OK the bushings have gone twice and the exhaust broke once but it was all fixed under warranty :)

[yashooa]

They look for the glue line to be broken on the tee where it goes to the wastegate. They can also pull the amounto of boost that the car is running from the computer, so always clear the computer before taking it to mazda. My dealer replaced all the turbo hoses for me from the waste gate all the way up past the T. Those sorry stock lines were pure shit! They cracked all to fuck on their own.

[hello2000]

Don't raise the boost until you change your exhaust!! Our stock exhuast is too restrictive. I learned the hard way!

[ChiMSP]

Don't raise the boost until you change your exhaust!! Our stock exhuast is too restrictive. I learned the hard way!
Which size would be best 2.5 or 3"? I'm gonna be upgrading soon and was afraid 3" would be over kill. My bad... jacked the thread

[yashooa]

Don't raise the boost until you change your exhaust!! Our stock exhuast is too restrictive. I learned the hard way!Well 46,000 miles ago I raised it to 12PSI...all else is stock.

[MSPinVA]

Which size would be best 2.5 or 3"? I'm gonna be upgrading soon and was afraid 3" would be over kill. My bad... jacked the thread

The bigger the better. The biggest that can reasonably fit under our cars is 3" exhaust piping, and that is plenty big for anything you can throw at the motor. It will also free up your top end considerably and let your turbo breathe easier.

[hello2000]

(mswerd)


The bigger the better. The biggest that can reasonably fit under our cars is 3" exhaust piping, and that is plenty big for anything you can throw at the motor. It will also free up your top end considerably and let your turbo breathe easier.

I raise mine to 12PSI too and I have a FMIC and a CAI--Which helps the engine, not hurt it. The reason it slung a rod was because of backpressure.


Well 46,000 miles ago I raised it to 12PSI...all else is stock.

[yashooa]

(mswerd)



I raise mine to 12PSI too and I have a FMIC and a CAI--Which helps the engine, not hurt it. The reason it slung a rod was because of backpressure.
Or maybe something else went wrong. Driving style, bad gas, your Moon was in Jupiter, a factory defect like Jecky's car, or just bad luck. One thing is certain mine is running great at 48,000 plus miles with 12-13PSI of fun almost the entire time. Heck, I even get 400 miles out of 12 gallons with several WOT runs a day to and from work. Out of the several thousand MSP's that have been manufactured only a handfull have had motors blow there has to be a certain number of flaws that would be much more apparent under higher boost that may never have reared their ugly heads under the very sad 5-7 stock PSI.
Don't get me wrong a new exhaust is defintely in the cards just not right now. I love the ION but I actually want to get the exhaust while I still own the car :)
So maybe Perrin(?) or Cork Sport.

[Swerny]

The computer does not control or monitor boost in any way.



You're trying to tell me that over 10% of all Mazdaspeeds have blown their motor?

Sorry dude, your 'tight connection' is blatantly false.
Jersey I agree with you 100%.
I'm glad someone said something becuase I was laughing at the BS this guy was posting.
I have the Injen CAI, CS exhaust, and the Joe P MBC, i spike to about 9.5-10 PSI, hold at about 8.5 (my gauge is a bit off), on 91 octane for the most part (94 if it happens to be cheap that day).
I can't do that in the winter obviously.
No problems to date.

[BlkZoomZoom]

Don't be so sure you can't monitior boost pressure....not that I know anything.

Oh and that zzooomm guy is a joke.