Free Mod: Modify your maf!

[KyRaceFan]

On everyones MAF sensor there is a little black plastic honeycomb that you can remove. Not sure if there are any real gains to be made, but it slides right out and will probably improve flow.
Gcotton tried it today and said he thinks theres a difference, but who knows.

Shouldnt hurt anything either. Enjoy!

[Subghetto]

I've heard that it is not recommended to do that and that they are not any real gains to be made but I could be wrong. I'am still skeptical and they only thing that would change my mind would be a dyno reading before and after the honeycomb shell was removed.

[Matthew]

doubt that does shit except possibly allow things into your engine.

[Micah]

call your parts dept to find out how much a new mass air is.

[Matthew]

(rofl)

[Subghetto]

doubt that does shit except possibly allow things into your engine.(mswerd)Reasons for not removing the screen in your MAF:

1. you can break or fuck up your MAF

2. you can also get inaccurate readings of the MAF

3. Additional turbulance in the MAF area is an issue, as well as debris.

4. If you remove your screen, it will make your car run either lean or richer
for that matter.

5. Keep the screen unless your going to have your computer tuned! The MAF
is tuned to work with the screen, once you pull them out, the MAF WILL
NOT read all the air going throught it at high RPM.

6. You might get a cel later on.

[Micah]

and the number one reason - Don't be such a cheap fvck, spend money on mods that are actually worthwhile instead of hacking up your car in the holy pursuit of free horsepower/torque.

[Matthew]

damn micah youve been ruthless lately.

[dominoy2k1]

i say let the fucker fuck up his car. that way when he comes on here sayin the car is not running. we can talk shit to him.

[KyRaceFan]

Its not going to mess with the tune of your MAF. Turning up your boost is going to do alot more than removing the plastic screen. And as long as you have a good filter on the car, nothing is going in the engine.

I seriously doubt there is a real gain to be made, but if it frees up one or two or even 4 hp from improved airflow, then why not, since any little hp gain is going to add up.
Plus this isnt exactly hacking up your car, its removing a screen thats not held on anyways.
Im sure there are risks, but wow, calling me a cheapass and flaming away isnt right attitude to have.

edit: Read for comprehension. I never said it was done to my car, only to gcottons. Kthxbye.

[Matthew]

i just think people have seen other people toy with the MAF sensor and fuck up their car.

[Matthew]

http://www.msprotege.com/forum/showthread.php?t=57826&highlight=maf+broke

[KyRaceFan]

i just think people have seen other people toy with the MAF sensor and fuck up their car.And they probably were doing alot more than removing the screen... This is probably a 500-600 dollar part, definately not something to toy around with. But like i said, its something you can stick back on in 5 seconds, and if you have a filter on the other end of the MAF, its protected from debris anyways.

edit: Yea, i read that thread before. He said he poked it, or something.... if you do this mod.. DONT POKE THE MAF.

[Dexter]

there has to be a point for that screen. ill leave mine in.

[Matthew]

nah im sure mazda regularly slaps on worthless and senseless parts. normally when i put my car back together after working on it, i just throw whatever parts dont look important away. great for weight reduction and reducing 1/4 times.

[MSP Chris]

Ricer

[KyRaceFan]

Read for comprehension. I never said it was done to my car, only to gcottons. Kthxbye.

[mp5jeff]

question to starter of thread, you said yourself it probably doesn't do anything, so why bother and risk fucking up a maf that costs like 500 bucks?

[Micah]

damn micah youve been ruthless lately.
Sorry man, not getting laid - but got a chance tonight

(mj) (attn) (mj)

[KyRaceFan]

DONT DO IT unless you really know what the hell ur doing.. im on the hunt for a new one cuz joe cut uip the honey comb & with my FMIC its fucking up the car... DONT DO IT !
How do you know this is the reason your car isnt running right?

[KyRaceFan]

question to starter of thread, you said yourself it probably doesn't do anything, so why bother and risk fucking up a maf that costs like 500 bucks?
Im sure it does something.. less turbulence and increased airflow through the MAF. I dont see a way of fucking up the MAF unless you stick a screwdriver through the wires.

[melicha8]

This is a silly ass mod. I bet you don't even get 1hp from this at the crank

[Micah]

How do you know this is the reason your car isnt running right?
He doesn't - none of us do. But what we can all agree on is this. The Protege is an econobox, so is the MSP. Mazda built these cars to sell and make money. Don't fool youself into thinking that they spent one extra cent on the car they didn't need to. So when someone talks about free HP gains by removing items found in the engine bay - yeah, we are all going to react and ask the person to please use some common sense.

We love our cars - hell, I'm paying mine off so I can get an SRT4, and I still love my protege, I just want something that looks like a skittle and has more HP.

(drive)

My point being - we look out for each other as best we can on this forum. If you really want to make a difference, just run with a 1/4 tank of gas. The weight savings alone are going to make a bigger difference and it's safe. Worst thing that could happen is your run out and have to call AAA.

[KyRaceFan]

This is a silly ass mod. I bet you don't even get 1hp from this at the crank
no worse than removing weatherstripping.... :)

[Dexter]

Im sure it does something.. less turbulence and increased airflow through the MAF. I dont see a way of fucking up the MAF unless you stick a screwdriver through the wires.
Can you back these claims up with some data? Its got to be there for a REASON. they dont just engineer a honeycomb pattern for nothing...

[KyRaceFan]

He doesn't - none of us do. But what we can all agree on is this. The Protege is an econobox, so is the MSP. Mazda built these cars to sell and make money. Don't fool youself into thinking that they spent one extra cent on the car they didn't need to. So when someone talks about free HP gains by removing items found in the engine bay - yeah, we are all going to react and ask the person to please use some common sense.

We love our cars - hell, I'm paying mine off so I can get an SRT4, and I still love my protege, I just want something that looks like a skittle and has more HP.

(drive)

My point being - we look out for each other as best we can on this forum. If you really want to make a difference, just run with a 1/4 tank of gas. The weight savings alone are going to make a bigger difference and it's safe. Worst thing that could happen is your run out and have to call AAA.

SHE doesnt. ;)
I totally agree with you. This is an econobox. Ive also talked to DSM guys whove been doing it for years with no side effects.
Look at my posts, and try to tell me i dont look out for the community, or that i give bad advice.

Anyways, :werd: on the not getting laid thing.. and i have a g/f. :o

[srtchick]

(headshake i shoulda just bought a NEW un modded car....oh well u live & learn.

[Micah]

(headshake i shoulda just bought a NEW un modded car....oh well u live & learn.
Yep, hence my decision to buy an SRT4 - then install MOPAR's stage 2 kit with turbo toys. I just need to find a dealership that will do the install and warranty it.

[122 Vega]

Mine fell out due to vibration I'd assume. Over the next few months, the MAF signal got so screwed up my milege was down to 11-12 mpg. They put in a new MAF and it went back to 22ish. I really would not suggest doing it. There are bigger restrictions than the MAF screen.

Britt

[DSM2MSP]

Its not a screen at all, its a honeycomb that makes the air going in to go in smoother. In fact, not having it in is the worse thing you CAN do because it almost creates a vortex without it. Trust me, as a previous DSM owner, I can guarantee you that none of them (the smart ones at least) ever took out, or messed with the honeycomb, however there is a mod they can do where they unscrew this bolt on the bottom of the MAS to let in more unmeasured air. Honeycombs are good :)

If you really want to mess around with your MAS find one from a junkyard cheap that way you dont fuck up the only one you have and end up paying an arm and a leg for a new one at the dealer.

[kwiktsi]

Yeah, it smooths the airflow going through the MAF, without it the air can get turbulent and give flakey readings. Not a good idea to remove it, nothing to really be gained there and actually, if it sees more air, it will only make fuel cut worse.
Joe



there has to be a point for that screen. ill leave mine in.

[kwiktsi]

Lol, don't you still have the FCD in the car? The way that is modded really shouldn't do anything except lean the car out a touch. If you have an FMIC, you probably increased airflow a bit, so the MAF isn't reading too far off from what it would be stock :)..

Again, PLEASE don't let just anyone "diagnose" your car- so far, they have all been wrong especially those morons at the dyno :).
Joe



DONT DO IT unless you really know what the hell ur doing.. im on the hunt for a new one cuz joe cut uip the honey comb & with my FMIC its fucking up the car... DONT DO IT !

[Brian MP5T]

I Think this is the stupidest thread I have yet to see!

[kwiktsi]

Umm, no- again- the problem is you have the FCD in it and you drive it like grandma :) and are getting a low airflow code due to the FCD pulling "some" fuel at cruise- it has happened to like 3 people so far- all of them drive slow and let the car idle a lot. If I were there, I would double check for you to see if it is still there, but I did leave it in. Please don't say there are problems that aren't there, that car has a lot of history and R&D into it, when people that don't know what they are doing look at things they have no clue about, they are quick to point fingers when all they are really doing is hurting you more. The MAF is fine the way it is. It still has the honeycomb in front of the sensor chamber (what actually measures airflow).. Man, if I knew that the car was going to go through all this, I would have kept it and kept making records with it- it deservers better than strobes and colored hose kits :D :p .
Joe



i dont wanna thread jack but that is one of the main problems with this car... since i got the car its an airflow problem prolly due to hime cutting the honey comb all up.im hopefully gonna get a new one & it will solve my problem.....

[kwiktsi]

Or should have just let me looked at it from the start to see what the dealer did and didn't leave in it so you knew what you were working with. Having people that have no clue look at it isn't going to help you any. If the FCD is still in the car, it is as simple as just snipping one lead on the FCD itself and no more CEL, but I guess since the car is so hacked and it is in the hands of professionals now, they already knew that. I would gladly take that car back in a heartbeat- there is nothing wrong with the car, just the people working on it. Sorry, not trying to be harsh, but damn, we've discussed this stuff before. It goes from smoking a mid 13 second WRX down 211 to a half assed car that is being "tuned" and diagnosed by people I wouldn't even let park in the same lot as the car when I had it. If you want to set up a time to meet sometime, I will go over the whole car, see what is there and what is gone and get it back to how it should be- but you have to keep the expert "tuners" away from it so it doesn't get all fucked up again :). Trust me- there is NO ONE in Middletown or the surrounding areas that should be doing any more than an oil change on that car- I lived there for 8 years, I know this for a fact :).
Joe



(headshake i shoulda just bought a NEW un modded car....oh well u live & learn.

[DSM2MSP]

Are you guys ex lovers or something that hate each other?

Hahaa :P J/K Joe

[kwiktsi]

Lol, no. She bought my old car from the dealership I traded it in at. She is actually pretty cool, we have aim'ed back and for a bit. The problem is the people that give her advice on the car. She is trying, but between them not knowing what they are doing and us not knowing what the dealer left in or removed, it is frustrating for her since it all seems so bad. If I were closer, I would have looked it over and told her what needs to be done- the right way. I used to live near where she is now and it is all ricers who think they are expert tuners. Then there are the mega modded cars that are slow as piss because they have no clue what they are doing. The majority of the cars are typical ricer shit though- a LOT of it!!!
Joe


Are you guys ex lovers or something that hate each other?

Hahaa :P J/K Joe

[INGREXCO]

thanks matthew :-P i was trying to keep me out of this! hahaha

[instylz]

I actually have had mine off since December...(it fell out during my CAI cleaning) I never put it back on nor have I felt any ill effects of it not being there.

[BinaryRotary]

Heres something from another site on this :

The Mass Airflow Sensor can't get an accurate reading without the screen.
This is because the screen is used to smooth out the turbulant air in
being pulled into the engine. If the screen is removed, sure there is
suddenly less of a restriction... BUT, the computer can not measure this
accurately. In fact, if you noticed the numbers above, the MAF sensor
was sending erratic and LOWER numbers to the PCM.
Removing the screen will do nothing for your performance in a 3800 seriesII v6.
The lower MAF input and erratic readings make the computer think it's getting less incoming air than it actually is. That will do you no good. It clearly affected the idle quality in an adverse way. It did nothing for throttle response OR gas mileage. So... In my opinion, this mod is a waste of time and energy.

That said, hardly any of you knew the correct answer so maybe you shouldn't have bashed the guy. Yes, its been proven it actually decreases mpg and hp but theres no need to call the guy a 'ricer'. You people are being pathetic. Instead of bashing people on the board maybe you should point them in the right direction.

[instylz]

Heres something from another site on this :

The Mass Airflow Sensor can't get an accurate reading without the screen.
This is because the screen is used to smooth out the turbulant air in
being pulled into the engine. If the screen is removed, sure there is
suddenly less of a restriction... BUT, the computer can not measure this
accurately. In fact, if you noticed the numbers above, the MAF sensor
was sending erratic and LOWER numbers to the PCM.
Removing the screen will do nothing for your performance in a 3800 seriesII v6.
The lower MAF input and erratic readings make the computer think it's getting less incoming air than it actually is. That will do you no good. It clearly affected the idle quality in an adverse way. It did nothing for throttle response OR gas mileage. So... In my opinion, this mod is a waste of time and energy.

That said, hardly any of you knew the correct answer so maybe you shouldn't have bashed the guy. Yes, its been proven it actually decreases mpg and hp but theres no need to call the guy a 'ricer'. You people are being pathetic. Instead of bashing people on the board maybe you should point them in the right direction.
excellent post! I agree some people should think before they voice thier opinions in a negative way.

[Brian MP5T]

http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/sucks1.jpe
http://www.msprotege.com/members/Brian%20MP5T/Anim%20-%20(1).gif

[shaolin]

^^^hahah butthead's head keeps twitching...it's not a tumahhh...

[Notorious]

this has got to be the most ghetto mod i ever heard of

[Mach 3.5 Turbo]

Well sheeeeit people, back off a little bit. This is all that KY posted, maybe you all should read it again:


On everyones MAF sensor there is a little black plastic honeycomb that you can remove. Not sure if there are any real gains to be made, but it slides right out and will probably improve flow.
Gcotton tried it today and said he thinks theres a difference, but who knows.

Shouldnt hurt anything either. Enjoy!
In my book, that doesn't make him a ricer or anything like it. Hell, mine was in cock-eyed when I put my cold-air-intake in, so I took it out. I still get 30-32 mpg consistently, and I idle fine. I certainly didn't feel any power increase, but who cares? I just didn't like the looks of the damn thing. If any of you have taken fluid mechanics you might realize that air doesn't "straighten out" as it goes through the waffle like many of you have claimed. It's not play-doh, it's air. You're not going to extrude a column through the waffle and have it perfectly waft past the MAF sensor, it's just going to get turbulent again on the other side if it even was before the screen. There's a plain and simple explanation for the thing being there:


When you get your air filter changed, you have to take the "lid" off of your air cleaner. At this point, you can see straight into the MAF. Most people wouldn't stick shit in there, but some might. Therefore, to protect us from ourselves, they put a little waffle in there so we can't jam screwdrivers and toothbrushes into the hotwire. Since I'm not a complete moron and I can change my own air filter, I went ahead and took it out. Did it hurt anything? Probably not. Did it help anything? Probably not. Just quit busting people's balls for trying to get a little information out.

[KyRaceFan]

Well sheeeeit people, back off a little bit. This is all that KY posted, maybe you all should read it again:


In my book, that doesn't make him a ricer or anything like it. Hell, mine was in cock-eyed when I put my cold-air-intake in, so I took it out. I still get 30-32 mpg consistently, and I idle fine. I certainly didn't feel any power increase, but who cares? I just didn't like the looks of the damn thing. If any of you have taken fluid mechanics you might realize that air doesn't "straighten out" as it goes through the waffle like many of you have claimed. It's not play-doh, it's air. You're not going to extrude a column through the waffle and have it perfectly waft past the MAF sensor, it's just going to get turbulent again on the other side if it even was before the screen. There's a plain and simple explanation for the thing being there:


When you get your air filter changed, you have to take the "lid" off of your air cleaner. At this point, you can see straight into the MAF. Most people wouldn't stick shit in there, but some might. Therefore, to protect us from ourselves, they put a little waffle in there so we can't jam screwdrivers and toothbrushes into the hotwire. Since I'm not a complete moron and I can change my own air filter, I went ahead and took it out. Did it hurt anything? Probably not. Did it help anything? Probably not. Just quit busting people's balls for trying to get a little information out.
Thanks. (yippy)

[DiscreetSpeed]

Well sheeeeit people, back off a little bit. This is all that KY posted, maybe you all should read it again:


In my book, that doesn't make him a ricer or anything like it. Hell, mine was in cock-eyed when I put my cold-air-intake in, so I took it out. I still get 30-32 mpg consistently, and I idle fine. I certainly didn't feel any power increase, but who cares? I just didn't like the looks of the damn thing. If any of you have taken fluid mechanics you might realize that air doesn't "straighten out" as it goes through the waffle like many of you have claimed. It's not play-doh, it's air. You're not going to extrude a column through the waffle and have it perfectly waft past the MAF sensor, it's just going to get turbulent again on the other side if it even was before the screen. There's a plain and simple explanation for the thing being there:


When you get your air filter changed, you have to take the "lid" off of your air cleaner. At this point, you can see straight into the MAF. Most people wouldn't stick shit in there, but some might. Therefore, to protect us from ourselves, they put a little waffle in there so we can't jam screwdrivers and toothbrushes into the hotwire. Since I'm not a complete moron and I can change my own air filter, I went ahead and took it out. Did it hurt anything? Probably not. Did it help anything? Probably not. Just quit busting people's balls for trying to get a little information out.lol i took mine out(thumb)..................yaaaah im a ricer (yippy)

[Brian MP5T]

The point of the "Waffle" is to protect the sensor from balistic dammage. So fucking leave it in as it makes no performace improvements.

[Black Molly]

I know this is a old thread but I thought the same thing and did some research here on this matter. As for you need a waffle to even out air flow I consider that BS. I have a 02 Harley truck and it DOES not have a waffle. In fact look at many after market MAFS and they do not have a waffles. Does anyone have Dyno sheets one way or the other and not all this, welll I assume it does this or that?

[livelyjay]

The point of the "Waffle" is to protect the sensor from balistic dammage. So fucking leave it in as it makes no performace improvements.
He is correct, even though he doesn't spell too well. The first function is to protect the MAF sensor, as it's replacement is over $200 from the dealership. The second, and most debated function, is what it does to the airflow. This was discussed mightily on the Lancer forums and it was believed that the waffle creates a type of vortex inside the MAF so it gets a more accurate reading. Weather that is :bs: or not doesn't really matter, because removing it DOES NOTHING.

[fr0st]

The point of the "Waffle" is to protect the sensor from balistic dammage. So please don't leave it in as it makes a little bit more throttle response and works very well.


there,

fixed it for ya.(spank)

[Black Molly]

I really do not see how it does nothing. The one thing that we all lust after is more air to go in and more air to go out so we can go faster and faster. Any type of restriction is going to cause less air to go in thus less HP. Is my thinking faulty? If so we do they have bigger MAFS? As for protection that is why we have air filters. Once again on my truck there is no waffle and it works just fine and I have not had to replace it. Someone has to have a g-tech or dyno sheet to prove this matter one way or the other. I am not saying that it will or will not for sure make more HP, less HP, or NO HP change. I just want proof one way or the other or nothing. ANYONE?

[fr0st]

mine is off and will remain that way.. the car is better.. it doesnt take out 3 seconds on the quarter mile, but its alot better..

this can be confirmed by other users as well

[2.0t03speed]

yep i took mine out and instantly noticed the car ran smoother combined with my dsm afc i have no hesitation at all

[crashkelly]

I really do not see how it does nothing. The one thing that we all lust after is more air to go in and more air to go out so we can go faster and faster. Any type of restriction is going to cause less air to go in thus less HP. Is my thinking faulty? If so we do they have bigger MAFS? As for protection that is why we have air filters. Once again on my truck there is no waffle and it works just fine and I have not had to replace it. Someone has to have a g-tech or dyno sheet to prove this matter one way or the other. I am not saying that it will or will not for sure make more HP, less HP, or NO HP change. I just want proof one way or the other or nothing. ANYONE?

um yeah your filter might save you from things outside the car getting into the pipe and then shooting into your turbo( or throttle body if you dont have a turbo) but what about if something breaks in your filter...some jackass mechanic had my intake off the car and closed the hood on it and it crushed a plastic piece that held my filters shape...I was really glad the maf waffle was in because it stopped all the small plastic fragments from shooting into my turbo and completely destroying it...


the same thing could very easily happen in a car crash...front end damage causes your airbox or intake filter to rip off leaving the maf and a pipe...with no waffle broken shit will gladly get sucked in their....

Point being IT IS THERE FOR A REASON!!! You will get NO gains from removing it, you are better off relocating for better more even flow(thats what I did)

[Mach 3.5 Turbo]

I really do not see how it does nothing. The one thing that we all lust after is more air to go in and more air to go out so we can go faster and faster. Any type of restriction is going to cause less air to go in thus less HP. Is my thinking faulty? If so we do they have bigger MAFS? As for protection that is why we have air filters. Once again on my truck there is no waffle and it works just fine and I have not had to replace it. Someone has to have a g-tech or dyno sheet to prove this matter one way or the other. I am not saying that it will or will not for sure make more HP, less HP, or NO HP change. I just want proof one way or the other or nothing. ANYONE?

Yes, removing a restriction from the intake tract will make an improvement. In much the same way that getting a haircut makes you run faster, removing the waffle will increase your overall intake efficiency. It's just so small a gain that you'll never notice. I'd be willing to bet that cleaning the trash out of your backseat or driving with less gas in the tank would both make more noticable improvements. However, I did take mine out just because I thought it looked stupid and because I was hoping for that miraculous 3 second quarter mile gain from a simple mod.

Since I wrote the comment above (what, 2 years ago now?), I've graduated and now I work as a powertrain engineer for a major auto company (not telling who). Trust me, the waffle is there to keep idiots from sticking stuff into the MAF that doesn't belong there. If someone or someone's mechanic is stupid enough to do something that causes shrapnel flying through the intake tract, then I guess the waffle does help you. I'm not going to assume that this kind of thing will ever happen to me since I do my own work and am confident in it.

[Black Molly]

okay so what I am reading now is it may give you 1-3 HP MAYBE but there is a risk just like any other mod. Has anyone had negative effects that are documented?

[_Slotegé_]

Ok,last month I removed this baffle gimmick to see what would happen or if anything at all would happen.Well I did this without my wife seeing me touch the car or me telling her a word about it....So, later on that night we got into the car to go to the store I started the car and the first thing I noticed was that the idle was smoother but,I still didn't say a word to her about doing anything to the car or the better idle well, while we're on our way to the store she say's.....

"Did you do somthing new to the car?"

me:"No why?"

Her:"it seems like you changed your spark plugs or somthing, the Idle is not as rough as it was and the car isn't bucking that bad today"


I was floored that she noticed this without me saying anything to her!

All and all,did I gain any HP? I don't really care it has smoothed out the idle a bit and made this thing a bit more driveable for me and thats more then, I expected out of doing this so, it's staying out!

[JaredB]

Just go and buy a MAF cleaner at Advanced Auto parts. If you clean it every time you clean or change your air filter it will continue to read cleaner air and not get caked with dirt and crap in the air when it flows through the intake. I just did this for the FIRST time yesterday (because i just found out about it) and loved it.




Can you back these claims up with some data? Its got to be there for a REASON. they dont just engineer a honeycomb pattern for nothing...

[jeffmsp]

just use a multimeter to see if you even making differences in readings on the maf. takes 5 mins.

[Brian MP5T]

I know this is a old thread but I thought the same thing and did some research here on this matter. As for you need a waffle to even out air flow I consider that BS. I have a 02 Harley truck and it DOES not have a waffle. In fact look at many after market MAFS and they do not have a waffles. Does anyone have Dyno sheets one way or the other and not all this, welll I assume it does this or that?
Do you actually think that just because some don't have the screen, that all don't need it.

The point of my post FROM 2004 ( HOLY SHIT I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU BUMPED THIS ), was that when Mazda calibrated the Mass Air for this particular car, they did it with that screen attached. Altering the volume of air without altering the ECU program will alter the A/F.

There is such a small chance that this would add any performace, why risk fucking up such a major component of your EFI for nothing. As was stated, adding a clean air filter would make more of a diference in HP.

Getting your ass on a treadmill and taking off 10 Lbs will do more for your 1/4 Mile than this would ever do.

[Brian MP5T]

okay so what I am reading now is it may give you 1-3 HP MAYBE but there is a risk just like any other mod. Has anyone had negative effects that are documented?

Try 0.03 WHP...

[jeffmsp]

definitely better sources of free power then this.

[fr0st]

Do you actually think that just because some don't have the screen, that all don't need it.

The point of my post FROM 2004 ( HOLY SHIT I CAN'T BELIEVE YOU BUMPED THIS ), was that when Mazda calibrated the Mass Air for this particular car, they did it with that screen attached. Altering the volume of air without altering the ECU program will alter the A/F.

There is such a small chance that this would add any performace, why risk fucking up such a major component of your EFI for nothing. As was stated, adding a clean air filter would make more of a diference in HP.

Getting your ass on a treadmill and taking off 10 Lbs will do more for your 1/4 Mile than this would ever do.



after working with and installing industrial flow meters of all sorts thaat are worth half the price of a stock msp, i can tell you that it,s not the diffusor thats gonna kill the maf or antyhing else..

the diffusor is there to give out a more spread the air entering it more evenly so the maf will read correctly and with more precision the air entering.

as ANY gaz traveling in a pipe with be faster in the center (where the sensor is btw) that on the sides.

the thing that kills mafs or makes them read even more inprecisely is temperature and CFM..as in cubic feet per minute(the amount).. and the speed of the air entering (Feet per second).... if you say
when Mazda calibrated the Mass Air for this particular car, they did it with that screen attached. Altering the volume of air without altering the ECU program will alter the A/F.


you are correct. the did this with the screen on.

but don't forget that MAF's have limits in FPS( feet per second) also.. the faster the air goes in the less precise it will read and get a maxed out reading long before the actual reading could be read.

another thing about flow sensors is the capability to adjust with tempertature as air is more dense when cold.. thus, getting more oxygen to the engine. thats called temperature compensation. for the same CFM, air at 100 F will be less dense than air at 70 F and fuel injection will "know" by the IAT in the air box that the air is a certain temperature and there are like xxx CFM going on so i need to put xxx amount a fuel.

on a maf relocated setup, ( like yours) you left the IAT on the air filter side but put the maf on the cold pipe AFTER the turbocharger. and since a turbo has a tendency to "compress" air, making it hot.. very hot. (the smaller the turbo, the more air it has to compress to reach the cfm a larger turbo would do at lower psi.. thus, less heat build up of the air) so on a GT25R at let's say, 8 or 9 psi the air is at 200-250 F which is VERY common.. the intercooler coold is down to what.. 150 maybe? sure if you have a FMIC it must help and must be better than this.. but on the stocker.. no way.. and even with a FMIC it's not as cold as outside ambient temperature.. it never will be. so you end up, telling the ECM that the air intake temp is at 70 F while the air thats really entering the engine is at 100-150 F ?

do you think that could make the ECU not give the right amount of fuel for the amount of air in the combustion chamber??

to sum it up,

the diffusor grill may not be the best thing to do but puting the MAF on the cold pipe isin't neither.. both make the ECM misread whats really happening... both make the car less rich.. and since the msp is rich as hell when stock, it might just be a "not so bad" thing..

so stop saying that removing the grill is a bad thing.. most of those running a relocated MAF are in the same boat ... and even worst.. some are running 2" pipe on the cold side, which tends to leave the CMF the same but get the FPS ( feet per second) alot faster.. and m,akes 'em read less precise because they get close(or over) to the maximum flow readable (which leads to lean mixtures...and boom)

no flow meter in the world ( unless specidifed for it) should be runned with more than 30 FPS.. i can tell ya that after installing a few dozens.


Fr0st

Ps: we all triers out here.. in the coming weeks, im going relocated too and im assuming my mods and mistakes.. saying the end of the world is coming because you removed the grill is not something someone should be saying if he's in the same boat.. you using a maf designed to be sucked in air.. not blown by.. so..

[Brian MP5T]

I actually have a MAP.

You refer to old photos.

[Kypatrick]

Ill go ahead and add my 2 cents. I took mine off when i made my SRI. I dont even think it does anything. If it affected calibration, wouldnt CAI and SRI really mess things up more. Its a stupid arguement, i think that if u r not comfortable removing it, then dont. If u wanna remove it, take it out, its your car! I have seen no changes in my car at ALL since i removed it, its probably just to protect the MAF sensor. <<< thats just a guess, im sure u r all more knowledgable about cars than me.

[Black Molly]

Well I took it out and i did notice slight better throttle response and pick up. Would not say it was a NOS kit bit I am not putting it back in. As for anyone reading this thread... Try it yourself. IF you do not like it put it back in.. no harm done....unless you are a idiot that pokes at the MAF. PS I did clean the MAF Before I took out the Baffle and I did not notice a difference.

[slomsprotege]

i know one thing when i took it off my car at my uncles shop it didnt seem to do anything, then he hooked up some probes to the maf from some big ass computer rig and showed me that it was VERY erattic, it would spike 2.5 volts then to 1 volt above normal. we put the screen back in then it was reading normal at idle....i left it in :)

[Matrix]

I hate to dig up an old thread, but I figured it was better to post in this one than start a new one.

About 2 years ago, I got a set of hard pipes that relocated my MAF. At the time that I relocated the MAF, I popped out the plastic screen and installed the MAF. I had been driving around without the plastic mesh in my MAF for 2 years. I didn't think it was a big deal. The car bogged a bit and suffered wheel hop, but I thought the wheel hop was just from bad motor mount bushings or something. The car ran pig rich, but I just attributed that to how the cars were already running very rich.

Anyway, last Friday I failed the VA emissions inspection. They said they couldn't get a good read and there was too much unburnt fuel in the exhaust. I started thinking about the plastic screen in the MAF, and I put it back in 2 days ago and reset the ECU. The car actually runs much better! The low-rpm bog has been eliminated and I don't smell nearly as much unburnt fuel in the exhaust. Accelleration is a bit more linear.

I'll be taking it back for emissions soon and I'll let you know what happens.

Lesson learned: Don't remove the screen!

[WIMSPWI]

or you may suck the whole plastic thing through your turbo like i did :(

[ND4MSP]

That blows. Mine came loose and turned 90 degrees basically making the air split and go aroung the signal element thingy. The car spit up coolant and was misfiring and threw a cyl misfire code. I was going to clean it for shits and thats how I found it. But I would gladly take my experience over yours. So I currently don't have it in there. I should put it back in now that I have a wideband and see if my afr's change.

[1moreMPH]

dear Christ, this thread... really?