Stalling while recirculating... need help ASAP!

[TooleBox]

We installed my hardpipes, front-mount and HKS SSV on friday...

I am noticing now that even while recirculating, if I have built up any boost whatsoever and have to brake hard... or if i just throw it in neutral, my car stalls out...

I have tried adjusting the BOV in every position possible from hardent to softest and everything inbetween annd nothing seems to be helping...

If anyone can help me resolve this... I would greatly appreciate it!

[_Slotegé_]

try posting this in the FI section you might get more help. man i gotta check that stage1&2 kit that you got out some time maybe at one of the tampa meet's.

[KyRaceFan]

You cant just throw the car in neutral on an open vent BOV.
tightening and loosening wont help either, it mostly just changes the sound.
I suggest you learn to rev match, use the right foot to manipulate the gas and brakes at the same time. It'll keep your revs up and prevent the car from stalling.

[TiGrayMsp716]

Is the HKS a dual piston design? With a dual piston BOV you shouldn't have any problems venting... the problem with single piston bov is that the vent under vacuum and that causes stalling.

[dominoy2k1]

hmm should not stall since its recirculating, make sure there are no vacuum leaks. you can also move the adjustment screw for the throttle body. but if its recirculating it should not stall at all unless there is a vacuum leak.

[KyRaceFan]

Is the HKS a dual piston design? With a dual piston BOV you shouldn't have any problems venting... the problem with single piston bov is that the vent under vacuum and that causes stalling.

HKS BOV is a pull type BOV, it requires boost to open. The more vacuum being pulled, the tighter its closed. It will not leak at idle, or under moderate accell. Once youre in boost and it senses a pressure change, then it will open and vent, and close almost instantly again.

If you have it recirced, then there must be a vacuum leak to cause it to stall. Do you have a boost/vac gauge? With the fans off and the car at idle, how much vacuum are you pulling? My car pulls 20-22.

[TooleBox]

thats my main issue KyRaceFan... my gauge wont be here for a few more days...

I do not think i have a vac leak... my last car was supercharged (jackson racing) and that damn thing had so many places to leak from... i have mastered the art of detecting vac leaks... this is not one of them...

im doing what you said... just blipping the throttle a but on decel to prevent the stalling... i'll trouble shoot it a bit more when i get a chance

[505zoom]

We installed my hardpipes, front-mount and HKS SSV on friday...

I am noticing now that even while recirculating, if I have built up any boost whatsoever and have to brake hard... or if i just throw it in neutral, my car stalls out...

I have tried adjusting the BOV in every position possible from hardent to softest and everything inbetween annd nothing seems to be helping...

If anyone can help me resolve this... I would greatly appreciate it!


If you can get me a list of your other mods, and some pics or a good description of exactly how you have it set up, then I might be able to help you. One of my recirculated SSQV setups that I tried produced some stalling as well, so let me know how it's setup.

[TooleBox]

505... it's the EssentialSpeed kit... stages 1 & 2...

it vents directly back into the post-maf side of the intake...

as far as I know all couplings are still tight (but I wont have time to take off the bumper and check the one between the bumper and the radiator for a couple weeks now with my bust schedule... but i truly dont see a vaccume leak being the issue as it still boosts as strong as ever (butt dyno... gauge will be in in a couple days) and the idle is not rough (which it usually will get somewhat rough if you have a vaccume leak...

http://images.cardomain.com/member_images/11/web/383000-383999/383795_157_full.jpg

[dominoy2k1]

ohh nice engine bay, hope you find the problem

[azian6er]

lets see pics of the IC up front.
-B

[505zoom]

505... it's the EssentialSpeed kit... stages 1 & 2...

it vents directly back into the post-maf side of the intake...

as far as I know all couplings are still tight (but I wont have time to take off the bumper and check the one between the bumper and the radiator for a couple weeks now with my bust schedule... but i truly dont see a vaccume leak being the issue as it still boosts as strong as ever (butt dyno... gauge will be in in a couple days) and the idle is not rough (which it usually will get somewhat rough if you have a vaccume leak...


After looking at the pic, and factoring all the different things you have said about what's happening, I think that the return on the intake is too close to the MAF sensor. When you vent the air through the BOV and into the intake, some of it is traveling backwards and affecting the reading that the sensor is getting. This will cause the issues you have stated.

Just my .02

[servoeyes]

After looking at the pic, and factoring all the different things you have said about what's happening, I think that the return on the intake is too close to the MAF sensor. When you vent the air through the BOV and into the intake, some of it is traveling backwards and affecting the reading that the sensor is getting. This will cause the issues you have stated.

Just my .02
Agreed. That's the first thing that I thought when I saw your set-up. Steph's (SpicyMSP) car was doing this when Injen first made the intake. That's why the injen makes has that goofy long pipe.

[505zoom]

Agreed. That's the first thing that I thought when I saw your set-up. Steph's (SpicyMSP) car was doing this when Injen first made the intake. That's why the injen makes has that goofy long pipe.

Exactly... more importantly though, it is much closer to the turbo on the injen.

[TooleBox]

hmmm... thanks for the info guys... i'll keep you all posted as to whether i can get this resolved...

one theory that i have is this... the standard ES intercooler is designed to flow 300CFM less than the one they prepared for me... is it possible that after blowoff, under idling airflow, the system cannot fill the volume of the cooler fast enough continue flowing the air to bring the revs back up?

If i bumped the boost from stock to say 8psi... would that help fill up the volume and keep things more consistant?

just an idea... but i do not see how the boost setting would affect things under a closed throttle condition... Afterall... the turbo is exhaust-spun... under idling conditions, the turbo would be spinning/pulling the same amount of airflow nomatter what the boost setting is at... it is only under acceleration that the boost will build to the predetermined level of the boost controller... no?

(ps... sorry if that made no sense... im new to the whole turbo thing)

anyways, i'll keep ya posted

[TooleBox]

here is the album of all the parts, the install, etc...

it should answer any "visual" based questions you may have

EssentialSpeed Stages 1 & 2 installation Pictures (http://www.imagestation.com/album/?id=4287749967)

[jred321]

http://www.msprotege.com/vbb300/showthread.php?t=38720&page=1&pp=40&highlight=bov+stall
it sounds like the problem acidbbg was having. it turned out his return was too close to the maf i believe. it's either that or the terrible angle the return is at compared to airflow is disrupting the flow too much, but i wouldn't think so

[TooleBox]

i just have no clue... not one other person with the ES kit has had this issue.. and the only difference is that my intercooler is slightly larger than the one that usually ships with the kit...

im thinking i may just bump up my idle a bit and see if that will work as a temp fix... i really need my gauge to arrive so I can get a visual on what the manifold preassure looks like when this occurs

[Black Majik MSP]

The Forge BOV is the only dual-piston design I know of...I'd suggest that everyone get one, but it sounds like this might be an especially good idea in your case.

[spacemonkey]

i thought Apex has a dual piston design...

[TooleBox]

well.. the problem seems to be cured... i removed the recirculate, capped off the intake tube and am now venting to atmosphere... it's runnin great now!

[505zoom]

well.. the problem seems to be cured... i removed the recirculate, capped off the intake tube and am now venting to atmosphere... it's runnin great now!

Cool, now that you aren't confusing the MAF it should be happier. You *might* develop a stalling condition later after the PCM gets familiar with your new setup.

[TooleBox]

yeah... it stalls on occasion now... but it seems to catch itself right as the lights come on...

I'll be talking to ES tomorrow about a redesign on the recirc fitting... thats all this kit needs to be flawless!

[TooleBox]

Update, I went over some details today with Kevin at essentialspeed today. He has already redesigned the recirculate fitting and will be sending me a new pipe to test out...

This guy is amazing and is doing everything to maintain THE BEST kit available for the MSP!

[505zoom]

Update, I went over some details today with Kevin at essentialspeed today. He has already redesigned the recirculate fitting and will be sending me a new pipe to test out...

This guy is amazing and is doing everything to maintain THE BEST kit available for the MSP!

Good stuff, way to go ES for great CS.:)