Murdered a WRX on the Highway

[LinuxRacr]

I was comming home from work this morning on Westbound 635, and right before the I-35 junction, I pull up behind this WRX Wagon going slower than I liked, so I proceded to ride his ass (I hate when folks do this to me). The guy finally starts to accellerate, and I followed. I stayed right with him (surprisingly) up to the sharp left-turn ramp going to southbound I-35, and then the suspention showed him what was up. On the turn, I sped up to over 100, and passed him, and stayed ahead. On the turn's exit, I was over 110, and left him bad. When I decided to slow down, I was up the road about 1/4 Mi, and going over 120. That was fun!:D

[manuel]

http://manuel.envy.nu/smilies/bs1.gif

[LinuxRacr]

I know there would be someone who would raise the coveted flag. I didn't believe it either, but it happend. You Obviously don't know. I'm just stating what happened. Maybe the guy gave up on the corner, when he tried to catch me.

[manuel]

im not clear with some statistics and/or some facts, but is the mp3 traction far better than that of a 4wd vehicle? the wagons still have 4wd right? btw, i dont know since i wasnt there, so i can only go by what you said.

one other thing....dont like the smilie with the flag? heres another...
http://manuel.envy.nu/images/bsmeter.gif

[Gyre]

The stock WRX is pretty easy to get going sideways. I'm not sure if it's a higher stance or softer springs or what. I think it's because of people trying to do the whole rally thing off-road.

[LinuxRacr]

Originally posted by manuel
im not clear with some statistics and/or some facts, but is the mp3 traction far better than that of a 4wd vehicle? the wagons still have 4wd right? btw, i dont know since i wasnt there, so i can only go by what you said.

one other thing....dont like the smilie with the flag? heres another...
http://manuel.envy.nu/images/bsmeter.gif

That BS meter is better! LOL!:D As far as the suspention on that thing, I saw him lean bad trying to keep up on that curve.

[cjstringer]

WRX has a lot more body roll than our car. AutoX will prove that to ya. They constantly beg for mercy when they see the MP3 pull up. :)

[NYCZMP3]

where u from??....


anyone heard from asian hottie??....i think we have some snaked in our garden....:mad:

[javy212]

Havign driven both a stock WRX and my stock MP3, this is entirely possible assuming the amount of straight road was extremely limited. The WRX suspension is fairly mushy (but i've ridden on one with a thicker sway bar set and a strut bar and it rivals mp3 with those mods). Also, the stock WRX tires SUCK!!! I mean they suck. My winter tires were grippier than those things. So yea, this is definitely possible.... Good kill!

[LinuxRacr]

Yeah,

I drove a stock WRX also. It would kill me from the line, but on a variable highway, It's the MP3 all the way!(at high speeds!):D

[heartbroken]

Yes I have snaked into the garden.

The WRX is the safer car to go.

For the record, I took Linux to go test drive the WRX as a surprise for him, so no, I'm not all bitch. I can be nice when I am being nice to.

[blazerex]

here, gonna throw a HUGE BS...

As someone who owns a WRX there is nothing your car will do better than mine. Even in stock trim. The one POSSIBLE advantage you may have is that the stock RE-92s blow so badly that in a hard corner, and I do mean hard, not highway speeds, they start to fold.

Also anyone who said a stock WRX is easy to get sideways has never driven one. As is typcal with AWD cars they are very difficult to get sideways in street trim, and push through corners rather than oversteer.

Now that being said You still want to tell me your 15,000$ 130hp grocery getter out accelerated a 227hp, AWD, sport tuned wagon? I'll put a thousand bux down that the WRX can give you a 2-3 second head start and STILL out accelerate you to 100.

Wait wait wait.. maybe, just maybe it was all those fully functional body moldings that made your corner so well? Hey don't get me wrong, the P5 is a tight little car, and lots of bang for the buck, but it is no where NEAR the quality, performance or handling of a WRX. And for those of you that think it is (in stock trim mind you) put your money where your mouth is.

-blaze

[manuel]

haha someone who finally sees MY POINT!!

well not really, please EDIT your reply to refer to the MP3 not the PROTEGE5!! but i KNOW what you are talking about. i dont drive a wrx, but i know when the game owns me, and a wrx does that.

[blazerex]

hey no offense meant to anyone, but an MP3 is still just a protege ES 2.0 with some mild suspensions changes, and an upgraded intake thus allowing the HUGE jump to 140hp. None the less you're still driving a protoge. Just like in the end I am STILL Driving an impreza, all be it the best impreza there is.

I am quite sure my little 2.0l produces more than 140hp w/o a turbo in fact....

I just want to hear bung hole here acknowledge that under NO circumstance would he ever be able to compete with a WRX on ANY level. This is like me saying I blew away a C5 on the highway when i was stock. While I can now keep up with them (definitely not stock anymore) I certainly couldn't blow them away.

so just for S&Gs let's go over this again

MP3 = P5 + 10hp + cool colors and a z929 deck + some suspension work, Okay...

WRX = Impreza TS (which BTW would probably still own an MP3) + 80hp via smaller block, lower compression and a TD04 running 14.4psi. + stiffer tuned suspension.

MP3 != WRX.

But in the end, all that matters is that you like your car, but don't try to convince us, or anyone that you blew away a WRX. Unless of course you think your car does 0-60 in 5.4, and quarters in 14.8, or 0-100-0 in 17 seconds. In fact let's just take acceleration OUT of the picture, I would bet money that a bone stock WRX can pull more G's on a track than an MP3, nevermind the HP. Or to call someones bluff, let's take bone stock MP3s and bone stock WRX and run em at an auto-cross, I'll pay the entry fees, but when the MP3 loses you have to pay me back for both.... any takers? Oh, need to have a neutral drive too. Someone either familiar with both cars or not familiar with either.

Peace - Z

[blazerex]

and while I'm at it... since Linux boy is all super modded out, i'll pit my car against his too...

the result will of course be:

su -
rm -rf /home/LinuxRacr
ps -aux |grep -i linuxracr
killall (insert linuxracr parent pid here)
mkdir /home/WRXownedJ00
vi /etc/fstab
o
/dev/realcar /home/WRXownedJ00 iso9660, defaults, ro 1 2
ZZ
mount -a
hostname "WRXownedJ00"
echo "WRXownedJ00 127.0.0.1" >/etc/hosts
rm -rf /boot/lilo
rm -rf /boot/grub
echo "" > /root/.bash_history
history -c
init 6


the end result?.... I think you get the picture - OWNED.

-blaze

[manuel]

well thanks for all those facts, but uhm, that unix stuff...im lost...either way i still think the mp3 has more than "some" suspension work.....and yes, the wrx is better than the mp3 in handling, speed, lots of stuff....keep in mind having a turbo and 4wd is no match to a fwd 2.0l. now lets consider this, a turbo, 4wd, and yes, bigger engine on the mp3. im not trying to compare your wrx to an mp3, because I KNOW it outhandles, pretty much beats it anywhere. and NO the mp3 is NOT a p5, its a protege with "some" stuff. but hey i was gonna get a wrx, just didnt have the other 5k to fork out. dangit, i shoulda waited, oh well. though its good to know the mp3 can out do the c3/c5 autocrossing, but hey even i know rwd are harder to control in the turns, unless you love to drift, wait i have no clue what im talking about. need ssllleeeppppp.

i must implore you stop using the linux stuff, i just fried half of my brain, well, i just finished it off.

[BigBlue]

The WRX is a bad ass car no doubt about it. If I had the coin I likely would have bought it, but the difference in price here in Canada is about 10 thousand dollars before taxes...just not worth it...plus to boot you get a car that is at least here starting to become quite commonplace to see. There's only one other MP3 here in a city of just over 1/2 a million...not too shabby.


Or to call someones bluff, let's take bone stock MP3s and bone stock WRX and run em at an auto-cross, I'll pay the entry fees, but when the MP3 loses you have to pay me back for both.... any takers? Oh, need to have a neutral drive too. Someone either familiar with both cars or not familiar with either.

On this one I'd beg to differ tho. I have raced against a WRX owner on multiple occassions at autocross. I'm not a very good driver yet and it's my first year both in autocross and with a manual tranny car. He's been to multiple autoX schools as well as this being his second year of autoX and he's had a manual before his WRX too. Every single event we've raced, I've beaten him.

25 DSS Tom Buller 98 Sat SC2 0 00:41.477
23 CSS Harold Ramos 87 Toy MR2 0 00:41.752
2 ESS Craig Thoroughgood 86 Toy Corr 0 00:42.260
5 ESS Corey Dyck 00 Focus ZX3 0 00:42.304
8 DSP Mike Florence 92 Niss 240 2 00:42.891
14 DSS Ian Leavens 98 Saturn SC2 0 00:43.079
4 DSP Glen Linington 99 Camaro 0 00:43.396
12 DS Chris Deacon 02 Nissan SER 0 00:43.555
15 ES Ryan Papineau 01 ProtegeMP3 0 00:43.828
1 FS Art Schroeder 99 Chev Camar 0 00:43.915
22 CSP Dan Goodman 84 RX7 White 0 00:43.963
28 CS Ed Arnold 86 Toy MR2 0 00:44.307
18 ESS Robert Polson 99 Hond Sir 0 00:44.511
26 DSP Steve Carmicheal 92 Integra 0 00:44.738
20 ESS Chris Yorke 86 GTI 0 00:44.798
29 CSP Nick Hybschmann 92 Civic Si 0 00:44.857
17 SS Calvin Leung 01 Boxter S 0 00:45.382
3 DSS Allan Chan 02 WRX 0 00:45.406

That's not the whole listing...just up until the WRX. Note that he isn't even in stock anymore as he's upgraded his exhaust and bought a new BOV and some other stuff as well I believe. The only reason I don't do better is because every single person except for the Spec V above me has R-Compound tires. Not too bad for a mildly upgraded Protege tho.

[Zeorymer]

Originally posted by manuel
now lets consider this, a turbo, 4wd, and yes, bigger engine on the mp3
Wait, what are you trying to say here?
Both cars have the same size engine.
Did I read this wrong?

[LinuxRacr]

Someone in here obviously hasn't been reading what's really going on. First of all, the WRX is DEFINITELY quicker. I have about 150 HP. When I get tuned I will have about 165 HP (which is still slower). Second of all...Read my posts again and you will get the clear picture! As a matter of fact, I talked to a WRX owner yesterday and I humbly told him about my race, and he even said that it was possible. He said that this is because the pick up and go of the WRX is VERY crisp up until about just under 100 MPH, not to mention the huge drive-train losses of the AWD. Now I have learned that the estimated top speed of the WRX is 147 mph. My car can go up to about 140+ MPH. We were at 70 MPH at least when we started. I was right BEHIND him until the corner. I hit that corner at over 100 MPH. I know that he was trying to keep up, cause he was leaning in my rear-view really bad. I made it out of the turn way before he did, and got to 120 MPH pretty quick after this. Now the question is when did he decide that he did not want to race anymore? I got at least a 1/4 mi. on him before I shut it down. It is pointless to sit here and argue this. I present what happened. Either folks will accept it, or not. The facts are out there now. Believe what you want, but remember, you weren't there!:cool:

[LinuxRacr]

Ya know, maybe it's the title of the thread that is mis-leading(but exciting!).

[LinuxRacr]

Originally posted by blazerex
and while I'm at it... since Linux boy is all super modded out, i'll pit my car against his too...

the result will of course be:

su -
rm -rf /home/LinuxRacr
ps -aux |grep -i linuxracr
killall (insert linuxracr parent pid here)
mkdir /home/WRXownedJ00
vi /etc/fstab
o
/dev/realcar /home/WRXownedJ00 iso9660, defaults, ro 1 2
ZZ
mount -a
hostname "WRXownedJ00"
echo "WRXownedJ00 127.0.0.1" >/etc/hosts
rm -rf /boot/lilo
rm -rf /boot/grub
echo "" > /root/.bash_history
history -c
init 6


the end result?.... I think you get the picture - OWNED.

-blaze

This boy talks much shit without reading the facts well. Lets get to the point:

su -
rm -rf /home/WRXownedJ00
ps -aux |grep -i WRXownedJ00
killall (insert WRXownedJ00's parent pid here)
hostname This_guy_is_phucking_arrogant
ping -f -l 9600 (insert blazerex's hostname here)

Time to re-install, and restore from the latest full backup+incrementals.

[javy212]

Just wanted to clarify somethings:
WRX: skidpad-.82g
Slalom - 66.8 mph

MP3: Skidpad: .90g
Slalom : 70.2mph

.08g is a big difference, and 4 mph is an even bigger difference. As i said in my previous post, Linux's story is definitely possible. I am a huge wrx fan, so much so that I'm gonna go get one. and although the wrx is straight out faster, the MP3 will whip it in a cornering situation, espeically at speed. The MP3 is more stable, and even if the WRX can outhandle it in a highway speed situation, the MP3 is such a confidence inspiring ride that you feel comfortable pushing it to its limits whereas the WRX doesn't do that as much. So Blazerex, let it be known that noone in here will argue that the WRX is a phat car deserving of much praise. But as MP3 owners we know our stregths and our weaknesses. I would drive my car at speed with a porsche or ferrari on an off-ramp any day of the week and keep tight with it, let alone a wrx.

[Sean]

It's all driver, period. Regarding AutoX times my 137HP Impreza 2.2 wagon (no turbo) beat a Protege 5 in raw time. Posting a single autocross result doesn't really prove that the Protege 3 is better than a WRX. I guess that, by that logic, my Impreza 2.2 is better than a WRX since I beat the Protege 5 at a single autocross! :D

G 3 186 Lau, Alex 2002 Mazda Protege5 98.795 96.545 101.191 97.172 101.798 95.698 107.685 * Best: Morning: 96.545 Afternoon: 95.698 Average: 96.122

I 9 47 Sosik-Hamor, Sean 1998 Subaru Impreza 2.2 OBS 98.124 99.413 95.481 94.252 95.878 96.830 93.629 * Best: Morning: 94.252 Afternoon: 93.629 Average: 93.941

http://www.trunkmonkeyracing.com/pics/lil.gif There is no cone | The Trunkmonkey is in a coma
Trunkmonkey Racing (http://www.trunkmonkeyracing.com/) | sean@trunkmonkey.com | What is a Trunkmonkey? (http://www.trunkmonkeyracing.com/show.php?Article=3)

[Syzygy]

Originally posted by Sean
...(snip)...my 137HP Impreza 2.2 wagon (no turbo) beat a Protege 5 in raw time...(snip)...So I take it you don't own a Mazda, you're just here to talk s**t.

Cool! Since this is your first (and probably only) post, welcome, Sean!

[manuel]

well finally.....some people started replying, goodness i was getting tired of replying with mumbo jumbo....

[javy212]

When it really comes down to it, in any race, it's gonna be the driver. So while it does seem like sean has come around intending to ruffle some feathers, he makes a very valid point in this conversation.

[LinuxRacr]

Originally posted by javy212
When it really comes down to it, in any race, it's gonna be the driver. So while it does seem like sean has come around intending to ruffle some feathers, he makes a very valid point in this conversation.

I agree.

[LinuxRacr]

By the way, this is not a thread about any car being better, it was about a race!:mad:

[blazerex]

Actual auto-cross times mean jack. I have been autocrossing for almost 4 years, and I still suck. In fact I suck so badly that I am back to running novice this year :).... My car deifnitely would put me in street mod simply by modification alone, yet that being said a good driver in a stock WRX still beats me. As any auto-crosser knows the key to auto crossing is good driving, not horse power. Sure HP and traction help, but only if you can drive it.

I Also notice you were beat by a 99 camaro, a saturn SC2, well 2 of them in fact.

As far as getting a car that is "common place" - this is all relative. 16000 2002 WRX's were made. I own a blaze yellow one, one of 425 limited editions. Mine happens to be a standard, now it's down to one of 200. I have a custom sunroof, 18" 13lb forged alloys - I guarantee my car is one of a kind.

[Sean]

Originally posted by javy212
When it really comes down to it, in any race, it's gonna be the driver. So while it does seem like sean has come around intending to ruffle some feathers, he makes a very valid point in this conversation.

No, someone simply posted on i-club.com that a Protege 3 driver "owned" a WRX. I hit the thread to see if it was something that happened at an accurately timed track event. Turns out that it was some kid driving recklessly at well over 100 MPH on an onramp doing what sounds like an illegal pass on a one lane ramp.

After reading the standard "my car is bigger than your car" crap comparing a 150whatever HP 2WD Protege 3 to a 230whatever HP AWD WRX I realized that someone added a few inches to the story. I was fully prepared to simply ignore the thread completely until the "my Protege beat a WRX at the autocross so the WRX is crap" post.

I simply felt the need to post a single response stating that competition driving is 100% driver. I routinely kick WRX drivers' asses in my 137 HP Impreza 2.2 wagon at rallycross and autocross events. I know they can own me in a straight line and I don't pretend that my car is faster. But, under certain circumstances, my skill is better to the point of pulling faster lap times at New Hampshire International Speedway than some of the WRX and Porsche drivers.

So, it doesn't matter what the car is...it's all driver. Now, am I saying that the driver who originally posted this thread is a better driver? No, I won't even go there. Illegal 100+ MPH maneuvers on an onramp on public roads? Yeah...I won't even comment on that.

[LinuxRacr]

Originally posted by Sean


So, it doesn't matter what the car is...it's all driver.

Not always, but most of the time. Better suspension, and tires can definitely help.


Now, am I saying that the driver who originally posted this thread is a better driver? No, I won't even go there.
Illegal 100+ MPH maneuvers on an onramp on public roads? Yeah...I won't even comment on that.

Yeah, don't!

One more thing, this is NOT a thread about my MP3 being better than anyone else's car, it is however me telling what I experienced one day. People need to read more carefully! Don't believe the hype!!!:mad:

[Sean]

Originally posted by LinuxRacr
Not always, but most of the time. Better suspension, and tires can definitely help.

Yes, they help, but they contribute far less to the performance of a vehicle than most people think. Get a professional or seasoned driver in a bone stock WRX on the stock crappy RE92 tires and soft suspension and he will more than likely beat the novice driver, even if the novice driver has a modified WRX with race tires and tuned suspension. This has been shown time and time again at all of the autocross, rallycross and track events I've shown up at.

However, tires and suspension contribute greatly when both drivers are of the same skill level or when comparing raw statistics. For example, the skid pad rating that was posted before. What kind of tires come stock on the MP3 and the MP5? The WRX comes with the crappy Bridgestone RE92s that break free extremely quickly under cornering. So, raw skid pad numbers will be skewed by tire and suspension choice. However, on the track, an experienced driver on stock tires can still beat a novice driver on race tires.

100% driver, 0% car. Case in point...Team O'Neil rallycross, a dude in a 3 banger Subaru Justy with less than a hundred horsepower ran stage times that were three seconds faster than everyone else and kicked the crap out of the WRXs, VWs, Audis and fully prepared ProRally cars. Again, Team O'Neil rallycross, a guy in a bone stock Subaru Impreza 2.5 RS on street tires was running 10 seconds faster than everyone else...again including the same batch of Audis, WRXs and ProRally cars.

BMWCCA ice racing series...I pulled second place in AWD snow tire class for the season in my virtually stock Impreza 2.2 (only had intake, bigger brakes, swaybars and short shifter, all of which do nothing on ice) and beat out the guys in the AWD WRXs, AWD Porsches, AWD BMWs, AWD Audis, etc. The only guy in my class who was pulling consistently faster times than me was a professional ice racer who, after kicking my ass in his stock WRX, proceeded to go out and kick my ass in a RWD BMW as well. ;)

On a side note, a guy in another class driving a Miata on all season tires (not even snow tires) pulled faster stage times than me on two or three stages even though my stage time were good for a class win. Again, 100% driver, 0% car.


One more thing, this is NOT a thread about my MP3 being better than anyone else's car, it is however me telling what I experienced one day. People need to read more carefully! Don't believe the hype!!!:mad:

Correct, your original post was not about your MP3 being better than the WRX, however some of the people who replied turned it into that by posting stats and autocross times of WRXs getting beaten by the MP3. I just figured I'd chime in.

So, on that note, I leave you with this: :D

http://www.trunkmonkeyracing.com/Scrapbook/20020224-01-BMWCCA-IceRace/640/20020224-008-BMWCCA-IceRace.jpg

Not a very good pic, but he showed up to the ice races this year and did quite well for his first season out on the ice. :)

[BigBlue]

Ok first off especially since I'm the one who posted the autoX times and I wasn't trying to come off the wrong way but obviously stuff happens.

This was originally posted by blazerex

Or to call someones bluff, let's take bone stock MP3s and bone stock WRX and run em at an auto-cross, I'll pay the entry fees, but when the MP3 loses you have to pay me back for both.... any takers?

Ok so you started with the smack talk about how the WRX would kick the crap outta the MP3....if it was done by the same driver...yeah probably it would log a faster time. I'm not so sure the times would be a huge difference tho...in autocross. The PAX time conversion for the two different classes in my area are very close to one another.




I Also notice you were beat by a 99 camaro, a saturn SC2, well 2 of them in fact.

Yup I was beat by a bunch of cars. I am a novice driver...only have about a 1/2 dozen races under my belt. Maybe my times will improve hopefully as I get more seat time. Oh and those Saturn drivers....full respect to them....they are both amazing drivers and they have both said once they got R-compounds it was like night and day....probably the biggest reason I want a set, but will likely wait till I'm a better driver.





"my Protege beat a WRX at the autocross so the WRX is crap" post.

Ok this is where I get a bit cheesed off tho. I try to post at all times with respect and don't appreciate when people just make stuff up. I beat one WRX and was using that as an example that just because you have a WRX doesn't make you impossible to beat anywhere. It exactly does have a lot to do with driver.
As a matter of fact, the very first line where I'm apparently calling the WRX "crap" reads:


The WRX is a bad ass car no doubt about it

and I even go on to say how I'd have bought one myself if I had the money. So in the future at least be fair when discussing stuff and don't make things up.


I simply felt the need to post a single response stating that competition driving is 100% driver.

Just one last note...it is not 100% driver. I have had the opportunity to drive other vehicles....my ex-gf had a Honda Civic...and altho I never autocrossed it, I did do things like take turns fast. There is no way I felt able to make those turns at the same speeds I could in the MP3(or a WRX). Yeah a good driver can win against novice drivers in a slower car. But if you give that same good driver a faster/better handling car...you can't tell me he will not go faster still. If you had the perfect driver and he drove the MP3 and WRX to the limit in autoX, by all logic I believe the WRX should win...so use that as a quote if you want. I was not bashing the WRX at all.

[LinuxRacr]

The ice race photo is a trip!:D Sean, thanks for the clarity, and the fact that you are NOT being a .......!

[javy212]

My purpose in posting the skidpad times was just to illustrate that Linux's story was in fact possible. Someone thrwe up a BS flag and I just stated that the idea of an MP3 out-dooing a WRX in this situation isn't outrageous.


the skid pad rating that was posted before. What kind of tires come stock on the MP3 and the MP5? The WRX comes with the crappy Bridgestone RE92s that break free extremely quickly under cornering.

I'm well aware of this and actually in my very first post in this thread i made this exceedingly clear:


The WRX suspension is fairly mushy (but i've ridden on one with a thicker sway bar set and a strut bar and it rivals mp3 with those mods). Also, the stock WRX tires SUCK!!! I mean they suck.

And while this thread isn't about one car being better than the other, I have to say that the WRX is probably a better car in general. Gotta love the MP3 tho :D

Nothin but Luv!

[cjstringer]

Originally posted by Sean
Posting a single autocross result doesn't really prove that the Protege 3 is better than a WRX.

Well, as a WRX lover myself, I'll still post that the MP3 kicks ass in AutoX. Check any of the events I've been to. You'll be hard pressed to find a WRX beating me. It may be driver to some extent, but this is my first year. I'm a rookie. Some of these guys have been at it for years. WRX, great for power and rallies, not so great on a solid surface. JMHO

Linux, I'm with ya. Understood from the beginning. Some people just can't read.