T-Too Small to a Big-t28

[luvsd619]

Just wondering if anyone has done this yet. It should be a direct bolt on like the Eclipse/Talons right?

[ForceFed]

YES!
It should bolt right up with minimal mods if any.
I have thought about doing this myself but not with all the MSP's tearing themselves apart with the tiny pea shooter t-25!WTF!
Oh well ,hope this helps
Matt

[instylz]

Engine management

[03MSP]

semi-threadjack here; I heard that the T-25 flows about 405 cfm, what are the numbers for the T-28?

405 cfm for the T-25 seems high though, but I dunno, my old IHI VJ-11 had a rating of ~190 cfm and it added about the same power to my MX-6 as the T-25 does for the Protege at around the same levels of boost.

[mp5jeff]

luvsd619 -- would be a good idea to get fuel/timing management before swapping in a bigger turbo, i think someone on here acctualy lost power just putting in the turbo..just a thought

[ForceFed]

The T-25 and the T-28 utilize the same exterior turbo housings.They are essentially the same turbo from the EXTERIOR LOOKS of them.The differences aren't seen until you go into the internals but yes without proper tuning then
i think the turbo is over kill.Not to mention the fact that we are proving more every day that the weak stock internals of this motor are just not meant for FI applications.
So thew answer to your question is yes it will work but BEWARE!
Matt;)

[luvsd619]

yeh fuel manage is the key. I had to do it with the talon when i up the boost to 18psi. Fuel pump, injectors, and fuel control was needed for all that forced air.

[TiGrayMsp716]

I'm really wary of doing anything to my car till after some engine management and forged internals.....

[luvsd619]

Yeh, I just found out that the motor is a stock lx/dx or what ever u call it. Thats why the boost is so low. What was mazda thinking? If the motor was built, The MSP would be up there wit da evo and sti.

[03MSP]

Originally posted by luvsd619
Yeh, I just found out that the motor is a stock lx/dx or what ever u call it. Thats why the boost is so low. What was mazda thinking? If the motor was built, The MSP would be up there wit da evo and sti.

That's true, I always ask myself why Mazda would not build up the engine, but you have to remember, the price would be up there with the EVO and STi as well.

[instylz]

Yea but I do believe this motor does have some potential with just really good engine management. I mean we can't expect miracles but one would imagine 10-12psi on the stock turbo with 100% reliability should be attainable without second guessing.

[TiGrayMsp716]

Yeah but they didn't think that anyone would pay for the extra amount of parts (plus there profit margin) you'd be looking at 24 - 27k for a protege....

[luvsd619]

03msp ur right about that. da price would be up too.

[TiGrayMsp716]

mazda had the idea when they came up with the prototype (bunch of HKS goodies) but there accountants couldn't make it work

[mp5jeff]

can you put the t-28 compressor/turbine wheels in the stock housings? this would work good IMO, i would still suggest fuel management

[luvsd619]

I think u can swap. The outer shell of the t-25 and the t-28 are the same. The insides different. Look at turbochargers.com I thing they show the difference between the two.

[shaolin]

At that point it would be less trouble to swap the two all together.

[luvsd619]

shaolin- ur right about that and i like ur 1/64 f&f.

[Aricjm15]

get a better intercooler first

[ForceFed]

Originally posted by mp5jeff
can you put the t-28 compressor/turbine wheels in the stock housings? this would work good IMO, i would still suggest fuel management

Well then the t-25 would be a t-28 wouldn't it?
You get the picture now.
It would prob be cheaper in the long run to just buy the t-28
Matt

[AutoBox]

u could easily swap a t-28 bb from a newer black top s14 sr20det motor from the nissan camp...they can push 300whp easy......but i dont plan to try til i fins management that works.....i think our motors can hold the boost....u just gotta dimiss detonation for it to hold......

[shaolin]

Engine Management.
Fuel Management.
Forged Internals.
New Injectors.
Better Plugs.

Now talk about turbo upgrades.

[yashooa]

Originally posted by instylz
Yea but I do believe this motor does have some potential with just really good engine management. I mean we can't expect miracles but one would imagine 10-12psi on the stock turbo with 100% reliability should be attainable without second guessing.

Werd bITCH!!!! wErD (beer) (usa) (poke) (screwy) (poke) (usa) (beer)

[yashooa]

Originally posted by AutoBox
u could easily swap a t-28 bb from a newer black top s14 sr20det motor from the nissan camp...they can push 300whp easy......but i dont plan to try til i fins management that works.....i think our motors can hold the boost....u just gotta dimiss detonation for it to hold......
True dat, TRAAAAUUUE DAT.

We all must eliminate the DETEONATE! So we mustn’t procrastinate or hesitate to remove said DETTONAAAYTION!
Yowsa...
Can I get a Johnny Cockran brouthas and sistas AMEN!

[AutoBox]

may my wisdom hit all that listen......anyway....dont jump the gun on buildin up expensive ass motors....why not explore and see what the stock motor can really do?? if u got the loot to spend on engine internals, save it and once u got management, boost it up stock, shit if it does go...then use ur money u saved and rebuild it.....you guys are so quick to go wastin money.....i will bet our motors can hold good boost if its tuned properly and no corners are cut....just good tuning makes a world of difference.....

[DiscreetSpeed]

all of this has been done....

[yashooa]

Originally posted by AutoBox
may my wisdom hit all that listen......anyway....dont jump the gun on buildin up expensive ass motors....why not explore and see what the stock motor can really do?? if u got the loot to spend on engine internals, save it and once u got management, boost it up stock, shit if it does go...then use ur money u saved and rebuild it.....you guys are so quick to go wastin money.....i will bet our motors can hold good boost if its tuned properly and no corners are cut....just good tuning makes a world of difference.....
Words spoken Like Little Joey P.
He took his to 21PSI on the DYNO with 116 octane. He pushed hard and it did not come apart. Heck he was basically pushing to see when it would pop but it never did. I don't think there is one magic thread that binds all these failures together. One was a manufacturing defect and the others all have other things involved besides just boost there are a lot of things that can occur and to blame it on boost alone seems short sighted.
Heck Jecky NEVER upped his boost and the motor went. Another one had a coolant leak and it died on the dyno. True he did up the boost but he could have had the leaky hose clamp and it could have contributed to his engine's death. Sensible boost increase with normal driving and maintainence without beating the shit out of the car will not destroy the motor. It's a Protege drive it like one. It's not a 400 WHP DSM it's an affordable, attractive little family car, with great handling, good milage, and a very large fun factor.

BTW I love my MSP!

For those have no fear DRIVE THAT MUTHA FUGGA!!!!
Drive it hard :p
As for me I am kinda SKEERED so the occasional 12 PSI run will have to suffice.

[z00mer]

I say that proper tuning is the key. W/out that expect a blown motor.

By the way, has anybody tried a GT-25? I have a bud in San Jose who just rebuilt one, and is giving it to me for free.

[AutoBox]

i havent noticed anyone upgrading their stock turbo to something that bolts on...i think a few have just jumped to t3 or t3/t4 hybrids....

yashooa - well it takes ppl with balls to true show the point of no return.....even thou every car is different its still a good baseline.....everyone talks about the motor being weak cus ppl blow them.....im almost 100% sure every single blow was without good tuning....unless they were truely testin th elimits of the motor which i havent even seen yet...i have seen full built sr20det motors (rods,pistons, rings, metal headgasket) blow because of detonation or coolant troubles...thats my point, why spend so much on somehting not needed yet...there is no way a protege cant boost 12 or so psi on stock block....u just have to tune it.....and about the fully built sr20 motor, the guy threw that one out and went stock block and is makin almost 430whp at 16psi.......he took his time and tuned it.....cant compare motors of course but the simple fact that he had a built motor with shitty tuning....then stepped back and realized his mistake and took a stock block motor and tuned it right and made more whp is what i follow to this day.......its not the motors fault some owners are stupid.

[DiscreetSpeed]

Originally posted by z00mer
I say that proper tuning is the key. W/out that expect a blown motor.

By the way, has anybody tried a GT-25? I have a bud in San Jose who just rebuilt one, and is giving it to me for free.
the turbo we have is a gt-25....?

[Yay-Boost]

Putting a larger trubo will help max. performance but, will poosibly hurt the low end. One of the things that makes the MSP fun to drive is the lack of turbo lag. People with 1.8t VW's put larger turbo's on and do increase the 6000 RPM horsepower but lose at lower RPM's. If you are using it just for racing it is the way to go. For an everyday driver. No thanks.

[AutoBox]

a t-28 or modified t-25 or Bigt28 is not gonna affect the spool up that much, at the most a few hundred rpm.....but the mid and upper range benfits far out way a lil turbo lag...the t25 is a tiny turbo and a t28 is only slightly larger.....u only see big lag when u start swapin over t3/t4 hybrids and other larger turbos....some of the gt series turbos that are t3 sized have awesome spool up...one friend had a gt 2830 i belive it was, anyway it would full boost by 3500 and scream to redline....it was very responsive and a breeze daily driven.....

[z00mer]

the turbo we have is a gt-25....?

Nope. Unfortunately we have a T-25.

[ForceFed]

Originally posted by z00mer
Nope. Unfortunately we have a T-25.

NOPE!
Unfortunately it IS a GT-25!
Who told you otherwise?
It is a dual ball bearing t-25 so ibeleive this makes it a GT series.
Besides ,it says in all of mazdas tech info that it is a Garrett GT series turbo.
Matt;)

[DiscreetSpeed]

all the G stands for is Garret my young apprentice.
which ours is a garret turbo-25

[yashooa]

Originally posted by DiscreetSpeed
the turbo we have is a gt-25....?
Yep according to Mazda's spec sheet it's a GT-25R.

[BinaryRotary]

You just need HKS'd nice T-25 Upgrade.

[AutoBox]

gt series of turbos are garrets line of dual bb turbos....i dunno what gt means but gt-25 and t-25 are different turbos...one is bb and the other is not....hks turbos are just rebadged garret turbos....minus possible special treatments......several lines of gt series turbos under garret and hks bolt up to our stock manifold and offer nice gains over our stock turbo.....gt2528, gt2830, gt3037 (not sure if this bolts on thou), the list goes on........

[Notorious]

I'm almost certain we have a t-25. Because at sevenstock one of the engineers had a GT-25 and showing it to people. He was saying that mazdaspeed owners should consider upgrading to it. Dr. Sound, chinkysauvo, i think Spicymsp were all there.

[AutoBox]

reg t-25 is non-bb....unless we didnt get something off the product list of garret it should be a gt-25....but i dunno.....

[Notorious]

hmmm i know we have a ball bearing turbo, but i was under the impression that it still fell under the standard t-25 turbo classification. When I first saw the gt-25 turbo at sevenstock I thought it was a t-28 and even asked the guy if it was. He said it was a gt-25 and its good for about 315 hp or so. Maybe Dr. Sound or one of the other guys that was at sevenstock could chime in and help us out here.

[z00mer]

I was told by one of the MazdaSpeed techs at 'Peoples Mazda'(Las Vegas, NV.), that all we had was a regular T-25.....not a GT-25. And being that he went through all the trouble to be a certified MazdaSpeed tech, I tend to go along w/ what he said.

[yashooa]

Originally posted by Notorious
hmmm i know we have a ball bearing turbo, but i was under the impression that it still fell under the standard t-25 turbo classification. When I first saw the gt-25 turbo at sevenstock I thought it was a t-28 and even asked the guy if it was. He said it was a gt-25 and its good for about 315 hp or so. Maybe Dr. Sound or one of the other guys that was at sevenstock could chime in and help us out here.

Ahem...
Callaway Engine

MAZDASPEED has reteamed with Callaway Cars to boost the Mazda 2.0-liter 16-valve, four-cylinder engine to an even higher performance level. Pumping up the MAZDASPEED Protegé's heart rate is the Callaway engine's Garrett T25 turbocharger system. The turbocharger incorporates the latest in aerodynamic and ball-bearing technology. This muscular power plant is engineered for optimum performance and superior driving excitement - without sacrificing driveability, fuel economy, or exhaust emission compliance.




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Garrett T25 Turbocharger System

Garrett is the largest manufacturer of turbochargers in the world, providing engine boosting systems that save fuel and reduce emissions while providing an increase to engine performance. Garrett's turbocharging business has sustained its reputation for innovating turbocharger technologies generation after generation. From its long list of industry firsts to its leading-edge ball bearing turbos for racecars, Garrett develops and manufactures the same cutting-edge boosting expertise that goes into all Garrett products.

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Competition Enthusiasts: Get Ready to Start Your Turbo Engines

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Type 2.0L DOHC 16-valve in-line 4-cylinder, turbocharged and intercooled



Turbocharger Fully engineered boosting system powered by a Garrett T25 Ball Bearing Turbocharger



Intercooler Factory air-to-air intercooler



Displacement (cc) 1991 cc/121.4 cu. in.



Bore x Stroke (mm) 83 x 92 mm/3.26 x 3.62 inch



Compression Ratio 9.1:1



Horsepower (SAE hp @ rpm) 170 @ 6000 rpm



Torque (SAE lb-ft @ rpm) 160 lb-ft @3500 rpm



Emissions T-LEV-B



Fuel Premium Fuel Only






Renesis rotary engine

3.0-liter DOHC V6 Engine

Cosworth Casting Process







© Copyright 2003 Mazda North American Operations. All Rights Reserved. terms & conditions | privacy policy

[yashooa]

Originally posted by z00mer
I was told by one of the MazdaSpeed techs at 'Peoples Mazda'(Las Vegas, NV.), that all we had was a regular T-25.....not a GT-25. And being that he went through all the trouble to be a certified MazdaSpeed tech, I tend to go along w/ what he said.

He is a FUCKING TARD!

See my other post this has been gone over a 100 times our turbo is a GT25R. Maybe he slept through the part about our turbo.

[Notorious]

Yash to the rescue. Thanx for the info!

[yashooa]

Originally posted by Notorious
Yash to the rescue. Thanx for the info!

http://www.mazdausa.com/MusaWeb/displayPage.action?pageParameter=perEngineCallaway

Welcome :D

[AutoBox]

yeh from what i read its not a turbo from garret's line of turbos but a one off just for our cars.....from what i read i bet its a regular t25 turbo with a ball bearing center section....i guess the some wheel and other lil mods along with the bb center section give it the nice "r" designation....but if u check garrets website all their bb turbos are designatied "gt" as in gt series. also if u read what yas posted they used some of garrets technology on the turbo...aka bb center section :)