*ATTENTION* Permanent Clunk Fix - FOOLPROOF!!!

[Melanism]

Okay.....After dealing with the dreaded 'clunk' problem due to subpar, unlubed rubber bushings on the rear sway bar, I have found a permanent fix, that actually increases the performance even more. I decided to replace the rubber bushings with Energy Suspension Polyurethane bushings. I purchased item # (9-5157 13/16") from http://www.nipponpower.com. The guys there were very helpful with getting me this part. I took me about an hour to replace the self greasable bushings. It was pretty simple, but did require some modifications. First off, the original bushing bracket is shaped differently from the new one, so I had to shape the new bracket with a hammer, very simple. Second obstacle was a bushing stoppage piece on the sway bar that prevents the bushing from slipping back and forth on the bar. These need to be pushed toward the inside about a quarter of an inch on each side. Other than that, you just grease up the bushings with all purpose grease and slip them on, bolt up the brackets and reap the benefits of Poly bushings! Maybe just me, but I think it stiffins cornering. NO NOISE AT ALL!! And the best thing about them, is that theyre self greasable. Has a nipple on it so that you hook a grease gun to it and pump in lube! I took pictures at several stages throughout the modification and I am currently working a tutorial....soon to come.



http://www.mazdamp3.com/vbb230/_handler.php/Melanism/sm_gsbb.jpg Dimensions in image are not actual to dimensions of part number 9-5157 http://www.mazdamp3.com/vbb230/_handler.php/Melanism/ens-9-5158g.jpg

[LinuxRacr]

Can't wait to see what you came up with.

[scott42]

How long have you been running with them?

[Melanism]

Actually, I have just put them on yesterday, but I am REALLY impressed so far. My car has NEVER been this quiet going over bumps. I turned everything off...radio, heat and just rode over bumpy terrain. I hear nothing. My next project is to tackle the front bushings. But the 'clunk' doesnt come from the front bushings. Just squealing on cold days.

By the way. When I took off the rubber bushings in the back, there was absolutely NO lube on them at all. There was so much friction occurring, that it burned the paint off of the bar. Damn Mazda Tech Genuises! Dont take your car back for a replacement, you are going to go into a perpetual problematic situation. Theyre only gonna replace it with another new faulty one. It will only be a matter of time before the new one starts to act up.

***I will update frequently with any new developments, so keep an eye on this post.

[cjstringer]

My dealer put on something similar, maybe even the same part, and was warrantying it before I sold my car.
Problem with those is, the bar will move from side to side under heavy cornering loads, and when it does, it REALLY messes up your handling.
You may never encounter this under everyday street driving, but if you corner hard, it could happen, just be careful.
Good luck! Hope it works out for you.

[Melanism]

Originally posted by cjstringer
My dealer put on something similar, maybe even the same part, and was warrantying it before I sold my car.
Problem with those is, the bar will move from side to side under heavy cornering loads, and when it does, it REALLY messes up your handling.
You may never encounter this under everyday street driving, but if you corner hard, it could happen, just be careful.
Good luck! Hope it works out for you.

The bar moving is caused by removal of the stoppage piece on the bar I described. I didnt remove this piece for the exact reason you are describing. I'm glad I didnt take those pieces off, and I wouldnt recommend anyone removing these pieces. I tested cornering....real hard cornering and I dont see any degradation of performance....so far lol

[mazdadan]

I ran this same exact set of bushings when I had the AWR sway bar on my ES. There were no adverse affects to the handling. The creak and clunking was eliminated. They cost less than $15.

[122 Vega]

Stoppage piece = hose clamp/joke

You really shouldn't call something permanent until it's been on the car for more than 24 hours.

Increased performance? Of what exactly? Understeer?

Britt

[scott42]

Melanism, I hope more than anyone that you're correct, but you should give this thread a read, if you haven't already explaining that no matter what type of bushing used, due to the forces and the way they are applied, nothing will stop it with any certainty until the mounting position of the bushing is changed.
http://207.44.244.58/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33490&highlight=klunk

I think your increased handling is basically the car as it is in new condition/the way it should be...mine feels great everytime I get mine replaced for the first 500 miles.

[Melanism]

Originally posted by 122 Vega
Stoppage piece = hose clamp/joke

You really shouldn't call something permanent until it's been on the car for more than 24 hours.

Increased performance? Of what exactly? Understeer?

Britt


That stoppage piece is not just a hose clamp....try and move it, then tell me whether you think its a hose clamp. I dont think so. Besides, it does exactly what it's supposed to do....keep the bushing from moving toward the inside. And as far as increased performance, I notice slight stiffness in body roll, like I said, maybe its all in my head. And SO FAR, it had COMPLETELY gotten rid of the 'clunk' problem thats so annoying.

[Pmpkinhead]

Um, did you read my info on the greaseable Summit Racing bushings! Mine have been in since March. They look the same.
1244 (msporange

[Newf]

drive on them for at least 2-3000 miles over REALLY BUMPY roads, and in wet conditions before you declare victory. I've tested several typle of fixes, one of which was poly urethane( which were the worse for noise btw) and to have it last one day is a joke. 1 month, also a joke. You need to properly test these before saying it's fixed.

really great idea, nice effort, but put some miles on the puppies first.

As for the rest of you, don't try any dyi fixes until you see the next bushing. You don't Mazda to say....sorry your warranty is void due to bla bla bla bla do you?

[122 Vega]

Okay, it's a hose clamp with some rubber inside of it. The bar still moves to to the lateral compliance of the bushing. Even poly bushings allow some stretch.

Britt

[Newf]

regardless keep us up to date with this.

[Melanism]

Originally posted by scott42
Melanism, I hope more than anyone that you're correct, but you should give this thread a read, if you haven't already explaining that no matter what type of bushing used, due to the forces and the way they are applied, nothing will stop it with any certainty until the mounting position of the bushing is changed.
http://207.44.244.58/vbb225/showthread.php?s=&threadid=33490&highlight=klunk

I think your increased handling is basically the car as it is in new condition/the way it should be...mine feels great everytime I get mine replaced for the first 500 miles.

Hmmm.....I see. Faulty design. Well I hope to goodness that this works out for me in the longrun. Little things like this are REALLY starting to irritate the shit out of me....I see an RX-8 in my future.

[TXMazdaSpeeder]

Originally posted by Melanism
Hmmm.....I see. Faulty design. Well I hope to goodness that this works out for me in the longrun. Little things like this are REALLY starting to irritate the shit out of me....I see an RX-8 in my future.


my friend's 03 rx8 has been in the shop more than mp3 in the last two months.

[Kooldino]

Originally posted by TXMazdaSpeeder
my friend's 03 rx8 has been in the shop more than mp3 in the last two months.

What for??



Anway, Melanism, good work, but as mentioned before, one day is far from a test.

Poly DOES tend to squeak worse than anything else, so we'll see what happens.

[Melanism]

No clunk, No squeak, very quiet, rigid and stiff.

[Newf]

keep the updates coming. Ya never know, Mazda's "fix" may fail and we'll need other options

good work!

[RyanJayG]

interesting... now, I'm gonna drill and tap my stock bushings. and insert a grease zerk. I think this might actually help :)

[Newf]

go get the Mazda fix first before screwing with your warranty. That's my advice

[Melanism]

What exactly is the 'Mazda Fix'? Please enlighten me. Thanks.

[scott42]

there are 4 of them now...
156b
156c
156d
156e...
and they all suck.

[mazdadan]

Originally posted by RyanJayG
interesting... now, I'm gonna drill and tap my stock bushings. and insert a grease zerk. I think this might actually help :)

That's actually a damn good idea. Make sure you also put a hole in the bushing so there is a channel for the grease to go into.

When I had the Energy Suspension Greasable Bushings, they also had channels in the bushings to help retain the grease. As long as I greased them regularly, there was no clunk or creak. I guess a lot of people are leary, but this is something that works pretty damn well.

[StuttersC]

Yeah....But maintenance is a pain if you don't 'grease" them regularly..

[ARunto]

Originally posted by StuttersC
Yeah....But maintenance is a pain if you don't 'grease" them regularly..

the downfall of owning a performance vehicle

[Melanism]

No clunk, tight, no squeaks or squeals. Absolutely quiet with no radio or heater fans on.

[scott42]

quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by StuttersC
Yeah....But maintenance is a pain if you don't 'grease" them regularly..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quoate:
-------------------------------------------------------------
"the downfall of owning a performance vehicle"
---------------------------------------------------------------

Performance vehicles that require this kind of work, are full of aftermarket, high quality parts, designed to require maintenence on cars that would blow this one away...
...this is a case of a stock car, with poor parts, and poor design (in this particular part of the car), and not a performance car requirement. if i wanted a car that I had to grease up every couple weeks, I'd have bought a track car, but then I wouldn't be able to drive to work. (shrug)

[StuttersC]

Originally posted by scott42
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by StuttersC
Yeah....But maintenance is a pain if you don't 'grease" them regularly..
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

quoate:
-------------------------------------------------------------
"the downfall of owning a performance vehicle"
---------------------------------------------------------------

Performance vehicles that require this kind of work, are full of aftermarket, high quality parts, designed to require maintenence on cars that would blow this one away...
...this is a case of a stock car, with poor parts, and poor design (in this particular part of the car), and not a performance car requirement. if i wanted a car that I had to grease up every couple weeks, I'd have bought a track car, but then I wouldn't be able to drive to work. (shrug)


Exactly my point...

[scott42]

I'm with ya Stutters! (thumb)

[ARunto]

scott...well techincally the parts aren't stock they are aftermarket parts put on my Mazda. I have to agree it is bad design. You could always take the bar off and that would solve the problem all together or you could just make the car a all out track car and add more noise.

[StuttersC]

Hmm, since the car is fairly noisy as it is, maybe making it noisier would help stop worry about the squeaks from the back end...

I like it.

[BlueMP5Dave]

Energy suspension sells these also, I purchased a set for my AWR 21.5 swaybar. You can buy these at your local Autozone. here are the ones I bought.

/members/BlueMP5Dave/dsc00004.jpg

I still have them if anyone wants them. These are already modified to fit a Protege. The interdiameter of the bushing is 7/8 for the AWR bar though. I never used them because they were for my ES which I sold right before I got to put these on. :cool:

Hope these work to fix the clunk that would be great (no more clunk threads) :D

[ARunto]

BINGO! Actually if you get a fairly loud exhaust you won't notice the clunk.

[Melanism]

Originally posted by BlueMP5Dave
Energy suspension sells these also, I purchased a set for my AWR 21.5 swaybar. You can buy these at your local Autozone. here are the ones I bought.

/members/BlueMP5Dave/dsc00004.jpg

I still have them if anyone wants them. These are already modified to fit a Protege. The interdiameter of the bushing is 7/8 for the AWR bar though. I never used them because they were for my ES which I sold right before I got to put these on. :cool:

Hope these work to fix the clunk that would be great (no more clunk threads) :D

BlueMP5Dave,
Those bushings won't work for the Racing Beat MP3 bar. The right model number is 9-5157. The ones you posted are the excatly the same as what I posted in the first post, just a different color and slightly off a couple of millimeters. See first post for more info.

[BlueMP5Dave]

I will quote myself that I purchased these for my AWR 21.5 Swaybar to keep it from making the same noise as the MP3. I had the same issue with my AWR bar as you do with your MP3 big bar. Yes they are 7/8 and not 13/16 I was mearly referencing off of what you said. I am sorry for any confusion (cool).

Now back to the topic.

[scott42]

ARunto, I see your point as well, but when I buy a car from a dealership, brand new; its a stock car. Nothing is aftermarket when coming from the factory, no matter what brand. If it was truely aftermarket, and designed for the car, it would actually be Racing Beats original design, and we wouldnt be in this mess. We would have a TRUE aftermarket, quality design, and not a cost cut POS that we have now. If you remove the swaybar, I may as well have bought an ES and saved myself 5k; and I don't need a track car to get to the office :)
Let's Cross our fingers for 'Micaspeed!' to develop a quality replacement system for a decent price. :D

[ARunto]

Scott...I understand where your coming from. IMO I find that this is a performance vehicle and that somethings are "the nature of the vehicle". It's fair to say that the MP3/MSP have there fair share of concerns. I think I'd rather have a track car to drive to work. Who says it isn't fun to pass your boss's car on the way to work...well at least it's fun for me since my boss drives a Z06 vette. :) LOL! Well back to the topic...how's the clunk fix?

[Melanism]

Not a peep. Satisfied

[scott42]

ARunto, we're both agreeing to the same thing through different thoughts :) If it was done right the first time, it would almost BE a track car :) and still not have the clunk. The problem has never been the noise for me, its the breakdown of the rubber in the bushing which leads to less effective "flattening" by the swaybar...its a performance thing more than a noise thing. If I knew that even with the noise, it was still working 100%, I'd have no problem with it...but just the fact that the noise is being made says that the suspension is far from 100% effective. :D

[Melanism]

No Clunk, No Noise, No Squeal.....damn I'm Good!

[o.g.sk8er]

I did the same thing three weeks ago. Same here, no clunk. Yet. I only have about 1100 miles on mine and so far so good.
Good job!:D

Patrick

[Kooldino]

Hmmm, this is tempting.

[scott42]

I agree ^^
Though I like Micaspeed!'s idea a bit more (theoretically), and will probably hold off for that.

[Melanism]

Several thousand miles later...no noise, tight , quiet.

[Melanism]

Still....even more miles with extreme cold conditions....not a peep. No clunk, no squeal. Don't hate. :p

[Kooldino]

Sweet.

[o.g.sk8er]

I did the same thing awhile back, and mine are still quiet as well.:D

[Salmon_Rob]

i did that a while...wait, nvm, my 13yr old car doesnt have any noises ;)

[Newf]

definitely nice to know there's another alternative out there.

Good job guys

[scott42]

Yes, its great news. My only worry, should it continue to stay quiet (obviously that's the goal:)) would be the crazy stresses on the bar over time...since the hold is so solid with the fix that the sound is still staying away, how much stress can the bar take before it gets weakened or possibly even bends/breaks. If you think about Micaspeeds! explination and apply any physics/engineering classes that you may have taken, it seems like something will eventually have to give. Noise or no noise.
But again, its great to see that this is working so well for so long(thumb)

[Melanism]

At the time I had no other alternative but to come up with a so-called 'fix' I do realize that there is a lot of stress on that bar, but what else is there to do? It's a flawed design; therefore we have to work with what we have. So far I am satisfied, and I hope it will suffice throughout the life of the car. I can’t see anything breaking besides the bolts that hold the brackets…they are definitely the weak points...I know. When I first put the brackets back on, I stripped one of the bolts. After a day of driving I heard a loud 'POP' and the bolt came out. I simply rethreaded the hole with a larger bolt and tightened it back down. Problem solved.

[vodapas77]

Yeah, I'm thinking for the cost Melanism has definitely found a "fix" the daily driver. I completely agree that far more stress is probably being added to the bar than originally designed for, but I know even living in Hawaii with curvy mountain roads and horridly uneven pavement I still don't put the suspension through too much trauma. I'm going for it, but I can see how for someone who runs Auto-X this wouldn't be a very good idea. As for the warranty issues, hell I blew those away last weekend. If I ever have a problem with my suspension and go to the dealer they'll send me packing when they see the Teins.

Thanks for the idea Melanism and the consistent updates. Think it's time to fight back against the clunk cause mine is geting real bad.

[scott42]

Oh yeah, Melanism, I'm totally with you. This is the BEST and most reliable fix to be developed, you've got that credential. You should send in the 'ol resume to MNAO and put some shitty Mazda engineers out of a job ;)

[PaulMP3]

Originally posted by Melanism
I know. When I first put the brackets back on, I stripped one of the bolts. After a day of driving I heard a loud 'POP' and the bolt came out. I simply rethreaded the hole with a larger bolt and tightened it back down. Problem solved.

i snapped the weld on the nut welded to the frame, while un-doing one of the brackets.. i just got a new bolt and nut, and stuck it through the frame, ans used an open end wrench to hold it.

probally b/c i have had these bushing on and off 20 times:wtf:

Im still clunk free:D

[Newf]

I popped the same bolt on the mp3 once.

[Melanism]

Not a peep. Holding tight. No squeal. Wish I could say the same for the front. But nothing a little silicone spray wont fix. At least it's no clunk up front.

[Kooldino]

Originally posted by Melanism
Not a peep. Holding tight. No squeal. Wish I could say the same for the front. But nothing a little silicone spray wont fix. At least it's no clunk up front.

Awesome. Yeah, my front squeaks too. Where do you spray the silicon?

[DooMer_MP3]

Supposedly just spray a decent amount near it on the bar, and it will work itself in...

[Melanism]

Originally posted by Kooldino
Awesome. Yeah, my front squeaks too. Where do you spray the silicon?


If you turn each wheel so that you can access the back of it good, or just take the wheel off, you can peek in there and see the rubber bushing, set back behind the firewall a bit. Spray away!

[DooMer_MP3]

Any more updates? If no noise, these are probably what I'll end up buying when the time comes, unless MicaSpeed's is done. I can't seem to find any howto with pics mentioned in the first post? Did you ever put those up? Sounds simple enough without one though.

Chris

[akhilleus]

Just a tip on the poly bushings. I had poly bushings on my AWR bar and they did eventually fail. I had also considered the energy susp bushings since they are greasable. However i never used them. But ultimately i think the bushings will wear out. I guess its the price of perf.

[DooMer_MP3]

Yeah. I'll take 5-6 months through winter any time though ;).

Chris

[akhilleus]

true... very true

[INGREXCO]

ya know the mp3 came out in 2001 and they knew about the clunk, yet they used the same design on the mazdaspeed

[scott42]

Yes, we have confirmed that the people who agreed to continue the suspension setup in the rear from the MP3 to the Speed are idiots. :)

[Melanism]

No clunk, but i'll prob have to grease them up again after the harsh winter...snow and salt and all.

[stdntDrvr]

do you know the part # for the front bushings?

Thanks!

[Melanism]

do you know the part # for the front bushings?

Thanks!
Can't say that I know the part number for the fronts. I only measured and dealt with the back ones.

I did buy a grease gun and lube the back ones up though. Takes a whole two minutes!! No complaints here.

[BlueMP5Dave]

Topher you can just purchace these bushing by the outer diameter of the Swaybar. If you know that and you can adjust or bend the brackets into the right shape to fit then it is a direct bolt on. Just find out the diameter and give Energy a call they are very helpful people, I have dealt with them many times.


do you know the part # for the front bushings?

Thanks!

[Melanism]

Well....still no clunk. Although sometimes I hear a slight squeak....hit it with the grease gun, gone.

[Melanism]

24 Sept Update: Still no clunk...besides the occasional lubing, no problems to report.




Well....still no clunk. Although sometimes I hear a slight squeak....hit it with the grease gun, gone.

[Wiggles422]

i wish i found this thread sooner. i am attempting to do what you've done Melanism. What did you do to make the brackets fit right? I tried a hammer and a vise... I think mapp gas/blow torch is next. I did hold them up to where they will go and it seems like the grease fitting is way too close to the rod going from the rear cross member to the bottom of the strut area. have you had any issues with that?

[Wiggles422]

I got the brackets bent so that they fit... the problem now is that they are too wide and I can't move the "stoppers" on the sway bar out enough to allow the bushings/brackets to line up with the bolt holes on the cross member.
Anyone that has done this, how did you make everything line up?

[AznXstazy]

my "stoppers" are a good inch from the bushings. i think my "stoppers" moved some how lol. ill try to get a pic up if i can. mayb u can try to put on one side then go to the other side and push hard? i know that you can take off the stoppers, but i dont think its a good idea too.

[Wiggles422]

thanks, pics would help! I tried all I could to move them. but I agree, taking them off sounds like a bad idea. it seemed to me that there was a ridge or something they were sitting in. I had a pair of pliars around the stoppers and I was hitting that with a hammer. it budged maybe 1/4" and then it seemed as if it was getting caught on something where the metal band was crimped together.

[Wiggles422]

(bump)

[VividYellowMP3]

Maybe I'm dumb, but I can't find these bushings anywhere on the Nippon Power website... Did they stop making them or something? I looked at the bushings listing for every vehicle and even did a search for the part number to no avail. I was looking forward to giving this a try.