Any interest in an intercooler spray kit?

[ghettlo]

Alright, I know I dont drive a msp...........but my 1.8t vw has some of the same problems that you guys have with heatsoak. One of the easiest and cheapest ways to remedy this is to spray the intercooler with some cool liquid to bring the charge temps down. I have a system thought up that would be great for both of our cars. The kit would contain a separate resevoir for whatever type of liquid you want to use, so you wouldnt have to use your windshield wash resevoir. A separate pump and nozzle system just for spraying the intercooler. And a switch that would be mounted somewhere in the interior to control the spray. The kit would come complete with easy to follow directions and everything needed for the install. Price would most likely be sub 100 dollars shipped to your door!

let me know if there would be any interest!
thanks- Joe

[alexlitov]

Not to be a dick, but who would in their right mind buy from someone with only 2 posts???

[Emode]

dont worry about his integrity, i have know him for a long time and you have my word about those kind of worries. Plus i think at this point this is more of an interest guaging post, to see if it will be pursued

[west]

i'm in wisconsin as well, might be interested

[Emode]

we will be using my car as a prototype in order to develop it and make it fit, since he lives in my hometown a couple hours away, it might take a couple weeks, but i think this could be a quality, inexpensive way to cool our intake charge down a bit

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by west
i'm in wisconsin as well, might be interested
Well as soon as emode comes up here so we can install one of these in his ride I will have exact prices for everyone.

[alexlitov]

Originally posted by ghettlo
Price would most likely be sub 100 dollars shipped to your door!

let me know if there would be any interest!
thanks- Joe

[Emode]

notice it says most likely
also it says "if there would be any interest"

as in guaging..............for interest.......like i said

is it really that big of a deal how it was worded
im more worried about going fast

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by alexlitov


The price could vary quite a bit! I could probably crack out a kit that uses a cheap nozzle, doesnt atomize the water droplets, and drips while not in use for 35 - 50 dollars. But, thats not the way I do things.......I am going to use the best nozzle I can find that wont leak or drip, and has the best atomization properties for maximum cooling efficiency. So Most likely the price will be sub 100 dollars.

[MazdaDryvr]

I would be interested but I would , of course, want to see some real stats on its effect.

[jeremyfl]

Yeah and some long term use applications would be nice.

I don't want this to destroy or rust anything......

[Emode]

well that sucks cause we were planning on adding self destruct button and coating it in super corrosive copper................back to the drawing board:D

seriously though, we are going to try and get at least 5-10 people interested in this so it will be worth our work. I will be going back in one week and ill meet with ghettlo and we will get this thing up on my vehicle. for those with quality concerns, i woulnt do stuff to my car unless it was clean and of good workmanship, so thats all i would pass on to anyone else. So if you interested, drop a post and ghettlo (joe) and i will keep you informed to our progress.

thanks
rob

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by MazdaDryvr
I would be interested but I would , of course, want to see some real stats on its effect.
Long term effects are not going to be an issue, your intercooler gets wet just about everytime it rains or if you go through a car wash. I would be more worried about the corrosives they use at the car wash, or the pollutants in the puddles you drive through in a rain storm. Also your not going to see any gains with this type of device. What this will do is allow you to keep the power you already have longer, and when your intercooler becomes heatsoaked this will cool it down quicker. There is a reason sti and evo owners already use these on there cars.

[YuYuRena]

See if you can mount the spray button on the steering wheel? So it's always there for "spraying"

[MazdaDryvr]

ghettlo, I wasnt worried about corrosion :) I was just wondering about its ability to reduce heatsoak. I didnt know that such devices were already in use on other cars.

[Emode]

yes for those of you who didnt know, water sparyers come stock on those cars, that is awesome

[JDM Sam]

just add an extra T to your windshield nozzles and buy some stupid rice nozzle lights and mount em behind the bumper near the grill. flush out all the windshield washer fluid and just use water. simple easy to use why pay 100 when u can spend $20.

[Emode]

cool man
sounds good
(bow)

[II-Savy]

I think it sounds cool;) . Having a kit to your door as long as it is nice...which it sounds like it will.

COUNT ME IN

[unwound]

for those who doubt what IC sprayers can do, i can assure you that they are worth it! i custom fabbed a set for my msp and i definitely can notice a difference.

i do not have any "numbers" for you dyno freaks, but it is noticeable.
for instance: when launching in florida's hot afternoon sun, my msp would seem boggish or lacking power with the hesitation being very noticable and annoying. after flicking the switch and letting the sprayers run for about 8-10 secs., the car would pull smoother and the hesitation was almost non-existent.

this is only a water set-up; i am using the factory washer pump and bottle too.

here are some pics:
pic 1 (http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/unwound/0046_r1.jpg)
pic 2 (http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/unwound/0047.jpg)
pic 3 (http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/unwound/0048.jpg)
pic 4 (http://www.mazdamp3.com/members/unwound/0050_r1.jpg)

ghettlo and emode check your pms

[2K3 MSP]

Originally posted by Emode
yes for those of you who didnt know, water sparyers come stock on those cars, that is awesome
I just learned that the other day. Surprised the hell out of me:)

[Apexi]

theres plenty of kits already on the market..search around...personally i wouldnt buy a kit from some guy made in his garage when theres kits that have been around for awile

[Little Beavis]

Where at are the kits that have been around? (Sorry I'm search challenged. . .)

Anyway, I would be interested. Just to be able to spray it when I'm at a light on a hot day and see the steam rise. . .that might be worth it alone! :D

As far as the engineering involved, if you can cool down the intercooler, you'll have a greater delta T between the intake charge and the "ambient" at that point, so you will remove more heat and have a denser air charge, ie. lower temp. Kind of like trying to get the benefit of an air to water intercooler, of course it only "lasts" as long as the time it takes to spray and return to the original temp. Who knows how long that is. But a spray before a race, will help if the car is hot already. If the intercooler is the same temp as the spray, no benefit.

Yippee. . .

But I'm usually visiting my brothers in Madison, so I'm in Wisconsin from time to time, so I'm all for checking this out when you have a prototype ready.

[Apexi]

http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/article.html?&A=0527
same as above (http://www.audiworld.com/tech/eng22b.shtml)


http://www.machv.com/pivwatsprayc.html

most popular

[Snowman]

Huh, well I think I will bypass the intercooler sprayer idea altogether. I'm actually making the move from Florida to Stevens Point, Wisconsin so if any of you run in Kaukana let me know. I have a NX EFI kit going on my 2003.5. I had the kit from my previous car, so it will be the first modification to the MSP once she's broken in a little more.

Mike

[Emode]

so there will be another msp in point now
that is cool, i am in milwaukee now, but i go back frequently
make sure to represent well
lots of rice waiting to get cooked out there.........

[Black Majik MSP]

Corksport has a kit for like $125 that uses the ww nozzles too.

Maybe now all of the people who think CAIs are better than SRIs will realize that getting one of these is the REAL way to get cooler air.

300 posts, almost time to leave for NOPI, & I haven't slept at all...yay

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by Apexi
http://www.autospeed.com.au/cms/article.html?&A=0527
same as above (http://www.audiworld.com/tech/eng22b.shtml)


http://www.machv.com/pivwatsprayc.html

most popular

Yes there are other people out there that make water mist kits, but there isnt anyone that has a straight up msp kit! Also I dont know about you guys but I would rather have some easy to follow directions directly related to my car, rather then having to figure things out while doing an install. The products in these links are great, but one is just a controller.........you still have to fab up a resevoir, pump, and tubing. The autospeed setup looks like it is crazy expensive! To the person who said they dont want to buy something produced in some guys garage........dont buy one from me! But, just think about how every car parts company got started. I am sure that they didnt just move into a multi million dollar facility and start making parts, most likely they started out in there garage/basement!

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by JDM Sam
just add an extra T to your windshield nozzles and buy some stupid rice nozzle lights and mount em behind the bumper near the grill. flush out all the windshield washer fluid and just use water. simple easy to use why pay 100 when u can spend $20.

Its going to cost more then 20 to do this properly. Just spraying your intercooler with any nozzle will cool it down a little. Just soaking the ic isnt the best way to do it. The reason why I am using a really fine mist nozzle is because..........the finer the mist the easier and faster the water will evaporate............as the water evaporates it takes heat with it..........this has been proven to be the most effective and efficient process for ic spraying. If you dont believe me do your own research, or better yet go take some physics classes at your local college.

[NeverSober]

I'm down. For under $100 delivered to your door, that sounds great, especially the part about it being specific for oue car. Let me know when you have an exact price and are ready to ship. Thanks


Chris

[chitownballer]

yea i am down for 100 too to the door

[GI-]

I would more than likely be down for this, as long as I can see some finished photos of this product and maybe some dyno results. Thanks for looking into doing this.

BTW, where are you located in Wisconsin?

[Emode]

you will be able to see this first hand, on my car after next weekend hopefully. That is when i will be going back to Stevens point and working on this with joe(ghettlo)

[GI-]

Where is Joe from?

[Emode]

from my hometown of point
iv known him for about 8 years now, he was into cars long before i was:D

[JDM Sam]

Originally posted by ghettlo
Its going to cost more then 20 to do this properly. Just spraying your intercooler with any nozzle will cool it down a little. Just soaking the ic isnt the best way to do it. The reason why I am using a really fine mist nozzle is because..........the finer the mist the easier and faster the water will evaporate............as the water evaporates it takes heat with it..........this has been proven to be the most effective and efficient process for ic spraying. If you dont believe me do your own research, or better yet go take some physics classes at your local college.

You can buy fine atomizing nozzles cheap.
Take 2 lines and 2 t taps drain your washer fluid use water run to nozzles like that guy did it in the pics and itll mist over it! If the spray nozzles on the evo 8 squirt streams of water I think windshield nozzles will suffice. besides how much water will come out and "soak" the i/c. its just 2 nozzles. If youre gonna charge over a hundred you might as well buy an NX i/c sprayer since nitrous will drop the air temp even more than water for $350.

[Emode]

notice we said it will probably be sub one hundred
this is also aimed at people who want to keep their windshield washers normal
and maybe people dont have 350 for the nx kit, along with money to keep refilling the tanks and such

do you have anything better to do than post negative comments to people who are trying to do something helpful for the members who arent made of cash? like myself?

[JDM Sam]

how is my post negative? im posting to help people who want just the basic water squirter with the easiest install and cheapest. it does keep ur washers in the same place, it just squirts water at the same time it cleans ur window.

BTW its you and your buddy getting on the defensive because im telling everyone else theres a cheaper way. sorry to blow on ur parade its a simple mod that anyone can do. im not flaming anyone. the only one flaming here is him. hes telling me to take physics classes like I don't know shit about cars.

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by JDM Sam
how is my post negative? im posting to help people who want just the basic water squirter with the easiest install and cheapest. it does keep ur washers in the same place, it just squirts water at the same time it cleans ur window.

BTW its you and your buddy getting on the defensive because im telling everyone else theres a cheaper way. sorry to blow on ur parade its a simple mod that anyone can do. im not flaming anyone. the only one flaming here is him. hes telling me to take physics classes like I don't know shit about cars.

Cars and the evaporating properties of liquid do not have anything in common:D Notice I didnt say you know jack 5hit about cars, I said you know jack 5hit about evaporation and the cooling properties it can posess. If you dont want to buy a kit, fine then dont buy one. I am not here to start a flame war! And if you want to tee into your existing washer system, then go for it and I am sure it will get the job done for you. Most people dont want to be spraying there windshield and waiting for it to dry at the lights. I live in a colder climate and in the winter I still use my windshield washers. I dont want to be coating my IC with ice when its negative 20! The kit I am putting together will work without a wet windshield :D and you will control when the ic gets sprayed.

[II-Savy]

I don't have 350. Crap for 350 your talking exhaust $$. big increase in preformance.

I hear ya dude. I think it sounds interesting.

Also - you will go through your bottle very fast cleaning windows AND spraying your interc.

[Emode]

word

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by Emode
notice we said it will probably be sub one hundred
this is also aimed at people who want to keep their windshield washers normal
and maybe people dont have 350 for the nx kit, along with money to keep refilling the tanks and such

do you have anything better to do than post negative comments to people who are trying to do something helpful for the members who arent made of cash? like myself?

If anyone knows where to find fine atomizing nozzles (preferrably made of metal for a good price let me know! The nozzles I am looking into using are over 20 dollars and shipping from australia isnt cheap! The cheaper the components cost, the cheaper the kit will be. I am not doing this to make money, I just threw the sub 100 price estimate out there to give people an idea of what it might cost. I am trying to help out car enthusiasts, I dont really care what you drive as long as its a turbo and intercooled this product will help you out. The fact that I am willing to cater a kit just for msp owners, so they dont have to figure everything else out on there own must say something. I am sourcing all the parts, fabricating brackets, and figuring out the wiring........all I want to do is go fast and if there arent other cars on the road to give me competition then what fun is a fast car? :)

[JDM Sam]

if you plan on doing business prepare to have feedback. negative and positive. so go take a business class, a selling, and a marketing class while you're at it :)

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by JDM Sam
if you plan on doing business prepare to have feedback. negative and positive. so go take a business class, a selling, and a marketing class while you're at it :)

Well it just so happens I already have taken business classes in college. But please point out to me where I state feedback is bad?

[mrpopnfresh]

I know that Alcohol is Cooler than water, but will it still work as a fine mist or does it evaporate to fast?

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by mrpopnfresh
I know that Alcohol is Cooler than water, but will it still work as a fine mist or does it evaporate to fast?
Actually alot of people that already have these systems use a 50/50 mix of water and alcohol. Another option would be to use 50/50 water and windshield washer fluid (washer fluid has some alcohol in it) When I do my system I will most likely run a 50/50 water and washer fluid setup. When at the track I will dump some ice in the resevoir to get some real cooling power!

[mrpopnfresh]

Doesn't washer fluid have some kind of detergent or soap in it as well?

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by mrpopnfresh
Doesn't washer fluid have some kind of detergent or soap in it as well?

Yeah it probably does, but I wouldnt think that it would eat away at metal. Besides the cleaner the fins on the intercooler the better job it will do cooling.

[mrpopnfresh]

Hey...good one! Depending on what kind of metal alloy is being used for the intercooler, it might not be a good idea. If a small particle of detergent lodges itself anywhere on the intercooler, corrossion would arise. All depending on the alloy of course.

[Emode]

if you have doubts, dont put it in:D
ice is good

[mrpopnfresh]

I don't have doubts, just don't want you guys to run into problems.

[Emode]

thats cool
i was directing that more to the general people who might wonder about that:)

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by mrpopnfresh
I don't have doubts, just don't want you guys to run into problems.

The whole thing with this kit is it gives you the flexability to use what you want. If your running water you will be fine, anything else do your own research and run it at your own risk. I am sure that the detergents they use in windshield wash are not that bad, otherwise you better start washing your car everytime you decide to use your stock washers.

Also as I stated before I would be more worried about pollutants that would be kicked up from puddles during rain storms then anything I was putting in my resevoir. Thats just my opinion based on the pollution levels of the U.S

[JDM Sam]

Originally posted by ghettlo
Well it just so happens I already have taken business classes in college. But please point out to me where I state feedback is bad?

maybe a human relations sociology class is what you need. the posts i put in this thread is the feedback and you seem to really defensive about what I have said about this. oh wait maybe a chemistry class is what you need so you can find out if aluminum reacts to methanol. :rolleyes:

[Emode]

alright sam
you win the awesomest dude prize........
thanks again

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by JDM Sam
maybe a human relations sociology class is what you need. the posts i put in this thread is the feedback and you seem to really defensive about what I have said about this. oh wait maybe a chemistry class is what you need so you can find out if aluminum reacts to methanol. :rolleyes:

Not being defensive at all, just trying to relate my point of view. And your right I do need some chemistry classes. What I do know is this my intercooler may be aluminum and yes it might not be the smartest idea to spray washer fluid on it. But then why would anyone want to tee into the existing system so they can clean there windows and spray the ic with the same corrosive liquid (I thought you suggested this)? This stupid debate between us is going nowhere and you just keep eating your words.....so I am done here if you have anything to say to me come up to Wisconsin and we can chat all day about ic misters and college classes

Please leave pointless statements out of this thread.

[Apexi]

take out your winshield washers and point them at your innacooler, already wired up and all and just carry a wiper blade in your car for when it rains you can reach out the window and wipe away!!!!...or just use a ton of rain x! best of luck with the kit

[II-Savy]

Wow :eek: There's always someone in the crowd. :rolleyes:

JDM Sam - Dude if I were you I would NOT buy this system and I would just choose to read other threads.

Back on task:

I have a hundred questions
When are you shipping mine?
Can we maybe use a stock switch in the stock location?
Will it be dual sprayers?
What will kit include?...Tank....pump hose?
When are you shipping mine?

:) (spin)

[JDM Sam]

Originally posted by ghettlo
Not being defensive at all, just trying to relate my point of view. And your right I do need some chemistry classes. What I do know is this my intercooler may be aluminum and yes it might not be the smartest idea to spray washer fluid on it. But then why would anyone want to tee into the existing system so they can clean there windows and spray the ic with the same corrosive liquid (I thought you suggested this)? This stupid debate between us is going nowhere and you just keep eating your words.....so I am done here if you have anything to say to me come up to Wisconsin and we can chat all day about ic misters and college classes

Please leave pointless statements out of this thread.



actually i said this





just add an extra T to your windshield nozzles and buy some stupid rice nozzle lights and mount em behind the bumper near the grill. flush out all the windshield washer fluid and just use water. simple easy to use why pay 100 when u can spend $20.


Maybe developmental reading too. :rolleyes:

[jonnydoe48]

owned by sam

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by jonnydoe48
owned by sam

lol........."fighting on the internet is like winning a gold in the special olympics............even if you win your still a retard"

To all those interested please private message me for the rest of the details.

[No.5]

Originally posted by ghettlo
...........even if you win your still a retard"


Oh Geez.....that comment is just plain rude.

PM as Ghettlo said, and close this Thread.

[II-Savy]

What the fuck does "owned by sam" mean?:bs:

[unwound]

joe,

pm'd you all the info

[ebsalem]

Id buy it if there was a way from inside the car to run either the washers the intercooler.

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by ebsalem
Id buy it if there was a way from inside the car to run either the washers the intercooler.

There will be a switch mounted in the cabin that will allow you to spray the ic without washing the windshield. Keep an eye out for the new thread with pictures and some "butt dyno results"

[JDM Sam]

yup im the retard wasting my time with a washer nozzle sprayer kit when its better to just buy a fmic. owned by sam means this fuck nut was owned cuz he cant say nothing else cept like the shit on his previous post.

[jeremyfl]

No offense this is why I hate being on this MSP board most of you are cool and have really good things to say but others just cant keep there big yap shut.

Here is an old saying "opinions are like a$$holes, everyone has one and everyone thinks theres doesnt stink!"

If you don't want one then don't buy it, if you think it's a rip off then again don't buy one, but don't knock the guy for trying to do something for the people on this board.

And how the hell are you gonna compare the price difference between this product and a FMIC......

Not trying to flame just making a point. I'm not saying don't give an opinion but you dont have to knock the product or the guy for trying geezz.....

[chitownballer]

get the nitrous intercooler kit, spray that shit on there and it gets ice cold as in icecles falling offa it, my buddy pual installed it on his speed, now that makes a difference...

[Apexi]

Originally posted by chitownballer
get the nitrous intercooler kit, spray that shit on there and it gets ice cold as in icecles falling offa it, my buddy pual installed it on his speed, now that makes a difference...


:eek:

http://www.machvforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=22608


2nd page

[ghettlo]

Well Emode got into an accident and things didnt work out for us this weekend. He will hopefully be up here in two - three weeks and we will get this on his car. I have been buying parts for our prototype and will be ordering nozzles rather quickly. I would like to know who is seriously interested and what mods they have on there car. After looking at some pics of the engine bay it seems quite cramped. I specifically would like to know if you have a intake or modified airbox (one without the snorkel). This will affect the install of the additional resevoir so please let me know-
thanks- Joe

[NeverSober]

I am interested, and I have the Spool CAI.


Chris

[II-Savy]

I am still interested and I'm stock. I will be buying a black Injen CAI.

[jeremyfl]

Anything new about this???

[Emode]

Originally posted by ghettlo
Well Emode got into an accident and things didnt work out for us this weekend. He will hopefully be up here in two - three weeks and we will get this on his car. I have been buying parts for our prototype and will be ordering nozzles rather quickly. I would like to know who is seriously interested and what mods they have on there car. After looking at some pics of the engine bay it seems quite cramped. I specifically would like to know if you have a intake or modified airbox (one without the snorkel). This will affect the install of the additional resevoir so please let me know-
thanks- Joe

[tddelsol]

um if you can get someone to pay any where near $100 dollars for a used windsheild washer pump and some hose you should be a business proffesor

[II-Savy]

proffesor?

Used pump and hose? What the hell are you talking about? Someone took there DA pill. :wtf:

I believe it will be a full kit including wiring, brackets, pump, dual sprayers and hose sent to your door.


......and if you weren't interested why even bother reading the thread and posting ? :wtf:

[Emode]

that is correct

[II-Savy]

So how's everything emode?

I for one am dieing to see this kit. I think it sounds cool. (no pun intended) :D

I hope it has a nice switch to mount, maybe a momentary(sp) switch.

[EvilMSP]

This sounds like a good idea. I have heard about them before but never thought about it for my car.

Are there big performance gains with this....well I know they won't be huge, but is it worth while?

[II-Savy]

I'm doing it half for the coolness factor. It will help SOME but it's not going to be awsome....I figuer (sp) with a CAI from Injen, a ram air mod and some kind of sprayer, I'll be doing what ever I can to get the air cool.....short of spending 600+ for a new FMIC.

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by II-Savy
So how's everything emode?

I for one am dieing to see this kit. I think it sounds cool. (no pun intended) :D

I hope it has a nice switch to mount, maybe a momentary(sp) switch.

You will be happy to hear that the switch I have sitting in front of me is a momentary switch, just waiting on emode to get his car back together and we will do the install. My only worry is for those of you with stock airbox setups it doesnt look like there are a lot of mounting options for the resevoir. You may be required to remove the snorkel for this kit to work.

[unwound]

what kind of monentary switch is it?

i tried to mount a "nos" momentary switch to my steering wheel, but it did not work out the way i wanted it to, so now i have a toggle mounted beside the rheostat in the plug.

[ghettlo]

Originally posted by unwound
what kind of monentary switch is it?

i tried to mount a "nos" momentary switch to my steering wheel, but it did not work out the way i wanted it to, so now i have a toggle mounted beside the rheostat in the plug.

Not exactly sure what type of switch it is, but its a push button one :D It provides power when the button is pushed. Should work just fine its an automotive grade switch so it wont burn out.

[ghettlo]

Basically we have canned the idea for an intercooler mister, its just to hard for emode to come up here and work on his car and I have no access to a msp. Good news is I have sourced most of the parts for the do it yourselfers.

First off the resevoir with 12v pump included can be had at autozone for about $25.00. This kit has almost everything you need to set this thing up! It includes the resevoir and pump, along with a momentary switch, cheap nylon hosing, nozzles, and a tee to hook up two nozzles (very cheap nozzles). Part number is #9-400 and once again this is at autozone autoparts.

Secondly I would recommend buying some silicone hosing to use instead of the nylon hose. Or I would also try to use rubber auto hosing, which would be alot cheaper. Can be found at any auto parts store.

Lastly the nozzle, in my view the most important part of the kit. Here is the one I was looking at using: http://www.autospeed.com/shop/category_705/browse.html
But a forum member by the name of unwound was nice enough to point me towards www.rittenhouse.ca.
The parts list:
teejet disc nozzle hss d3 $0.78 424
teejet brass core 25 $0.97 425
nozzle body 1/4"x 1/4" 1321a $1.09 452
strainer w/ check valve 4193a $2.57 454
*specify the 100 mesh size
nozzle cap 1325a $0.69[U] 457

total: $6.10 each
call the 1-800-461-1041 number and do the order over the phone (that is what i did) the cust svc is awesome. the website is very hard to navigate.
This nozzle info is courtesy of unwound, once again thanks alot!

So it looks as though the complete kit would have cost under 50 bux, which is way below my original estimates. I hope someone on here will go ahead and put this kit together and find some good results.

Last thing I just wanted to say good bye and good luck to my good friend jdm sam. I dont know what your problem is but hopefully you will get laid or your male enhancement pills will work or something.

[ND4MSP]

that is very classy to give up an idea like that for us. I know its not rocket science and I'm sure someone else is doing it already, but still very cool of ya. Oh yeah, Go jdm sam haha

[BlkZoomZoom]

Just a question why would you use water?? If you used that at the track they would kick you off.