10 psi safe???!!

[EVILSRT]

I just got my joe MBC in....and my car hauls major ass now...

I am just making sure that 10 psi is safe....that is what I am currently running.

Wil I be ok?

[pshaw34]

yeah, 9-10 psi is a safe psi to run.

[MemphisRacer]

should be fine man, im sure your bound to hit fuel cut every now and then which will feel like hitting a brick wall!! but no worries, enjoy it!!!

[EVILSRT]

cool guys...the car is SO much faster now!!!

So I am 100% safe.....

The Mazdaspeed is living up to its name!

[MemphisRacer]

well, look at it this way, you're never going to be able to say you're 100% safe, but lets call it 99%. you always gotta be mindfull of that 1% and not get carried away. (thumb)

[MazdaDryvr]

I'm going to limit mine at 9psi to be extra safe :)

[Maestrokneer]

I have a question about boosting my MSP, seeing as how I also just got my Joe MBC.

The general consensus is that 9-10 psi is "safe". But what about long-term effects on the life of the engine? How much increased wear and tear does this create? And how much stress am I putting on my engine in the long run. Is this reducing the life of my car?

That's what I'm concerned about, so if anyone has any answers, feel free to post them here. Thanks.

[Captain KRM P5]

Look at it this way - there are specific reasons why Mazda and Calloway set the boost at the level that they did. Is it possible that tampering with that will reduce the life of your engine? Sure it is. The fact is this; no one has YET blown an engine through higher boost, but also remember that no one has had the car long enough to truly determine what, if any, long term effects there may be. Check back six months to a year from now.

I personally feel that 10 psi on the MSP's setup is too much. Get an EGT gauge and/or an Air to Fuel Ratio gauge and monitor how rich/lean you run on fuel as well as temperature. Keep those ranges within acceptable limits and you'll be fine. It takes work, but that's why its called "tuning" :)

The higher psi you boost, the more air you force into your engine. You need the fuel to compensate, something that the ECU on all three variants of Protege does not do well at all. As stated above, the MSP has even been setup with a fuel cut (safety measure I imagine). What Flyin' Protege suggests for running higher than normal boost is an inline fuel pump. That along with their 02 signal modifier is enough to safely turn up the boost on my kit. $300

I've blown an engine, and let me tell you that it is no fun. Just be careful and tune smartly and you will probably have no problems.

Oh and one final thing - alot of people have posted in rather naive fashion that if the SRT 4 can have its boost turned up with an MBC right from the box, then goshdarn so can the MSP! Wrong. The SRT 4 has forged internals among other things, much much tougher than your average Joe Neon. The MSP has a Protege engine with a turbo. Mazda has stated in their racing materials that they believe the engine can safely handle 220 horsepower at the crank. Look at the SpeedVision series Proteges - they replace an engine every four races. Something to think about.

[MazdaDryvr]

ok, now you're freakin me out. Joe said he's run his car all over the place and monitored the fuel ratio while testing. He's put over 8,000 miles on already and said he beleives that the MSP still runs rich enough to be safe.

[ZoomZoomH]

it's a risk you pioneers need to be willing to take to be the pioneers in MSP tuning...

[kwiktsi]

Originally posted by Captain KRM P5
Look at it this way - there are specific reasons why Mazda and Calloway set the boost at the level that they did. Is it possible that tampering with that will reduce the life of your engine? Sure it is. The fact is this; no one has YET blown an engine through higher boost, but also remember that no one has had the car long enough to truly determine what, if any, long term effects there may be. Check back six months to a year from now.

I personally feel that 10 psi on the MSP's setup is too much. Get an EGT gauge and/or an Air to Fuel Ratio gauge and monitor how rich/lean you run on fuel as well as temperature. Keep those ranges within acceptable limits and you'll be fine. It takes work, but that's why its called "tuning" :)

The higher psi you boost, the more air you force into your engine. You need the fuel to compensate, something that the ECU on all three variants of Protege does not do well at all. As stated above, the MSP has even been setup with a fuel cut (safety measure I imagine). What Flyin' Protege suggests for running higher than normal boost is an inline fuel pump. That along with their 02 signal modifier is enough to safely turn up the boost on my kit. $300

I've blown an engine, and let me tell you that it is no fun. Just be careful and tune smartly and you will probably have no problems.

Oh and one final thing - alot of people have posted in rather naive fashion that if the SRT 4 can have its boost turned up with an MBC right from the box, then goshdarn so can the MSP! Wrong. The SRT 4 has forged internals among other things, much much tougher than your average Joe Neon. The MSP has a Protege engine with a turbo. Mazda has stated in their racing materials that they believe the engine can safely handle 220 horsepower at the crank. Look at the SpeedVision series Proteges - they replace an engine every four races. Something to think about.
Don't forget- MAzda and callaway also have to consider the morons who put 87 octane in the car even though it says not to and the occassional bad tank of gas with the mindless drone driving the car never hearing detoantion or not even knowing what it is if they did hear it :). The car has more than enough fuel for 10 psi, hell, I have run 14 without going lean. The stuff that these guys are doing is tested by others who know how to tune and passed down to them with a "this is the limit, so you are safe here" message :).. The MSP also doesn't start to detonate until 11-12 psi with stock fuel, timing, plugs, etc. As for 220 at the crank, my snowmobile can handle more than that :).. That is a VERY conservative number. I know quite a few people with MSP's and P5's putting in excess of 240 to the wheels with no issues whatsoever. Some have been together for over 50K miles already.. I agree, it is all in the tuning.. That is why there are those of us that tune and push the thing and then those who just go to the safe limit of stock tuning.
Joe

[EVILSRT]

damn.....after reading captins post.....I dont feel safe at all now.

I hear all this hype about the MBC and now that I get mine on I am very nervous. But let me ask this question..if you drive like a decent human....shifting at 4 etc....then you should have no worries because you only really start to stress the motor at the higher RPMs..right?

[ZoomZoomH]

but what's the fun shifting at 4k??

[EVILSRT]

But what I dont understand is our car is SO rich from factory....why would it be unsafe??

[boostisgood]

AZSpeed, If it was any other car, then I would up my fuel pressure. I got an A/F gauge, and it is always pegged at rich, unless im at idle. There should be no issues boosting to 10 PSI. I am, and have no issues as of yet, and I drve hard every day. :D

[EVILSRT]

cool.....I feel much better now:)

[bcbadboy]

Shit people I drive hard at 14psi's all day to work from work and home to the supermarket to my hoes house and all that good shit and not one problem with my car. I am at 4356 miles and going strong.:wtf:

[TURBO3WAGON]

Praise the boosted!

(scratch) I’m next, I’m tired of pussy footing around!


(second) (hump) place!

[Maestrokneer]

Originally posted by bcbadboy
Shit people I drive hard at 14psi's all day to work from work and home to the supermarket to my hoes house and all that good shit and not one problem with my car. I am at 4356 miles and going strong.:wtf:

Umm....that's great badboy.....but 4356 is about what? 4-5 months worth of driving? Let's see where your car is in 5 years.

At any rate, I know the risk of boosting increases wear on your motor, I just wanted to see if anyone had any technical data on that. That way I can be picking up "my hoes" in five years and going strong.

[AGR]

Originally posted by TURBO3WAGON
Praise the boosted!

(scratch) I’m next, I’m tired of pussy footing around!


(second) (hump) place!

pussy foot!!!!!!! (rofl)

[TURBO3WAGON]

Happy boy! (bicker) (upbum)

[bcbadboy]

Originally posted by Maestrokneer


Umm....that's great badboy.....but 4356 is about what? 4-5 months worth of driving? Let's see where your car is in 5 years.

At any rate, I know the risk of boosting increases wear on your motor, I just wanted to see if anyone had any technical data on that. That way I can be picking up "my hoes" in five years and going strong.

I don't think I will have my car in 5 years from now. I get cars like every 2-3 years. But anyways I maintain my car at all times. I treat my car as if were my bitch. I keep up on the oil and all other things that need to be maintained on it. I drive hard but I know my limits.

[Maestrokneer]

Originally posted by bcbadboy


I don't think I will have my car in 5 years from now. I get cars like every 2-3 years. But anyways I maintain my car at all times. I treat my car as if were my bitch. I keep up on the oil and all other things that need to be maintained on it. I drive hard but I know my limits.

In that case.....G's up hoes down badboy. Keep the pedal to the floor and the bitches in your lap. Word. :D

[chwood]

Originally posted by Maestrokneer


Umm....that's great badboy.....but 4356 is about what? 4-5 months worth of driving? Let's see where your car is in 5 years.

At any rate, I know the risk of boosting increases wear on your motor, I just wanted to see if anyone had any technical data on that. That way I can be picking up "my hoes" in five years and going strong.

Um...4300 = 4/5 months?

(hand)

I hit that driving since 4.26.03....

[TURBO3WAGON]

I have about 4600 in 2 months.

:D

[SuperSpud]

Im at 2000 after 3 weeks.. ha ha ha ha I think my odometer is in Km or somthing...

[Maestrokneer]

Then you all just drive WAY to much! :D I based my calc on an average milage of 12,000/year, which I've heard is pretty standard.

Plus, I've had mine for a month and a half now and am only at 2100.

[kwiktsi]

Originally posted by boostisgood
AZSpeed, If it was any other car, then I would up my fuel pressure. I got an A/F gauge, and it is always pegged at rich, unless im at idle. There should be no issues boosting to 10 PSI. I am, and have no issues as of yet, and I drve hard every day. :D

Agreed- my car gets taken to the rev limiter in first and second gear SEVERAL times a day and shifted at 6500 or so from there up (none of this "the MSP won't make power there"- it will and does once you let it breathe :) ). It has been driven like this at no less than 9 psi and as much as 11-13 psi (14 once, but that was a spike) EVERY SINGLE DAY since it had about 300 or so miles on it- it now has 6500 and I have had no issues with anything.. yes, only time will tell long term effects, but you mod a car, you drive it hard and you wear it out faster- no matter what kind of car it is :).. If you want 100% reliable trouble free operation, stay stock- and even then it won't always work as planned :).. there are some of us here with years of experience in building and maintaining turbo cars- we are the ones monitoring every little aspect of this car and how it responds to what. The rest of the guys are more than safe staying well behind how hard "we" are pushing our "test cars" :).

I wouldn't recommend 9.5-10 psi on a bone stock car if you are the type to rip down the highway- the exhaust is too restrictive for that. It is safe for those who like to just jump on it for quick shots down the road and such. once the exhaust is done, then you will eliminate a huge restriction and a huge generator of cylinder pressure/heat/detonation :).
Joe

[kwiktsi]

Originally posted by bcbadboy


I don't think I will have my car in 5 years from now. I get cars like every 2-3 years.

2-3? Wow, you are in for the long haul- I am already looking for something else :). I think I last 3-4 months before the ADD kicks in :) lol... I have honestly had at least 75 cars so far. About 20 of them were DSM's!!! I'll probably hang on to the MSP for a while, but it's replacement is hopefully coming shortly :).
Joe

[yashooa]

Exhaust you say Joey? Cool thanks for the tip ma Brutha!
I'll keep it at 9lbs and only spank it on those "special" occasions.
Spank da car dat is...
No one likeS preignition WORD TO MA HOMIES!
Opposing wave fronts can ruin your poor little cast piston's day :(
I'm so cracked in a bad way.

[AGR]

The MAZDASPEED I have greeted in my garage the past couple of mornings isn't the same one I purchased in January. This Mother Fucker is POSSESSED!!!!!!!!!

I LOVE MY (HIGHER BOOST) MAZDASPEED!!! (k) (k) (k) (k) (k)

[RX-KEVIN]

I am running 10-11 psi daily, and have noticed a huge difference when I took the cat back section off. the key to more boost is more flow. The factory pipes just add low end and seriously limit high boost flow I managed a 14.6 10psi with stock exhaust and predict 14.4 with a mod that cost nothing

[Captain KRM P5]

As for 220 at the crank, my snowmobile can handle more than that .. That is a VERY conservative number. I know quite a few people with MSP's and P5's putting in excess of 240 to the wheels with no issues whatsoever.

The Speedvision WC Proteges (i.e. - Roger Foo's P5, Bonacorssi's ES) run about 230 horsepower with custom engine work and they have to be rebuilt every four races - what are they doing differently that thier engines wear out faster? That work and those parts are all done by Mazdaspeed. Also, if you and bunch of others know how to get 240 wheel horses from my Protege5's turbo, please let me know. I was running about 11 - 12 psi on my Garrett T3 w/intercooler setup when my bottom end gave out, snapped a rod and shattered a piston and blew four holes in the block. Running way too lean. Granted, my turbo is a completely different setup than the MS/Calloway setup, but I'd like that extra power as much as the next guy.

Not calling the BS flag, don't get me wrong, I'm just as curious as anyone else how to get around the ECU issues / fuel issues. I also don't want to see anyone blow up their engine like I did, so you'll find me tending to advise CAUTION :) The only person I was aware that was getting anywhere near that kind of power was SpoolinMP3, and he was running race gas and fuel mgmt.

[kwiktsi]

Originally posted by Captain KRM P5


The Speedvision WC Proteges (i.e. - Roger Foo's P5, Bonacorssi's ES) run about 230 horsepower with custom engine work and they have to be rebuilt every four races - what are they doing differently that thier engines wear out faster? That work and those parts are all done by Mazdaspeed. Also, if you and bunch of others know how to get 240 wheel horses from my Protege5's turbo, please let me know. I was running about 11 - 12 psi on my Garrett T3 w/intercooler setup when my bottom end gave out, snapped a rod and shattered a piston and blew four holes in the block. Running way too lean. Granted, my turbo is a completely different setup than the MS/Calloway setup, but I'd like that extra power as much as the next guy.

Not calling the BS flag, don't get me wrong, I'm just as curious as anyone else how to get around the ECU issues / fuel issues. I also don't want to see anyone blow up their engine like I did, so you'll find me tending to advise CAUTION :) The only person I was aware that was getting anywhere near that kind of power was SpoolinMP3, and he was running race gas and fuel mgmt.

A lot of race teams rebuild every so many races :).. As for the motor not handling over 220 hp- you are stating that your car ran lean and popped and SpoolinMP3 was running race fuel and fuel mgmt to get his #'s.. That right there says the tuning will not handle over 220, not the actual engine :).. The motor, while not the strongest or best candidatefor boost IMHO, is also not as frail as people make it seem. With proper tuning, timing, fuel, etc. the motor will hold up past what people say it will. It won't hold 500hp or anything, but it will hold up for what most here are going to do. You just have to keep it from detonating and hammering on the rods- they can't handle the additional stress :).

On the MSP with it's less aggressive timing, over rich fuel condition and tiny paperweight of a turbo, 9-10 psi will not supply enough air to pop the motor. Just be sure to use premium fuel and keep the car in good tune- if the fuel filter starts to clog, that could be the end right there with any turbo car and getting 1 or 2 heat ranges colder on the plugs won't hurt either.
Joe