Still waiting? No deposit? Read this. [Archive]

Grimace

03-17-2003, 09:24 PM

Originally posted by JY Speed
oh man and i felt special when avante called this morning. fuck man, 5 mazdaspeeds were suppose to arrive at avante in febuary. than i put my a deposit like 2 weeks ago, and they tell me maybe in late march or early april. they call me today to confirm that mazda guarantees it within 30 days. hopefully that 30 days isn't really 30 days.

Small world. This is Avante that called me, the one at Young and Steeles. They were supposed to get 8 cars altogether, and only ended up getting a couple, and no more until they are pre-sold.
So I have to work in a test drive in a Spec V before I go in on Wednesday and plunk down money (or not, depending on how the test drive goes).
I'm really hoping my car comes in in less than 30 days too, I *need* it for the Easter weekend.

AFaceInTheCrowd

03-17-2003, 09:32 PM

what happens if its not within 30 days? do i get it free???? ;)

Grimace

03-17-2003, 09:35 PM

Originally posted by AFaceInTheCrowd
what happens if its not within 30 days? do i get it free???? ;)

You get TWO free!
I have no idea, you probably get a free middle finger and a "sorry for your luck." But the dealer did stress that it was guarenteed delivered within 30 days...but talk that with a grain of salt. Or a salt lick. :D

JY Speed

03-17-2003, 09:53 PM

yup the same avante. talk to don or eddie (chinese sales manageer, he's a nice guy). u better order urs now man! oh n don't get the spec v unless u on a tight budget. the normal spec v with no options comes to 25g's with like a 600 discount, and with the sport package comes close to 30g's. the spec v has some mad wheel spin, some mad torque steer when u push that car, and the gear box is kinda weird feeling. yo and don't go to the nissan dealer ship besides avante, they r jerk offs.

damn and i better get my car before april, (limited edition, pray for me, haha). it would be so good to have like a couple of mazdaspeeds crusing to the meet together.

Caffeine

03-17-2003, 09:56 PM

Originally posted by Grimace

But the dealer did stress that it was guarenteed delivered within 30 days...

Does this apply to just the 2003 models or the 2003.5`s as well? Sorry if im getting a little ahead of myself but when i inquired with a dealership he said they will have a titanium Msp in 30 days so his comment seems to line up with yours.

Grimace

03-17-2003, 10:00 PM

The guy I've been talking to is Gaspare S., a really nice guy who has been straight with me so far. Been in communications with him since December.
Not sure where you're getting those numbers from JY. ;) A base Spec V is $22, and there is only one option package for $2900 which is ABS, stereo upgrade, sunroof, alarm, folding seat.
That makes $24900, and the Nissan dealers are more willing to deal than Mazda. Are you going to try to bargain them down? Gaspare already told me flat out not to try and get less than MSRP, but I will probably try to get a few $100 off. If you try to too, it will make my bargaining easier. :)

Grimace

03-17-2003, 10:02 PM

Originally posted by Caffeine

Does this apply to just the 2003 models or the 2003.5`s as well? Sorry if im getting a little ahead of myself but when i inquired with a dealership he said they will have a titanium Msp in 30 days so his comment seems to line up with yours.

This is for the remaining 2003's. My dealer doesn't have any info on the 2003.5's... we know more than they do.

AFaceInTheCrowd

03-17-2003, 10:11 PM

damn this thread is making me wanna call my dealer.

Caffeine

03-17-2003, 10:13 PM

Ok cool thanks Grimace Ill have to call mine again and make sure hes not a dumbass and thinks im talking about a 2003.

Newf

03-17-2003, 10:40 PM

well, this sounds promising for those still waiting. Not the first time I've heard it though. When the orange one was brought here in late December, they called my dealer asking for my name so they could basically register the car in my name before they sent it! Otherwise they wouldn't send it. I'm not kidding. This is a long story but, Another guy had a deposit on one before me, so it had to go in his name anyhow. Sure enough, everything was done paper wise before it was sent.

I thought this was only for the first few cars, I'm surprised to hear this still. I guess too many cars are just sitting on lots somewhere, or there's so many dealers wanting them, they are only shipping to serious ones....I dunno

Newf

03-17-2003, 10:42 PM

on another note, this is really pathetic. I mean, there's NO information on these cars. Mazda's web site is horrible. You really can't see the car or any pics of it unless you do the internet thing your self, and now the 2003.5's are in the same boat, but there's even less information about them around. So, buyers are basically forced into buying car without really seeing it first. That's insane.

Caffeine

03-17-2003, 10:50 PM

Yeah the only reason im willing to buy a gray 2003.5 before I see it in person is because its basically the same car and ive test driven a MSP. It was funny cause I didnt mention i wanted gray at first cause I thought he might not let me drive it or do some credit approval first. But as soon as I stepped out of the car I was like man i love this thing, so when can I order a gray 2003.5?

JY Speed

03-17-2003, 11:52 PM

oh i wasn't talking about the msrp, but the final price out of the dealership. mazdaspeed is a little over 32 g's, meanwhile a spec v with a sport package is around 30 g's.

JY Speed

03-18-2003, 12:02 AM

:( eddie the sales manager told me there was going to be no discount on the car, not even a couple hundred dollars. they said something about mazda not allowing it (dont' know if it bs or not, but oh well). anyways im just happy that im getting the car. and the people at avante are pretty damn nice, unlike the pricks at nissan besides mazda. ( they wouldn't even talk to me, when i went up to them to talk about the spec v )

this is me:
hi can i get the pricing info on the spec
dealer:
(looks at me funny), hands me a sheet
me:
how much will the car be out of the dealership with some kind of discount
dealer:
do u plan on buying the car now?
me:
i plan on buying sometime soon i guess, i like the spec v from what i see
dealer: if u don't plan on buying now, we shouldn't talk

that's the end of that!

brennan

03-18-2003, 12:34 AM

I've had my car for about 2 weeks now, and I am goin to the meet on april 5th depending if I find out where it is?

Slipstream

03-18-2003, 01:27 AM

If I hadn't already driven the car a couple of times, I'd be pretty pissed. Like I told the Subaru dealer, how am I supposed to decide if I like the car unless I get a chance to drive one? I won't buy unless I get a test drive first. But I guess on a positive note, it means there will be fewer people who walk into a Mazda dealer and say "Oh, that's a cute car... Daddy, I want one of those!" :mad: ... and more people who actually WANT one buying them.

mspeedpro

03-18-2003, 04:05 AM

brennan! u have the wings west kit on ur msp?? post sum pics mann! come on!! i wanna see it!?!?! sorry but u gotta!

oliver2000

03-18-2003, 08:56 AM

this makes sense in a wierd way....my dealer got my car at the end of feb and they are only getting one, a mystery man pulled a string or two and bamm my car arrived. I suspect that with whatever number they have left of the 2003 they want to make sure they are sold before they ship them. I went to avante in December and the story they have 5 or 6 more in two weeks was the story I heard...now if you order one 30 days to be delivered is reasonable.

Make sure you can get delivery before the end of march and take advantage of the 6 months no payments ( 150 days interest free ), the MSP qualifies for this, no special interest rate but 150 days of free money.

Grimace

03-18-2003, 10:29 AM

"Make sure you can get delivery before the end of march and take advantage of the 6 months no payments ( 150 days interest free ), the MSP qualifies for this, no special interest rate but 150 days of free money."

Eh? Details! I didn't hear anything about this!

oliver2000

03-18-2003, 10:38 AM

here is the link for the details, basically you sign up for lease or purchase financing, select the term and bamm no payments for 6 months and no interest for 150 days.

For me I am paying cash for the car so instead of writing a cheque to the dealer, I applied for the financing ( purchase ) over a 5 year term and on the 149th day I will walk into the bank ( scotiabank ) and give them the cheque I was going to give the dealer anyway....150 days of money in my jeans.

http://www.mazda.ca/english/125.htm

Logan

03-18-2003, 11:24 AM

Listen,
All you folks who are being told by dealers (Canada) that you have to pay MSRP are being lied to.
I did the regular car deal with my dealer in Peterborough, and paid less than MSRP, plus I took advantage of the $600 CDN grad rebate from Mazda.
If your salesman is telling you "Mazda wont let you pay less than MSRP" he/she is feeding you a line.
Walk in with a form, say "this is what I am going to pay, do you want to sell it to me or not??"
They say yes, you give them a deposit, they say no, you go to another dealer.
I got 90 days no payments on mine.

Logan

03-18-2003, 11:26 AM

http://www.mazda.ca/english/125.htm
You will note on this page it says it doesn't apply to Mazdaspeed Protege. Read the fine print at the bottom.

oliver2000

03-18-2003, 11:43 AM

if you read the fine print...the 0% does not apply to the MSP, but the deferal option of the 150 days of no interest does apply.

here is the fine print, you will note the line of no interest for 150 days on ALL other APR rates.

*No Payments for 180 days, no interest for 150 days on purchase financing. Six month deferral offer applies to
all other APR rates up to terms of 60 months.

*0% purchase financing applies to all 2002 and 2003 Mazda models with the exception of 2003 MazdaSpeed
Protegé. Offer does not apply to 2004 Mazda6.

chwood

03-18-2003, 12:44 PM

*0% purchase financing applies to all 2002 and 2003 Mazda models with the exception of 2003 MazdaSpeed
Protegé. Offer does not apply to 2004 Mazda6.

....so does that mean it WOULD apply to the 2003.5??

;)

oliver2000

03-18-2003, 01:13 PM

sure if it was delivered before the end of march.....fat chance of that happening

Grimace

03-18-2003, 01:36 PM

Originally posted by Logan
Listen,
All you folks who are being told by dealers (Canada) that you have to pay MSRP are being lied to.
I did the regular car deal with my dealer in Peterborough, and paid less than MSRP, plus I took advantage of the $600 CDN grad rebate from Mazda.
If your salesman is telling you "Mazda wont let you pay less than MSRP" he/she is feeding you a line.
Walk in with a form, say "this is what I am going to pay, do you want to sell it to me or not??"
They say yes, you give them a deposit, they say no, you go to another dealer.
I got 90 days no payments on mine.

Can you post/email/pm the dealer contact info?
How much did you bargain them down?

Heathen23

03-18-2003, 01:39 PM

I used the College Grad Rebate too. It applies to grad's wthin two years so I just made it in under the wire. If anyone plans to use this just copy your diploma for proof and you will get a nice $500(US) rebate. A 1.50 a kinko's well spent!

Daemos

03-18-2003, 01:57 PM

Originally posted by JY Speed
yup the same avante. talk to don or eddie (chinese sales manageer, he's a nice guy). u better order urs now man! oh n don't get the spec v unless u on a tight budget. the normal spec v with no options comes to 25g's with like a 600 discount, and with the sport package comes close to 30g's. the spec v has some mad wheel spin, some mad torque steer when u push that car, and the gear box is kinda weird feeling. yo and don't go to the nissan dealer ship besides avante, they r jerk offs.

damn and i better get my car before april, (limited edition, pray for me, haha). it would be so good to have like a couple of mazdaspeeds crusing to the meet together.

umm...what are you smoking?

I got my spec v fully loaded for like 23 Gs :)

Loaded I mean, all available factory options, winter tires/rims. That's all before trade in as well. After trade in I got my Spec for like 19 Gs :)

I might of gone to other places to get a car, if they offered a car for the same price, and offered such a generous trade value for my older car :)

Oh yea...those are all canadian prices :) and before taxes (obviously)...

arkitek

03-18-2003, 02:33 PM

Originally posted by oliver2000
here is the link for the details, basically you sign up for lease or purchase financing, select the term and bamm no payments for 6 months and no interest for 150 days.

For me I am paying cash for the car so instead of writing a cheque to the dealer, I applied for the financing ( purchase ) over a 5 year term and on the 149th day I will walk into the bank ( scotiabank ) and give them the cheque I was going to give the dealer anyway....150 days of money in my jeans.

http://www.mazda.ca/english/125.htm

You might want to verify with Mazda that there's no clauses or conditions there penalizing you for opting out of the loan like this.

Grimace

03-18-2003, 02:37 PM

Originally posted by Heathen23
I used the College Grad Rebate too. It applies to grad's wthin two years so I just made it in under the wire. If anyone plans to use this just copy your diploma for proof and you will get a nice $500(US) rebate. A 1.50 a kinko's well spent!

My dealer won't accept anything less than an original transcript.
Guess they want to check my grades too. :)

JY Speed

03-18-2003, 02:45 PM

what have i been smooking? haha weed of course.
as i stated before, 25 out of the dealership, taxes, freight, all the administration, air tax and shit like that for the base spec v. the one with the sport package out is like somewhere in the high 29's out of the dealership. ;)

Heathen23

03-18-2003, 02:53 PM

My dealer won't accept anything less than an original transcript.

I originally brought in my diploma in it's frame because they tried that crap on me too. It costs money to request an official transcrpt so I told them I could even bring in the VHS of my graduation ceremony. I logged on to my former school's website and showed them my online transcript just to prove a point. It was classic.... I was inside the sales tower scrolling through my semester's sarcastically commenting on how each course was.

In the end they just sent me to kinkos to make a complete copy of my official diploma.

Daemos

03-18-2003, 05:21 PM

Originally posted by JY Speed
what have i been smooking? haha weed of course.
as i stated before, 25 out of the dealership, taxes, freight, all the administration, air tax and shit like that for the base spec v. the one with the sport package out is like somewhere in the high 29's out of the dealership. ;)

bah you don't know how to talk down the dealership then.

eventhough there was a 5 month line up for a Spec V, I still bargined them down.

No other dealership would give me such a good price on my trade in as well, which was atleast $1500 more that nissan offered.

I mean $23,000 for a 2003 Spec V, with Sports Package, included winter rims/tires. I must of gotten the deal of the century or something :)

then was like brought down to like 18-19 thousand Canadian after trade in...that's a damned good deal I got :p

Taxes and those fees kill prices on cars -.-;;

brennan

03-18-2003, 07:50 PM

I haven't put the wings west kit on but I have the front bumper and the side skirts in my room, I'm contemplating if I should get the rear skirt. Also soon I am getting the rear lip spoiler and fender flairs I'm also looking into getting the evo style hood.

JY Speed

03-19-2003, 01:27 AM

wow daemos u got a pretty a damn amazing deal. which deal u go to? i didn't really bother talking about a deal on the car, because after the test drive i was leaning more towards the mazdaspeed and they give no respect to kids (they don't give respect to young looking asian kids, unless u drive a bmw). anyways im getting the mazdaspeed now and am pretty happy. the spec v was my second choice because it couldn't be beat for the price. so how much u end up paying for the spec v out of dealership with all the shit like taxes n freight and other stupid taxes?

Daemos

03-19-2003, 02:10 AM

Originally posted by JY Speed
wow daemos u got a pretty a damn amazing deal. which deal u go to? i didn't really bother talking about a deal on the car, because after the test drive i was leaning more towards the mazdaspeed and they give no respect to kids (they don't give respect to young looking asian kids, unless u drive a bmw). anyways im getting the mazdaspeed now and am pretty happy. the spec v was my second choice because it couldn't be beat for the price. so how much u end up paying for the spec v out of dealership with all the shit like taxes n freight and other stupid taxes?

I went to a local dealership in winnipeg, I was lucky, and I caught the owner while he was in town, very nice guy. Although I'm 18, asian, I drove a 1995 sentra xe auto, they still treated me with much respect. Some people say it's how I dress...but I don't dress any diffrent from other people :confused:

But I can't remember how much I paid after everything, since it was my parents who bought it for me, and set the limit to like around 20 Gs before tax, including the trade in.

But I think we got a good deal, because I walked in alone, talked, said I would pay cash (paid by cheque, so it was close enough) Told him what I wanted, and he said he wouldn't give anything off, and I would have to wait 5 months for my car...then I started saying in 5 months I could be at another dealership buying another car.

including wintertires and rims, and all the service I got, I just remember it was around 19-20K before taxes. I'm not upto date on all the fees, but I'm guessing that would make it around 23K after fees and taxes.

If I were to get a MSP, the first MSP just got into my city, I wouldn't touch it, it was already ragged on by a sales man, who raced me. Also, the service at the dealership that does have it, was all over the news for ripping people off on certain things.

Apparently as well, they have a small markup on the car, and arn't willing to deal down since it's "limited production"

bah...and at that time, all that really concerned me is that I got a decent speed car with handling, and it had to have a sunroof, cuz I love crusin with the sunroof open.

So, just letting you know, if you guys are in winnipeg, and I believe there is an MSP still available, it was in the show room window last weekend, don't take that one, it's been ragged on forsure.

Vicocola

03-19-2003, 02:14 AM

consider how some ppl in forum said that they have like at least 5 or more msp in their local dealer... i wonder wut they gonna do with it if nobody buys them lol... *trash can*

buster

03-19-2003, 05:14 AM

Nice work with the SpecV! It sounds like the SpecV is still the best deal by far in this group of cars. If a dealer isn't willing to deal with someone who want's to buy the car, even if it means flexing a little on price, they aren't worth dealing with.

psifactor

03-19-2003, 08:40 AM

Got a call from my dealer today. Long story short, Mazda isn't sending any Mazdaspeeds anywhere else unless the dealer has pre-sold it. There are some leftover 2003's, but unless you put down a deposit, they won't be shipped to the dealer, even if the dealer has previously been allocated a certain amount of MSP's.
Just a heads-up. My dealer was supposed to be getting in several more, but it doesn't look like that is the case any longer. I have until Tuesday night to decide if I really, really want one.
By the way, they said once you put down money, Mazda guarentees that you will have the car in 30 days or less. I guess its just a matter of shipping it?

hey..I have 4 mazdaspeeds in stock RIGHT now as I type......We don't do any of that taking deposits before we will order one......Tell you dealer to shove it....

we will also have 18 RX-8's ordered :)

Daemos

03-19-2003, 11:45 AM

[QUOTE]Originally posted by psifactor

hey..I have 4 mazdaspeeds in stock RIGHT now as I type......We don't do any of that taking deposits before we will order one......Tell you dealer to shove it....

we will also have 18 RX-8's ordered :) [/QUOT

*drool* 18 rx-8s :)

psifactor

03-19-2003, 05:49 PM

I cannot wait till they get here. Soon we get to go to the test track with a rx8 also........it does not get any better than being able to beat on a track car:)

Caffeine

03-19-2003, 06:03 PM

You have any information on how the 2003.5`s are being rolled out PSI? I am guessing gray and yellow will come out the same time. My dealer says he can have me a titanium in 30 days but i dont know if hes bsing me or not.

psifactor

03-19-2003, 06:21 PM

I will give it to you stright from the book I got.

The 2003.5 Mazdaspeed protege retains the extensive performance modifications that created the 2003 mazdaspeed Protege while adding exterior and interior refinements.

Exterior
Two new colors: Titanium Grey Metallic (1,100 units) and Blazing Yellow Mica (650 units)

New front skirt (without fog lights0

Dark Hyper Silver finisht on Racing Hart 17-inch 5 spoke alloy wheels

New rear skirt

Larger and polished oval exhaust tip with Mazdaspeed logo

New rear wing with center hight mounted stop light

Interior
New cloth seat inserts

Black leather manual transmission shift boot

Electric yellow stiching on cloth seats, leather shift boot, and leather wrapped steering wheel

New aluminum and leather shift knob with Mazdaspeed logo

New aluminum foot pedals with mazdaspeed logo

New carpeted floor mats with mazdaspeed logo

New silver center on guage needles

Thats all I know about the new mazdaspeed..

psifactor

03-19-2003, 06:23 PM

My dealer says he can have me a titanium in 30 days but i dont know if hes bsing me or not.

I have a guy at work that would know for sure when they are going to be out...

IMO, I think he's bsing you..
I will find out for sure tomorrow. :)

psifactor

03-19-2003, 06:32 PM

Nice work with the SpecV! It sounds like the SpecV is still the best deal by far in this group of cars.

Mazdaspeed Protege over Nissan SE-R SPEC V

World-Class suppliers

Callaway CArs co-engineered turbocharger system

Tochigi Fuji Sangyo KK super limited slip differential

Racing Beat-tuned front and rear suspensions with Tokico shock absorbers

Standard anit-lock brake system

Standard antitheft alarm system

Racing Hart 17-inch 5 spoke alloy wheels and wheel locks

More passenger and trunk room

Satellite radio ready 450 watt Kenwood AM/FM/CD/MP3 stereo with seven speakers

Longer warranty coverage

No-cost emergency roadside assistance

Free loaner car during warranty service..

Thats just a few reason why the mazdaspeed is better..

SCC did a article of the best performance cars for under 20k...the mazdaspeed came in second behind the neon.

I forget where the sentra was in that test.

Caffeine

03-19-2003, 06:41 PM

I have a guy at work that would know for sure when they are going to be out...

Thanks man ill be checking this thread hourly for your post :)

psifactor

03-19-2003, 06:51 PM

lol..I will not know till tomorrow.

Daemos

03-19-2003, 07:00 PM

Originally posted by psifactor

Mazdaspeed Protege over Nissan SE-R SPEC V

World-Class suppliers

Callaway CArs co-engineered turbocharger system (yea...it only puts out 170 hp...a lil sad from a turbo system, a boosted stock nissan SR20 put out 250 hp)

Tochigi Fuji Sangyo KK super limited slip differential (And...your point the spec also has a HLSD)

Racing Beat-tuned front and rear suspensions with Tokico shock absorbers (oooo you make it sound fancy, all it is beefed up shocks, and stiffer springs, and anti roll bars, the thing is the Spec V doesn't have ARB (well not true ones) or good shocks, so yea you got me up on there)

Standard anit-lock brake system (um...yea I got that too)

Standard antitheft alarm system (ditto, but still stock alarms suck)

Racing Hart 17-inch 5 spoke alloy wheels and wheel locks (still heavy, and name doesn't really matter)

More passenger and trunk room (umm...right...last time I sat in a protege, it was the same size)

Satellite radio ready 450 watt Kenwood AM/FM/CD/MP3 stereo with seven speakers (hate to burst your bubble...but it still sounds like shit)

Longer warranty coverage (acctually it's the exact same as nissan)

No-cost emergency roadside assistance (ditto)

Free loaner car during warranty service..(same here with my dealership)

Thats just a few reason why the mazdaspeed is better..

SCC did a article of the best performance cars for under 20k...the mazdaspeed came in second behind the neon.

I forget where the sentra was in that test.

Oh yea, you forgot the MSP doesn't have nicely bolstered seats, sun roof, or cruse control. hmmm...
Yea...but still if I got the Mazda speed I would of paid almost 5-6K more canadian before taxes for one.

lets not make this into another MSP vs another car thread where the MSP will win even if the car is a skyline thread.

SCC, yea they produced good numbers from the MSP, but in earlier articles, the Spec V from the numbers would of tied the MSP, in all aspects, you can't always use magazines, espically when in the article the SPec V they used was burning oil, and wasn't in top condition.

For the price I got my Spec V for, the MSP can't touch it in price/value. With the MSP going for like 28K here, and me getting my spec V for like 22-23K (before trade in) and having winter tires thrown in...I think I got a much better deal.

I'll give you props, for equal drivers, the MSP should pull away from the Spec V in the 1/4 mile, and in handling, slowly, but it won't be such a big lead that the MSP will always win.

The car in the price that will win will be the neon, it's funny, the company that learned to do import cars right..cept for looks and reliablity, is a domestic.

Price is what took me to the Spec V, that and the sunroof, it's been so warm lately, I don't think I could make due without one :)

you sound like some other people who think their car is the best car in the world. The MSP, the Spec V both are good cars...but they both suck.

SCC compares performance aspects of the car, I didn't buy my spec V to race every day, or to autox every day. It was ment to be a confortable daily driver. Which ment it needed to meet certain luxery requirements, the MSP doesn't meet those requirements, neither does the new neon.

For now, the Spec V will be slightly modded in the suspension, cuz that's one thing that needs fixing, the ride quality, funny thing is...going for full coilovers by JIC on a spec, will improve handling, and ride...

Then, if I make enough money this summer, it's gonna be S14 SR20DET baby for my summer ride :)

psifactor

03-19-2003, 07:26 PM

It was ment to be a confortable daily driver. Which ment it needed to meet certain luxery requirements, the MSP doesn't meet those requirements, neither does the new neon.

Why isn't it a good daily driver? I have a 12's car thats my daily driver.

Then, if I make enough money this summer, it's gonna be S14 SR20DET baby for my summer ride
hell yeah thats what I'm talking about!!!!!!

I just dont see the spec V having as much potential as the Mazdaspeed protege. And it never will till you put in that SR20DET or a CA18DET.........If your plans are to do that..then you really did not get the spec V to be just a comfortable transportation.

Either way..we all know the MSP has more potential than a 4banger n/a car.

btw, the spec V came in 5th place out of 8 cars, and it was in prefect running condition.

competition cars:
8th Place: Honda Civic Si
7th Volkswagen gti 1.8t
6th Hyundai Tiburon v6
5th Sentra SE-R spec V
4th...none
3rd Mini Cooper S
3rd Ford Svt Focus
2nd Mazdaspeed
1st Neon

that was in January's issue of SCC.

Daemos

03-19-2003, 07:45 PM

Originally posted by psifactor

Why isn't it a good daily driver? I have a 12's car thats my daily driver.

hell yeah thats what I'm talking about!!!!!!

I just dont see the spec V having as much potential as the Mazdaspeed protege. And it never will till you put in that SR20DET or a CA18DET.........If your plans are to do that..then you really did not get the spec V to be just a comfortable transportation.

Either way..we all know the MSP has more potential than a 4banger n/a car.

btw, the spec V came in 5th place out of 8 cars, and it was in prefect running condition.

competition cars:
8th Place: Honda Civic Si
7th Volkswagen gti 1.8t
6th Hyundai Tiburon v6
5th Sentra SE-R spec V
4th...none
3rd Mini Cooper S
3rd Ford Svt Focus
2nd Mazdaspeed
1st Neon

that was in January's issue of SCC.

"read again, the Engine was full of ping, and the gear box was full of crunch, we've seen 15.5 from healther ones."

But numbers talk.

Best MSP numbers from SCC

1/4 mile: 15.3 sec
lat grip .89 g
slalom: 70.3 mph

Spec V numbers:
1/4 mile: 15.4
lat grip .88g
slalom 70.2 mph

S14 doesn't = Spec V. S14 = 240 SX w/RWD :) which means, it still MUST have a sunroof, since it gets hot enough here to want to have one open as you cruise..but it also means my Spec gets turned over to a winter beater...which my parents probally won't like at all hehe. they'll be lilke "a USED car is your summer car, and a NEW car is a winter beater, WTF" hehehe

Spec V has alot of potential, acctually I see it as more potential than the MSP, because you can still bolt on a turbo to the Spec, while the MSP's tranny is just holding on at 7psi it can at max go to 10 PSI.

The Spec can run reliable on 7 PSI, but it's making same power as the MSP without a turbo, but once I throw a turbo in the equation it's madness although the turbo kit in works will be putting 250 to the wheels at like 7 PSI.

If I wanted that much power, I'd put it in a RWD platform, which I hope to do soon...

psifactor

03-19-2003, 08:02 PM

I guess you are right about the two cars having close to the same potential.

Just because mazda did a shitty job...All they did was add a turbo kit. Most real turbo cars are designed for turbos. Such as the 4g63 which will hold up to 450hp and still love you. The EJ20 is also alot more friendly wiht boost...But the 4g63 and the EJ20's trannys both suck. I have come to the conclusion that the japeneese do not know how to make Strong Transmissions.

To make Any of thoes cars as i mentioned before you would have to rebuild the engine to actually support any amount of horsepower.

I have been really dissapointed in all of the new prodution cars. I cannot really think of a new car around 25k that I would like to own. The only things that come to mind are the STI, and EVO8. Look at the 350Z, RX8,Eclipise...none of thoes are turbo anymore
:(
Oh well..I guess I'm going to have to stick to old school or get a sti!!!

Daemos

03-19-2003, 09:16 PM

Originally posted by psifactor
I guess you are right about the two cars having close to the same potential.

Just because mazda did a shitty job...All they did was add a turbo kit. Most real turbo cars are designed for turbos. Such as the 4g63 which will hold up to 450hp and still love you. The EJ20 is also alot more friendly wiht boost...But the 4g63 and the EJ20's trannys both suck. I have come to the conclusion that the japeneese do not know how to make Strong Transmissions.

To make Any of thoes cars as i mentioned before you would have to rebuild the engine to actually support any amount of horsepower.

I have been really dissapointed in all of the new prodution cars. I cannot really think of a new car around 25k that I would like to own. The only things that come to mind are the STI, and EVO8. Look at the 350Z, RX8,Eclipise...none of thoes are turbo anymore
:(
Oh well..I guess I'm going to have to stick to old school or get a sti!!!

acctually it's not that the japanese can't build strong trannys...it's getting a combination of a strong engine and a strong tranny.

The Mazda's engine is decent for boosting, it can probally take 12-14 psi reliably, but the tranny will die far before that.

The Sentra's Tranny...it's like umm indestructable you could say, in terms of holding power, according to the tranny's manu website, it can hold up to 400 lb-ft of torque before breaking. But the engine, will blow before that, unless if you find some meraclous way to make that much power all NA on a 2.5L 4 banger.

the RX8 really doesn't impress me, personally. It handles well, but it's lacking the power, I'd much rather get a G35 Coupe, because it can easily be made to handle just as well, with more power.

the 350Z...it's bubbly, G35 looks nicer, and handles almost as nice...and Nismo has a G35 suspension kit comming out.

The only real new cars I'm intrested in are the STi, Evo, and the G35 coupe.

They will be until mazda shows me a real sucessor to the RX7, and until nissan decides to show us a real skyline, Z car, and silvia.

all and all though, we really can't complain about our cars, they're ecnoboxes, the low end of the scale, so obviously nissan and mazda arn't gonna throw money into these cars. They're good for what they are.

The most logical reasons for Nissan and Mazda making these two cars the Spec V and the MSP are: Mazda is phasing out the protege soon, so they wanted it to go out with a bang...they're also phasing out the engine, so to make none of them go to waste, they will throw on a turbo, and hype up the car so it sells, so they can get rid of left over invatory.

The Spec V is diffrent...Nissan was trying to do a revival of it's old sports cars with the 350Z comming out, they wanted to revive the old school SE-R, but they did it also so they could phase out the Sentra SE which used the SR20 engine, which they wanted to stop using since it was making it hard to pass emissions. Nissan also needed a way to bring attention to a car that wasn't selling as well as it used to be.

Mazda and Nissan both made these cars to save money, they didn't exacly do the best job on them. We can't expect them to, we're still driving their low end models.

If I really wanted to turn an ecnobox into a race car...it would have to be an EG6 Civic, the aftermarket for that car is just amazing. It can be all to easy to make a civic a 10 second beast on the drag strip, while easily carving corners in autox.

I really hope the MSP and the Spec V do something for the aftermarket of Nissans and Mazda though, the aftermarket has always been lagging behind for both companies.

psifactor

03-19-2003, 10:04 PM

and until nissan decides to show us a real skyline, Z car, and silvia.

Have you seen the skyline that we are getting over here...IT SUCKS
I could not find the info I wanted on it..but here is a link
http://www.rapidcars.com/gtrpics.html
http://www.gtr.co.uk/html/
how can they put a v8 in that car...its just wrong!!!!!!

The cars now still suck...
7 to 12 years ago then had the rx-7, 300zx, steath/3000gt, supra, celica gt-4, integra typeR, and Talon/Eclipise. Thats all I could think of right now. I'm just really dissapointed in what they are making now. I know some of the cars I mentioned are a little on the high side of price..But the cars today just dont compare to them.

The only other tranny I can think of that would hold any power are the turbo II, the MKIII 5 speed, and the MKIV 6s peed.

I really dont know a whole lot about the se-r...I'm just suprised that thay made a good tranny for it. Nothing is better than shifting as quickly as possible. I learned my lesson the 1st time and have got this tranny to last so far:)

Kelly

Daemos

03-19-2003, 10:35 PM

Originally posted by psifactor

Have you seen the skyline that we are getting over here...IT SUCKS
I could not find the info I wanted on it..but here is a link
http://www.rapidcars.com/gtrpics.html
http://www.gtr.co.uk/html/
how can they put a v8 in that car...its just wrong!!!!!!

The cars now still suck...
7 to 12 years ago then had the rx-7, 300zx, steath/3000gt, supra, celica gt-4, integra typeR, and Talon/Eclipise. Thats all I could think of right now. I'm just really dissapointed in what they are making now. I know some of the cars I mentioned are a little on the high side of price..But the cars today just dont compare to them.

The only other tranny I can think of that would hold any power are the turbo II, the MKIII 5 speed, and the MKIV 6s peed.

I really dont know a whole lot about the se-r...I'm just suprised that thay made a good tranny for it. Nothing is better than shifting as quickly as possible. I learned my lesson the 1st time and have got this tranny to last so far:)

Kelly

The tranny it self, if you misshift you can blow it, like if you force it into gears, like going from 6th 4000 rpm into second, it'll blow (obviously)

yea, the funny thing is the reason the Spec V got a good tranny is because nissan is trying to save money, so they reused the beefy tranny right off the maxima :)

psifactor

03-19-2003, 10:55 PM

Damoes what made you think that the mazdaspeed protege would not make a good daily driver? Just some of the simple features like sunroof and cruise control?

I cannot believe that it does not have cruise control.....I will have to check that out...why would mazda leave that out?

Daemos

03-19-2003, 11:26 PM

Originally posted by psifactor
Damoes what made you think that the mazdaspeed protege would not make a good daily driver? Just some of the simple features like sunroof and cruise control?

I cannot believe that it does not have cruise control.....I will have to check that out...why would mazda leave that out?

Well, for me it wouldn't be as good of a daily driver. If I owned one I'd still use it as a daily driver

The Seats arn't as comfy, no sunroof, no cruise, and the low end grunt just isn't there which I think is nice for a daily driver.

Overall the MSP still makes a great car, but IMO the spec makes a better just day to day driver.

Just the small things that make a diffrence, the sound system in both cars are bleh, but I can live with them.

IT's like just the small things that make the MSP a slightly better performing car, ie no sunroof makes the body more rigid, no cruise control/sunroof make the car lighter.

If I don't get the 240SX I want, I'm gonna mod the hell outta the spec, but the only thing I want to mod if I don't mod the hell out of the car is coilovers/rims/tires/antiroll (can't believe nissan didn't even add those on, the rear has a "intergrated anti-roll bar" but it doesn't do jack all for anti-roll momentum heh...) That'll fix the ride quality issue, which is really the only issue I have with it. Hopefully I won't get too carried away, and before I know it throw all my money into the spec, so I can't even afford a project car hehe.

buster

03-20-2003, 12:09 AM

That SpecV was also a 2002 and there are a number of improvements with the 2003's namely a gearbox with shorter gearing down low so the times have improved a little. I alos heard a rumour that they chenged the shock valving to improve performance and ride quality.

Daemos

03-20-2003, 01:23 AM

Originally posted by buster
That SpecV was also a 2002 and there are a number of improvements with the 2003's namely a gearbox with shorter gearing down low so the times have improved a little. I alos heard a rumour that they chenged the shock valving to improve performance and ride quality.

BHAHAHA I wish they would change the shocks, it would help handling sooooo much.

The shocks are what seriously kill the spec v's handing, which is already really good, concerdering that it doesn't have any real Anti Roll bars, it can still be counted as one of the top 3 handling FWD cars (stock that is). Pulling off nice skidpad numbers and slalom speeds.

But no, the shocks are identical to the ones found on the sentra XE, the ride height is the same as the sentra xe which is the base base base model of the sentra.

All nissan did was throw stiffer springs, a front sway bar, a retuned rear axle and rear suspension, and HLSD.

the shocks on my car are worthless, heh, that's what you get when you have to save money to make a car.

The tranny is diffrent, but the box, and syncros have been revised, and the gear ratios are slightly longer in 1st and 2nd, shorter in 3rd and 4th, same in 5th, and longer in 6th for better fuel economey.

the 2003s are probally just slightly faster, but probally not noticable by normal people. The gearbox however is much greatly improved, and same with the seat fabric/colours :).

I guess nissan could of put more work into the shocks, and anti roll bars, I wouldn't of minded paying a bit more for them, I mean, if Nissan can make an SUV (the FX45) out slalom a G35 coupe, and a SUV that outhandles most cars on the road...they could of made the b15 chassis handle a bit better :)

JY Speed

03-20-2003, 02:55 AM

my opinion is that they are both good depending on the person

price wise: the spec v wins as it can be bought for like 3g's (fully loaded) cheaper in canada

performance: mazdaspeed (turbo, racing beat, tokico and the rest)

styling: tie (don't like how orange is only in canada, and the spec v has a fugly back)

bang for the buck: i think the mazdaspeed has a little edge as it comes with a factory turbo, tokico, sparco, racing beat suspension

handling n supension: drove the spec v, wasn't that great at handling, breaks lose, torque steer, mad wheel spin. can't say for sure for the mazdaspeed, as i have not driven one yet. but from what i hear, it is amazing handling, but the ride isn't that smooth.

potential: depends. the spec v has more potential with a turbo (if jwt ever produces it), the mazdaspeed i think has more potential as it is factory turbo and will be easier to modify since it is. flip side, the spec v goes up close to 20 hp and 20 lbs tq from headers and a balance shaft removal and if cams ever come out (jwt again!) car can running close to 200 hp at wheel n/a (with the help of a cai and ecu)

price visited again: i can get a base spec v for 25 out of the dealership, 7 g's cheaper than mazda in canada.
edge: spec v

extra features: spec v: cruise control (not that great), sun roff ( i can live without one
mazdaspeed: turbo! (i like listening to turbo cars more)

if u got less to spend the base spec v is the way to go, if got a bit more, the mazdaspeed is the better one. 32g's versus around 25.
i personally bought the mazdaspeed after test driving the spec v, and reading all the great reviews about it.

JY Speed

03-20-2003, 02:58 AM

transmission: spec v gear box isn't smooth and has clunk, but i have driven both the 2002 and 2003, and must say the 2003 has been greatly improved.

from what i read: the 2002 spec v's have some mad problems going to the transmission to the oil burning.

the key here is: 2003 spec v is probably okay, 2002 spec v is a no no.

psifactor

03-20-2003, 09:44 AM

the sound system in both cars are bleh
The sound system in the mazdaspeed is awsome. Well again..I'm not into the best systems, but it come with a kenwood front deck, 450watt amp, and a 10' sub woofer. I blieve this is one of the best factory sounding systems I have ever heard in a lower end car.

If I don't get the 240SX I want..What one do you want. I have one currently :)

If I really wanted to turn an ecnobox into a race car...it would have to be an EG6 Civic, the aftermarket for that car is just amazing. It can be all to easy to make a civic a 10 second beast on the drag strip, while easily carving corners in autox.
...um ok.
how many 10s cars have you seen at autox?? NONE. you cannot mix a full drag car with autox, especially a 10s one. I took my car thats only a 12s car and is SUCKED at the scca events. You dont need a fast car at autox. Just a good handling car.

Have you ever seen a 12s honda driving around on the road? It near to impossible to the adverage joe without lots of money. I do know of one, Its a accord and it kicks ass. (it also has like 30k+ under the hood)

Just because the aftermarket is good does not mean its a good drag car. A civic would be one of my last choices to make a drag car. First its front wheel drive, Then engine is not built for any kind of horsepower.

If you want to make a 10 s car..save yourself 10 of thousands of dollars and start with another car. It would be alot cheaper to get a mkIV or mkIII and turn up the boost (thats good for 12's right there) Get a 300zx do a few basic mods and your all ready in the 12's). A starion with a FMIC, upgraded fuel system, Boost controler, and a like 20g will put you easily in the 12's (all that for under 5k) The 4g63 is probably one of the 4cyl's with the most potential. do the fuel system, turn up the boost, FMIC, 18g, and you will be in the 12's if you know how to tune:).

If you dont have tons of money to spend making a 10s cars stay away from hondas. it is one of the harder cars to actually make fast. Sure we all know the kids that have turbos on their honda, but they are still in the 14's. why would you want to take a car that ran 17's stock and try to make it a 10's car?

Stick with the sr20det or the ca18det in a 240sx..thoes are both great engine that you will not have to pay a fortune to get into the 12's.

only 4cyl's that I would ever want to mess with:)
3sgte
4g63
ej20
f20
4g55b

do the sr20det or at least get something more worth your while.

Newf

03-20-2003, 11:02 AM

Great another Daemos and his Spec V vs the world thread.

What's the expression?

...sounds like a broken record.

buster

03-20-2003, 11:08 AM

Newf...you sig is hilarious!

It's OK Daemos, I know what you are getting at.

psifactor

03-20-2003, 11:43 AM

This has not turned into a thread about the spec v vr. the msp. We have all figured out they both suck. Neither car was made for power.

Daemos

03-20-2003, 12:32 PM

newf come to winnipeg, we got our one and only MSP still sitting in the show room floor.

You may want to avoid it, since it's been ragged on, and the seats arn't too supportive. But the engine has been ragged on, that's the thing that should worry you.

Apparently no one in winnipeg wants a MSP.

I agree both the MSP and the Spec V both suck, but they're still good for ecnoboxes turned sport compact.

But in comparison to like RX7 TTs, Supras, Silvias, they're pathetic cars.

Newf

03-20-2003, 01:23 PM

I wouldn't doubt were going to see a lot of MSP's sitting around here in Canada, small towns especially. Why....ummmmm, because it's orange ! A lot of people, besides true car guys, just don't like it. the Average joe just doesn't seem to like orange.

Not only that, but it's unique market, one with few buyers, even fewer making the right amount of $$$, and one that is becoming more and more flooded ( it's not flooded yet but you know what I'm getting at ) with other manufactures releasing other sweet deals, srt4, spec , vw's, soon to be sir bla bla, that are actually getting to market ON TIME. Mazda may have rekindled (spelling?) the segment with the mp3, but, due to constant delays, they are going to pay for it, and as a result, their so called limited edition car is is becoming less of a demand then it was. they KNOW, if the 2003.5 are out at the same time, that eithier they will loose money on the 2003's, or, because of the loud color orange, they just won't sell.

Imagine, summer time, you go to the dealer, there's a yellow, Titanium, Orange, blue and silver one sitting there. Which color do you think will get looked at the most? Matter of opinion really, but the orange will be sitting there the longest imho, due to color, and the fact it's a 2003. Rumour is up here, the 2003.5 may get the new warranties. I never looked into it, don't know if it's true, but if it is, that's another thing the 2003's won't have going for them

Newf

03-20-2003, 01:45 PM

oh, and as for the seats, I don't know what peoples problems are with them I come from accords, preludes, leather seats etc and so on, and I find them just fine. And I'm someone that has had his neck broken, back severely f'd up, and I can't sit in anything but these seats are just fine. I traded in a 2000 civic for this, and those seats were pathetic. I'd last an hour in them before my hack was killing me. As for taking sharp corners, i think people get really anal when complaining about the seats, their fine. Sure, they could be better, but this is a basically an small non-expensive car.

Daemos

03-20-2003, 02:42 PM

I acctually really like the orange color, it's unique, and looks good on the MSP.

I think the main reason that the car hasn't been sold yet, is because of the report on the dealership, and the markup, someone told me the dealership was marking up the car because it's the only one that will be comming to winnipeg, which is stupid.

Talking about seats...I'm really picky about them, even my parent's 2003's altima seats I find unconfortable, and the seats in our mini van are just flat.

The Spec V's seats are really supportive, and I wouldn't mind changing them to real sparco or recaro seats, but I don't want to lose my side impact airbags, which will probally save my life.
the best stock seats I've ever sat in must either be the RX7 TT's seats, or the 350Z seats, those are REALLY supportive and comfy seats.

But, yea I like the 2003 MSP orange, personally I don't like the look of the 2003.5s as much, the big ass wing, no fogs, increase in price, not worth it IMO.

I'd personally stick with the mp3 that you have over the MSP. Since if you wanted to serously boost with the MSP, you'd be replacing most of the compoents of the turbo anyways, ie intercooler, piping, bov, computer management, better turbo, wastegates etc. That's like buying a whole new Turbo kit. And I also like the color of the MP3 more, and you KNOW your car will be more unique than the MSP since mazda is making more MSPs now.

Apparently as well the MP3's sound system is better due to a bigger sub, 10" vs 8".

Newf

03-20-2003, 02:52 PM

I think the main reason that the car hasn't been sold yet, is because of the report on the dealership, and the markup, someone told me the dealership was marking up the car because it's the only one that will be comming to winnipeg, which is stupid.

Well, that's not going to help sell it at all.

As for the mp3/msp thing. Your right, the color is better on mine :) I do personally like the orange though, but I am glad I never got it. After seeing the guy here with one almost daily, I'm almost tired of it now. I don't mind the titanium color, but it's no laser blue though. The wing I can get past, the fogs I'm putting in, and the extra $$$ isn't fair, but i think I can work something out for it. once I'm done, it'll be nice i'm sure. Beleive it or not the only complaint I have ever had about the mp3 was the ..... spoiler. Not everyone likes it, even the guys at Mazda commented on the speed when they first saw pics of it said, "they could have at least changed the spoile" Personally, I love it.

As for stereo. Your right again, I personally like the mp3 better, the head unit is better, the rear deck speakers are nice
i've got two subs identical to the mp3's one so that's no problem, I'll just stick that into the speed for now maybe get a real setup later if I care too. The msp one does sound really good though.

I can't get aftermarket turbo's here, it's just not feasable, and no one here can take care of it. If I could go that route, I'd have a spoolin setup right now and just keep the mp3 and the speed wouldn't even be a consideration. I do like having full warranties though.

So, I'm hoping to get into a speed, have a turbo with a warranty, keep it for about 2 years, maybe get the next one hopefully with REAL horsepower, and AWD. Or just get a new subie :) I wish we had a subie dealership close to me.

take care