Difference between MP3 and MP5 [Archive]

1sty

03-04-2003, 02:05 AM

Just get an intake and a full catback 2.25" exhuast and your already ahead of the MP3. Also the MP3 does not have some sensors tat the P5 does so the ECus aren't an exact swap but it can be down.

THe MP3 has a better suspension but you don't want the clunk and squeeks so stick to some good struts and lowing springs

chuyler1

03-04-2003, 08:42 AM

Well I was considering an exhaust/intake upgrade but the consensus seems to be that I won't gain much more than 7-8HP. Plus I don't want my car to sound ricy, if you know what I mean.

I hear you on the suspension though, my MP5 is tight enough for me.

keyserscott

03-04-2003, 10:28 AM

You won't sound ricey if you get the right exhaust. I have a Thermal and it sounds good. It has a lower tone than what I've heard before. The intake has a pretty cool sound to it to but it doesn't draw too much attention to itself. Your right, you probably will only see a 10HP increase but this figure is probably at the wheels. Basically, an MP5 with a good 2.25 exhaust and a CAI will be ahead of an MP3.

bazooka joe

03-04-2003, 12:50 PM

i think the mp3 ecu is pretty expensive too!

crayz_d

03-04-2003, 01:01 PM

The only differences between my car and an MP3 is 10hp (which is made up by intake and exhaust) and I have a 5th door on the back. I lucked out I guess. Dealer show cars cost more but they are worth it.:p

chuyler1

03-04-2003, 01:13 PM

So you don't get an extra drone from your exhaust on the highway? I don't mind a little noise during acceleration, but I can't stand cars that have this drone coming from the tail pipe at 75mph.

1sty

03-04-2003, 02:42 PM

There is no need to buy an MP3 ECu but it would be around $1200 if you did. Its the same computer just a different program.

KYREDP5

03-04-2003, 04:22 PM

Originally posted by crayz_d
The only differences between my car and an MP3 is 10hp (which is made up by intake and exhaust) and I have a 5th door on the back. I lucked out I guess. Dealer show cars cost more but they are worth it.:p

And the specially tuned suspension (sway bars, struts, springs), the diffrent ecu, built in MP3 player, shorter shifter.....

BTW, the 10 HP is from the ECU and the exhaust. You'd be luvky to get 10 from intake and exhaust.

1sty

03-04-2003, 04:29 PM

most of the the 10 HP is the retuned computer which is simply 3 degrees of advanced timing. See if a dealer can flash your ECU with the MP3s program.

chuyler1

03-04-2003, 05:40 PM

Thanks, i don't need the suspension, mp3 player, or short shift kit...

I just want a gauranteed 10hp gain if I am going to spend money on mods. Because it seems that just an intake and exhaust won't do it.

Does the MP3 take higher octane gas then?

KYREDP5

03-04-2003, 05:54 PM

Yes it requires higher octane. You'd be better off going with intake, exhaust, then cams if you want gaureneed 10 hp. That'd end up being a little more than 10 hp.

sundevilMP5

03-04-2003, 06:08 PM

switching out the ecu is definitely not worth it...it costs too much and the performance gain isn't even near 10hp...flyin miata did some tests with this...they tested a stock mp3 then switched to the P5 ecu...check out the minimal loss between the two

http://www.flyinmiata.com/protege/tech/dyno_runs/MP3_ecu_comparison.pdf

LazerBlueP5

03-04-2003, 06:08 PM

Originally posted by KYREDP5

And the specially tuned suspension (sway bars, struts, springs), the diffrent ecu, built in MP3 player, shorter shifter.....

BTW, the 10 HP is from the ECU and the exhaust. You'd be luvky to get 10 from intake and exhaust.

The thing is it's crank-shaft hp, not at the wheels. So if an exhaust and intake dyno shows a gain of 10hp thats probably 15-17hp at the crank.

1sty

03-04-2003, 06:10 PM

www.flyinprotege.com has the dyno differences!

keyserscott

03-04-2003, 07:36 PM

Exactly,

MP5 130HP at the crank + intake/exhaust about 15HP at the crank=145HP

MP3 140HP at the crank

Not much difference but it's nice to know.

Flyin Protege Turbo or Spoolin Stage 1 Turbo 165HP at the wheels = close to 195HP at the crank

Start saving.

JrTekSilverP5

03-05-2003, 11:31 AM

i knew is was more then just switchin the ecu

crayz_d

03-05-2003, 12:17 PM

Originally posted by KYREDP5

And the specially tuned suspension (sway bars, struts, springs), the diffrent ecu, built in MP3 player, shorter shifter.....

BTW, the 10 HP is from the ECU and the exhaust. You'd be luvky to get 10 from intake and exhaust.

I would like to point out that I have that <b>"specially tuned suspension (sway bars, struts, springs)"</b> because the dealer put it on for me. It is all listed in my mods list below, just an FYI. So again, I have an MP3 with a 5th door as far as I am concerned. Peace.

alec172

03-11-2003, 08:33 AM

Correct me if im wrong but Flying Protege compares the 2 software on an MP5 with a Turbo Kit. What about a stock engine?

I talked to a dealer and he's willing to do the job and charge only time but I have to find my own MP3 to come with me so he can download the S/W from him and upload it to mine. This, of course, is on the 2002 MP3 and MP5.

1sty

03-11-2003, 11:44 AM

MP3s were 2001 only.

alec172

03-11-2003, 05:24 PM

ure right. 2001 MP3 bought at the same time approx as 2002 MP5.

sundevilMP5

03-11-2003, 06:42 PM

Originally posted by alec172
Correct me if im wrong but Flying Protege compares the 2 software on an MP5 with a Turbo Kit. What about a stock engine?

I talked to a dealer and he's willing to do the job and charge only time but I have to find my own MP3 to come with me so he can download the S/W from him and upload it to mine. This, of course, is on the 2002 MP3 and MP5.

look at the numbers for the stock mp3...they tested a bone stock mp3 with the different ECUs...it was mentioned by somebody earlier that the only reason that the mp3 gets 10hp more is because of the different ecu...so logically if you put a p5 ecu on an mp3 then you would have 10 less hp...but the difference is not even close to that

alec172

03-12-2003, 05:04 PM

It's not entirely true. The MP3 has a slight advance of timming and the injection time is slightly longer. The 10 Hp difference is not entirely due to the ECU, the engine head as been shimmed a couple of milimeters shorter giving a higher compression ratio.

The MAZDA ECUs aren't EPROM, therefor u cannot change it's software. I it could, I would of swap s/w just for the kick of it but u need the new ECU. It's not worth it

alec172

03-12-2003, 05:07 PM

atmospheric engines react very differently depending in weather conditions. Some post an average of dynoruns taken on different days, some just post the best/worse results they can. Im not saying that FP did there dyno testing wrong but Im not totally convinced

1sty

03-12-2003, 05:10 PM

Interesting how no one from Fm or even spoolin has mentioned a higher compresion ratio.

alec172

03-12-2003, 05:49 PM

dunno. Just saying if the head is slimmer, the compression must be higher.

alec172

03-12-2003, 06:30 PM

1st MP3 in NH, u must know about that???? Did u check with your dealer? What did they told u? (the tech not the sales rep)

1sty

03-12-2003, 06:37 PM

About the compression?
I was never told anything. Especialy since there isn't a Mazda Tech worth Shit within 100 miles of me.

1. A tech was convinced the ECu was in the pasanger Dash behind the A/C and took over an hour to get to.

2. Another concluded my ECU had no ground for just the IAC valve since they could't see ground with a multimeter when the car was on. Of coarse a multimeter can't read ground through that type of circuit when on.

3. A dealership told me they would diagnose an idle problem until I remove the turbo kit. Interesting to see what the legalities are on that one.

In short I know more about this car then the techs do around here.

But in all my conversations about the differences in the cars the compression ration had never been mentioned by anyone at all.

alec172

03-12-2003, 07:35 PM

I feel your pain! I talked with at least 10 techs of different dealerships all around Montreal and beyoud to finally come upon one that knew what he talked about.
Iknow the MP5 has a ratio of 9.1:1 and I just tumbled across an article that claims the MP3 has 15.4:1 (hard to believe). U can view it at www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadtests/firstdrive/46530/article.html

alec172

03-12-2003, 07:39 PM

Ill continue to look it up. 15.4:1 is almost unbelivable. Ill let u know if i find something.

1sty

03-12-2003, 07:40 PM

Absolutely not. No way its that much different. It would be impossible for the car not to explode from a turbo at that compression.
I am very certain its the same 9.1:1 as all other proteges

the 15.4:1 is the steering ratio of the car not the compression!

alec172

03-12-2003, 09:25 PM

u're right cause the msp has the same ratio as MP5.

big_ben

03-12-2003, 10:49 PM

Here is the biggest difference between the MP3 and the P5. If your feelings are easily hurt, stop reading this now.

MP3=stylish sedan that was built to look good and handle like a $50,000 to $300,000 car.

P5=a wagon form of the protege that was meant for old men and women to drive. This is obvious because thats the the demographic that I always seeing drive the car.

Just telling you what I see going to work everyday.

1sty

03-12-2003, 10:52 PM

Better hope Nuke doesn't see this :D

chuyler1

03-13-2003, 12:16 AM

Originally posted by big_ben
Here is the biggest difference between the MP3 and the P5. If your feelings are easily hurt, stop reading this now.

MP3=stylish sedan that was built to look good and handle like a $50,000 to $300,000 car.

P5=a wagon form of the protege that was meant for old men and women to drive. This is obvious because thats the the demographic that I always seeing drive the car.

Just telling you what I see going to work everyday.

Funny, the car was marketed toward young people between 20-30 who don't remember what hatchbacks were in the 70's...

...and that is all I see driving them where I am.

...and if you think it handles like a $50K car, you have yet to drive a $50K car.

MP3skaterNC

03-13-2003, 12:33 AM

have you ever driven an mp3?

ive pushed zo6's though turns before, you can guess what happens when we exited that corner, but still pushing the "god" of all vettes though turns is damn good for an 18k dollar car.

alec172

03-13-2003, 07:58 AM

I have to agree that there's a lot of old farts driving the MP5 but I got a lot of yougsters too, I would say 50/50.

bazooka joe

03-13-2003, 08:13 AM

i guess i'm one of those old farts. i'm in my 40's and i'm not sure what's up with this age thing?? i guess i'm just a kid at heart and enjoy turning my car into something that reflects me and my personality.(silverp5)

CruzinAltitude

03-13-2003, 10:04 AM

Originally posted by chuyler1

Funny, the car was marketed toward young people between 20-30 who don't remember what hatchbacks were in the 70's...

...and that is all I see driving them where I am.

I have to second that notion, Unlike the PT Cruiser, which I mostly see 40 year old women driving, I have yet to see a Pro 5 with a driver that appeared over 30.

big_ben

03-13-2003, 10:13 AM

I didn't say there was anything wrong with the P5, I'm just telling you what the differences are. I'm sorry, but if yu think Mazda marketed this wagon towards you, they missed their mark by a mile. Do you think they actually suck that bad? I think not.

...and if you think it handles like a $50K car, you have yet to drive a $50K car.
I don't have to drive one to know that the MP3 outhandles them. I leave that up to SEVERAL professional drivers who have tested both and consistantly beat the expensive cars with the MP3. Alright, I proved you completely wrong, your turn to come up with some factual info against what I said. Oh,..... you cant because you know it's true. :'( You are the weakest link,......good bye.(weakest)

alec172

03-13-2003, 10:59 AM

and old fart to me drives 90Km/h in the right lane on the highway and gets on the highway at 60 Km/h. There's no age to love performance!

bazooka joe

03-13-2003, 11:15 AM

i agree alec172, my wife sure doesn't! she thinks i'm nuts, "you go and buy a brand new car and then you take it apart and add all this junk to it!" she's actually accused me of never growing up! she may be right!!

Newf

03-13-2003, 12:33 PM

in Big Bens offence, I see a LOT of senior people, even late 50's, early 60's driving P5's. Even more LX's.

Did I just agree with Big B again?

1sty

03-13-2003, 05:57 PM

Ben you are getting seriously lazy with your insults.

I P5 is very much advertised for the twenties and thirties crowd if not even young. Take mazda Graduate rebate program, its not a senior citizens discount! Also the Protege has the harshess suspension of any non special edition compact. I don't know to many senoirs that go out of there way get a stiff suspension so they can tool around. Who you see driving the car is hardly an indeication of Mazdas marketing. Obviously they will make the car more mild to appeal to a larger crowd then they would the MP3.

The MP3 while being to out handle a $50,000 its suspension is hardly as competent. A $50K cars suspension doesnt constantly clunk, bump, and creek. No to mention a M3s suspension doesn't transmit half the bumps and dips in the road as harshly as the MP3 does.

chuyler1

03-13-2003, 06:32 PM

Originally posted by 1st MP3 in NH
Ben you are getting seriously lazy with your insults.

I P5 is very much advertised for the twenties and thirties crowd if not even young. Take mazda Graduate rebate program, its not a senior citizens discount! Also the Protege has the harshess suspension of any non special edition compact. I don't know to many senoirs that go out of there way get a stiff suspension so they can tool around. Who you see driving the car is hardly an indeication of Mazdas marketing. Obviously they will make the car more mild to appeal to a larger crowd then they would the MP3.

The MP3 while being to out handle a $50,000 its suspension is hardly as competent. A $50K cars suspension doesnt constantly clunk, bump, and creek. No to mention a M3s suspension doesn't transmit half the bumps and dips in the road as harshly as the MP3 does.

I agree with you except that the M3 is a bad example....you could drive over a pebble and feel it. But the car doesn't make a single rattle while doing it. I test drove a bunch with my friend who was looking to buy one a while back. Has anyone ever driven an Audi S4? Now that is a rock solid car that drives on air.

I can see how critics can say it 'feels like a $50K car' but there is still $25-30K worth of handling, performance, and craftsmanship that is missing. They are just trying to put in words that it feels better than any other car in its class as well as many sports cars above its class.